[nagdu] GDA Ownership Agreement

cheryl echevarria cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com
Sat Apr 23 12:04:38 UTC 2011


are we putting this information on the NAGDU website? It should be I believe.

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  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Marion Gwizdala<mailto:blind411 at verizon.net> 
  To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org> 
  Sent: Saturday, April 23, 2011 6:51 AM
  Subject: Re: [nagdu] GDA Ownership Agreement


  Buddy,
      In your opinion, what is disappointing in the GDA agreement?

  Fraternally yours,
  Marion


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: "Buddy Brannan" <buddy at brannan.name<mailto:buddy at brannan.name>>
  To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
  <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  Sent: Friday, April 22, 2011 1:42 PM
  Subject: Re: [nagdu] GDA Ownership Agreement


  > Well,  you won't get a contract from Seeing Eye, because there isn't one. 
  > Yeah, the GDA thing is a bit disappointing though.
  > --
  > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
  > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
  >
  >
  >
  > On Apr 22, 2011, at 1:31 PM, Marion Gwizdala wrote:
  >
  >> Julie and Listers,
  >>   Attached to this mesage is Guide Dogs of America's ownership agreement. 
  >> It was sent to me upon my request. FYI, I also asked GDF for their 
  >> ownership agreement and am in the process of making similar requests to 
  >> each of the training programs. As of this writing, I have received no 
  >> other replies.
  >> Fraternally yours,
  >> Marion Gwizdala
  >>
  >>
  >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Julie J" <julielj at neb.rr.com<mailto:julielj at neb.rr.com>>
  >> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
  >> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >> Sent: Friday, April 22, 2011 1:20 PM
  >> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>
  >>
  >>> I guess I thought GDA gave true legal ownership.  That doesn't sound 
  >>> like what they offer.  that's kind of disappointing.
  >>>
  >>> Does anyone know if the ownership contracts of any of the programs are 
  >>> available on the internet?  For me, being able to read the contract 
  >>> would help me immensely in deciding if that is a program I would want to 
  >>> apply to. It seems a large waste of everyone's time to apply, be 
  >>> accepted and then read the contract only to find out it isn't something 
  >>> I'm willing to sign.
  >>>
  >>> thoughts?
  >>> Julie
  >>>
  >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brittney N. Mejico" 
  >>> <brittneymejico at verizon.net<mailto:brittneymejico at verizon.net>>
  >>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
  >>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 7:15 PM
  >>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>
  >>>
  >>>> Julie
  >>>> They give ownership of your dog to you,  but if they hear that your dog 
  >>>> is being abused or someone other than you is using your guide dog they 
  >>>> have the right to take your dog At least that's what they told me.
  >>>>
  >>>> -----Original Message----- From: Julie J
  >>>> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 4:48 PM
  >>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
  >>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>>
  >>>> Brittney,
  >>>>
  >>>> I thought GDA gave ownership to their grads.  Is there something in the
  >>>> contract that allows them to take a dog you own?  I'm confused.
  >>>>
  >>>> I'm glad it all worked out in the end, but sorry you had to go through 
  >>>> that.
  >>>>
  >>>> Julie
  >>>>
  >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brittney N. Mejico" 
  >>>> <brittneymejico at verizon.net<mailto:brittneymejico at verizon.net>>
  >>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
  >>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 6:23 PM
  >>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>>
  >>>>
  >>>>> Hi Tami  and Lyn,
  >>>>> I would like to thank both of you for sharing your experiences.Both of 
  >>>>> you guys stories have helped me out.  I can't put it into words how 
  >>>>> much. I got my dog from GDA and nothing against anyone who goes there 
  >>>>> but man they LOVE LOVE good stories.  I found this out about six 
  >>>>> months ago. My grandmother told them that my X boy friend hits and 
  >>>>> kicks my guide dog and they believed her.  They took my dog and then 
  >>>>> gave her back after they couldn't find any proof that she had been 
  >>>>> abused.  It was a totally uncool experience.    Yes the fabracated 
  >>>>> stories have to stop. I thought that I was the only one who has had 
  >>>>> some person make up a story about them and have the school take 
  >>>>> someone elses side but yours.I am just thankful I got my dog back.  I 
  >>>>> am glad that I now know know that the schools talk to each other.I 
  >>>>> hope this issue does not effect me if I ever apply for another guide.
  >>>>>
  >>>>> Thanks a bunch
  >>>>>
  >>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Tamara Smith-Kinney
  >>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 9:34 AM
  >>>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
  >>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>>>
  >>>>> Lyn,
  >>>>>
  >>>>> Had that experience with my application to GDB, through the Boring 
  >>>>> campus,
  >>>>> which I attempted to finish up after the big disaster at Oregon 
  >>>>> Commission
  >>>>> for the Blind.  Oh, they definitely talk to each other, too!  And the 
  >>>>> GDB
  >>>>> interviewer and, apparently, the selection committee, clearly believed 
  >>>>> them
  >>>>> hook line and sinker!
