[nagdu] The Requirement of a Harness

Pickrell, Rebecca M (IS) REBECCA.PICKRELL at ngc.com
Wed Sep 9 15:22:15 UTC 2009


I think that guide dog instructors are like any other professional. They
have good points to offer and a good instructor should be able to convey
why a given course of action may or may not be appropriate given a
senario. 
That being said, the instructors do not live with a guide dog 24/7. So,
there is some distance between what will work in their world and what
will work in the world of one of us. It is our job, and the good
instructors will realize this too, to figure out when their reality and
ours colide and when our reality will have to win. 
This is really no different from our relationships with any other
professional when you think about it. 
 

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Linda Gwizdak
Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 1:43 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] The Requirement of a Harness

Hi all,
I didn't know that any school told people not to remove their harnesses
during flights.  When I have traveled home from Seeing Eye - or any
other school I attended - with my dogs, the instructors have either said
nothing about it at all or mentioned that it might be more comfortable
for the dog and me if I DID take the harness off.

But, really folks, I do think the schools expect that we are adults and
will determine for ourselves what is best to do on a flight or any other
situation with our dogs! (grin!)  For my cross-country flights, I take
the harness off.  If I were to take a one-hour flight and the plane
wasn't crowded, I might just leave the harness on.

I think we just have to be adults and determine for ourselves what is
best for us in any given situation with us and our dogs.  There is
nothing wrong with asking another guide dog user aboout a situation that
is new to us. 
But to blindly follow every little thing a school instructor might tell
us - well - that can get to being too much!

Marion's right - it's the training that makes the guide dog, not the
harness.

Cheers,

Linda
----- Original Message -----
From: "Marion & Martin" <swampfox1833 at verizon.net>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 5:09 AM
Subject: [nagdu] The Requirement of a Harness


> Angie,
>    Do you know which airlines have such a policy? Although an airline
may 
> make such a policy, there is no such requirement in law. If I chose to

> travel with my dog out of harness using my white cane, the airline
could 
> not deny me access. The harness does not make a service dog; its
training 
> does. Some service animals do not wear harnesses and their owners
still 
> have the right of access with their dogs
>    Everyone needs to be aware that, even though the schools tell us 
> otherwise, we are not required to have our dogs in harness in order to
be 
> afforded the right of access with them. There is nothing in the
Federal 
> law requiring a service animal be harnessed. In spite of the fact that

> some state laws require this, such laws are unenforceable.
>
> Fraternally yours,
> Marion Gwizdala
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Angie Matney" <angie.matney at gmail.com>
> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
Users'" 
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, August 29, 2009 1:31 AM
> Subject: [nagdu] Quick-release handles: was Air Charters and the extra

> seat
>
>
>> Wayne,
>>
>> This kind of experience is one reason I hope The Seeing Eye will
consider
>> ways to provide us with quick-release handles. If we can simply
remove 
>> the
>> harness handle, it will easily fit in the space between a window seat
and
>> the inside wall of the plane. This will allow both the human and dog
to
>> enjoy more room while they fly, while reducing the chances that a
flight
>> attendant would seek to remove the harness from the dog's owner.
>>
>> Also, some airline policies state that the dog must remain in harness
at 
>> all
>> times. If we had a quick-release handle, we could comply with such 
>> policies
>> while gaining a bit more leg/dog room.
>>
>> I don't know how you feel about quick-release handles, but if you
agree 
>> with
>> me, I hope you will consider relating this experience to someone at 
>> Seeing
>> Eye as a reason to consider quick-release handles.
>>
>> Angie
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>> Behalf
>> Of Wayne Merritt
>> Sent: Friday, August 28, 2009 11:15 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Air Charters and the extra seat
>>
>> I think he's referring to a part of airline history in the eighties
>> where the airlines tried to take or in some cases took canes away
from
>> blind people, claiming that they were dangerous and could fly up and
>> hit someone if something were to happen to the plane. Though I missed
>> this part of airline history in my travels, I've still been asked a
>> few times by flight attendants to give up my cane. I even explained
to
>> one persont that the cane was securely between my window seat and the
>> inside wall of the plane; in other words, it wasn't going anywhere.
>> I'm sad to say that I have been pushed into giving up my cane, with
>> the flight attendant in question assuring me that she would put my
>> cane in the closet at the front of the plane during the flight, but
>> this has happened a very few times, thankfully.
>>
>> I did have one similar experience in my recent Florida travels, when
>> they were trying to acccommodate my seating arrangement on one of
>> those smaller express jets, where I had to give up my dog's harness.
I
>> chose not to make an issue of it since I was able to get a seat with
>> potentially more room in the first class area, though we are still
>> talking of those smaller jets. I was reminded of of the incidents of
>> giving up canes though and wondered if giving up a harness was
>> similar. Sadly, it does sound familiar to me. I was able to get the
>> harness back when leaving the plane, but I still felt like something
>> was violated by having to give up the harness. I tried to show the
>> flight attendant that it was secure against the wall of the plane,
but
>> no dice. Thoughts?
>>
>> Hth,
>> Wayne
>>
>>
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>
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