[nagdu] leaving your dog alone

Tami Kinney tamara.8024 at comcast.net
Fri Jul 15 20:00:27 UTC 2011 

Oh, goodie! We can go around talking our dogs' heads off. /lol/
Apparently, a surprising number of guide dog users do that without
realizing it until somebody points it out to them. Those who have
admitted to such silliness don't appear to know why they're doing it,
either. Living alone does make it really easy to fall into the havit of
just talking to your dog like you do people, though. Then again, now
that I live with two other humans and another dog and a chincilla, we
all just talk to all the animals like they're people, and they just act
like this is normal and that they have come to expect it. We sspell
words in front of the dogs before we realize that this is not fooling
them a tall.  /lol/ 

So I've been considering why I talk so much to Mitzi about what we're
doing and where we're going and so forth. When we're at the dog park,
people seem to be a little confused by my asking her where things are,
like the trash for a full doggie bag, until she just walks over and
shows me while I follow her jingle. Or I will ask her where her ball is,
aand they won't realize I'm talking to her. /lol/ She's trained to "show
me" but "where is...?" works just as well. Funny critter.

Anyway, I've also been noticing that my dog is trained and doesn't need
a whole lot of cheerleading from me anymore, but I always end up with my
clicker in hand, using it to click randomly without realizing it in a
way that I can't possibly pass of even to myself as reinforcing behavior
more complex than putting one foot in front of the other. So one day I
left Mitzi at the groomer, grabbed my cane and clicker and off I went,
clicking that cane every time it hesitated to allow me to figure out
where I was in order to find something...  I would catch myself asking
myself where's the door... Um... 

So I finally clued in to what I'm actually doing there. I'm using
echolocation to figure out my surroundings. /lol/ I go around yakking
annoyingly -- even to myself -- sometimes whn I'm feeling a bit lost
literally just to hear the sound of my own voice. So now I'm working on
finding ways to use echolocation without alla the random
chatter. /smmile/ The clicker really does make a difference, and Mitzi
is apparently used to my random clicking  beyond reinforcing the
occasional good move just for kicks... Huh. Some trainer I am. /lol/  I
can't use the ffinger snap technique of echolocation, because that's
what I use with her to let her know I'm serious and she can now stop
testing me and remember her manners.  Don't have to do that often, but
it's a quick way to end an argument when she's beeing snotty. The
tongue-click doesn't always work for me, but I'm kinda trying it, too. I
feel very stupid just at the thought of using it in public, but if it
works...  

I will still keep talking to Mitzi like she's people, of course, and she
will still nod and grin and show me where things are just because I
happen to be wondering.  /grin/