  >>>>>
  >>>>> So the one reason given that was GDB's own is that I had set a load of
  >>>>> laundry by the kitchen door to the basement because the washers were 
  >>>>> full.
  >>>>> It was still there when she arrived for the home interview, so when I 
  >>>>> showed
  >>>>> her around, I explained that I'd set it there for later instead of 
  >>>>> carrying
  >>>>> it up another flight of stairs in my house and having to carry it down 
  >>>>> that
  >>>>> same extra flight later on when it was my turn for the laundry room.
  >>>>> Apparently, if I will do such a carefless, negligent, dangerous thing 
  >>>>> when
  >>>>> there is no dog in the house, I will almost certainly kill any guide 
  >>>>> dog of
  >>>>> theirs because it will eat a sock and die.  Turns out, that did 
  >>>>> apparently
  >>>>> happen to one of their dogs way back in the mists of history.  So I've 
  >>>>> heard
  >>>>> others scratching their heads about the dire danger of socks and how 
  >>>>> come
  >>>>> they have to keep hearing about how their going to kill their dogs if 
  >>>>> they
  >>>>> drop a sock on the floor.  Very odd.  I'm not knocking the program or 
  >>>>> their
  >>>>> dogs, since we all know they turn out good dogs and happy grads who 
  >>>>> somehow
  >>>>> manage to avoid the dangers of lurking killer socks.
  >>>>>
  >>>>> The other two points in the letter were straight from Oregon 
  >>>>> Commission for
  >>>>> the Blind, almost verbatim.  The mobility instructor -- who also did 
  >>>>> some
  >>>>> in-home living skills instructing -- reported that my ability to 
  >>>>> navigate
  >>>>> and orient, along with my ability to accomplish household tasks 
  >>>>> without
  >>>>> assistance from her, allowing her to play spider solitaire on my 
  >>>>> computer,
  >>>>> indicated that I was using my really great vision to do these things. 
  >>>>> She
  >>>>> did not -- or the letter from GDB did not mention this detail -- that 
  >>>>> I was
  >>>>> performing those tasks under sleep shade.  Anyway, since I had really 
  >>>>> great
  >>>>> vision and didn't need a guide dog and would most certainly screw it 
  >>>>> up if
  >>>>> it lived long enough what with the socks and all, they preferred to 
  >>>>> save
  >>>>> their dogs for blind people who needed them.  Sigh.
  >>>>>
  >>>>> Also, because of what had happened when I came across the state to the
  >>>>> Living Skills Center and nearly ended up dead, it appeared I had some
  >>>>> serious mental health issues and would, you know, do bad things to the 
  >>>>> dog.
  >>>>> Um...  I had a real problem with that one, since I was getting through 
  >>>>> the
  >>>>> PTSD from all that, and had been declared in the aftermath by not one 
  >>>>> but
  >>>>> three licensed and qualified professionals using metric tools and 
  >>>>> everything
  >>>>> to be quite sane otherwise and to be handling the PTSD in a 
  >>>>> surprisingly
  >>>>> mentally healthy way even before I got into counseling for it.  Also, 
  >>>>> it
  >>>>> seemed to me that it might be helpful for me to know if the OCB had 
  >>>>> crossed
  >>>>> the line somewhere in what they communicated to the guide dog program 
  >>>>> when
  >>>>> they submitted the O&M assessment the program required.  I had been 
  >>>>> quite
  >>>>> open with the interviewer from GDB, and I did give them a release of
  >>>>> information from the counselor I was still seeing for the PTSD, then 
  >>>>> chatted
  >>>>> about it in session while going through the status check part of the
  >>>>> conversation.  The counselor's input matched with my general 
  >>>>> perception of
  >>>>> my own reality -- still got a ways to go, but doing well, can expect a 
  >>>>> good
  >>>>> outcome, have coping skills to use in moving along, etc., etc.  She 
  >>>>> didn't
  >>>>> tell me what she planned to report to GDB, or what she did report, 
  >>>>> which
  >>>>> seemed pretty professional of her, so I didn't really worry about it. 
  >>>>> She
  >>>>> struck me as the type to do her job as she should, which was to give 
  >>>>> an
  >>>>> accurate report on my mental health status...
