[nagdu] Freedom for guide dogs

Sat Nov 27 05:09:06 UTC 2010

He does seem to have a lot of energy sometimes. It depends on the day.
I really need to work on recall sigh. I've been trying since he got
home.

On 11/26/10, Lora <blindhistory at gmail.com> wrote:
> My dog is a golden retreiver/ black lab mix. He is mostly golden.
> Danielle how do you get the dogs to not bark? My dog is amazing at not
> barking. He whines ifhe has to go outside, only out of harness, and
> makes grumbly noises but that is it.
>
> On 11/26/10, Danielle Larsen <dnlarsen75 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> well said Tammi!
>> i'm a puppy raiser for TSE, not yet a guide dog handler, but I am
>> visually
>> impaired, so I do understand the difficulty of  correcting quickly. What
>> type of dog do you haev?
>>
>> I find that dogs having some freedom is good for them, and having them on
>> leash all the tiem will be stressful for you both. Sometims when I know
>> the
>> puppy has a problemw ith certain thigns, I will go out of my way to "set
>> up"
>> these situations. Our puppy (I'll call her bear for the sake of keeping
>> the
>> raiser/handler confidentiality)  countersurfs in the worst way!!
>> So what we've done is set food on the counter and pretned that we are no
>> longer paying attention. she thinks she is being sneaky and when we catch
>> her hop right up we correct her very sternly. It has taken work but
>> improved
>> significantly.
>>
>> It's hard to let them be free when you feel sure they will ge tinto
>> things.
>> But I've found letting them get into it and correecting it right away is
>> ,
>> although difficult, quite successful. Do you ever put bellson your dog.
>> that
>> is a really great way to hear what they are doing. Our puppy is always
>> belled.
>>
>> Hope this info is even sort of productive!
>> -Danielle
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 8:30 PM, Tamara Smith-Kinney <
>> tamara.8024 at comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Dan and Lora,
>>>
>>> Sometimes it's the orthodoxy that is ill-advised.  /evil grin/  I'm a
>>> big
>>> proponent of freedom to run play in wide open spaces.  Apparently, most
>>> if
>>> not all U.S. guide dog programs are against that sort of thing.  At
>>> least
>>> they used to be; I hear they're getting less uptight about it lately.
>>>
>>> The key is to find a place where your dog will be as safe as possible to
>>> run
>>> and play and even socialize with other dogs.  Especially at first,
>>> because
>>> reliable recall and boundaries take time to learn.  Also, it seems that
>>> reliability is a matter of maturity, so you need to maintain protections
>>> for
>>> a wild and crazy dog until at least the age of 5.  /smile/  Well, the
>>> level
>>> of total reliability I'm referring to there means that the dog is
>>> self-disciplined and obedient enough to walk with its owner off-leash
>>> around
>>> a city neighborhood without getting into trouble or endangering itself
>>> or
>>> others.  Used to be, Portlanders would take their well-trained,
>>> well-mannered dogs all over the place that way -- farmer's markets,
>>> street
>>> fairs, community picnics, you name it.  Then people started taking their
>>> untrained, ill-mannered scurvy curs to those venues, so now those of us
>>> who
>>> have taken the time to train our dogs have to keep them on leash even
>>> though
>>> the law still says on leash or under control.  Oh, well!  Mine is just
>>> now
>>> mature and reliable enough for me to consider wandering around a
>>> farmer's
>>> market or such with her off leash, and I would be using her as a guide
>>> anyway. Still!  I would have loved an opportunity to see all that
>>> patience
>>> and perserverance come into play, just a time or two.  I'm silly that
>>> way,
>>> I
>>> guess.
>>>
>>> So the 5-year maturity limit is only if you really want to have a dog
>>> that
>>> is totally reliable off-leash in unfenced areas.  I do, so I've been
>>> working
>>> with Mitzi poodle on that since January of '07...  While I still limit
>>> potential risks when we're doing our thing with no physical connection
>>> between us, she's pretty awesome and I don't worry much these days.
>>> Also,
>>> she truly does jingle guide and squeak guide with her ball, so it's
>>> great
>>> for just walking around in the great outdoors with her.  /smile/
>>>
>>> I put bells on her collar so I know where she is, and I always reinforce
>>> recall and minding boundaries.  Which I can now set on the fly, so
>>> that's
>>> cool.  I have no need to take her on a sidewalk near traffic, and would
>>> not
>>> choose to do so.  However, it is nice to know that if for whatever
>>> strange
>>> reason I have a need for her to be off-leash, she would be fine.  I did
>>> actually manage to lose my leash at the park a couple of years back and
>>> was
>>> astonished at how well she did coming home without it.  It was a pretty
