[nagdu] problems with new dog

Tue Apr 20 05:26:07 UTC 2010

Cheryl,

Julie gave a very good description of using positive reinforcement, clicker
training to deal with the greeting problem.  I have found that a clicker is
good for things like that because you can reward with the click from the
distance, once the dog learns that the click is associated with a high-value
reward. 

With Daisy, our rehab hound, I did much what she described to get her used
to having people in the house.  Of course, her problem back then was that
she wanted to eat them and to bark really loud between bites!  She's a
coonhound, so a really loud bark from her will shatter eardrums for miles
around.  Ugh!  So I would just let her dad greet whoever (we were having
contractors and workmen over at the time) while I would hold her leash for
dear life.  If she got too out of hand with the barking, I would pull her
back.  When she was quiet, I would let her go forward, etc.  I think it may
have helped some that Mitzi is a very sweet greeter, so Daisy finally clued
in that visitors were a happy thing.  Also, greeting visitors in a quiet,
friendly manner brings approval from....  The Dad!  Aha!  Whereas barking
like a fiend with a megaphone brings disapproval from The Dad and banishment
to the bedroom.  I had to play a bunch of other games for her anxiety
issues.  Yikes!

We also ended up having help from our neighbors in the old house --
Mexicans, coincidentally.  They were very good about just accepting that
entering the house required some special work with Daisy -- careful work.  A
stern voice would upset her, but they would simplyl adapt and say calmly,
"Daisy, off," and refuse to reinforce her until she was off, then pet her.
She saw them all the time through the fence and adored them all, so that was
great.  /smile/

Once Daisy discovered that visitors are wonderful, she went to the other
extreme, naturally.  Sigh.  So Mitzi started competing for the visitors'
attention (some of them were *her* buddies first!), so now I'm pretty much
in the finishing process of bringing two over-greeters to order.  For people
we know and want to come in the house, if Daisy's Dad isn't home, I simply
unlatch the door, then go into the kitchen and call the dogs and give them
treats and obedience exercises until they settle down and can pretend
they've heard of manners.  /smile/  It's not foolproof, and we will always
have to keep close watch on Daisy because of her fear aggression.  But
people can now enter our house without being either eaten or knocked over.
Whew!

Do you have a door that can be entered without going through your yard?  If
so, your drop by friends might understand if you ask them to come to that
door without going through the yard.  My experience with Mexican culture is
through those who have come here, but all of my Mexican friends have had a
fine sense of respect for others and their homes.  I don't know about any
cultural differences in your area, but there does seem to be a great deal of
courtesy in the culture in general.  Some of the bits and pieces are
different from American cultural expectations, but respect and courtesy are
very nice to have in one's friends, even if it's not always expressed the
way you culturally expect it to be.  If that makes sense.  /smile/

Anyway, if you have a door that is separate from the yard and simply ask if
your friends who drop by -- especially those who are afraid of dogs -- if
they can come to that door so that you can teach your dog (pup -- perrita)
to greet them more politely, that might work.  You know the people and your
circumstances, so it's only a suggestion.  /smile/

As for trying to get a grip on the dog from the backyard when you can't just
run grab it...  That's a big bummer!  When we purchased this house, the
landowner was supposed to grade the backyard so that it was manageable --
and safe for me or anybody.  They have not gotten around to it for some
reason....  Winter erosion helped a bit, as well as the dog activity, but it
appears we will have to do the work ourselves -- by hand.  Good grief!  So I
can walk in it *very* carefully.  And slowly.  Sighted people won't walk
around in there at all, but in our household, I am the dog management
specialist, so I get yelled at when the dogs bark.  Only by one neighbor,
but I do make some effort to keep them quiet(er) since he's currently
working nights.  One tries to be courteous, you know.  Also, I gotta say,
Daisy's bark does carry and is designed to penetrate the human eardrum --
and skull, it seems -- from a long way away.

Anyway, I lost some ground with the barking training over the winter for a
couple of reasons, and have been doing a lot of grumbling by how dangerous
it is for me to work with the dogs (Mitzi has gone bark monster, too) to
retrain them to "quiet" just because of how difficult it is to walk around
in my own back yard.  Maddening!  But we're getting there.

We've made it pretty clear that who comes in the backyard unauthorized
deserves what they get.  Don't care who ya are, you come to the front door!
Hm...  The only people we haven't had to remind and retrain and point out to
them that there *will* be blood (from one of us, if Daisy doesn't get to
them first!) are the Mexicans....  They usually call before they come over,
but even if they drop by, they come to the front door because we asked them
to before we got around to moving in.  /smile/  We have several neighbors on
this end of the park who are dreadfully anti-Mexican, and I get really mad
at hearing from them how awful "them Mexicans is."  We miss living next to
Them Mexicans frequently.  But I digress.

I'm trying to think of any further suggestions I can offer that might be
useful...  If you're interested in switching to clicker training to give you
more control over the situation, you can ask on the list -- there are some
great clicker/positive reinforcement trainers who describe the process very
well.  Or feel free to e-mail me off list, and I can give you some more
concrete, step-by-step suggestions.

Good luck!

Tami Smith-Kinney

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Julie J
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2010 5:31 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] problems with new dog

Cheryl,

I use primarily clicker training with my dogs, at least in the beginning. 
The basic premise is that you click when the dog has done the desired 
behavior and immediately follow it up with a treat.  Typically the treat is 
food, but it could be a quick toss of a ball or something else that the dog 
highly values.  the treat must be more valuable than the reward of the 
unwanted behavior.

My approach is to control the situation so that it isn't overwhelming for 
the dog.  I want the dog to succeed, so I make the situation just difficult 
enough for learning to occur, but not so difficult as to cause the dog to 
display the unwanted behavior.  Set the dog up for success.

The first thing I'd do is to find a group of people who are willing to help,

a youth group, church group, neighborhood kids, whoever you can get to help 
you out in exchange for cookies or something.   Next I'd ask them to walk by

and pay no attention to the dog.  I use clicker so I'd click and treat every

time someone walked by, assuming that the dog stayed calm with feet on the 
ground.  If you don't use clicker just a treat will probably work.  I'd 
repeat this until she looks to you when someone walks by.  then perhaps have

the person stop at the gate and then move on without entering.   Then the 
person could lift the latch, close it again and move on without entering. 
then the person could step inside and immediately turn around and leave.  If

she gets too excited it's a sign that you've moved ahead too quickly back up

to the previous step or break it down into more steps.   You are going to 
need to have a lot of people to practice with so that she generalizes the 
behavior to *all* people.

Some other ideas...keep her on a leash and under your direct supervision 
until she has solidly learned what you expect.   This is the method that I 
used with my overenthusiastic greeter.  I don't get too many visitors, but 
when someone would approach the house I'd take Monty to a different room 
while another family member answered the door.  I'd move forward with him a 
few feet at a time, waiting each time until he was calm and able to follow 
my direction to sit or down.  Then we'd move forward a bit more and repeat 
one or two quick obedience commands.  By the time we got into the living 
room he was usually calm enough to be let off the leash and greet the 
visitor, if the visitor was up for visiting.   If at any time during that 
process he got crazy, we backed up and tried it again.

HTH
Julie

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