  >>>>>
  >>>>> I did want to discuss the issue with the interviewer from GDB, though, 
  >>>>> to
  >>>>> find out what was going on there, how to correctly translate their 
  >>>>> statement
  >>>>> from the letter, and to find out what I needed to do to resolve the 
  >>>>> issue in
  >>>>> the event I decided to reapply at the appropriate time...  No return
  >>>>> communication.  Tried the boss...  Nope!  At that point, I noticed 
  >>>>> that I
  >>>>> seem to have ordered a poodle to be delivered to my home and had 
  >>>>> better
  >>>>> things to do than worry about what a bunch of strangers thought of how
  >>>>> dangerous crazy I must be.  Doesn't matter to me at all and doesn't 
  >>>>> affect
  >>>>> me in any way, so Bob's your uncle!  Mitzi lives!  /evil grin/
  >>>>>
  >>>>> Black listing people based on rumor and innuendo and possibly flat out 
  >>>>> lies
  >>>>> has got to go!
  >>>>>
  >>>>> Tami Smith-Kinney
  >>>>>
  >>>>> -----Original Message-----
  >>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
  >>>>> Behalf
  >>>>> Of Lyn Gwizdak
  >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 9:36 AM
  >>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
  >>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>>>
  >>>>> Guide Dogs of America and GDB for believing fabricated stories.  The 
  >>>>> "busy
  >>>>> body" I referred to in my post is someone who fabricates stories here
  >>>>> locally and she is known to do this for years.   In other words, she 
  >>>>> doesn't
  >>>>>
  >>>>> have much real credibility aroound here and wwe're glad she moved out 
  >>>>> of
  >>>>> town although we see her around from time to time.  She personally 
  >>>>> doesn't
  >>>>> like me for my refusal to be intimidated by her and that I am LGBT.
  >>>>>
  >>>>> I know that people get good dogs from them and that's fine.  I just 
  >>>>> will
  >>>>> never go back there again. I don't dump on either school and respect
  >>>>> people's choices as to where they wish to get their dog from.  This is 
  >>>>> all
  >>>>> my own personal experiences with these two schools, that's all.
  >>>>>
  >>>>> Also, as a result of the refusal of services by GDA, I got turned down 
  >>>>> by
  >>>>> GDB - with the "giving my retired guide to another person to use as a 
  >>>>> guide"
  >>>>>
  >>>>> rationale. Whatever.  I'm glad I went back to TSE.
  >>>>>
  >>>>> Whether we realize it of not, these schools talk to each other about
  >>>>> prospective students. What I was upset about is that GDB believed the
  >>>>> stories rather than finding out the truth about me and what really 
  >>>>> happened
  >>>>> with the retired guide dog.
  >>>>>
  >>>>> When I applied to TSE, I told them about this situation because I 
  >>>>> thought
  >>>>> they might hear it from someone other than from me.  As far as TSE was
  >>>>> concerned, I already had a track record with them and they accepted me 
  >>>>> back
  >>>>> with no problem.  I have had nothing but adult treatment and respect 
  >>>>> from
  >>>>> TSE.
  >>>>>
  >>>>> Lyn and Landon
  >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brittney N. Mejico" 
  >>>>> <brittneymejico at verizon.net<mailto:brittneymejico at verizon.net>>
  >>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
  >>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2011 5:39 PM
  >>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>>>
  >>>>>
  >>>>>> hay Lyn
  >>>>>> Witch School in california did you go to?  That is crazy they treated 
  >>>>>> you
  >>>>>> like that
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Lyn Gwizdak
  >>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2011 4:19 PM
  >>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
  >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>> Got that right, Marion!
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>> Back in 1990, I went to a California guide dog school. While at the
  >>>>>> school,
  >>>>>> I befriended a man there who was on class with me.  this man's 
  >>>>>> brother was
  >>>>>> also in the same class and the two brothers did NOT get along with 
  >>>>>> each
  >>>>>> other.  Why they were put into the same class, I don't know.  However 
  >>>>>> they
  >>>>>> did.  The brother of they guy I hung out with would do stuff to 
  >>>>>> irritate
  >>>>>> his
  >>>>>> brother like come into the room where we were sitting and blow 
  >>>>>> cigarette
  >>>>>> smoke at us.  I asked the brother to not do this as I never did 
  >>>>>> anything
  >>>>>> to
  >>>>>> him and that we should be adults on class even if the two of them 
  >>>>>> didn't
  >>>>>> get
  >>>>>> along.
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>> Well, after that, the instructor called the three of us - 
  >>>>>> individually -
  >>>>>> into his office and proceeded to threaten us with being sent home 
  >>>>>> without
  >>>>>> our dogs if the crap didn't stop.  Well, I was VERY upset over this
  >>>>>> treatment especially since I was doing NOTHING wrong or breaking any 
  >>>>>> of
  >>>>>> the
  >>>>>> house rules or disrespecting any other person there.  Fortunately, 
  >>>>>> the
  >>>>>> crap
  >>>>>> stopped and we all went home with our dogs.