Tami

On Thu, 2011-07-14 at 18:31 -0400, Sean Moore wrote:
> One of these days I need to meet you Tami. You also seem to talk to Mitzi as 
> much as I do Franklin. Maybe because I live alone and that i'm only my early 
> 20s.
> 
> No idea.
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Tami Kinney" <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
> To: <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, July 14, 2011 5:41 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] leaving your dog alone
> 
> 
> > Gary,
> >
> > Ah, the poodle howl. I find Mitzi's quite lovely, but one can't always
> > vouch for the neighbors sharing one's taste in howling dogs. /lol/ Mitzi
> > has an absolute talent for the little whine and a variety of piteous,
> > broken-hearted yips to send after me just to make sure I understand how
> > terribly I have caused her such pain as to step outside the
> > door... /lol/ I had to work up to leaving her for any time at all by
> > herself before she was socialized enough to go with  me to more and more
> > places. Actually, I would use grounding as negative reinforcement, and
> > that actually worked. Who knew? /lol/
> >
> > She does much better if I tell her to stay and make sure to let her know
> > where I'm going and why she needs to stay behind, etc., etc. Just taking
> > off without her is a serious infraction of the rules and is not allowed!
> > It had better be a good reason, too, or I am not off the hook! Funny
> > dog, my poodle. I don't leave her alone at home with no humans present,
> > because we just can't be that sure of Daisy. We're just not willing to
> > take the risk that something might happen to set off her anxiety and
> > cause her to redline, so Mitzi just doesn't stay home with her without
> > supervision. Just in case. I'm glad to feel perfectly comfortable
> > leaving her with DD, whom she adores, but... He assures me that if I
> > want to go off and leave her for so long as 15 minutes to half an hour
> > that she will drive him nuts. Huh. The couple of times I've done that,
> > she has apparently paced and sighed and whined , which is all very
> > heart-rending to him, so then he gets her quited down and tries to relax
> > and watch TV, so she starts all over again.  /smile/ Ah, well. I so
> > rarely have a reason even to consider leaving her with him that it'snot
> > a huge trial to me. Also, frankly, I like having my dog with me enough
> > that there are an extremely limited number of conditions that cause me
> > to think about it ever. Mostly heat-related in the summer because of her
> > black coat and because of the dearth of sidewalks around here which
> > means too much walking directly on blacktop. Booties do help with
> > protecting her paws there, but they seem to increase the effects of heat
> > for her by cutting off one source of air and cooling.  Her coat is just
> > so super thick that it doesn't let the heat go once it's collected it.
> > Or am I just too tender-hearted. /lol/
> >
> > Anyway, I'm glad to know your poodle does better when you take the time
> > to explain things to him, whatever it is our mysterious curly ones
> > perceive or understand of the words we're saying. Frankly, based on my
> > observations of Mitzi poodle, I would not be at all surpried to learn
> > science had discovered that what she hears and understands when I talk
> > is only slightly more advanced than what a human does. I really do
> > wonder what goes on in that brain of hers. Daisy shows a great deal of
> > understanding of what we say, as well, and to respond to it, especially
> > ifit  involves  the word "go." /lol/ Even before we make moves to enact
> > the plan we concoctedover morning coffee, she knows the game is afoot!
> > Mitz, however, has responded to specifically to random conversation with
> > strangers for me to discount the possibility that she's getting
> > something close to a word by word comprehension. You know, I'll be
> > talking to someone, say at the mall,  and mention that I plan to go
> > upstairs and hope i remember where the escalator is. THen I'll chat
> > about other stuff, maybe mention I'm off to Starbuck's first... So then
> > Mitzi and I part from  whomever it is I was talking to and just kinda go
> > off to Starbuck's , then I pause to wrack my brain again for the
> > location of that dratted escalator, then notice I haven't said a word
> > but am being guided straight from Starbuck's to the escalator since that
> > is the next step on the itineraray.  I've actually had arguments with my
> > silly dog over a sudden change in itinerary. Nop! We're going to Plaid
> > Pantry, then to Meat, then to Wild Oat... Circle K was not on the
> > itinerary you presented to me, so we're not going there just brecause
> > you suddenly remembered something you need from them the Plad Pantry
> > doesn't have. /lol/ She did that a couple of times or more before
> > finally relenting and agreeing that it wouldn't kill her to allow me to
> > change my mind every now and then.  I don't get that, really I don't,
> > but her behavior does indicate that something like that is what is going
> > on. Very strange.
> >
> > Tami
> >
> > On Tue, 2011-07-12 at 15:34 -0700, GARY STEEVES wrote:
> >> Hi:
> >>
> >> I've learned that Bogart is pretty good at staying alone. Last summer I'd 
> >> had him for about 2 months when my girlfriend went away for 2 weeks. I 
> >> had left him alone for short periods with no issues so he seemed fine for 
> >> the about 5 hours I was out to see some bands.
> >>
> >> The only time he had a problem was once when Susan and I went out to look 
> >> at an apartment and thought it best to not introduce the dog issue before 
> >> we even decided if we were interested. We got out side and could hear him 
> >> howling from the back alley. I went back up and sort of got in his face 
> >> and said enough. I got him to his bed and told him to stay. Of course, he 
> >> didn't stay as I was leaving but he got that he wasn't forgotten. 
> >> Saturdays we often take him out to the dog park or for long walks at 
> >> least so he wasn't happy about being left behind. The other time was when 
> >> I was in Germany and left him with Susan. For the one weekday I was away, 
> >> she came home from work to take him out. I didn't think that was 
> >> necessary and when she brought him back and then had to  leave again he 
> >> did the howling thing again. She went back did the same thing as before 
> >> and he was fine. In that case I think he would have been better just to 
