[nagdu] questions about having a guide dog

Wed Aug 31 02:07:11 UTC 2011

Dear Tatyana.

I have written you privately but I'll also answer this question publicly.
For those who haven't had the dubious privilege of meeting me, this is Dan
Weiner from Florida with the Carter Dog, a spunky black lab from Leader
Dogs.

A dogs role in getting you across the street would be to guide you just as
on the sidewalk, keep you going in a straight line to the curb rather than
veering, and looking out for traffic and stopping or taking you out of the
way of danger.
When you cross a street with a guide dog, you first listen for traffic flow
as you would with a cane.
You issue the command, say "forward" which is the command indicating that
your dog should move in a straight line avoiding obstacles.
However, the dog will alter or refuse the command if according to training
it isn't safe.
This is sometimes called "intelligent disobedience".
When you actually do cross your dog will take you around obstacles and if a
car comes in front of you your dog will be trained to execute what's called
a traffic check.
This means that she, or he--smile--will stop or maybe step back to avoid the
car.
This has happened to all of us with dogs on numerous occasions--smile.
So, a good team of guide dog and human will have the potential to be safer
on street crossings.
I tend to veer when I use a cane, my dogs keep me moving straight and guide
me to the curb.

I felt qualified to answer this because, for one I'm a guide dog user like
so many others on the list--smile--and also because, before I got a dog, I
was very timid about street crossings.
I only hear in the right ear and telling the direction of traffic is very
difficult so I felt hesitant.
After getting a guide dog the training and the confidence I developed helped
me become more mobile and willing to risk travel to new areas and generally
it increased my sense of adventure.
The better I and my dog did, the more we went places.

I honestly think that in 1994 when I went for my first hound, if the school
rep has realized how rarely I crossed streets myself they might not have
given me a dog--smile.
The past 18 years have seen a dramatic change and yes, guys, in large part
due to having a dog's vision to help me out.

A dog can see and can react, according to his training, to things your can
might not be able to find until you hit them, including cars.

One of the incidents which led me to get a dog was crossing a street and
having my cane run over by a car.
The car was idling and I started across.
When I started walking, the seemingly unaware driver revved up the engine
and clobbered my poor helpless cane.
My cane was a cane no more but was splintered in t many unattractive
pieces--smile.
I walked in a daze and did the best I could until I got to my destination.

I don't honestly think I was a very good cane user, or maybe I was good but
I didn't have the confidence. Though I did all right in mobility lessons, I
tended not to cross any streets myself and spent a lot of time being guided
around.  This left me impatient and frankly rather resentful.
You don't, therefore, need to be an excellent cane user to get a dog.  You
do need to have some idea of orientation, knowing where you are in your
environment and how to get there.
You also have to be wiling to really work at developing these skills.
These are just thoughts off the top of my head as we say.

Let's take a typical crossing Dan Weiner might make.
Walking on state highway 426 heading east.  The street is on my right.
I am crossing streets that are in front or sometimes entrances to parking
lots.
Dan listens to the constantly flowing traffic on the right, how loud, what a
pain.
I have the light, a car is idling.
Dan intones "Carter, forward" and off they go.
The car starts up, the guy wanted to just break in to the oncoming traffic
while there was an opening.
After five steps on to the crossing that's what happens. Carter stops
suddenly, and steps back.  Dan knows that something is happening though he
wasn't sure what.  Carter waits for the car to pass and then proceeds, he
takes me around an island.
Yes, I knew it was there but it's nice to just walk around it.
He moves then back in a straight line or resuming the straight line and
steps on to the up curb.  Dan praises Carter and off they go.

Now, having aid that, you still need to pay attention, dogs aren't robots
and could get distracted, but I would say that after you're a working team
incidents of mistakes on crossings are less and less.

If you have any other questions, write to us on the list or write me
privately.

