[nagdu] nagdu Digest, Vol 75, Issue 32

PICKRELL, REBECCA M (TASC) REBECCA.PICKRELL at tasc.com
Tue Jun 28 12:16:05 UTC 2011


What I meant guys, is that there seems to be a lot of mythologizing of the guide dog users of yesterday. The ones who are probably dead now and can set none of us straight on how things really were.
I wonder if that plays into the stats, comparing a super blind guy or gal from 1930 with a super dog to the meer mortal human dog teams of today.


-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione
Sent: Monday, June 27, 2011 4:15 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] nagdu Digest, Vol 75, Issue 32

Hi Bertha.
I think Rebecca said "super blind guy" to separate it from ordinary blind
guys, who don't walk 10 miles a day at 5 miles per hour.  Though I believe
there are some such on this list, and I freely admit to being a lesser
woman than they.  Though I don't really have the time to walk 10 miles a
day, unless I got up at 3 AM.  Oh well. I'm sure I'd be healthier for it,
but I am what I am. We all do the best we can.
Tracy

> Maybe I'm being a little overly sensitive but I have a question about your
> statement: "The super blind guy or gal who walks 10 miles a day at 5 miles
> per hour in all kinds of weather:. Does this mean, if we don't walk ten
> miles a day five miles an hour in all kinds of weather, that we are less
> than desirable handlers?
>
> Again, forgive me if I am a bit sensitive, I am a first time handler and
> just returned home from Morristown with many concerns and not giving my
> dog
> the exercise she was accustomed to in New Jersey is top on the list.
> Bertha
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of PICKRELL, REBECCA M (TASC)
> Sent: Monday, June 27, 2011 1:22 PM
> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] nagdu Digest, Vol 75, Issue 32
>
> I'm curious about Holly's statement re dogs having a more demanding life
> now.
> I'd bet that very few of us were around in the 1920's and 1930's. I'd
> argue
> that food for dogs wasn't as healthy, medical care wasn't as good, and
> dogs
> had more wear and tear on their bodies just like people would have back
> then.
> Ideas? Finally, we know a bit more about breeding then we did back in the
> 1920's or I'd imagine we would.
> I am curious about standards of behavior. Do you all think they were less
> then what we'd expect now or higher.
> What about behavior of the handler? The super blind guy or gal who walks
> 10
> miles a day at 5 miles per hour in al lkinds of weather comes to mind.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of holly mcknight
> Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2011 6:02 PM
> To: nagdu
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] nagdu Digest, Vol 75, Issue 32
>
>
> Hi All, I have several things to comment on.  I haven't been on much
> lately
> due to my crazy life.  I love the spoof article on "evil blind people."
> When
> I was a student at CCB almost twenty years ago, we all joked about using
> "evil sight." That was fun.  I think if we can't laugh at ourselves and
> our
> prsent situation, things are sad indeed.  I am a three time GDB grad and
> have been using dogs for almost eighteen years.  When I started, I was
> told
> that only about half the puppies born at my school made it as guides for
> one
> reason or another.  I have now heard that about sixty percent are chosen.
> Our dogs now, lead a much more demanding life in general than they used
> to.
> This is because there are noqw more blind people in the work force, or
> just
> out and about doing things, like having families, etc.  I know having a
> dog
> was one of the best choices I have ever made and I strongly encourage
> those
> who have a life that a dog would help in, to apply and train with one.
> Hope
> these thoughts help, and again thank you for having a list to bounce
> things
> around on and learn from each other.  Hope all are well.
>
>
>> From: nagdu-request at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: nagdu Digest, Vol 75, Issue 32
>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 16:47:40 -0500
>>
>> Send nagdu mailing list submissions to
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>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of nagdu digest..."
>>
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>> 1. Greetings and a Thank You (Robert Martin)
>> 2. Re: question about convention and booties. (cheryl echevarria)
>> 3. Re: Greetings and a Thank You (cheryl echevarria)
>> 4. Re: Greetings and a Thank You (Dan Weiner)
>> 5. Re: Success stats (Tami Kinney)
>> 6. Re: Success stats (Jeffrey Young)
>> 7. Re: question about convention and booties. (Tami Kinney)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 14:56:29 -0500
>> From: Robert Martin <robert.martin at cfu.net>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: [nagdu] Greetings and a Thank You
>> Message-ID: <91DDA37F489E4C0387AF18705D6A7BB5 at robert165me37x>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>
>> Good Morning,
>>
>> For the past couple of months I've been an infrequent contributer but a
> frequent reader of the contributions to this tlist. I have been unable to
> read everything because of my work but I have learned a great deal in
> preparation for my trip to the Seeing Eye to train with a guide dog
> partner.
> Tomorrow I fly to Morristown to begin my training and what I have learned
> from all of you gives me some sense of security and also confidence that I
> have, at a later age in life, made the right decision. Thanks to all of
> you
> for your work and the information you share.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Bob Martin
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 15:59:07 -0400
>> From: "cheryl echevarria" <cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] question about convention and booties.
>> Message-ID: <BLU162-ds133D8B2818AF54BBBF70D5A1520 at phx.gbl>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>
>> my very first convention in 2007 in Atlanta, was the first one I went
> alone with Maxx, I had just got him in Feb of 2007. He was great, never
> estimate you dogs, I find maxx works better after seeing other dogs, it's
> like us seeing our old friends, and once he calms down after saying hello,
> we have to remember our training of meet and greeting people I think we
> sometimes forget.
>>
>> Myself included.
>>
>> I again will be alone, Hubby not coming, but welcome which ever you
> decide.
>>
>> I might be at the full meeting on the 3rd I am also giving a
>> presentation
> at the Travel and Tourism meeting, so I have to budget my time.
>>
>> Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
>>
>> Cheryl Echevarria
>> http://www.echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/>
>> 631-456-5394
>>
> reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com>
>>
>> Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel
> CST-1018299-10
>>
>> Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise & Travel,
> Inc.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Sherrill O'Brien<mailto:sherrill.obrien at verizon.net>
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
> Users<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 3:19 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] question about convention and booties.
>>
>>
>> Hello Tara,
>>
>> You've certainly come to the right place for advice on this important
>> question. It's especially difficult to make this decision if you and/or
> your
>> dog have never experienced an NFb convention.
>> Though many on this list have read the excellent Braille Monitor article
>> about taking your guide to convention, there are always new subscribers
> who
>> have never read it. So I am pasting it in this post following my name.
>> If
>> you have never read it and are debating whether to take your dog, this
>> article will be extremely helpful to you.
>>
>> I have never used booties on my dogs, and I've lived in Florida for
>> thirty
>> years. Sidewalks are truly not too hot for your dog's paws. As Julie
>> said,
>> it's the asphalt in parking lots which you should avoid during the heat
>> of
>> the day. There is a large parking lot which I have to cross to get to
>> the
>> grocery store or my church. I don't worry about it in the morning and
>> evening. But in the summer, I don't walk on it during most of the day.
>> It's a good idea to stop and put your hand down flat on the asphalt, and
>> if you can't leave it there for more than a couple seconds, I wouldn't
>> subject my dog to it unless it's just a short distance from, say, a car
>> to
>> the grass or the sidewalk. I especially make sure I don't force my dog
>> to
>> stand still for any length of time on it. But remember that if you work
> your
>> dog outside all year, the pads naturally toughen up.
>>
>> And please know that there will be lots of experienced guide dog users
>> at
>> convention who will be more than glad to help you out with any questions
> or
>> concerns should you decide to bring your dog.
>>
>> Sherrill
>>
>> Top Ten Tips for a Successful Convention Trip with a Guide Dog
>> Braille Monitor
>>
>> May
>> 2006
>> Top Ten Tips for a Successful Convention Trip with a Guide Dog
>> by Melissa Riccobono
>>
>> >From the Editor: The following article first appeared in the
> Spring/Summer
>> 2005
>> issue of Harness Up, the publication of the National Association of
>> Guide
>> Dog
>> Users. Melissa Riccobono is an exemplary guide dog user. She has
>> slightly
>> revised her article for publication in the Braille Monitor in
>> preparation
>> for
>> the 2006 national convention. It contains valuable advice for all of us,
>> guide
>> dog and cane users alike. This is what she says:
>>
>> The NFB national convention--there's absolutely nothing like it! The
> energy,
>> the
>> meetings, the people, the late nights and early mornings... I can
>> honestly
>> say
>> it's the busiest, craziest week I'll spend all year. I've been going to
> the
>> NFB
>> national convention for the last seven years, and every year I swear
>> I'll
>> try to
>> get more sleep and eat meals more regularly so that I won't get so
>> exhausted,
>> but somehow that never works out. And actually I wouldn't have it any
> other
>> way.
>> I wouldn't feel as if I was at convention unless I was a part of the
> crazy,
>> chaotic convention experience.
>> Yet in the midst of the chaos and the hectic schedule, I need to stop
>> and
>> take
>> the convention experience of someone else into account. That someone is
>> my
>> nine-year-old black lab, Fanta. Fanta has been coming to conventions
>> with
> me
>> from the beginning, and I know it's a hectic, stressful week for her.
>> But
>> over
>> the years I've learned a lot about Fanta at convention, and I've
>> realized
>> some
>> things I can do to make this week in July as easy as possible for her.
>> I'd
>> like
>> to share my top ten tips with guide dog users in hopes that some of them
>> will
>> help to make convention easier for your dogs. I'm sure many of you
>> already
>> do
>> some or all of these things, but I hope you will read this article to
>> the
>> end,
>> because it never hurts to be reminded of the small things we can do to
> make
>> our
>> dogs' convention experiences more enjoyable.
>>
>> Tip 1. Decide if Convention Is the Right Place for Your Dog.
>> This seems obvious, but I encourage you to take a few minutes now to
>> think
>> about
>> whether the national convention is the right place to take your dog. I
>> believe
>> you should do this especially if you've never taken your dog to
>> convention
>> before. Ask yourself the following questions.
>>
>> Is your dog extremely stressed in big crowds of people?
>> Is your dog afraid of canes?
>> Does your dog get along with other dogs, or does he or she tend to be
>> aggressive
>> toward them?
>> Is your dog easily distracted by other dogs?
>> How long have you and your dog been together?
>> Are you confident in your ability to work well as a team?
>>
>> Bear in mind that convention is full of crowds of people, many of them
>> swinging
>> long white canes back and forth, as well as many other guide dogs. If
>> your
>> dog
>> exhibits extreme stress in large crowds; is afraid of canes; or is
>> aggressive
>> toward, afraid of, or distracted by other dogs, convention is probably
>> not
> a
>> good place for him or her to be. In my opinion convention is also not
> likely
>> to
>> be a good place for a new guide dog team. I would recommend a team be
>> together
>> at least four months before attending a convention, but of course this
>> varies
>> from one team to another. Some teams jell after only a month or so,
>> while
>> others
>> might take a year to really settle down and work their best together.
>> Think about how well you and your dog work together and how stress makes
> you
>> act
>> and react toward your dog. If you become upset and stressed in crowded,
>> noisy
>> situations and you transmit these feelings to your dog, convention would
>> probably be a good place to brush up on your cane skills.