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>> Then, when I retired the dog and wanted to return for another one, 
  >>>>>> the
  >>>>>> school said I violated the contract by "giving my retired dog to 
  >>>>>> another
  >>>>>> person to use as a guide" - which was not true!  I gave the dog to 
  >>>>>> the
  >>>>>> woman's husband for a PET as my friend already had a guide dog from 
  >>>>>> that
  >>>>>> same school. These people moved out of state and she sent her dog 
  >>>>>> back and
  >>>>>> then used my retired dog as her guide.  They moved back here, a local
  >>>>>> busybody saw her with my dog and reported to the school.  The trainer 
  >>>>>> came
  >>>>>> to talk to us and I told him that I gave the dog to the husband and 
  >>>>>> that I
  >>>>>> mailed the harness back. I thought it was all clear and then I got 
  >>>>>> denied
  >>>>>> when I applied for a dog with that school six months later.   I was 
  >>>>>> denied
  >>>>>> service by this school.  that was fine - it got me to venture across 
  >>>>>> the
  >>>>>> country to go back to TSE for my next dog and I've been with TSE ever
  >>>>>> since!
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>> WE need to find the schools who respect us and not be paternalistic
  >>>>>> towards
  >>>>>> us and stick with their program!  You're right, marion, the schools 
  >>>>>> EXIST
  >>>>>> because of the blind people who want guide dogs and they must realize 
  >>>>>> this
  >>>>>> and be respectful towards us.
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>> Lyn and Landon
  >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marion Gwizdala" 
  >>>>>> <blind411 at verizon.net<mailto:blind411 at verizon.net>>
  >>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
  >>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2011 2:32 AM
  >>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>>> Brittney,
  >>>>>>>   I object to the characteristic of the guide dog consumer as a
  >>>>>>> "beggar". Guide dog training programs raise millions of dollars each 
  >>>>>>> year
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>> with the assertion that they are doing something beneficial and 
  >>>>>>> enhancing
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>> for the blind. Donors - many of whom are their own consumers - 
  >>>>>>> donate
  >>>>>>> these millions with the same intent. If it were not for us, those
  >>>>>>> employed by the training programs would not be earning their 
  >>>>>>> livings.
  >>>>>>>   The idea that we have no say and must settle for whatever we 
  >>>>>>> receive
  >>>>>>> with no rights to address abuse or maltreatment is archaic. Most 
  >>>>>>> training
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>> programs obviously view their blind consumers as nothing more than 
  >>>>>>> wards
  >>>>>>> who are unable to govern their own lives, let alone take care of a 
  >>>>>>> dog.
  >>>>>>> What other reason would they have for not transferring ownership 
  >>>>>>> upon
  >>>>>>> completion of the program? I have heard many justifications and
  >>>>>>> rationalizations for this paternalistic practice but none of them 
  >>>>>>> are
  >>>>>>> convincing. It is time for us to discard the notion that we are 
  >>>>>>> beholden
  >>>>>>> to the training programs and demand to be treated equitably and with 
  >>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>> dignity many of these programs mistakenly assert they provide.
  >>>>>>>
  >>>>>>> Fraternally yours,
  >>>>>>> Marion Gwizdala
  >>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>
  >>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brittney N. Mejico" 
  >>>>>>> <brittneymejico at verizon.net<mailto:brittneymejico at verizon.net>>
  >>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog 
  >>>>>>> Users"
  >>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 18, 2011 7:08 PM
  >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>> Hi,
  >>>>>>>> Do we have rights as guide dog users?  Most schools give us our 
  >>>>>>>> dogs for
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>> free or they charge a small fee that I think is extremely cheap.
  >>>>>>>> Beggers can't be choosers  I guess.  I think we should be informed 
  >>>>>>>> of
  >>>>>>>> any alergy or behavior problem but sometimes we aren't.  I think 
  >>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>> schools try there best we can't blame them for things that they may 
  >>>>>>>> have
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>> missed.  My guide has alergies, I found this after I brought her 
  >>>>>>>> home. I
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>> contacted the school I got her from,  and they helped me find a 
  >>>>>>>> food
  >>>>>>>> that didn't cause her problems.  A lot of people I know there guide 
  >>>>>>>> dogs
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>> have alergies, I don't know why, I guess things just happen.
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Lyn Gwizdak
  >>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 18, 2011 2:43 PM
  >>>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
  >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>> Hi guys,
  >>>>>>>> As a side discussion to this, it seems to me that many more dogs 
  >>>>>>>> are
  >>>>>>>> cropping up with one kind or another allergy these days.  When I 
  >>>>>>>> lived
  >>>>>>>> back
  >>>>>>>> east I never really encountered this problem until I moved to
  >>>>>>>> California.
  >>>>>>>> Now I hear that the dogs in the east coast have this problem as 
  >>>>>>>> well -
  >>>>>>>> actually dogs all over the US.  Is this my imagination or are the 
  >>>>>>>> dogs
  >>>>>>>> coming out of the schools now actually having more allergies? 
  >>>>>>>> Input
  >>>>>>>> anyone?