> >> have been left alone for longer rather than her coming home and he being 
> >> disappointed with her leaving yet one more time.
> >>
> >> I've learned that it is important that I tell him as we are getting ready 
> >> that he is gong to stay home or stay with susan if I have to go out 
> >> without him. He seems to understand in some way what we are saying so is 
> >> less upset.
> >>
> >> Yesterday I went out for a bike ride and came home. We played a bit but 
> >> then I had to head out to a jazz jam and it broke my little heart as he 
> >> gave a little whine as he realized what was happening. Our little guys 
> >> certainly have a direct route to our hearts don't they?
> >>
> >> Anyway, I think it is important to be able to leave your dog at home 
> >> alone for a good amount of time just so you have the option. I Also agree 
> >> to start in stages. I left him alone while I went and got the mail, or 
> >> went to the storage room, getting the laundry. Once I was sure that was 
> >> fine then it was running to the store or out to get a bottle of wine. :) 
> >> Once that was good it was going out for supper close by and then it ended 
> >> up with me going out to see some bands last summer when Susan was away.
> >>
> >> He seems pretty good and we haven't heard him howling or had any negative 
> >> reports from the neighbours so I think my way has worked for Bogart.
> >>
> >> Gary
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: Wayne Merritt <wcmerritt at gmail.com>
> >> Date: Tuesday, July 12, 2011 11:29 am
> >> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Guide dog Schools
> >> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
> >> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> >>
> >> > At The Seeing Eye, they recommend slowly introducing the dog to being
> >> > left alone, such as leaving for a few minutes, then for an hour, then
> >> > for several hours, and so forth. They definitely don't recommend to
> >> > walk out and leave them in a strange house the first time you leave
> >> > the dog alone. As you say though, each dog/team is different. The
> >> > first time I left my current guide at my parent's house, I had
> >> > forgotten about this gradual leaving the dog home thing. I went to
> >> > dinner with a friend and was gone for several hours. The next
> >> > day, I
> >> > asked my folks how my doggy did, and was told that the dog had some
> >> > anxiety about being left at home. They did say that when they
> >> > put her
> >> > leash on her that she was better, but when I heard about her anxiety,
> >> > I also made a mental note not to leave her alone for several
> >> > hours the
> >> > first time she was in a new place. That was operator error on my part
> >> > and not her fault. Funny, that last statement brings to mind a phrase
> >> > I had heard some time ago from a service dog trainer which can be
> >> > applied to our guides. It went something like, "If something happens
> >> > an the dog misbehaves, more than likely it's your fault."
> >> >
> >> > Wayne
> >> >
> >> > On 7/12/11, PICKRELL, REBECCA M (TASC)
> >> > <REBECCA.PICKRELL at tasc.com> wrote:
> >> > > I don't know the duration schools say for leaving a dog
> >> > shortly after coming
> >> > > home, but I left my dog for an evening to go to an Indigo
> >> > Girls concert. The
> >> > > dog was fine.
> >> > > I say this because you don't want to sell yourself short of
> >> > fun stuff to do,
> >> > > and because our dogs will be fine. I was gone for a night.
> >> > > Also, it was one of those things where me not going would have
> >> > been more
> >> > > upsetting then staying home with my dog.
> >> > > Also, if you do have to travel, your dog will adjust. That's
> >> > what they do.
> >> > >
> >> > > -----Original Message-----
> >> > > From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-
> >> > bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> >> > > Of Julie McGinnity
> >> > > Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 3:21 PM
> >> > > To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> >> > > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Guide dog Schools
> >> > >
> >> > > Hi Brianna.
> >> > >
> >> > > I went for my first dog when I was still in high school, so I was
> >> > > thinking about the same things you seem to be now.  I
> >> > went to
> >> > > GEB(Guiding Eyes for the blind).  I had a great
> >> > experience.  I worked
> >> > > well with the trainers, even though I was young and worried about
> >> > > everything.  Even if you would like a shorter program, I
> >> > just would
> >> > > like to remind you that all schools recommend that you don't travel
> >> > > with your dog or leave your dog alone to take a trip for the
> >> > first few
> >> > > months.  Also, a lot of your first Summer with that dog
> >> > will be full
> >> > > of that dog.  You and your dog will be forming a bond,
> >> > which is quite
> >> > > magical, but it does take time and energy.
> >> > >
> >> > > If you have any questions about Guide dogs, dog schools, or Guiding
> >> > > Eyes, feel free to email me off list.
> >> > >
> >> > > Now I have to get my own little dog out from under a
> >> > bed!  :)
> >> > >
> >> > > On 7/11/11, Cindy Ray <cindyray at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > >> Which school of those do you think you would like?
> >> > >>
> >> > >>
> >> > >> _______________________________________________
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> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > --
> >> > > Julie McG
> >> > >  Lindbergh High School class of 2009, participating
> >> > member in Opera
> >> > > Theater's Artist in Training Program, and proud graduate of Guiding
> >> > > Eyes for the Blind
> >> > >
> >> > > "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that
> >> > > everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal
> >> > > life."
> >> > > John 3:16
> >> > >
> >> > > _______________________________________________
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> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pickrell%40tasc.com>
> >> > > _______________________________________________
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> >> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/wcmerritt%40gmail.com>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > -- 
> >> > Follow me on Twitter at:
> >> > www.twitter.com/wcmerritt
> >> > My websites:
> >> > www.wayneism.com
> >> > www.whitecaneday.org
> >> >
> >> > _______________________________________________
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