>>> safe
>>> walk, except for a couple of passages, but she was awfully darn good,
>>> especially considering her age and general level of overall snottiness.
>>> Love her, but she is Mitzi poodle, after all.  /grin/
>>>
>>> Incorporating interactive play into your off-leash time also does
>>> wonders.
>>> You can do a lot of reinforcing your training without actually doing any
>>> training.  And you can both get lots of exercise while having fun
>>> together.
>>> You can praise a behavior your dog makes in the course of play ("Good
>>> bring
>>> it!), then reward the dog by throwing (or kicking) the ball,which is the
>>> reward.  It's a fun way to have a dog that listens and responds well
>>> during
>>> off leash romps.
>>>
>>> With my ulta high-energy wild and crazy curly girl, I have done my best
>>> to
>>> follow a couple of hard and fast rules for myself:
>>>
>>>        1.  Always reward recall.  Always!
>>>        2.  Never give a command you know your dog will not obey.
>>>
>>> Oh, and when it comes to teaching your dog to pay attention to you when
>>> it
>>> counts...  Smelly treats!  If they're much too expensive and you can't
>>> stand
>>> yourself when you have a pocket full of them, then you're probably on
>>> the
>>> right track.  /lol/  Early on, especially, using rank bribery to start
>>> conditioning obedience is definitely the way to go.  Dogs are
>>> scent-oriented, so a smelly treat will get the dog's attention and bring
>>> it
>>> to you, even when said dog was planning to run by you demonstrating that
>>> it
>>> has no intention of coming to you just because you called it.  I speak
>>> from
>>> experience there.  /grin/  It's a way to condition the dog to come
>>> whether
>>> it wants to be conditioned or not.  /lol/  I could still see Mitzi well
>>> enough on sunny days to catch her expression when that start kicking in.
>>> She was so mad!  But she couldn't help herself because, well, you
>>> know...
>>> Smelly treats are smelly treats.  Yum!
>>>
>>> Don't know if any of that is helpful in your situation.  It was fun to
>>> suddenly find myself thinking back through all the fun (and sometimes
>>> scary)
>>> times with my curly girl, seeing those sunny days in the park by my old
>>> apartment with far more clarity than I probably really did....
>>>
>>> Now, I need to remember how to walk around the house I live in on this
>>> dank
>>> and dreary winter's night... /lol/
>>>
>>> Good luck, and let us know how it goes.
>>>
>>> Tami Smith-Kinney
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf
>>>  Of Dan Weiner
>>> Sent: Friday, November 26, 2010 10:39 AM
>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Freedom for guide dogs
>>>
>>> Well, just my opinion.
>>> First of all, with outside do you mean a fenced-in area or an open space
>>> with no borders?
>>> If it's fenced-in, then really no harm done and let him run around and
>>> get
>>> rid of pent up energy.
>>> If it's totally open, I would say that letting her off lead is
>>> ill-advised.
>>> Perhaps you could buy a flexi-lead to give your dog more space to roam
>>> without getting away.
>>> I have a fifteen foot nylon leash I bought about 15 years ago, one foot
>>> per
>>> year--lol.
>>> The problem is that your dog can get tangled up in it.
>>> So, fenced-in area, all right, open area, not so hot--smile.
>>> Indoors, well, and this is just a general comment, I find that people
>>> are
>>> really uptight about everything their dogs do. How can your dog learn
>>> what's
>>> expected without freedom in the house. Besides, keeping him/her on leash
>>> if
>>> it's your home will make you a nervous wreck and start feeling like a
>>> burden.
>>> Even the best guide dogs I've seen will eventually do something silly in
>>> the
>>> house, so don't sweat the little stuff.
>>>
>>> Perhaps unorthodox but my two cent worth anyway.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Cindy Ray
>>> Sent: Friday, November 26, 2010 1:33 PM
>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Freedom for guide dogs
>>>
>>> Um, I wouldn't let him outside off leash myself. As for inside, are you
>>> doing obedience? Often the dogs really need that for a while before you
>>> can
>>> get what you are looking for. I do obedience on leash sometimes; then as
>>> a
>>> final exercise I do it off leash to see if he'll do it.
>>>
>>> CL
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Lora" <blindhistory at gmail.com>
>>> To: <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Friday, November 26, 2010 12:27 PM
>>> Subject: [nagdu] Freedom for guide dogs
>>>
>>>
>>> After about six months I have been trying to give my guide dog freedom
>>> outside and inside. He still gets into trouble mostly outside. He
>>> won't listen off leash. Any suggestions?
>>> --
>>> Lora
>>>
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>
>
> --
> Lora
>

-- 
Lora