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>> The Bill of Rights thing sounds good to me.  I think the schools do 
  >>>>>>>> what
  >>>>>>>> they can to try to make sure that the dogs we get are in good 
  >>>>>>>> health.
  >>>>>>>> But
  >>>>>>>> these same dogs go through the hands of puppy raisers who either 
  >>>>>>>> want
  >>>>>>>> their
  >>>>>>>> dog to suceed as a guide for a blind person or they want it to fail 
  >>>>>>>> so
  >>>>>>>> they
  >>>>>>>> can keep it as a pet (I actually encountered a puppy raiser like 
  >>>>>>>> this -
  >>>>>>>> they
  >>>>>>>> got found out and dropped from the program.).  I wonder if the only 
  >>>>>>>> info
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>> on
  >>>>>>>> a given dog is only that provided by the puppy raiser in their 
  >>>>>>>> reports
  >>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>> the school.  then there are the problems that nobody forsees like
  >>>>>>>> regional
  >>>>>>>> allergies or other problems that come up after the dog is exposed 
  >>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>> something as a ongoing thing after it goes out with a graduate.
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>> JUst wondering about these things. And then a dog is a living being 
  >>>>>>>> and
  >>>>>>>> there's no guarentees.
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>> Lyn and Landon
  >>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa Irving" 
  >>>>>>>> <lirving1234 at cox.net<mailto:lirving1234 at cox.net>>
  >>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog 
  >>>>>>>> Users"
  >>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2011 10:43 PM
  >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>> Marion, I'm not quite sure what I'm doing here.
  >>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>> Consumers shall receive verbal and written notification by the 
  >>>>>>>>> school
  >>>>>>>>> when a food allergy has been identified by the puppy raiser and or 
  >>>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>>> assigned veterinarian.  With holding such vital information could 
  >>>>>>>>> have
  >>>>>>>>> devastating results for the guide dog team.
  >>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>> Lisa and Bernie
  >>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marion Gwizdala" 
  >>>>>>>>> <blind411 at verizon.net<mailto:blind411 at verizon.net>>
  >>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog 
  >>>>>>>>> Users"
  >>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2011 3:26 AM
  >>>>>>>>> Subject: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
  >>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>> Lisa,
  >>>>>>>>>>   Let me ask you to complete this statement as it pertains to the
  >>>>>>>>>> issues you raise. Please keep the statement succinct, about one 
  >>>>>>>>>> or two
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>> sentences. Anyone else who wants to take a stab at it is welcome 
  >>>>>>>>>> to do
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>> so. As a guideline, here is the statement that would precede this 
  >>>>>>>>>> one.
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>> a.       Consumers shall expect that every effort shall be made 
  >>>>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>>>> provide dogs in excellent health and appropriate temperament
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>> Now, complete this statement to provide that the program 
  >>>>>>>>>> discloses
  >>>>>>>>>> this information:
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>> The guide dog training program shall disclose ....
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>> I look forward to your input on our Bill of Rights!
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>> fraternally yours,
  >>>>>>>>>> Marion Gwizdala
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa Irving" 
  >>>>>>>>>> <lirving1234 at cox.net<mailto:lirving1234 at cox.net>>
  >>>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog 
  >>>>>>>>>> Users"
  >>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2011 1:16 AM
  >>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nagdu] when should schools give information about dog 
  >>>>>>>>>> guides
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>> and re issued guides
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>> I believe  the school has an obligation to be up front with the
  >>>>>>>>>>> student. I respect  that the school doesn't want to set the 
  >>>>>>>>>>> student
  >>>>>>>>>>> or the dog up for frustration and failure. This is what I base 
  >>>>>>>>>>> my
  >>>>>>>>>>> belief on.
  >>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>> My first guide dog was a sweet and stubborn Goldie. She was a 
  >>>>>>>>>>> finicky
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>> eater too. The school said nothing about her propensity to not 
  >>>>>>>>>>> eat.
  >>>>>>>>>>> However, the puppy raiser did tell me on the sly.  I was told 
  >>>>>>>>>>> that
  >>>>>>>>>>> from the "get-go" my Goldie was a fussy eater. The puppyraisers 
  >>>>>>>>>>> used
  >>>>>>>>>>> unconventional ways to get her to eat. They sprinkled Parmashon
  >>>>>>>>>>> cheese on her food. That's all right by me. They also 'fessed up 
  >>>>>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>>>>> slipping her people food. I'm glad they told me. It helped me be 
  >>>>>>>>>>> on
  >>>>>>>>>>> the alert.
  >>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>> My second dog, Louie, was a ever hungry Labrador. The 
  >>>>>>>>>>> puppyraisers
  >>>>>>>>>>> said something about all of his allergies and how he needed 
  >>>>>>>>>>> special
  >>>>>>>>>>> food. I disregarded what they said because I figured if my dog 
  >>>>>>>>>>> had
  >>>>>>>>>>> various food allergies the school would know and they would tell 
  >>>>>>>>>>> me.