>> If you're wondering whether or not you should take your dog to national
>> convention, I suggest you talk with someone who takes or has taken his
>> or
>> her
>> dog to convention. Such a person can give you many more details about
>> what
>> convention is like than I can in this article. In fact, perhaps talking
>> to
>> two
>> or more people would be helpful since everyone's experience is slightly
>> different.
>>
>> Tip 2. Treat Your Dog for Fleas before You Leave Home.
>> So, you've decided to take your dog to convention. Now it's time to pack
> and
>> get
>> ready to go. I would suggest treating your dog for fleas before you get
>> on
>> the
>> plane. This will insure that you won't bring any unpleasant little
> critters
>> to
>> the hotel with you. It also means you will not pass fleas on to other
> dogs,
>> and
>> your dog will be protected in case someone else isn't as considerate.
>>
>> Tip 3. Orient Yourself to the Hotel to Make Life Easier for You and Your
> Dog
>> OK, so you've decided to take your dog to convention, and you've treated
>> your
>> dog for fleas. Now you've arrived in a huge hotel, and you don't know
> where
>> anything is. I recommend devoting some time to orient yourself to the
> hotel
>> as
>> soon as possible after arriving. I always bring a cane with me to
>> convention,
>> and often I heel my dog and walk around with my cane a bit. This helps
>> me
>> get a
>> better feel for the hotel, and it helps me give Fanta clearer, more
>> confident
>> directions. Walking somewhere with my cane also allows me to point
>> things
>> out to
>> Fanta. This may help her remember where something is later. I find that
> the
>> more
>> I wander around, trying to find something, the more confused both Fanta
> and
>> I
>> become. This doesn't help either of us. Do I still get lost, even after
>> walking
>> around the hotel with my cane a bit? Absolutely! That's unavoidable, but
>> I
>> believe that using my cane a little in the beginning is still helpful.
>>
>> Tip 4. Remember Your Dog's Needs as Well as Your Own
>> Convention is a busy time for everyone. It's one week out of the year
>> when
> I
>> usually don't eat regular or healthy meals. But I always try to keep
> Fanta's
>> food and water needs in the back of my mind. I suggest trying to keep
>> your
>> dog's
>> feeding schedule as normal as possible. If that means leaving a meeting
>> a
>> little
>> early or getting somewhere a little late, at least you'll have a happy
>> dog
>> who
>> has been fed to take with you. Keeping a regular feeding schedule also
> helps
>> with relieving, as I'm sure all of you know.
>> If you know you're not going to get back to your room to feed your dog,
>> bring
>> the food with you when you leave your room in the morning. This way you
> can
>> always feed your dog in the rest room if necessary.
>> Convention meeting rooms can get warm. I usually carry a water bottle
>> and
> a
>> portable dog dish with me so that I can give Fanta water in case she
>> gets
>> thirsty before we return to our room. I usually look at food and water
>> at
>> convention this way. Am I hungry? How late is it? Is Fanta hungry too?
>> Has
>> she
>> gotten all of her food today? Am I thirsty? Is Fanta thirsty too? How
>> long
>> has
>> it been since she's had water?
>>
>> Tip 5. Relieve Your Dog Often.
>> I cannot emphasize this tip enough. During convention your dog does a
>> lot
> of
>> walking. He or she is also relieving in a strange place with lots of
>> distractions. Even if I don't think Fanta has to go, I usually take her
>> to
>> the
>> relieving area at every opportunity. Over the years she has surprised me
>> more
>> than once by relieving even when I didn't think she would have to.
>> Giving
>> your
>> dog as many opportunities as possible to relieve means you will be less
>> likely
>> to have an accident to clean up. Remember, both stress and activity
>> cause
>> dogs
>> to relieve more often, so my advice is to relieve your dog even more
>> than
>> you
>> ordinarily do at home.
>>
>> Tip 6. Clean up after Your Dog
>> Cleaning up after your dog in the relief area is your responsibility. If
> you
>> do,
>> you leave the area clean for the next team who uses it. I also find it
>> useful to
>> clean up after Fanta at convention because that enables me to keep track
> of
>> what
>> she does and how often.
>> Convention is a stressful place. When Fanta has gotten an upset stomach,
> it
>> was
>> helpful for me to pick up after her and realize what was happening. I
> could
>> then
>> watch her carefully and pay attention even more closely to her relieving
>> needs.
>> If your dog does have an accident of any kind, do your best to clean it
>> up
>> yourself immediately. Always carrying extra plastic bags and paper
>> towels
>> for
>> this purpose is a good idea. Never just walk away from a mess because
> you're
>> embarrassed it happened and hope that no one will notice that you were
>> responsible. If it happens late at night, when few people are about, you
>> should
>> request assistance from a member of the hotel staff. If you are faced
>> with
>> this
>> problem during the day or early evening, try to find a passer-by to ask
>> an
>> NFB
>> staff member with a two-way radio to notify the relief-area staff to
>> come
> to
>> your assistance. Alternatively someone could go to the relief area for
>> you
>> and
>> summon help. A volunteer could also stand over the problem area,
> protecting
>> other people from stepping into it while you go to find a relief worker.
> To
>> preserve our good relationship with hotel personnel, we must always try
>> to
>> prevent accidents whenever possible and to deal with them within the
>> organization whenever we can.
>>
>> Tip 7. Keep Your Dog Out of the Way.
>> This can be tough, especially with a big dog in a relatively small
>> space,
>> but do
>> what you can to keep your dog out of the aisle. Your dog will be much
>> happier if
>> he or she is not stepped on, and people who are trying to get from place
> to
>> place will appreciate having a free space to walk. Fanta has actually
> become
>> accustomed to curling up as tightly as possible at convention. When I'm
>> sitting,
>> I push her as far back under my chair as she'll go. At times she's even
>> positioned herself sideways under my chair so that very little of her
> sticks
>> out. Of course she has an advantage because she's a smaller lab, but
>> even
>> big
>> dogs can be slid under a chair at least a little.
>> Try also to keep your dog out of the way in your hotel room, especially
>> if
>> you're sharing the room with other people. I usually try to designate a
>> corner
>> for Fanta in my room out of the way as much as possible. If need be, I
>> can
>> put
>> her on her tie down or leash in that corner and know she won't be
>> stepped
> on
>> and
>> can relax.
>>
>> Tip 8. Beware of Food.
>> Convention is a place where many people raise money by selling candy
>> bars,
>> peanuts, crackers, and many other snacks. People also bring food into
>> general
>> sessions with them to eat if they get hungry. Inevitably food drops on
>> the
>> floor, which is at the least distracting and at the worst dangerous for
> your
>> dog, especially if chocolate is involved. Keep track of what your dog is
>> doing
>> when you walk. If he or she is sniffing or has stopped to pick something
> up,
>> investigate right away. When you're sitting in meetings, make sure to
>> hold
>> onto
>> your dog's leash at all times and keep track of what he or she is doing.
>> I learned this the hard way. I once gave Fanta's leash to a friend for a
> few
>> minutes, got up, and ran an errand using my cane. When I came back, my
>> friend
>> told me apologetically that Fanta had turned herself around, crawled on
> her
>> stomach completely underneath my chair to the row behind me, and eaten a
>> muffin
>> that someone had in a bag under her chair. This was very embarrassing
>> because I
>> felt really bad that my dog had eaten someone's breakfast. I offered to
> buy
>> the
>> person a new muffin, but she wouldn't let me. Luckily she was a dog
>> lover
>> and
>> didn't seem too bothered by the whole thing. But I was embarrassed. I
>> was
>> also
>> worried that Fanta would get sick from the muffin. This experience
>> taught
> me
>> to
>> be more careful of whom I leave Fanta with or whether to leave her at
>> all.
>> Am I
>> saying that Fanta would not have gotten the muffin if I had been there?
> No.
>> I
>> might have let my guard down and stopped paying attention, so it might
> have
>> happened anyway. But, let me tell you, this lesson has taught me to pay
>> attention to where Fanta is during meetings. If I can help it, I never
> want
>> her
>> to get a muffin or any other unintended food again.
>> One more word about food. If you're fundraising yourself or sharing a
>> room
>> with
>> someone who's fundraising, make sure that whatever you're selling is
>> kept
>> out of
>> your dog's reach. This is only common sense, but it's easy to forget
>> about
>> putting food out of reach when you're unpacking and thinking of a
>> million
>> other
>> things. And the person you share a room with may not be used to dogs, so
>> a
>> gentle reminder from you to keep food in a drawer or on a high closet
> shelf
>> won't hurt.
>>
>> Tip 9. Give Your Dog Breaks.
>> Convention is a stressful place for dogs and people alike. Make sure you
>> give
>> your dog breaks from the hustle and bustle whenever possible. Even
>> fifteen
>> minutes in your room off leash or on tie down can be very helpful for
>> relieving
>> your dog's stress level. Make sure you pack some type of toy for your
>> dog
> to
>> chew or play with during these breaks. Fanta loves her bone and her
>> Kong,
>> and I
>> make sure they are both in my convention suitcase. Don't leave your dog
>> alone,
>> however, when you are giving him or her a break. Dogs left alone,
> especially
>> those who may be under some stress already, are more likely to chew,
>> bark,
>> whine, etc. Also hotel housekeeping staff will often refuse to clean a
> room
>> with
>> an unattended dog inside. So, if you really feel your dog needs a break
> and
>> you
>> can't take a break yourself, try to find someone you know and trust who
>> wouldn't
>> mind keeping your dog in a quiet place for a while.
>>
>> Tip 10. Listen to What Your Dog Is Telling You.
>> One of the best things about dogs is their ability to communicate. This
>> is
>> very
>> helpful during guide work and makes me feel great when Fanta says she
> loves
>> me.
>> This communication is especially important at convention. Listen to what
>> your
>> dog is telling you. As much as possible try to be patient with your dog
>> as
>> he or
>> she navigates big crowds. If he or she seems hesitant, don't just urge
>> or
>> correct him or her forward without checking whether or not your dog
>> wants
>> you to
>> avoid something. This can be challenging, especially if you're lost or
>> in
> a
>> hurry to get somewhere, but it will make convention easier for both of
> you.
>> In meetings make sure you pay attention to your dog's behavior. Is he or
> she
>> panting, whining, or restless? Is this normal behavior? If not, pay
>> attention to
>> that behavior. Does your dog need to relieve? Is he or she thirsty? Does
> he
>> or
>> she need a break? Be a detective and try to figure out and take care of
> your
>> dog's needs. It will make him or her, you, and those around you more
>> comfortable.
>> As I say, these ten tips are common sense, but I appreciate your taking
> the
>> time
>> to read to the end of this article anyway. I appreciate the fact that
>> you
>> care
>> so much about your dogs that you will do all you can to give them a
> positive
>> convention experience.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org>
> [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org]On
>> Behalf Of Julie J.
>> Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 1:51 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] question about convention and booties.
>>
>>
>> Tara,
>>
>> Do what's right for you. Some people take their guides to convention
>> and some don't. Neither option is better than the other. It completely
>> depends on what works for the individual team.
>>
>> Some points to ponder...
>> How far from your routine will you be during convention? How flexible
>> with feeding, relieving and sleeping is your dog?
>> How comfortable are you in crowds? How comfortable is your dog with
>> crowds? canes? people not moving out of your way? How affected is your
>> dog by your own stress? Can you manage your own stress so you can work
>> effectively with your dog?
>> Will you be attending events where you are not taking your guide? i.e.
