[nagdu] :Leash corrections for licking poodle

Fri Feb 5 19:23:29 UTC 2010

Nicole,

With her, it's not just the problem of catching her in the act, it's also
catching it before everybody giggles.  That's when I know she's been bad,
but her badness has already been positively reinforced by crowd approval.
Like any good comedienne, she does play to the laughter and applause.
/smile/  Somehow I always seem to end up being the butt of the joke.

A good sharp leash correction is awfully tempting at that point, but it's
already too late and would be counterproductive.  Doing so probably wouldn't
even make me feel better, so I just have to give her more subtle reminders
that, while everybody else thinks she is terribly, terribly fun, I am
unamused.  She will cease and desist doing it again now that she's had her
fun, until the next day she decides she's bored with the job.  /smile/

I don't use more than a reminder tug on the leash with her, just as a
reminder that she's on the job and it would be nice if she remembered her
manners.  In fact, I usually say, "Mitiz, manners," which seems to have
become a meaningful command.  /smile/  When she's in super distracto mode
when we're on the move, I will use harness corrections, since they seem to
work.  She's so light that if I need to repeat the corrections, I can simply
pick her up and put her back in line while still being fairly gentle.  I
think it embarrasses her more than anything, but she does hate to be
embarrassed!  /smile/  Mostly, "Leave it! Forward!" gets her back on track,
with a click or praise to reinforce the second she leaves it.  Much less
effort!  She still does have her days, though, and I find myself saying,
"Leave! Forward!" every five steps.  So then I start with the harness bumps
until she decides to be a grown up or until I've picked her up and put her
back on track at least once. 

I've used positive training throughout with her, so she is a very light
touch.  I guess you would call her a soft dog, despite her strong-willed,
independent nature.  I quite like that about her, really, despite the fact
that it could be absolutely maddening at times when she was in her rebel
youth.  /grin/  Over the past year she has been more and more applying that
will and intelligence very much as I hoped she would when she grew up.  She
still has her lapses, of course, but they're infrequent enough that I'm now
surprised by them.  Whew!

Poodles are funny critters, and I've heard that schools with successful
poodle programs had to adapt their raising and training methods to the
poodle temperament to improve their success rate.  Negative reinforcement
simply does not achieve the effect you were hoping for when you did it.  I
did do some experimentation with sharper corrections, but that experiment
was short-lived!  She found that sort of treatment entirely unacceptable and
became downright oppositional.  Especially with the behavior I had corrected
for!  I would up the strenght of the correction a bit, she would become more
oppositional, I would try it again...  Then stand on the sidewalk beside the
unmovable black thing that had just become part of it.  Really, I tried
pushing her, even picking her up, but she had become one with the earth and
would not be moved.

So I gave that technique up after achieving the same results a second or
third time.  My past experience with Arabian horses, who are exactly the
same way, has taught me a lot of alternative techniques.  And lots and lots
of patience!  /grin/  You don't control your animal, you earn its
cooperation. Unless you enjoy frustration and humiliation, anyway!

Come to think of it, the bad behaviors she puts on when she's in a mood and
which I had the most trouble straightening out as her training turned to
work were the very ones I had attempted to use corrections for.  Long
memory, my dog.

Tami Smith-Kinney

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Nicole B. Torcolini
Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 4:09 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Interesting Names Re: guide dog book about young person

Do you use collar corrections with Mitzi?  I do not know what works with 
poodles, but I think that the way that some handlers would work on the issue

would be to try to give a collar correction as it is happening.  However, I 
know from experience that sometimes catching them in the action is easier 
said than done.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tamara Smith-Kinney" <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 11:46 AM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Interesting Names Re: guide dog book about young person

> Mitzi also seems to know whom she can be instant best friends with and 
> whome
> not.  /smile/  it's still embarrassing.
>
> She loves toes, and is quite fond of the backs of bare knees of people who
> are wearing shorts.  It's always so surprising to be walking along minding
> my own business and hear someone nearby jump and gasp.  Also, very, very
> embarrassing.  Every one else laughs for some reason, including the person
> with a damp spot behind his/her knee, but I could just die.
>
> I have discussed this issue with Mitzi a time or two.  /smile/  I'll have 
> to
> wait until spring to find out if I've finally convinced her on that one or
> not.  /grin/
>
> Tami Smith-Kinney
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Nicole B. Torcolini
> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 7:55 AM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Interesting Names Re: guide dog book about young 
> person
>
> Yes... At times Lexia is nothing but a flirt. However, I don't get too 
> many
> drive by petters. I have to worry about the opposite sometimes: drive by
> licking from her end of the deal.  She knkows a dog person when she sees
> one.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Tamara Smith-Kinney" <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 10:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Interesting Names Re: guide dog book about young 
> person
>
>
>> Yeah, when a dobie looks at you, you know you have been looked at.
>> /smile/
>> I've always loved that about them.
>>
>> I've heard Mitzi does have a back-off stare when she wants to use it, and
>> she can be quite standoffish some days.  Even then we still get drive 
>> bys.
>> Sigh.
>>
>> Then there are the days she's all flirty and those eye send out
>> come-hither
>> rays like you wouldn't believe.  Come to me!  Adore me!  Touch me!  Never
>> mind the grumpy looking blind lady.  /lol/  She's not as bad as she was
>> for
>> awhile, but she went through a real floozy phase.  What a pain!
>>
>> Tami Smith-Kinney
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>> Behalf
>> Of The Pawpower Pack
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 7:06 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Interesting Names Re: guide dog book about young
>> person
>>
>> Laveau is a 55 lb Doberman and is 26 inches tall and even as slight as
>> she is, people get out of my way.
>>
>> Part of that I think is her propensity to "stare people down."
>> However I have several people tell me that she looks mean.  The people
>> that really know her don't think that but she's apparently
>> intimidating.  I kind of like it because like Julie said, it cuts way
>> back on drive by petters.
>> Rox and the Kitchen Bitches
>> Bristol (retired), Mill'E SD. and Laveau Guide Dog, CGC.
>> "It's wildly irritating to have invented something as revolutionary as
>> sarcasm, only to have it abused by amateurs." -- Christopher Moore
>> pawpower4me at gmail.com
>>
>> Windows Live Only: Brisomania at hotmail.com
>> AIM: Brissysgirl Yahoo: lillebriss
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nagdu:
>>
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> .net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nagdu:
>>
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecabl
> e.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nagdu mailing list
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nagdu:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> .net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nagdu mailing list
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nagdu:
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecabl
e.com 

_______________________________________________
nagdu mailing list
nagdu at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
.net