  >>>>>>>>>>> Louie is the dog I returned because I thought he had behavioral
  >>>>>>>>>>> issues. No, he had very severe food allergies which explained 
  >>>>>>>>>>> why he
  >>>>>>>>>>> learned to get the bungy cords off the trash cans and feast. He 
  >>>>>>>>>>> also
  >>>>>>>>>>> feasted on animal feces too.
  >>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>> Bernie, my third guide dog, probably has some food allergies. 
  >>>>>>>>>>> Not
  >>>>>>>>>>> wanting a sad repeat of the previous food related experiences 
  >>>>>>>>>>> with
  >>>>>>>>>>> Louie, I nipped the problem in the bud. That is, Bernie ate two
  >>>>>>>>>>> different dog foods  that left him with gooey poo.  Bernie eats 
  >>>>>>>>>>> a
  >>>>>>>>>>> fresh and whole food quality dog food. The joke is, I can eat 
  >>>>>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>>>>> dog's food if I really want a truly healthy and balanced 
  >>>>>>>>>>> diet.{In
  >>>>>>>>>>> Bernie's food is: salmon, barley, beets, carrots and ginger and 
  >>>>>>>>>>> other
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>> items{.
  >>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>> Lisa and Bernie ,  ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tracy 
  >>>>>>>>>>> Carcione" <carcione at access.net<mailto:carcione at access.net>>
  >>>>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog 
  >>>>>>>>>>> Users"
  >>>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 12:05 PM
  >>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second
  >>>>>>>>>>> ownerifitdoesn'tworkout with the first owner?
  >>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Sarah.
  >>>>>>>>>>>> Quite true.  Though I'd be happy if the puppy raiser would let 
  >>>>>>>>>>>> me
  >>>>>>>>>>>> know if,
  >>>>>>>>>>>> say, the dog was a habitual counter surfer.  Though they 
  >>>>>>>>>>>> probably
  >>>>>>>>>>>> wouldn't, for fear of getting their puppy dropped from 
  >>>>>>>>>>>> training.
  >>>>>>>>>>>> I figure knowledge is power, and I'm a big girl who won't go 
  >>>>>>>>>>>> nuts
  >>>>>>>>>>>> over
  >>>>>>>>>>>> little problems.  But you're probably right that no one is 
  >>>>>>>>>>>> going to
  >>>>>>>>>>>> tell
  >>>>>>>>>>>> me all I'd like to know.
  >>>>>>>>>>>> Tracy
  >>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Tracy,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> I was just comparing it to what we know about the guides we 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> receive
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> who
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> are
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> not reissues.  They normally don't tell us about those things 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> when
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> we
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> receive a nonreissue, so I wouldn't really expect them to for 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> a
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> reissue
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> just
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> because it was a reissue.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> Sarah & Miguel
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Tracy Carcione" <carcione at access.net<mailto:carcione at access.net>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> Users"
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 11:20 AM
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> ownerifitdoesn'tworkout
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> with the first owner?
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Sarah.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't think I buy your argument.  There could be plenty of
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> undesirable
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> behaviors I might never think to mention.  For example, Ben
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> empties on
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> route.  The best I've managed to do is teach him to pull over
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> first. To
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> me, this is a very undesirable behavior, but it did not occur 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> me
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> during
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the matching process to say so, any more than I would think 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> mention
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> a shoe salesman that I don't want my shoe laces coming untied
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> every 5
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> minutes.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Personally, I'd like to at least be made aware of any 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> undesirable
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> behavior
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the school is aware of, so I could either take immediate 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> steps to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> correct
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> it, or decide I don't want to deal with it at all.  You can 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> bet,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> next
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> time, I'll say very loudly that I don't want a dog who 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> empties on
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> route.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Then they'll probably give me a counter surfer instead. 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> <grimace.>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tracy
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Peggy,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thinking about it, you probably don't even really need to 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> know
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> why the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> match
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> didn't work, if its not something that is going to impact 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> only
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reason I can think of that a handler would need to know is 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> if the
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dog
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> some kind of medical condition where it is going to need
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> prescription
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dog
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> food, or baths every couple weeks, or something else that is
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> going to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> real hassel and/or cost a lot more money than usual.  But 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> then
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> again,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> think a handler should know this about any dog regardless if 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> its
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reissue
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> or not.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As long as the reissue matches what the new handler wants, 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> handler
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is specific in what they want, there shouldn't be any 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> problems.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> previous handler returned the dog because they didn't like
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> something
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> such
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that the dog scavenged a lot or counter surfed, etc, that
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shouldn't
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> matter
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> too much either because if the new handler specifically 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn't
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> want to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> deal
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with a major food distraction issue, they'd want to request 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a dog
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> isn't
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> too food distracted, or ideally, who doesn't have a food
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> distraction
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> problem
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> at all.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sarah & Miguel
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Peggy" <pshald at neb.rr.com<mailto:pshald at neb.rr.com>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dog
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Users"
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 6:29 AM
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ownerifitdoesn'tworkout
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with the first owner?