>> loud music events, water skiing, etc. Do you have someone to watch your
>> dog at these times?
>> Are you okay with taking time for extra relief breaks and setting aside
>> time for relaxing?
>>
>> About the boots...I have never used them. To me it seems like it would
>> be just one more thing for me to forget or lose. *smile* the dog's paws
>> will toughen up with use. If you notice a faster pace on hot pavement,
>> a sort of prancing or picking up the paws dramatically, the pavement is
>> too hot. I've only ever experienced this on asphalt roads or parking
>> lots.
>>
>> HTH
>> Julie
>>
>>
>> On 6/24/2011 12:18 PM, Tara Chavez wrote:
>> > Hello all,
>> > I have a couple of questions. I am currently debating whether or not
>> to
>> take
>> > my guide dog with me to convention. I've heard opinions on both sides
> and
>> > wonder what most people do.
>> > I've heard not to take her because I'd end up stressing her out more,
> plus
>> > I'd be worrying more about her and less likely to have fun at
> convention.
>> > I've also heard that I should take her (or at least I think I should)
>> > because of the experience of traveling and navigating the hotel and
>> all
>> that
>> > with her by my side. I am curious what a lot of people do. I know as a
>> guide
>> > dog user that I am proud of that and I want the world to know that I
> have
>> a
>> > wonderful companion... Thoughts?
>> > My other questions is about booties. I used them a lot last year when
>> I
>> > first came home, but not a whole lot since. Now that it's getting into
> the
>> > 90's and up, I want to be able to work my dog in booties, but she gets
>> > stressed when I put them on. I've tried putting them on and feeding
>> her
>> > dinner, since that was a suggestion from GDB when I asked them. I've
> also
>> > tried clickering her for allowing me to put them on her, but she has
> been
>> so
>> > stressed that she won't accept even high-value reward. Any
>> suggestions?
> I
>> > can't not work my dog because of the heat, can I?
>> > Thank you,
>> > Tara
>> >
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org>
> [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
>> > Of nagdu-request at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu-request at nfbnet.org>
>> > Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 11:00 AM
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: nagdu Digest, Vol 75, Issue 28
>> >
>> > Send nagdu mailing list submissions to
>> > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >
>> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>> > nagdu-request at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu-request at nfbnet.org>
>> >
>> > You can reach the person managing the list at
>> > nagdu-owner at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu-owner at nfbnet.org>
>> >
>> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> > than "Re: Contents of nagdu digest..."
>> >
>> >
>> > Today's Topics:
>> >
>> > 1. Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Hope Paulos)
>> > 2. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Buddy Brannan)
>> > 3. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Hope Paulos)
>> > 4. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Marion Gwizdala)
>> > 5. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Marion Gwizdala)
>> > 6. Re: Different types of dogs (Tami Kinney)
>> > 7. Re: [Flagdu] what the NFB Should Do! (Dan Weiner)
>> > 8. Re: DIFFERENT TYPES OF DOGS (Tami Kinney)
>> > 9. Re: what the NFB Should Do! (Tami Kinney)
>> > 10. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Tami Kinney)
>> > 11. Re: [Flagdu] what the NFB Should Do! (Tami Kinney)
>> > 12. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Buddy Brannan)
>> > 13. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Tami Kinney)
>> > 14. . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (Arthur Nolden)
>> > 15. Re: . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (Sean Moore)
>> > 16. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (cheryl echevarria)
>> > 17. Re: . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (Julie Phillipson)
>> > 18. Re: . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (Tami Kinney)
>> > 19. Re: . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (cheryl echevarria)
>> > 20. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Marion Gwizdala)
>> > 21. Cloning (Tracy Carcione)
>> > 22. Re: Cloning (PICKRELL, REBECCA M (TASC))
>> > 23. Success stats (Tracy Carcione)
>> > 24. Re: Cloning (Tami Kinney)
>> > 25. Re: Success stats (Tami Kinney)
>> > 26. Re: Success stats (Sheila Leigland)
>> > 27. Re: . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (Margo and Arrow)
>> >
>> >
>> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 1
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 14:37:45 -0400
>> > From: "Hope
>> Paulos"<hope.paulos at gmail.com<mailto:hope.paulos at gmail.com>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
> Message-ID:<6B86F91030FB44F6AE73B7A433F26478 at Espy<mailto:6B86F91030FB44F6AE7
> 3B7A433F26478 at Espy>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> > Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the Trekker
>> Breeze
>> > from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> attending
>> > convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment and have
>> > tickets filled out?
>> > Thanks.
>> > Hope and Beignet
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 2
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 14:52:39 -0400
>> > From: Buddy Brannan<buddy at brannan.name<mailto:buddy at brannan.name>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
> Message-ID:<35856142-62E1-4EEE-B450-71702C4DA917 at brannan.name<mailto:3585614
> 2-62E1-4EEE-B450-71702C4DA917 at brannan.name>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>> >
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
> handy
>> > Paypal link.
>> > --
>> > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> >
>> >> Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the Trekker
>> > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment
> and
>> > have tickets filled out?
>> >> Thanks.
>> >> Hope and Beignet
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 3
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 15:25:26 -0400
>> > From: "Hope
>> Paulos"<hope.paulos at gmail.com<mailto:hope.paulos at gmail.com>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
> Message-ID:<B192608FE5C8458AA68DB537300A3308 at Espy<mailto:B192608FE5C8458AA68
> DB537300A3308 at Espy>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>> > reply-type=original
>> >
>> > Thanks Buddy. Again, you're a life-saver. :)
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Buddy Brannan"<buddy at brannan.name<mailto:buddy at brannan.name>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 2:52 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
>> >
>> >> Hi,
>> >>
>> >> Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
> handy
>> >> Paypal link.
>> >> --
>> >> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> >> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
>> Trekker
>> >>> Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are
>> not
>> >>> attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit
>> payment
>> >>> and have tickets filled out?
>> >>> Thanks.
>> >>> Hope and Beignet
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> >>> nagdu:
>> >>>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> >> nagdu:
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40gmail.c
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40gmail.
> c>
>> > om
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 4
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 15:27:39 -0400
>> > From: "Marion
> Gwizdala"<blind411 at verizon.net<mailto:blind411 at verizon.net>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
> Message-ID:<440C123849064754B6CFE0901F9B002B at marion27df4b2a<mailto:440C12384
> 9064754B6CFE0901F9B002B at marion27df4b2a>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
>> > reply-type=original
>> >
>> > Hope,
>> > We attempted to make entries available through Pay pal; however, they
>> do
>> >
>> > not allow raffles and shut it down. We are working to get our account
>> > re-activated so we can collect membership dues. The challenge we would
>> face
>> > selling tickets outside of convention is how to accept payment. next
> year,
>> > we will have learned how to use Pay Pal without breaching our user
>> > agreement. If you have any suggestions as to how we can sell tickets
>> without
>> >
>> > using Pay Pal, please feel free to make suggestions. We are open to
>> allowing
>> >
>> > anyone who wants to support our projects the opportunity to do so!
>> >
>> > Fraternally yours,
>> > Marion Gwizdala, President
>> > National Association of Guide Dog Users (NAGDU)
>> > National Federation of the Blind
>> > 813-626-2789
>> > President at NAGDU.ORG<mailto:President at NAGDU.ORG>
>> > HTTP://WWW.NAGDU.ORG<http://www.nagdu.org/>
>> >
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Hope
>> Paulos"<hope.paulos at gmail.com<mailto:hope.paulos at gmail.com>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 2:37 PM
>> > Subject: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
>> >
>> >> Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the Trekker
>> >> Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> >> attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit
>> payment
>> and
>> >> have tickets filled out?
>> >> Thanks.
>> >> Hope and Beignet
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> >> nagdu:
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.ne
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.n
> e>
>> > t
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 5
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 15:28:54 -0400
>> > From: "Marion
> Gwizdala"<blind411 at verizon.net<mailto:blind411 at verizon.net>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
> Message-ID:<C132140FEFD44563B2E062079C3E80AC at marion27df4b2a<mailto:C132140FE
> FD44563B2E062079C3E80AC at marion27df4b2a>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
>> > reply-type=original
>> >
>> > Buddy,
>> > Unfortunately, we had to shut down that option, as Pay Pal suspended
>> our
>> >
>> > account! You were one of the few that got in before this happened. now
> we
>> > are working to access those funds!
>> >
>> > Marion
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Buddy Brannan"<buddy at brannan.name<mailto:buddy at brannan.name>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 2:52 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
>> >
>> >> Hi,
>> >>
>> >> Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
> handy
>> >> Paypal link.
>> >> --
>> >> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> >> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
>> Trekker
>> >>> Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are
>> not
>> >>> attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit
>> payment
>> >>> and have tickets filled out?
>> >>> Thanks.
>> >>> Hope and Beignet
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> >>> nagdu:
>> >>>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> >> nagdu:
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.ne
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.n
> e>
>> > t
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 6
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 12:55:51 -0700
>> > From: Tami
> Kinney<tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Different types of dogs
>> >
> Message-ID:<1308858951.2044.12.camel at tamara-desktop<mailto:1308858951.2044.1
> 2.camel at tamara-desktop>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Mardi,
>> >
>> > Just remember to collect and save some genetic material from Nala.
>> > Cloning technology is improving, and costs are coming down as R&D
>> > expenses are paid off. Unlike the adaptive tech market in a lot of
>> areas
>> > still. But that's another matter. I'm glad someone else will admit to
>> > seriously wanting to do that. /lol/ Blurting that out in conversation
>> > can generate awkward silence broken by strangled stutterings. I
>> havent'
>> > checked for awhile, but cloning is probably still beyond the means of
>> > the likes of you and I... By the time I need to start looking for
>> > Mitzi's successor, though, who knows? If it is possible for me to take
>> > that route, who knows what I will decide, really? She's only 5, and
>> > genetic health problems could still show up (I'm in denial about
>> that),
>> > etc. Physically, she is healthy and sound, except for some early
>> issues
>> > from bugs, not genes. Her temperament is fantastic, and I love her
>> > poodly brains and even obstinance at work, home and play. Also, as I
>> > keep telling her, she will be helping me raise herself, so that's
>> > vengeance for me for her puppyhood. /lol/ She grins and wags her tail
>> > as if I am being silly. Whether she knows what I am saying or not (I
>> > really do wonder sometimes even when she can't possibly), I get the
>> > impression she generally assumes that if I am talking, I am just being
>> > silly for her amusement. I then begin to wonder if I am a masochist
>> > when it comes to guide dogs. /lol/
>> >
>> > The greater choice in breed and individual is a big plus to
>> > owner-training. Except for the part where you're looking for the right
>> > pup from the breed you've selected, which is really nerve-wracking and
>> > can take a lot of time. Unless you're lucky, which seems to have
>> > happened to me with Mitzi. Maybe that's another reason I just want to
>> > clone her when the time comes. I don't have to turn myself into a
>> wreck
>> > wondering if I will find that elusive new prospect in a puppy... Scary
>> > stuff, that! /smile/
>> >
>> > Glad Shaman is doing well and progressing. He must be pretty adult,
>> > too, by now and building up experience. That's when it starts to be
>> real
>> > fun. /grin/
>> >
>> > On Wed, 2011-06-22 at 17:29 -0700, Mardi Hadfield wrote:
>> >> Hi all, If you need a guide dog and go to a school to get it, you
>> > probably
>> >> don't have a lot of choice in what breed of dog you want. You may be
> able
>> > to
>> >> state a preference,but that is no guarantee that you will actually
>> get
>> > what
>> >> you asked for. I think that for a first time dog user, it is wise to
> let
>> >> the school match you with the dog that they feel is best for
>> you.Maybe
> on
>> >> your second time you can get the kind of dog you want as you will
>> have
>> the
>> >> experience of already working with a dog. Of course this is just my
>> >> opinion,but to me it makes sense. On the other hand, if you are an
> owner
>> >> trainer and have a certain preference, go for it!My chosen breed is
>> the
>> >> Siberian Husky. This is not the breed for every one! There are many
> cons
>> > and
>> >> some pros. For me, I needed a dog that could keep up with my power
>> >> wheelchair and my very active life style.A breed that did not tire
> easily
>> >> and could go all day. The husky fit the bill for me.Since I already
>> had
> a
>> >> husky service dog,I just trained her as a guide dog. She was a
> wonderful
>> >> guide but had to be retired early as she got Vally Fever. This is a
>> > disease
>> >> limited to the southwest. She died unexpectedly a month after her
>> >> retirement.I was lucky to have found another Husky to train as my
>> next
>> >> guide. This dog has been an exceptional guide dog. She has gone above
> and
>> >> beyond as a guide dog.I don't expect to find another like her.I wish
>> I
>> > could
>> >> have her cloned,but my finances being what they are,well it's just
>> not
>> >> possible. When I was looking for another dog to take over for Nala so
> she
>> >> could retire, I just could not find a husky that could do the job.
