[nagdu] NFB Convention Guide Dog Policy

Wed Jul 6 14:47:24 UTC 2011

I've been thinking about this. 
All the dogs that caused problems at the 1994?? Convention are probably dead now. 
Anybody interested in a "Where are you now"? article about the handlers that acted inappropriately? 
I'd love to see something like that.

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tami Kinney
Sent: Sunday, July 03, 2011 11:36 PM
To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [nagdu] NFB Convention Guide Dog Policy

Julie,

There is that. /smile/ I had never thought of it this way, but if asking
us to follow a policy that is not horrifically restrictive and not
beyond the bounds of good sense is paternalistic, etc., etc., then isn't
giving us those unbelievably low rates for really great rooms in really
great hotels also paternalistic, etc., etc.?  What, do they think that
just because we're blind we can't afford to pay triple digis for those
rooms like everyone else?  That is just plain offensive! Er.. I'm being
sarcastic.  Trust me, I am way too poor to get there right now, and even
when I get to where I'm not, it will be a long time yet before I can
afford to *think* about staying in a hotel like the ones we host
Convention in!  Honestly, getting to stay at that level of hotel is at
around or below (the year I went, if I recall properly) Comfort Inn
prices is a great treat from my point of view. I love fancy
hotels. /smile/

I dunno. I've been to plenty of business and other conventions, and it
seems I remember being handed plenty of lists of rules for attendees at
the hotel and convention centers, as well as plenty of sardonic joking
and eye rolling with friends and co-workers over some of them.  But I do
not ever remember discussing whether our civil rights were being
violated because we were being asked to behave like adult
representatives of whatever group we were affiliated with, even when the
rules in question seemed restrictive by forbidding us from doing
something any or all of us might ordinarily do when traveling privately.
In those cases, we were either getting drastically reduced rate or, in
the case of work-related conventions, being reimbursed for our expenses
-- also under certain restrictions which often seemed silly, frankly, to
me and many as individuals. But we weren't there as individuals, we were
there as members of a group, and a large group can work more smoothly if
everyone knows what's expected of them ahead of time. And if they get
themselves in trouble anyway, whoever is running the show can better
deal with them, frankly, because of those dratted rules the troublemaker
chose to ignore.

So I suppose I've always taken this rule as in the same vein. A
convention with special arrangements and rates is a business arrangement
between the organizers of the even and the hotel/convention
center/whatever who is providing the space and accommodations. The
special rates for large groups are what the business believes it can
bear as a cost of increasing business by the hosting of the event. If
some fool with no sense of responsibility decides to misbehave in a way
that has a negative impact on the company's business, then guess what? I
don't get to have my affordable stay a ritzy hotel next time there's a
convention for that group, do I?  In a more localized setting,
convention may just not happen for awhile since no place with the space
for our convention will touch us with a ten-foot ple unless we pay
extra.  So that sucks for a lot of people, just because some so-called
adult thought it was just fine to break the rules that were clearly just
for children.

So, yes. We have a right to take our dogs to these hotels. If damage
occurs as a result of our taking our dogs, the hotel has the right to
charge us for that. If our dogs' behavior is disruptive, the hotel has
the right to ask us to take the behavior problem off the premises.  They
do not have the right to charge us extra for our guide and/or service
dogs.  The *do* have the right to charge us the same as they charge
everybody else.

So, maybe there *is* a better solution than creating some rule that says
we can't leave our dogs unattended at convention in a hotel where we pay
a fraction of what private individuals are paying for the same
accommodations.  We're *not* individuals in that case. We're part of a
group, and a pretty big one at that.  It is in that group's interest to
ensure that things go smoothly for the duration of the annual convention
in question and so that we can continue to have our little get-togethers
in the future in great accommodations at rates their members can
actually afford.

Now, if I'm traveling on my own hook on my own business, having made my
own arrangements, and some bozo from the NFB -- or any bozo at all, for
that matter, up to and including DD -- starts tellng me how to handle my
dog, there will be words and strong ones.  And that's only because I
just can't be certain of the outcome if I take the straighter and more
simplified route to expressing my willingness to accept that kind of
crap! Oh, how many times I have wished I had the height and reach to
just punch somebody in the nose and knock them down.  /lol/

Who knows? Perhaps one of these days we will come up with a solution
that is more to the liking of all involved for our conventions. There
are aspect of the way Jenine described that I do find very good indeed.
I wouldn't want to be the one to administer them, that's for
sure.  /smile/  But there could be some ideas there that could work for
somebody who is willing to take on the headache.  i am not suggesting
it, not by any means, because I do not want that someone to be
me!  /lol/

I hope everybody is having a great convention while I finish catching up
on all the stuff you discussed beforehand.  So I can get to all the
great stuff you who went talk about when you get back!

On Thu, 2011-06-30 at 17:52 -0500, Julie J. wrote:
> Jeff,
> 
> I see your point and to some degree you are correct.  However I think 
> the NFB could ensure that a person not get the cheaper group room rate 
> or be eligible to register for convention and various events occurring 
> at convention.  But if a person really wanted to go to the same hotel at 
> the same time as the convention was going on, I don't see how that could 
> be prevented.
> 
> Julie
> 
> 
> On 6/30/2011 3:58 PM, Jeffrey Young wrote:
> > How exactly can the NFB and Nagdu ban someone from attending convention? It seems a shallow threat that can't be inforced.
> >
> > Jeff and Hansel
> > On Jun 30, 2011, at 2:49 PM, The Pawpower Pack wrote:
> >
> >> I just returned from the American Association of the Deafblind conference.  I left my dog for about an hour or so to go swimming.  I put the do not disturb sign on the door, and she was quiet the entire time-- my neighbor didn't hear a thing.
> >> I would agree that if a dog destroys or damages property in the room that it is the handler's responsibility to pay for that, just as they would if it was themselves, or their child.  Laveau didn't do anything but lay by the door and wait while I was gone.
> >> I couldn't have gone swimming if I had been forced to take her with me.
> >> It is important to know your dog and to be sure he/she can handle being alone, but if a person is responsible, and if the person addresses and resolves any complaints so that they don't happen again, I don't see the issue here.
> >>
> >> Rox and the Kitchen Bitches
> >> Bristol (retired), Mill'E SD and Laveau guide dog, CGC.
> >> Do not meddle in the affaires of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
> >> http://pawpower4me.blogspot.com
> >> pawpower4me at gmail.com
> >> AIM: lillebriss
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> nagdu mailing list
> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jeff.young8806%40gmail.com
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nagdu mailing list
> > nagdu at nfbnet.org
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/julielj%40neb.rr.com
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nagdu mailing list
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast.net

_______________________________________________
nagdu mailing list
nagdu at nfbnet.org
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pickrell%40tasc.com