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That's just it, you have no idea why the match didn't work, 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> curious
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to find out, but schools don't always provide that 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> information.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> current Seeing Eye dog is a reissued dog and she is one of 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> best
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dogs
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have ever had.  As I said I'll always wonder why her 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> previous
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> match
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> didn't
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> work out but she is wonderful ... she was taken back to the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> school,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> re-evaluated and whatever else they have to do.  She lived 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> one of
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> instructor's offices for supervision for quite a while.  It 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> was
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> determined
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that she was still workable and was then matched with me 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it's
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> turned
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out wonderful.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Sarah Clark
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 10:15 PM
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dog
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Users
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second owner
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ifitdoesn'tworkout with the first owner?
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't think you can turn down all reissues, or classify 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all in
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> same category.  True that an occasional dog that is a 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reissue
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> may have
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> been
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sent back for unpleasant reasons like being too hard to 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> handle
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> handler, or certain health conditions that wouldn't stop 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the dog
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> working but that the handler didn't want to deal with, etc, 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> many
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are sent back for reasons that are not negative at all. 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Maybe
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the dog
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> just
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> walked too fast for the handler and they got home and 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> realized
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they couldn't slow the dog down (this happened to my 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> husband
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with a
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> guide
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> many years ago).  Maybe it just wasn't a good match.  Or 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> maybe
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> person
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> lived in a very hot climate and the dog just couldn't 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> handle the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> extreme
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> heat (also happened with someone I know).
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I wouldn't think twice about taking a reissue if the school
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thinks the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dog
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is a good match for me and what I'm looking for.  Its also 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> true
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have the experience under their belt so are often more 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> seasoned
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> than
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> younger dogs.  Though it is clear that some applicants 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> don't
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> want them
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because each school I have applied to has asked during the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> interview
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> if
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be open to having one.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sarah & Miguel
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Lyn Gwizdak" <linda.gwizdak at cox.net<mailto:linda.gwizdak at cox.net>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dog
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Users"
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 3:01 PM
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second owner 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> if
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> itdoesn'tworkout with the first owner?
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I know a guy who had a guide who had been reissued.  This 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dog
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> was with
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> guy who got himself arrested and a jail term and the dog 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> was
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> taken
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> him and my friend got this same dog.  Boy, what stories 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this dog
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have told if he could talk!  It was a very nice dog and 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> she
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> worked
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> well
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for my friend and she had a good long working life.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lyn and Landon
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Lisa Irving" <lirving1234 at cox.net<mailto:lirving1234 at cox.net>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dog
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Users"
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 1:24 AM
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second owner 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> if
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn'tworkout with the first owner?
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi there, Tami and Brittney,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The more I contemplate the re issuance of a guide dog, I 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> keep
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thinking
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> how much it means to me when someone gives me a second 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> chance.
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Our
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dogs
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> deserve as many chances as we can give them; first time 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> or re
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> issued.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lisa and Bernie
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Tamara Smith-Kinney" <tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Guide Dog
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Users'"
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2011 10:36 PM
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> owner if
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn'twork out with the first owner?
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Brittney,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm glad you asked this question.  That's one of those
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> program
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> policies
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ran across while researching for owner-training, and my 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> first
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> response
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the notion was very negative.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Since then, I've heard of enough positive experience 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dogs who
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> were
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reissued after being returned to have a more favorable 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> view
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> practice.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Most of what I've heard is from people who have done 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> well
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> re-issued
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dogs or from people who know people...  /smile/  Still, 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I get
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and understand the reasoning others have explained, and 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> does
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> seem
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> work
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for the most part.  There will certainly be times when 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn't,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is true of matches in general.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As for whether you're over-reacting...  As a still 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pretty new
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> only
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> somewhat experienced guide dog handler, also an 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> owner-trainer
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> then
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> self-taught handler, I've been observing the attitudes 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ways of
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thinking
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of handlers at or just above my level of experience as
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> closely as I
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> those of the long-timers.  I can watch my peers in that
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> regard to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> give
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> myself a reality check as to how I'm coming along not 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> just in
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> skill
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> maturity as a handler while I'm learning from those with 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> much
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experience.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So here's my observation, based not just on myself but 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> on a
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> generalized
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> group of other first time handlers going through or just
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> coming
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> past
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> team building phase:  We over-react.  To everything. 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> /lol/
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> good,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bad, the mundane...  It is all new and exciting and
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> frightening and
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wonderful and awful, all beyond belief.  We popped out 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dinner
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> just
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> evening, and at the restaurant there was just this one 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> little
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thing
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that no
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> one would have noticed beyond our table...  Outwardly, I
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> remained
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> calm
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> responded correctly and it was all okay.  Inwardly, what 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> did
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I do?