> After
>> >> trying several that "washed out",I expanded my search to other
>> breeds.
> I
>> >> found a Belgian Shepherd that had been rescued from a shelter. He was
> the
>> >> one that worked out. He has become a wonderful guide. We had a few
>> > setbacks
>> >> in the beginning but he has worked out very well.To date, Nala,my
> second
>> >> Husky has been the best guide I have ever had,but with time,who
>> knows.
>> >> Shaman may become just as good. He is excellent when it comes to
> traffic
>> >> checks, and has already saved my butt several times! Different people
>> > have
>> >> different needs when it comes to guide dogs. Some need fast dogs,some
>> need
>> >> slower dogs. I consider myself very lucky to have found dogs of the
>> breeds
>> >> that I like and had them become wonderful guides.But If I were to go
>> to
> a
>> >> school to get a dog sometime in the future, I would probably take
>> whatever
>> >> dog they matched me with as it is unlikely that I would get a
> Husky.Have
>> a
>> >> great day, Mardi andShaman and Nala,retired.
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 7
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 16:00:30 -0400
>> > From: "Dan
>> Weiner"<dcwein at dcwein.cnc.net<mailto:dcwein at dcwein.cnc.net>>
>> > To: "'Florida Association of Guide Dog
> Users'"<flagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:flagdu at nfbnet.org>>,
>> > "'NAGDU
> List'"<nagdu at nfbnet.org>,<blindtlk at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3E,%3C
> blindtlk at nfbnet.org>>,
>> > "'NFB
>> > Chapter
> presidents'"<chapter-presidents at nfbnet.org<mailto:chapter-presidents at nfbnet.
> org>>
>> > Cc: marion.gwizdala at verizon.net<mailto:marion.gwizdala at verizon.net>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] [Flagdu] what the NFB Should Do!
>> >
> Message-ID:<20110623200036.D2A959ABD at tonnant.cnc.net<mailto:20110623200036.D
> 2A959ABD at tonnant.cnc.net>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>> >
>> > Well, I suppose in that case people really don't know aht to do to
>> make
>> > government have different priorities, that's not just about blind
> people.
>> >
>> > It's easy to see a problem but knowing what to do about it is always a
>> > tricky thing.
>> >
>> > I'm not, of course, saying that people shouldn't join the organized
> blind
>> > movement--smile--just telling you what I think.
>> > People feel powerless. Especially we blind people have spent most of
>> our
>> > lives being told not to do this or not to do that or we can't do
>> things.
>> >
>> >
>> > Dan W. and the Carter Dog
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 8
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 13:02:01 -0700
>> > From: Tami
> Kinney<tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] DIFFERENT TYPES OF DOGS
>> >
> Message-ID:<1308859321.2044.18.camel at tamara-desktop<mailto:1308859321.2044.1
> 8.camel at tamara-desktop>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Oh! thanks for telling me so. As you may have guessed I love going
>> about
>> > my dog, dogs, my dog, every dog I've ever met... So I'm always glad
>> when
>> > my ramblings turn out to actually be helpful to someone. /smile/
>> >
>> > It's all my own experience and what I've picked up from others or
>> other
>> > dogs I've had, more and more informed by my growing experience as a
>> > guide dog user. So I'm better at evaluating pros and cons of the
>> > various breed and type options in light of what I want in a guide.
>> >
>> > I've liked hearing what most others have said on the matter of
>> > preference itself. It is very, very individual when it comes right
>> down
>> > to it.
>> >
>> > The even more important thing is the individual dog we are matched
>> with
>> > or end up with meets our needs in a way that enhances our lives. Which
>> > seems to happen most of the time, so that's a good thing. Glad you're
>> > enjoying your pup and life as a guide dog handler!
>> >
>> > On Wed, 2011-06-22 at 17:47 -0700, Brittney N. Mejico wrote:
>> >> Tami ,
>> >> Thanks very informative!
>> >>
>> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> From: Tami Kinney
>> >> Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2011 2:56 PM
>> >> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >> Subject: Re: [nagdu] DIFFERENT TYPES OF DOGS
>> >>
>> >> Brittney,
>> >>
>> >> Were you also informed which preference you were supposed to
>> >> have? /evil grin/
>> >>
>> >> I thought the whole poodle as guide dog notion was pretty iffy when I
>> >> first heard of it, but ended up putting in some time, energy and
> expense
>> >> getting my hands on one anyway for practical reasons. Now I can't
>> >> understand why everybody else isn't running around demanding poodle
>> >> guides... Until I remember that poodles are, you know, poodles.
>> >> Definitely an acquired taste, but addictive once you get hooked.
>> Unless
>> >> you want a quiet life, free of excitement and strife. The lack of
>> >> shedding is a big plus in a lot of ways, but the cost of grooming is
> not
>> >> easy on a budget. If you try to save now and then by stretching out
>> >> time between trims, you find yourself doing nothing but grooming the
>> >> poodle. Well, Mitzi has the soft, thick, fine coat and an extra
>> measure
>> >> of it at that, so it is absolutely gorgeous and wonerful to the touch
>> >> while being absolutely impossible to keep free of industrial-grade
>> >> snarls close to the skin if you don't keep on it. Also, the poodle
>> does
>> >> nto appear to be constructed to curl up in a tidy ball that will fit
>> >> neatly under even a really big chair, so it you're uptight about the
>> >> finer points of etiquette, a girl can really stress herself out about
>> >> that until she finally gives up and loosens up and finds a way to
>> >> achieve the same goals in a way that will actually work. /lol/ From
>> >> what I hear, bear-sized labs will curl up into tidy balls that will
>> fit
>> >> under toddler chairs and be perfectly comfortable doing it. I'm
>> >> exaggerating, but I've heard of folks with 90 pound labs that will
>> fit
>> >> places I have not been able to stuff my poodle to begin with, and
>> even
>> >> then bits of her start popping out like they've been spring-loaded,
>> so
> I
>> >> have driven myself nuts on the bus and train desperately trying to
> round
>> >> up legs and noses and stubby tails enough for 7 dogs! She would be
>> >> trying to comply but she sure would sigh a lot. Also, she has a huge
>> >> need to watch *everything* so our rules for keeping her out of the
>> way
>> >> and safe including her being positioned where she can do that without
>> >> moving around. She's a super-mellow poodle, so I am routinely
>> assurred,
>> >> but she is still a poodle. That same vigilance and curiosity works
>> out
>> >> wonderfully when we're on the go, so I don't mind adjusting our
>> seating
>> >> arrangements to keep her from getting twitchy. /smile/
>> >>
>> >> I've always had a yen for a sheperd guide and I still think they're
>> >> still pretty high on my list. The only thing that that breed loses
>> >> points over is their shedding and tendency to be a bit harder on
>> people
>> >> with sensitivities to dander because of its pH or something... I
>> >> wouldn't let that last part stop me getting one, but the shedding
> itself
>> >> seems a bit daunting now that I'm spoiled. Not having a budget crunch
>> >> from profressional grooming all the time would be a big plus, that's
> for
>> >> sure! I might take on shaving and trimming a companion poodle myself,
>> >> but my professional dog requires a professional haircut.
>> >>
>> >> Dobies also thrill me, for many of the same reasons GSDs do, only
>> with
>> >> shorter hair and less shedding and brushing. I'm lazy, so when
>> Mitzi's
>> >> curls are shorn and I can just wipe her off with a damp cloth to
>> spiif
>> >> her up for the most refined restaurant dining, I am happy as can be
> with
>> >> that arrangement. Dobie guide users speak of doing that with the
>> dobie
>> >> coat, so big, big plus!
>> >>
>> >> I would like a dog with less adorability and perhaps a bit more of a
>> >> back-off quality and a rep to add some encouragement. Mitzi has a
>> >> pretty intense stare, but it just doesn't have the same effect on
> people
>> >> as it does when it comes from what looks like a guard/police dog.
>> Here,
>> >> at least. The dirty little secret about poodles is that they're used
>> as
>> >> guard dogs in other countries because they're a lot like dobies and
>> >> shepherds that way. It's something to bear in mind, especially in
>> >> choosing a poodle for guide work or anything else, really, since
>> people
>> >> who have encountered bad-tempered poodles are scared to death of the
>> >> things. They can turn nasty if the temperament is not respected in
>> >> treatment and training. Statistically, they're responsible for more
>> dog
>> >> bites than pit bulls. That includes the smaller types, too, I guess,
>> >> and those are more prone to temperament problems due to irresponsible
>> >> breeders. Sigh. Anyway, Mitzi is, in a lot of way, a woolly doberman
>> >> that just doesn't scare people because she's so cu-ute. She does
>> have,
>> >> I have been told a very severe back-off look, but she seems to be
>> more
>> >> likely to use her direct stare and exotic dark eyes to draw people in
>> >> and take control of their minds so that they will do whatever she
>> wants
>> >> them to. /lol/ I've never been able to see her eyes, really, and see
> her
>> >> in my mind as not having any, but I can feel that stare and fall
>> victim
>> >> to its power. Still, there are times it would be handy to have an
>> >> equally nonaggressive dog that could scare people off properly just
>> by
>> >> looking at them. Mitzi has become quite the pro at dealing with all
>> the
>> >> attention and reaching hands with grace and composure, and we've
>> worked
>> >> out ways to keep it from getting out of hand, but... It would be nice
>> >> to have my dog admired from a safe distance by people who are
>> inspired
>> >> to keep their hands to themselves. /smile/
>> >>
>> >> Labs come in lower on the preference list simply because I like the
>> >> herding/guarding breeds better, either as guides or as companions. I
>> >> like labs and just get giddy around my labbie friends and family --
>> my
>> >> sister has a 106 lb. black lab Mitzi's age, and he is just so awesome
>> >> and very labby in his manner and personality. Out of habit, when I
>> >> stood beside him, I held my hand over his back to measure him for a
>> >> harness... I would have to be a lot taller. He is a way cool dog and
>> >> just love him. But if someone were to offer me the choice between his
>> >> exact clone and, say, a dobie or shepherd or poodle, I'd pick the
>> other
>> >> dog. Still, labs will start moving up my preference scale at some
>> point
>> >> for the very traits that make them so popular and numerous. In fact,
>> by
>> >> then I will no doubt be wanting an extra mellow, laid back, easy lab
>> >> guide, and I will love having a lab around because they really are
>> >> wonderful dogs.