Cordially,

Dan the man, Carter the dog

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Tatyana
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 9:31 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] questions about having a guide dog

Hi all,
Thanks to you  all so much for your detailed and informative answers. I very
appreciate  that you take my  questions so closely. I need to process
through all that you've said.  Of cause I'll have  more questions. My
neighborhood is very walkable so I can rich  any place myself but from other
hand if I would have a dog I could expand an area of my trips. I feel very
limited with my mobility skills crossing major intersections without an
audio signal. And  I can't cross an  unfamiliar intersection

Would a having a dog make a difference?

I understand,  that I do give a command to a dog not a dog walk me to other
side.

Does that mean I need to be  first a great cane user traveler before getting
a dog?

If so, what would  be a role of a dog crossing streets if I would be a great
traveler my self? Why I would need it?

Thanks again for your time.

Tatyana.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Julie J." <julielj at neb.rr.com>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 8:30 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] questions about having a guide dog

> Tatyana,
>
> Thanks for joining us on the list!  I'm Julie, one of the moderators. 
> Your questions don't have any hard and fast answers, but I'll give you my 
> take.
>
> Can a dog handle a plane ride of 11 hours?
> Depends on the dog.  Some dogs could do it.  Don't feed or water before 
> going and be sure to give ample opportunity to relieve beforehand.  If you

> can work the trip into an overnight thing so the dog will be sleeping that

> would probably be best.   My older retired guide dog frequently goes from 
> 8 pm to 8 am or later without going outside.  She has the opportunity, she

> just chooses not to take it sometimes.
>
> Can a guide dog go two weeks without working and maintain it's skills?
> Yes, absolutely.  Last summer I had an accident and couldn't work Monty 
> for a couple of weeks.  He jumped back into guiding like he hadn't missed 
> a day.  this summer I broke my foot.  Monty hasn't worked in 5 weeks and I

> expect it will be another 8 before he'll be working again.  He may need a 
> bit of brush up training to get back into tip top condition, but I expect 
> the core skills will still be there.
>
> Now if you are asking about being separated from the dog for two weeks 
> that is a bit different.  I do send my guide to the dog sitter sometimes 
> when I travel.  He really likes it there.  The longest I've ever left him 
> was 10 days.  I think if I had it to do over I'd try to limit the 
> separation to a week.  I also don't leave him frequently, maybe once a 
> year or less.  all that said, life happens and you do what you have to do.

> If you need to be separated for two weeks or longer it can be worked out.
>
> Do I have access problems frequently?
> No.  Actually I've only had one and it was resolved through my explaining 
> things to the hotel clerk.  the entire episode lasted only a few minutes 
> and was resolved to my complete satisfaction.  I live in the U.S. in a 
> rural agricultural based area.  People here are used to dogs with jobs.  I

> don't use taxi's since there aren't any.  Access problems and their 
> frequency seem to vary quite a bit depending on location and type of 
> places you frequent.  I don't want to sound judgmental, but ethnic 
> restaurants are notorious for access issues as are taxi's with ethnically 
> diverse drivers.
>
> I'm glad you're asking questions!  It would be concerning if you had no 
> questions about getting a guide dog.  Again, welcome to the list!  If you 
> think of anything else ask away!
> Julie
>
>
> On 8/30/2011 6:35 PM, Tatyana wrote:
>> Hi,
>> I'm not a guide dog user, still can't decide.Many, many questions.
>>
>> Can a dog stand 11 hours in an airplane before to relief?
>>
>> If you are not taking a dog with you while you're on leave, can a dog 
>> stay without  you for 2 weeks and not lose its shape as a service dog? 
>> Wouldn't it be also  a bad psychological impact?
>>
>> How often do you need to fight for the  right  to bring  a   dog with you

>> in restaurants, pools,  medical offices and other public places? Is it 
>> something that you do all the time or you get  mostly normal attitude 
>> from employees?
>>
>> Thank you and all the best
>> Tatyana.
>>
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