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> /lol/
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OMG!  How can this be?  What can it mean?  Oh, no, this 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is so
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> terrible!
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Then I noticed nothing had actually happened that was 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> worth
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fuss and
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> got over it.  /smile/  More and more, it's all old hat, 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> apparently
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> still freak out just fine over absolutely nothing.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As for working through bad habits in your re-issue 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dog... I
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> think
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> others
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are right in their observations that during the first 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> year or
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> so,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> there
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> will
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> always be something that will make you absolutely crazy 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dog.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your first dog, these will be far more magnified in your 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> own
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mind
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> than
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> those you work with later on as a truly experience 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dhandler.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bad
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> habits
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> need to be dealt with and modified, certainly, but it's 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> really
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> habit for
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you yet to deal with those ups and downs.  So you really 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> think
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> way through it and notice every little thing and try to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> figure out
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> how
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> counteract and...  Well, on and on.  It just takes 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> awhile for
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that to
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> become havit and natural.  I've only been there for a 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> short
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> while
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> minor blips where I freak out over nothing -- and that 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sure
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nice!
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Good luck with your dog; sounds like you're coming 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> through
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tream
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> building phase and are starting on the next one -- which 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> where
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> falls together and you're just you working your guide.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> /smile/
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> loving
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that, and trying to hold onto that feeling as I move 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> into the
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> taking
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for granted phase.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tami Smith-Kinney
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Behalf
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Of Brittney N. Mejico
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2011 3:20 PM
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: the National Association of Guide Dog Users NAGDU 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mailing
  >>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> List
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nagdu] should guides be given a second owner 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> if it
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn't
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> work
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out with the first owner?
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello all,
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My dog had another handler before me.  I don't think 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> guides
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> should
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> given another handlerbecause the dog picksup a lot of 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bad
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> habits
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are  really hard to get rid of.  I love my  dog very 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> muchand
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> harvard
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changed my life, but it took me a year to stop a lot of 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> her
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bad
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> habbits, and
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we still have some work to do.  What do you guys think? 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> am I
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reacting?
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> account
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> info
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/lirving1234%40cox.net<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/lirving1234%40cox.net>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> account
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> info
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.n<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.n>
  >>>>> et
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> info for
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
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  >>>>> l.net
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
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  >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/pshald%40neb.rr.com<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/pshald%40neb.rr.com>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dream as if you'll live forever, live as if you'll die 
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> today.
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
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  >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/goldflash9%40sbcgloba<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/goldflash9%40sbcgloba>
  >>>>> l.net
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
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  >>>>>
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
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  >>>>> l.net
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
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  >>>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>>
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  >>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
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  >>>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>>
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  >>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
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  >>>>>
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  >>>>> t
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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  >>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
  >>>>>>>>>> for
  >>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
  >>>>>>>>>>
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  >>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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  >>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
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  >>>>>>>>> nagdu:
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  >>>>> et
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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  >>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
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  >>>>>>>> for
  >>>>>>>> nagdu:
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/brittneymejico%40veri<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/brittneymejico%40veri>
  >>>>> zon.net
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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  >>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
  >>>>>>>> for
  >>>>>>>> nagdu:
  >>>>>>>>
  >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.ne<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.ne>
  >>>>> t
  >>>>>>>
  >>>>>>>
  >>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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  >>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
  >>>>>>> for
  >>>>>>> nagdu:
  >>>>>>>
  >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.n<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.n>
  >>>>> et
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>> _______________________________________________
  >>>>>> nagdu mailing list
  >>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
  >>>>>> nagdu:
  >>>>>>
  >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/brittneymejico%40veri<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/brittneymejico%40veri>
  >>>>> zon.net
  >>>>>>
  >>>>>> _______________________________________________
  >>>>>> nagdu mailing list
  >>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
  >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
  >>>>>> nagdu:
  >>>>>>
  >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.n<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.n>
  >>>>> et
  >>>>>
  >>>>>
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  >>>>> .net
  >>>>>
  >>>>>
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  >>>>>
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  >>>>> nagdu:
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  >>>>>
  >>>>
  >>>>
  >>>>
  >>>> _______________________________________________
  >>>> nagdu mailing list
  >>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
  >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
  >>>> nagdu:
  >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/brittneymejico%40verizon.net<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/brittneymejico%40verizon.net>
  >>>>
  >>>> _______________________________________________
  >>>> nagdu mailing list
  >>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
  >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
  >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
  >>>> nagdu:
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  >>>>
  >>>
  >>>
  >>>
  >>> _______________________________________________
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  >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
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  >> <GDA ownership 
  >> Agreement.rtf>_______________________________________________
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  >
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