>> >>
>> >> I just happen to prefer my super-alert, active, busy, difficult
>> poodle
>> >> and want something along the same lines in case she doesn't obey the
>> >> live-forever command and I don't get her cloned. /lol/
>> >>
>> >> I don't know if that is in any way informative, but I always love
>> these
>> >> questions because I learn so much about other handlers and the
>> >> differences between breeds and inviduals. So I'll shut up and get to
>> >> reading.
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, 2011-06-20 at 16:21 -0700, Brittney N. Mejico wrote:
>> >>> hello everyone,
>> >>> I always wanted to ask. Does the breed of dog you use as a guide
>> > matter?
>> >>> I know some guide dog users are really particular about a certain
> breed
>> >>> and others don?t care? Why is this? Before I got my guide people
>> asked
>> >>> me what type of dog I wanted and I would ask, ?should I have a
>> >>> preference?? and I was told that I shouldn??t care. Before I start
>> >>> rambleing I just want to know the difference in different breeds?
>> >>> _______________________________________________ nagdu mailing list
>> >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> >>> nagdu:
>> >>>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcas
> t>
>> > .net
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/brittneymejico%40veri
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/brittneymejico%40ver
> i>
>> > zon.net
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
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> t>
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 9
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 13:32:44 -0700
>> > From: Tami
> Kinney<tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] what the NFB Should Do!
>> >
> Message-ID:<1308861164.2044.30.camel at tamara-desktop<mailto:1308861164.2044.3
> 0.camel at tamara-desktop>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Marion, et al.,
>> >
>> > Agreed, re: article and well-said. I appreciate the humor and the
>> > expression of thanks to the doers, whether it's the bits or the bites
>> we
>> > contribute... While also making a strong statement. /smile/
>> >
>> > As I learn more about the organization -- and thus its warts and those
>> > of some of its people or even groups within the larger organization --
>> I
>> > keep hearing a long ago boss and mentor from my early career: Never go
>> > to the boss with a complaint without also having at least one solution
>> > to offer. Good advice from a wise woman! Having a solution to a
>> problem
>> > is much easier in the context of your job and department or company
>> than
>> > with a large member organization like the NFB, and at least one
>> > organizational wart really sticks in my craw, making it easy to feel
>> > whiney and powerless... But I know how much good I've gotten out of
>> the
>> > past work and the current work, so I am more motivated to do my little
>> > bits to contribute... Very small bits! But those little things to keep
>> > entertained enough to avoid complaining to adamantly about things I
>> > would like to see done or changed, because then I would feel obligated
>> > to help be part of the solution... That thought does shut me up fairly
>> > often. Don't know if that's what my mentor had in mind, but if you're
>> > afraid to complain you do have more time to do other things. /lol/
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 10:08 -0400, Margo and Arrow wrote:
>> >> It's called taking ownership. marion, well-said email and like Cindy,
>> I
>> >> think you might want to consider expanding it to a Monitor article.
>> >>
>> >> Margo and Arrow
>> >> ----- Original Message -----
>> >> From: "Cindy Ray"<cindyray at gmail.com<mailto:cindyray at gmail.com>>
>> >> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> >> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> >> Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 9:49 AM
>> >> Subject: Re: [nagdu] what the NFB Should Do!
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> Marion, I think that was well said. I think you should enlarge upon
>> it
>> > and
>> >>> make a Monitor article out of it. I know that variations have been
> done
>> >>> before, but we can't hear it often enough.
>> >>>
>> >>> Cindy
>> >>>
>> >>> On Jun 23, 2011, at 8:09 AM, Marion Gwizdala wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Dear All,
>> >>>> Please excuse this cross-posting but I think it is important enough
>> >>>> that I wanted to share it with as many of you as possible. When I
> speak
>> >>>> with many blind people who find out I am a leader in the
>> Federation,
> I
>> >>>> often have them say, "The NFB should ...". You can fill in the
>> blank
>> > with
>> >>>> a myriad of suggestions of what needs to be done to improve the
>> lives
>> > of
>> >>>> the blind. Generally, my response is, "Are you a member of the
>> NFB?"
>> > The
>> >>>> most frequent answer is "No!" This opens the door for me to share
> that
>> >>>> the Federation is a membership organization - a grass roots
>> Movement
>> > in
>> >>>> which each member must be actively involved in order for us to
> improve
>> >>>> our lives. It is not dr. Maurer; it is not the Board of Directors;
>> it
>> > is
>> >>>> not the people who work at the National Center for the Blind; it is
> not
>> >>>> our divisions, our affiliates, or our chapters! It is each and
>> every
>> >>>> member of the movement! I then invite them to become a member of
>> the
>> > NFB
>> >>>> and hear the same tired excuses of not being a joiner, not
>> >>> having enough time, not wanting to choose sides, not agreeing with
>> the
>> >>> philosophy, yah dah yah dah yah dah yawn! "In other words," I say,
> "you
>> >>> want someone else to solve your problems for you and are unwilling
>> to
>> >>> help. Is that right?" Of course, they think I am a rude, obnoxious,
>> >>> belligerent Federationist, what my wife and I would call "C.B." -
>> >>> Confirmation Bias - the bias that "All Federationists are (fill in
>> the
>> >>> blank!" and this experience confirms this belief!
>> >>>> I praise those of you who have joined me in our effort to improve
>> > the
>> >>>> lives of the blind. You have not made it someone else's problem to
>> > solve;
>> >>>> you have made it yours! To paraphrase the words of Mahatma Gandhi ,
>> > "You
>> >>>> are the change you want to see in the world!" Thank you for your
>> > service
>> >>>> and for joining me on the barricades! On to Orlando!
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Fraternally yours,
>> >>>> Marion Gwizdala, President
>> >>>> National Association of Guide Dog Users (NAGDU)
>> >>>> National Federation of the Blind
>> >>>> 813-626-2789
>> >>>> President at NAGDU.ORG<mailto:President at NAGDU.ORG>
>> >>>> HTTP://WWW.NAGDU.ORG<http://www.nagdu.org/>
>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> >>>> nagdu:
>> >>>>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cindyray%40gmail.com<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cindyray%40gmail.com>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> >>> nagdu:
>> >>>
>> >
>>
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> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/margo.downey%40veriz
> o>
>> > n.net
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
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> t>
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 10
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 13:38:25 -0700
>> > From: Tami
> Kinney<tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
> Message-ID:<1308861505.2044.35.camel at tamara-desktop<mailto:1308861505.2044.3
> 5.camel at tamara-desktop>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Hope and Buddy,
>> >
>> > I'm afraid we had to remove the PayPal button from the site... Turns
>> out
>> > they don't allow using their service for raffles, so now we know. But
>> > for this year, we've had to make adjustments. Those who paid through
>> > PayPal before they informed us how very displeased they are do have
>> the
>> > tickets they bought and paid for. We're planning and researching how
>> to
>> > deal with some of those fundraising activities through the website for
>> > everyone's convenience.
>> >
>> > Hope, if you want to know more, you can contact Marion at
>> > president at nagdu.org<mailto:president at nagdu.org> or Toni Whaley at
> treasurer at nagdu.org<mailto:treasurer at nagdu.org> to see if you
>> > can still get tickets. Come to think of it, it passed off my radar
>> when
>> > we decided to not use the website until we had a solution next year.
>> > But I still want that Breeze! /smile/
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 14:52 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> >> Hi,
>> >>
>> >> Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
> handy
>> > Paypal link.
>> >> --
>> >> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> >> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
>> Trekker
>> > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment
> and
>> > have tickets filled out?
>> >>> Thanks.
>> >>> Hope and Beignet
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
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> t>
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 11
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 13:56:54 -0700
>> > From: Tami
> Kinney<tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] [Flagdu] what the NFB Should Do!
>> >
> Message-ID:<1308862614.2044.47.camel at tamara-desktop<mailto:1308862614.2044.4
> 7.camel at tamara-desktop>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Yeah, I'm pretty new to be told that kind of crap all the time, so I
>> > just keep on getting real mad and obstinate. But I started noticing
>> way
>> > too early on how often the constant battery would affect my thinking
>> and
>> > decision-making, even though i know better! I am amazed -- and fairly
>> > weary -- by how much work I have to put in just to keep myself from
>> > starting to assume all those negative things about myself just because
>> > I'm blind.
>> >
>> > That experience does give me a greater appreciation for anyone who has
>> > been told that from childhood on for just getting up in the morning!
>> > Especially from my own age range and on. I realize that whatever the
>> > pros and cons of progressive vision loss, with the crossover to using
>> > noticeable adaptive methods and tools, the biggest benefit to me over
>> my
>> > lifetime until earlier this century has been that people weren't
>> > treating me like I was blind! Also, driving and reading print a page
>> at
>> > a glance provided many opportunities to go, do, learn which are more
>> > difficult and time-consuming now. So that's something I have benefited
>> > from especially in the context of my own generation. But i thought the
>> > way girls and women were treated then was bad and oppressive... Then I
>> > picked up a new skinny white friend in the 21st century, when women
>> can
>> > do stuff like think and make decisions officially, and discovered what
>> > *real* oppression is like. Then I started learning how much better
>> > things are now! Yikes! Well, they're getting better all the time,
>> > because we're all just soldiering on together and each in our way, so
>> > the adventure continues.
>> >
>> > Still, I can't truly grasp some of the attitudes of blind people
>> toward
>> > blindness, towards other blind people and towards themselves,
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 16:00 -0400, Dan Weiner wrote:
>> >> Well, I suppose in that case people really don't know aht to do to
>> make
>> >> government have different priorities, that's not just about blind
> people.
>> >>
>> >> It's easy to see a problem but knowing what to do about it is always
>> a
>> >> tricky thing.
>> >>
>> >> I'm not, of course, saying that people shouldn't join the organized
> blind
>> >> movement--smile--just telling you what I think.
>> >> People feel powerless. Especially we blind people have spent most of
> our
>> >> lives being told not to do this or not to do that or we can't do
> things.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Dan W. and the Carter Dog
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcas
> t>
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 12
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 17:10:14 -0400
>> > From: Buddy Brannan<buddy at brannan.name<mailto:buddy at brannan.name>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
> Message-ID:<3A19B225-D79A-4497-9F65-264DCAB3F698 at brannan.name<mailto:3A19B22
> 5-D79A-4497-9F65-264DCAB3F698 at brannan.name>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>> >
>> > So wait. I was able to buy tickets with Paypal and got a payment
>> > confirmation, so did I get them or am I outa luck?
>> > --
>> > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Jun 23, 2011, at 4:38 PM, Tami Kinney wrote:
>> >
>> >> Hope and Buddy,
>> >>
>> >> I'm afraid we had to remove the PayPal button from the site... Turns
> out
>> >> they don't allow using their service for raffles, so now we know. But
>> >> for this year, we've had to make adjustments. Those who paid through
>> >> PayPal before they informed us how very displeased they are do have
>> the
>> >> tickets they bought and paid for. We're planning and researching how
>> to
>> >> deal with some of those fundraising activities through the website
>> for
>> >> everyone's convenience.
>> >>
>> >> Hope, if you want to know more, you can contact Marion at
>> >> president at nagdu.org<mailto:president at nagdu.org> or Toni Whaley at
> treasurer at nagdu.org<mailto:treasurer at nagdu.org> to see if you
>> >> can still get tickets. Come to think of it, it passed off my radar
>> when
>> >> we decided to not use the website until we had a solution next year.
>> >> But I still want that Breeze! /smile/
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 14:52 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> >>> Hi,
>> >>>
>> >>> Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
>> handy
>> > Paypal link.
>> >>> --
>> >>> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> >>> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
>> Trekker
>> > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment
> and
>> > have tickets filled out?
>> >>>> Thanks.
>> >>>> Hope and Beignet
>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcas
> t>
>> > .net
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 13
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 14:38:01 -0700
>> > From: Tami
> Kinney<tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
> Message-ID:<1308865081.2044.49.camel at tamara-desktop<mailto:1308865081.2044.4
> 9.camel at tamara-desktop>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Buddy, you are in the running for the Breeze, no worries. As is anyone
>> > else who paid before we had to cease and desist. Sorry for the
>> > confusion!
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 17:10 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> >> So wait. I was able to buy tickets with Paypal and got a payment
>> > confirmation, so did I get them or am I outa luck?
>> >> --
>> >> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> >> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Jun 23, 2011, at 4:38 PM, Tami Kinney wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Hope and Buddy,
>> >>>
>> >>> I'm afraid we had to remove the PayPal button from the site... Turns
> out
>> >>> they don't allow using their service for raffles, so now we know.
>> But
>> >>> for this year, we've had to make adjustments. Those who paid through
>> >>> PayPal before they informed us how very displeased they are do have
> the
>> >>> tickets they bought and paid for. We're planning and researching how
> to
>> >>> deal with some of those fundraising activities through the website
>> for
>> >>> everyone's convenience.
>> >>>
>> >>> Hope, if you want to know more, you can contact Marion at
>> >>> president at nagdu.org<mailto:president at nagdu.org> or Toni Whaley at
> treasurer at nagdu.org<mailto:treasurer at nagdu.org> to see if you
>> >>> can still get tickets. Come to think of it, it passed off my radar
> when
>> >>> we decided to not use the website until we had a solution next year.
>> >>> But I still want that Breeze! /smile/
>> >>>
>> >>> On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 14:52 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> >>>> Hi,
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
>> > handy Paypal link.
>> >>>> --
>> >>>> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> >>>> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
> Trekker
>> > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment
> and
>> > have tickets filled out?
>> >>>>> Thanks.
>> >>>>> Hope and Beignet
>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcas
> t>
>> > .net
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcas
> t>
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 14
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 18:22:23 -0400
>> > From: "Arthur
> Nolden"<anolden at tampabay.rr.com<mailto:anolden at tampabay.rr.com>>
>> > To:<Undisclosed-Recipient:;>
>> > Subject: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
> Message-ID:<31BE0B810A9449B28F6C885AD16CD11C at yourc6417768d6<mailto:31BE0B810
> A9449B28F6C885AD16CD11C at yourc6417768d6>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Blind People Are Faking It!
>> >
>> > Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
>> secret
>> > society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
> vicious
>> > attack animals in public on a daily basis. These mysterious folk also
> have
>> a
>> > secret means of communication, while shocking new evidence seems to
>> indicate
>> > that they may even possess senses superior to those of other humans.
> We're
>> > speaking, of course, of the legions of the so-called blind.
>> >
>> > Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in the
>> first
>> > place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of sight, how
>> does
>> > that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and Ronnie
>> Milsap?
>> How
>> > could such men possibly play music if they were blind? What do they
>> take
>> us
>> > for-ignorant
>> > saps?
>> > The first issue I must point out is their very public display of armed
>> > might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a cudgel
> on
>> > their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them, are
> supposed
>> to
>> > help them feel their way along. They are painted white, almost as if
>> the
>> > bearer wished to remind passersby of its presence, and the weapon's
>> tip
> is
>> > painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who have studied the
> mysterious
>> > fighting arts of the Orient know that such sticks may be wielded with
>> deadly
>> > force by those with skill.
>> >
>> > In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> > could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> > encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
>> blind
>> also
>> > own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of guidance
> along
>> > city streets. With one word from their scheming masters, these
>> slavering
>> > "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> >
>> > Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a species
>> of
>> > killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
>> somehow
>> > fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
>> frightening
>> > aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their ability to
>> communicate
>> > with one another unbeknownst to upstanding citizens. Their secret code
>> > consists of a series of raised dots cunningly arranged into arcane
> shapes.
>> > Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has begun popping up in
>> places
>> > that were doubtlessly chosen for their mundane, everyday outward
>> appearance:
>> > elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
>> like.
>> >
>> > This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
>> attention.
>> But
>> > think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how would we
>> know?
>> > Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the signs will
>> change
>> > from "second
>> > floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
>> into
>> the
>> > chaos of revolution.
>> >
>> > At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
>> planning
>> such
>> > a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But can one
>> group
>> > possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to use it to
>> seize
>> > power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> >
>> > No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see the
>> threat
>> > where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary of the
>> blind
>> > menace.
>> >
>> > Alan P., Nevada.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 15
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 18:38:06 -0400
>> > From: "Sean
> Moore"<sean.moore at mediacombb.net<mailto:sean.moore at mediacombb.net>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
> Message-ID:<C5461A4DD88D4166ACE61067E467507E at aspireone<mailto:C5461A4DD88D41
> 66ACE61067E467507E at aspireone>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>> > reply-type=original
>> >
>> > What the ...?
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Arthur
> Nolden"<anolden at tampabay.rr.com<mailto:anolden at tampabay.rr.com>>
>> > To:<Undisclosed-Recipient:;>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:22 PM
>> > Subject: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Blind People Are Faking It!
>> >>
>> >> Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
> secret
>> >> society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
> vicious
>> >> attack animals in public on a daily basis. These mysterious folk also
>> have
>> >> a secret means of communication, while shocking new evidence seems to
>> >> indicate that they may even possess senses superior to those of other
>> >> humans. We're speaking, of course, of the legions of the so-called
> blind.
>> >>
>> >> Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in
>> the
>> >> first place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of sight,
>> how
>> >> does that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and Ronnie
>> >> Milsap? How could such men possibly play music if they were blind?
>> What
>> do
>> >> they take us for-ignorant
>> >> saps?
>> >> The first issue I must point out is their very public display of
>> armed
>> >> might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a
>> cudgel
> on
>> >> their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them, are
> supposed
>> >> to help them feel their way along. They are painted white, almost as
>> if
>> >> the bearer wished to remind passersby of its presence, and the
>> weapon's
>> >> tip is painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who have studied
>> the
>> >> mysterious fighting arts of the Orient know that such sticks may be
>> >> wielded with deadly force by those with skill.
>> >>
>> >> In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> >> could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> >> encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
>> blind
>> >> also own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of
> guidance
>> >> along city streets. With one word from their scheming masters, these
>> >> slavering "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> >>
>> >> Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a species
> of
>> >> killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
> somehow
>> >> fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
>> >> frightening aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their
> ability
>> >> to communicate with one another unbeknownst to upstanding citizens.
> Their
>> >> secret code consists of a series of raised dots cunningly arranged
>> into
>> >> arcane shapes. Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has begun
>> popping
>> >> up in places that were doubtlessly chosen for their mundane, everyday
>> >> outward appearance:
>> >> elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
> like.
>> >>
>> >> This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
> attention.
>> >> But think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how would
>> we
>> >> know? Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the
>> signs
>> >> will change from "second
>> >> floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
>> into
>> >> the chaos of revolution.
>> >>
>> >> At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
>> planning
>> >> such a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But can
>> one
>> >> group possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to
>> use
> it
>> >> to seize power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> >>
>> >> No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see the
>> >> threat where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary of
> the
>> >> blind menace.
>> >>
>> >> Alan P., Nevada.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> >> nagdu:
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediacom
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediaco
> m>
>> > bb.net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 16
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 21:39:14 -0400
>> > From: "cheryl
> echevarria"<cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com<mailto:cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
> Message-ID:<BLU162-ds8084A15951C07A96F9600A1520 at phx.gbl<mailto:BLU162-ds8084
> A15951C07A96F9600A1520 at phx.gbl>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> > well you can do it this way, just have a paypal button, doesn't have
>> to
> be
>> > for raffles. Just put in the information for payment of donation or
>> > whatever, doesn't have to say raffle.
>> >
>> > Then e-mail the contact person and let them know off list that it was
> for
>> > the Raffle.
>> >
>> > There are ways around it.
>> >
>> > Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
>> >
>> > Cheryl Echevarria
>> >
> http://www.echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/<http://www.
> echevarriatravel.com%3chttp//www.echevarriatravel.com/>>
>> > 631-456-5394
>> >
>>
> reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com<m
> ailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com%3Cmailto:reservations at echevarriatrav
> el.com>>
>> >
>> > Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel
>> CST-1018299-10
>> >
>> > Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise& Travel,
>> Inc.
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: Tami
> Kinney<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
>> > To:
> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:na
> gdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 4:38 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
>> >
>> > Hope and Buddy,
>> >
>> > I'm afraid we had to remove the PayPal button from the site... Turns
>> out
>> > they don't allow using their service for raffles, so now we know. But
>> > for this year, we've had to make adjustments. Those who paid through
>> > PayPal before they informed us how very displeased they are do have
>> the
>> > tickets they bought and paid for. We're planning and researching how
>> to
>> > deal with some of those fundraising activities through the website for
>> > everyone's convenience.
>> >
>> > Hope, if you want to know more, you can contact Marion at
>> >
> president at nagdu.org<mailto:president at nagdu.org<mailto:president at nagdu.org%3C
> mailto:president at nagdu.org>> or Toni Whaley at
>> >
> treasurer at nagdu.org<mailto:treasurer at nagdu.org<mailto:treasurer at nagdu.org%3C
> mailto:treasurer at nagdu.org>> to see if you
>> > can still get tickets. Come to think of it, it passed off my radar
>> when
>> > we decided to not use the website until we had a solution next year.
>> > But I still want that Breeze! /smile/
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 14:52 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> > > Hi,
>> > >
>> > > Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
>> > handy Paypal link.
>> > > --
>> > > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
>> Trekker
>> > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment
> and
>> > have tickets filled out?
>> > > > Thanks.
>> > > > Hope and Beignet
>> > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > >
> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:na
> gdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > > >
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org%3Chttp://www.nfbnet
> .or>
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > > >
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
> <
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>>
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > >
> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:na
> gdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > >
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org%3Chttp://www.nfbnet
> .or>
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcas
> t>
>> >
>>
> .net<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40co
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40co>
>> > mcast.net>
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
>> >
> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:na
> gdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> >
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org%3Chttp://www.nfbnet
> .or>
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%40hotma
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%40hotm
> a>
>> >
>>
> il.com<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%
>> > 40hotmail.com>
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 17
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 23:19:46 -0400
>> > From: "Julie
> Phillipson"<jbrew48 at verizon.net<mailto:jbrew48 at verizon.net>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
> Message-ID:<4DAE90F955164F5AB7709851EC36B4D1 at acer4d025c48b8<mailto:4DAE90F95
> 5164F5AB7709851EC36B4D1 at acer4d025c48b8>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>> > reply-type=response
>> >
>> > WHAT WAS NOT SAID ON THIS IS BELOW.
>> > Hi everyone,
>> >
>> > Below is something that if you can't laugh at far out humer then I
>> would
>> > suggest not reading it. The spoof came from a publication in Madison
>> > Wisconsin that does this kind of thing. Not sure how appropriate it is
> for
>> > the list, but sometimes one just needs to be a little crazy!!
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Julie Phillipson
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Sean
> Moore"<sean.moore at mediacombb.net<mailto:sean.moore at mediacombb.net>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:38 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
>> >
>> >> What the ...?
>> >> ----- Original Message -----
>> >> From: "Arthur
> Nolden"<anolden at tampabay.rr.com<mailto:anolden at tampabay.rr.com>>
>> >> To:<Undisclosed-Recipient:;>
>> >> Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:22 PM
>> >> Subject: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Blind People Are Faking It!
>> >>>
>> >>> Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
> secret
>> >>> society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
>> vicious
>> >>> attack animals in public on a daily basis. These mysterious folk
>> also
>> >>> have a secret means of communication, while shocking new evidence
> seems
>> >>> to indicate that they may even possess senses superior to those of
> other
>> >>> humans. We're speaking, of course, of the legions of the so-called
>> blind.
>> >>>
>> >>> Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in
>> the
>> >>> first place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of
>> sight,
>> >>> how does that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and
> Ronnie
>> >>> Milsap? How could such men possibly play music if they were blind?
> What
>> >>> do they take us for-ignorant
>> >>> saps?
>> >>> The first issue I must point out is their very public display of
>> armed
>> >>> might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a
>> cudgel
>> on
>> >>> their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them, are
>> supposed
>> >>> to help them feel their way along. They are painted white, almost as
> if
>> >>> the bearer wished to remind passersby of its presence, and the
> weapon's
>> >>> tip is painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who have studied
>> the
>> >>> mysterious fighting arts of the Orient know that such sticks may be
>> >>> wielded with deadly force by those with skill.
>> >>>
>> >>> In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> >>> could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> >>> encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
> blind
>> >>> also own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of
> guidance
>> >>> along city streets. With one word from their scheming masters, these
>> >>> slavering "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> >>>
>> >>> Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a
>> species
> of
>> >>> killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
> somehow
>> >>> fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
>> >>> frightening aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their
> ability
>> >>> to communicate with one another unbeknownst to upstanding citizens.
>> Their
>> >>> secret code consists of a series of raised dots cunningly arranged
> into
>> >>> arcane shapes. Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has begun
>> >>> popping up in places that were doubtlessly chosen for their mundane,
>> >>> everyday outward appearance:
>> >>> elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
> like.
>> >>>
>> >>> This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
> attention.
>> >>> But think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how would
>> we
>> >>> know? Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the
>> signs
>> >>> will change from "second
>> >>> floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
> into
>> >>> the chaos of revolution.
>> >>>
>> >>> At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
> planning
>> >>> such a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But can
> one
>> >>> group possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to
>> use
>> it
>> >>> to seize power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> >>>
>> >>> No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see the
>> >>> threat where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary
>> of
>> the
>> >>> blind menace.
>> >>>
>> >>> Alan P., Nevada.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> >>> nagdu:
>> >>>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediacom
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediaco
> m>
>> > bb.net
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> >> nagdu:
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.net
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.ne
> t>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 18
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 21:31:13 -0700
>> > From: Tami
> Kinney<tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
> Message-ID:<1308889873.2959.55.camel at tamara-desktop<mailto:1308889873.2959.5
> 5.camel at tamara-desktop>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > OMG! ROTFL! Heard the audio version a couple of days ago, but it just
>> > never stops being hysterical. Especially the way my new screen reader
>> > does it. I think I might have sprained something laughing!
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 18:22 -0400, Arthur Nolden wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Blind People Are Faking It!
>> >>
>> >> Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
> secret
>> > society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
> vicious
>> > attack animals in public on a daily basis. These mysterious folk also
> have
>> a
>> > secret means of communication, while shocking new evidence seems to
>> indicate
>> > that they may even possess senses superior to those of other humans.
> We're
>> > speaking, of course, of the legions of the so-called blind.
>> >> Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in
>> the
>> > first place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of sight,
> how
>> > does that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and Ronnie
>> Milsap?
>> > How could such men possibly play music if they were blind? What do
>> they
>> take
>> > us for-ignorant
>> >> saps?
>> >> The first issue I must point out is their very public display of
>> armed
>> > might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a cudgel
> on
>> > their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them, are
> supposed
>> to
>> > help them feel their way along. They are painted white, almost as if
>> the
>> > bearer wished to remind passersby of its presence, and the weapon's
>> tip
> is
>> > painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who have studied the
> mysterious
>> > fighting arts of the Orient know that such sticks may be wielded with
>> deadly
>> > force by those with skill.
>> >> In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> >> could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> > encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
>> blind
>> also
>> > own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of guidance
> along
>> > city streets. With one word from their scheming masters, these
>> slavering
>> > "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> >> Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a species
> of
>> > killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
>> somehow
>> > fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
>> frightening
>> > aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their ability to
>> communicate
>> > with one another unbeknownst to upstanding citizens. Their secret code
>> > consists of a series of raised dots cunningly arranged into arcane
> shapes.
>> > Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has begun popping up in
>> places
>> > that were doubtlessly chosen for their mundane, everyday outward
>> appearance:
>> >> elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
> like.
>> >>
>> >> This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
> attention.
>> > But think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how would we
>> know?
>> > Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the signs will
>> change
>> > from "second
>> >> floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
>> into
>> > the chaos of revolution.
>> >> At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
>> planning
>> > such a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But can
>> one
>> > group possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to use
> it
>> to
>> > seize power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> >> No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see the
>> > threat where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary of
> the
>> > blind menace.
>> >> Alan P., Nevada.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcas
> t>
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 19
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 05:47:57 -0400
>> > From: "cheryl
> echevarria"<cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com<mailto:cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
> Message-ID:<BLU162-ds13BBC737B2BC34501713C2A1520 at phx.gbl<mailto:BLU162-ds13B
> BC737B2BC34501713C2A1520 at phx.gbl>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> > it is funny ART, you are funny.
>> >
>> > Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
>> >
>> > Cheryl Echevarria
>> >
> http://www.echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/<http://www.
> echevarriatravel.com%3chttp//www.echevarriatravel.com/>>
>> > 631-456-5394
>> >
>>
> reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com<m
> ailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com%3Cmailto:reservations at echevarriatrav
> el.com>>
>> >
>> > Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel
>> CST-1018299-10
>> >
>> > Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise& Travel,
>> Inc.
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: Julie
> Phillipson<mailto:jbrew48 at verizon.net<mailto:jbrew48 at verizon.net>>
>> > To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
>> > Users<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 11:19 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
>> >
>> > WHAT WAS NOT SAID ON THIS IS BELOW.
>> > Hi everyone,
>> >
>> > Below is something that if you can't laugh at far out humer then I
>> would
>> > suggest not reading it. The spoof came from a publication in Madison
>> > Wisconsin that does this kind of thing. Not sure how appropriate it is
>> for
>> >
>> > the list, but sometimes one just needs to be a little crazy!!
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Julie Phillipson
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Sean Moore"
>> >
> <sean.moore at mediacombb.net<mailto:sean.moore at mediacombb.net<mailto:sean.moor
> e at mediacombb.net%3Cmailto:sean.moore at mediacombb.net>>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> >
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:n
> agdu at nfbnet.org>>>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:38 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
>> >
>> > > What the ...?
>> > > ----- Original Message -----
>> > > From: "Arthur Nolden"
>> >
> <anolden at tampabay.rr.com<mailto:anolden at tampabay.rr.com<mailto:anolden at tampa
> bay.rr.com%3Cmailto:anolden at tampabay.rr.com>>>
>> > > To:<Undisclosed-Recipient:;>
>> > > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:22 PM
>> > > Subject: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> Blind People Are Faking It!
>> > >>
>> > >> Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
>> > secret
>> > >> society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
>> > vicious
>> > >> attack animals in public on a daily basis. These mysterious folk
>> also
>> > >> have a secret means of communication, while shocking new evidence
>> seems
>> >
>> > >> to indicate that they may even possess senses superior to those of
>> > other
>> > >> humans. We're speaking, of course, of the legions of the so-called
>> > blind.
>> > >>
>> > >> Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in
>> the
>> > >> first place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of
>> sight,
>> > >> how does that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and
>> > Ronnie
>> > >> Milsap? How could such men possibly play music if they were blind?
>> What
>> >
>> > >> do they take us for-ignorant
>> > >> saps?
>> > >> The first issue I must point out is their very public display of
>> armed
>> > >> might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a
>> cudgel
>> > on
>> > >> their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them, are
>> > supposed
>> > >> to help them feel their way along. They are painted white, almost
>> as if
>> >
>> > >> the bearer wished to remind passersby of its presence, and the
>> weapon's
>> >
>> > >> tip is painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who have studied
>> the
>> > >> mysterious fighting arts of the Orient know that such sticks may be
>> > >> wielded with deadly force by those with skill.
>> > >>
>> > >> In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> > >> could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> > >> encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
>> blind
>> >
>> > >> also own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of
>> > guidance
>> > >> along city streets. With one word from their scheming masters,
>> these
>> > >> slavering "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> > >>
>> > >> Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a
>> species
>> > of
>> > >> killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
>> > somehow
>> > >> fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
>> > >> frightening aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their
>> > ability
>> > >> to communicate with one another unbeknownst to upstanding citizens.
>> > Their
>> > >> secret code consists of a series of raised dots cunningly arranged
>> into
>> >
>> > >> arcane shapes. Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has begun
>> > >> popping up in places that were doubtlessly chosen for their
>> mundane,
>> > >> everyday outward appearance:
>> > >> elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
>> > like.
>> > >>
>> > >> This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
>> > attention.
>> > >> But think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how would
>> we
>> > >> know? Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the
>> signs
>> > >> will change from "second
>> > >> floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
>> into
>> >
>> > >> the chaos of revolution.
>> > >>
>> > >> At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
>> planning
>> >
>> > >> such a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But
>> can
>> > one
>> > >> group possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to
>> use
>> > it
>> > >> to seize power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> > >>
>> > >> No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see
>> the
>> > >> threat where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary
>> of
>> > the
>> > >> blind menace.
>> > >>
>> > >> Alan P., Nevada.
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> nagdu mailing list
>> > >>
> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:na
> gdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org%3Chttp://www.nfbnet
> .or>
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > >> nagdu:
>> > >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediacom
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediaco
> m>
>> >
>>
> bb.net<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40m
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40m>
>> > ediacombb.net>
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > >
> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:na
> gdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > >
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org%3Chttp://www.nfbnet
> .or>
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.net
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.ne
> t>
>> >
>>
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.ne
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.ne
>>
>> > t>
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
>> >
> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:na
> gdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> >
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org%3Chttp://www.nfbnet
> .or>
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%40hotma
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%40hotm
> a>
>> >
>>
> il.com<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%
>> > 40hotmail.com>
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 20
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 08:30:47 -0400
>> > From: "Marion
> Gwizdala"<blind411 at verizon.net<mailto:blind411 at verizon.net>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
> Message-ID:<B560BFA05E674B108AC90002C499A6FB at marion27df4b2a<mailto:B560BFA05
> E674B108AC90002C499A6FB at marion27df4b2a>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
>> > reply-type=original
>> >
>> > Cheryl,
>> > Thanks for the info. we are not going to pursue this for year, as I
>> > believe it would probably raise some red flags with Pay Pal. We will
>> > consider this option for next year's *drawing*!
>> >
>> > Marion
>> >
>> > this
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "cheryl
> echevarria"<cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com<mailto:cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 9:39 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
>> >
>> >> well you can do it this way, just have a paypal button, doesn't have
>> to
>> be
>> >> for raffles. Just put in the information for payment of donation or
>> >> whatever, doesn't have to say raffle.
>> >>
>> >> Then e-mail the contact person and let them know off list that it was
> for
>> >> the Raffle.
>> >>
>> >> There are ways around it.
>> >>
>> >> Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
>> >>
>> >> Cheryl Echevarria
>> >>
> http://www.echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/<http://www.
> echevarriatravel.com%3chttp//www.echevarriatravel.com/>>
>> >> 631-456-5394
>> >>
>> >
>>
> reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com<m
> ailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com%3Cmailto:reservations at echevarriatrav
> el.com>>
>> >> Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel
>> >> CST-1018299-10
>> >>
>> >> Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise& Travel,
>> >> Inc.
>> >> ----- Original Message -----
>> >> From: Tami
> Kinney<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
>> >> To:
> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:na
> gdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> >> Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 4:38 PM
>> >> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Hope and Buddy,
>> >>
>> >> I'm afraid we had to remove the PayPal button from the site... Turns
>> out
>> >> they don't allow using their service for raffles, so now we know. But
>> >> for this year, we've had to make adjustments. Those who paid through
>> >> PayPal before they informed us how very displeased they are do have
>> the
>> >> tickets they bought and paid for. We're planning and researching how
>> to
>> >> deal with some of those fundraising activities through the website
>> for
>> >> everyone's convenience.
>> >>
>> >> Hope, if you want to know more, you can contact Marion at
>> >>
> president at nagdu.org<mailto:president at nagdu.org<mailto:president at nagdu.org%3C
> mailto:president at nagdu.org>> or Toni Whaley at
>> >>
> treasurer at nagdu.org<mailto:treasurer at nagdu.org<mailto:treasurer at nagdu.org%3C
> mailto:treasurer at nagdu.org>> to see if you
>> >> can still get tickets. Come to think of it, it passed off my radar
>> when
>> >> we decided to not use the website until we had a solution next year.
>> >> But I still want that Breeze! /smile/
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 14:52 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> >> > Hi,
>> >> >
>> >> > Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
>> >> handy Paypal link.
>> >> > --
>> >> > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> >> > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > > Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
>> Trekker
>> >> Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> >> attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit
>> payment
>> and
>> >> have tickets filled out?
>> >> > > Thanks.
>> >> > > Hope and Beignet
>> >> > > _______________________________________________
>> >> > > nagdu mailing list
>> >> > >
> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:na
> gdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> >> > >
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org%3Chttp://www.nfbnet
> .or>
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> >> nagdu:
>> >> > >
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
> <
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > _______________________________________________
>> >> > nagdu mailing list
>> >> >
> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:na
> gdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org%3Chttp://www.nfbnet
> .or>
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> >> nagdu:
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcas
> t>
>> >
>>
> .net<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40co
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40co>
>> > mcast.net>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >>
> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:na
> gdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org%3Chttp://www.nfbnet
> .or>
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> >> nagdu:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%40hotma
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%40hotm
> a>
>> >
>>
> il.com<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%
>> > 40hotmail.com>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> >> nagdu:
>> >>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.ne
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.n
> e>
>> > t
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 21
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 10:18:15 -0400
>> > From: "Tracy
>> Carcione"<carcione at access.net<mailto:carcione at access.net>>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: [nagdu] Cloning
>> >
> Message-ID:<9b4cadb7cfeb707c2f4ff952f8abca3c.squirrel at mail.panix.com<mailto:
> 9b4cadb7cfeb707c2f4ff952f8abca3c.squirrel at mail.panix.com>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>> >
>> > I heard a story about cloning on NPR a few weeks ago. A police
> department
>> > tried cloning a police dog with a really super nose and other great
>> > characteristics. The clones noses were just so-so, not the same as the
>> > original. I thought that was interesting.
>> > I've sometimes wished I could clone one of my dogs. But it might still
>> > not be the same. And I'd miss getting to know the wonderful uniqueness
> of
>> > the next dog. Vive la difference! It is in the natural order of things
> to
>> > have to let go of the old and embrace the new.
>> > Tracy
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 22
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 14:20:47 +0000
>> > From: "PICKRELL, REBECCA M
> (TASC)"<REBECCA.PICKRELL at tasc.com<mailto:REBECCA.PICKRELL at tasc.com>>
>> > To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>> > Users'" <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Cloning
>> >
> Message-ID:<AAE38548E198F64B8E345439B68CCC781260AE37 at TSEAMB02<mailto:AAE3854
> 8E198F64B8E345439B68CCC781260AE37 at TSEAMB02>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>> >
>> > Keep in mind with cloning, you are not cloning souls. We all have them
> We
>> > also are not cloning experiences and interpertations on experiences.
>> We
>> all
>> > have those too.
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org>
> [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
>> > Of Tracy Carcione
>> > Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 10:18 AM
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: [nagdu] Cloning
>> >
>> > I heard a story about cloning on NPR a few weeks ago. A police
> department
>> > tried cloning a police dog with a really super nose and other great
>> > characteristics. The clones noses were just so-so, not the same as the
>> > original. I thought that was interesting.
>> > I've sometimes wished I could clone one of my dogs. But it might still
>> > not be the same. And I'd miss getting to know the wonderful uniqueness
> of
>> > the next dog. Vive la difference! It is in the natural order of things
> to
>> > have to let go of the old and embrace the new.
>> > Tracy
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
>> > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pickrell%40ta
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pickrell%40t
> a>
>> > sc.com
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 23
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 11:44:15 -0400
>> > From: "Tracy
>> Carcione"<carcione at access.net<mailto:carcione at access.net>>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: [nagdu] Success stats
>> >
> Message-ID:<e41fac95e159265db497442342f4b9d2.squirrel at mail.panix.com<mailto:
> e41fac95e159265db497442342f4b9d2.squirrel at mail.panix.com>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>> >
>> > In the latest Seeing Eye annual report, they talk about working to
> improve
>> > their success rate from birth to a successful match. The report said
> that
>> > 80% of the dogs that enter training make it through. It also said that
>> > they have lowered the number of puppies they need to breed in order to
>> > have enough for training, but, looking at the numbers, it looks like
>> > roughly 2 to 1--509 pups born, 254 partnered with students.
>> > I remember reading, ages ago, that only 50% of guide dog puppies make
>> it
>> > through, and these stats look about the same, to me.
>> > I would really like to know if GDB's new methods have changed that
>> ratio
>> > significantly. I'm also curious if it's about the same at other
>> schools.
>> > 50% seems pretty poor to me, but maybe that's just how it is. Anyway,
>> > these sorts of stats interest me, and I thought they might interest
>> > others, too. If anyone else has different stats, I'd love to find out
>> > more.
>> > Tracy
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 24
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 09:24:44 -0700
>> > From: Tami
> Kinney<tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Cloning
>> >
> Message-ID:<1308932684.2091.34.camel at tamara-desktop<mailto:1308932684.2091.3
> 4.camel at tamara-desktop>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > True! Since I plan to have several years before I have to make a
>> > decision, I can have fun with idea of doing it because I really do
>> adore
>> > my poodle girl and want to hang on to her forever... When the time
>> > comes, and it's a *real* decision, who knows? As a lifelong sci-fi
>> nut,
>> > it's just really exciting that we can now discuss the pros and cons
>> > seriuosly because we're not just making things up that will never be
>> > possible. /smile/
>> >
>> > On Fri, 2011-06-24 at 10:18 -0400, Tracy Carcione wrote:
>> >> I heard a story about cloning on NPR a few weeks ago. A police
>> department
>> >> tried cloning a police dog with a really super nose and other great
>> >> characteristics. The clones noses were just so-so, not the same as
>> the
>> >> original. I thought that was interesting.
>> >> I've sometimes wished I could clone one of my dogs. But it might
>> still
>> >> not be the same. And I'd miss getting to know the wonderful
>> uniqueness
>> of
>> >> the next dog. Vive la difference! It is in the natural order of
>> things
>> to
>> >> have to let go of the old and embrace the new.
>> >> Tracy
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcas
> t>
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 25
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 09:30:36 -0700
>> > From: Tami
> Kinney<tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Success stats
>> >
> Message-ID:<1308933036.2091.39.camel at tamara-desktop<mailto:1308933036.2091.3
> 9.camel at tamara-desktop>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Tracy, I read the older stats you mentioned when I was researching the
>> > notion of owner-training, and they were awfully daunting since I was
>> > looking for one dog which meant I needed a 100 percent success rate to
>> > have a guide dog. And this was how it was working out for people who
>> > actually knew what they were doing? /lol/ There was also an equally
>> > daunting ratio of returns after the match or early retirements... I
>> got
>> > the dog I found anyway and figured that I'd just start training her
>> and
>> > see what happened.
>> >
>> > Anyway, thanks for sharing the updated info. I do have a vague item
>> > penciled in way down on my to do list to look into what changes there
>> > have been over time at various programs, so I'm glad someone else does
>> > that, too, and lets others know. Cool!
>> >
>> > On Fri, 2011-06-24 at 11:44 -0400, Tracy Carcione wrote:
>> >> In the latest Seeing Eye annual report, they talk about working to
>> improve
>> >> their success rate from birth to a successful match. The report said
>> that
>> >> 80% of the dogs that enter training make it through. It also said
>> that
>> >> they have lowered the number of puppies they need to breed in order
>> to
>> >> have enough for training, but, looking at the numbers, it looks like
>> >> roughly 2 to 1--509 pups born, 254 partnered with students.
>> >> I remember reading, ages ago, that only 50% of guide dog puppies make
> it
>> >> through, and these stats look about the same, to me.
>> >> I would really like to know if GDB's new methods have changed that
> ratio
>> >> significantly. I'm also curious if it's about the same at other
> schools.
>> >> 50% seems pretty poor to me, but maybe that's just how it is. Anyway,
>> >> these sorts of stats interest me, and I thought they might interest
>> >> others, too. If anyone else has different stats, I'd love to find out
>> >> more.
>> >> Tracy
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcas
> t>
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 26
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 10:58:23 -0600
>> > From: Sheila
> Leigland<sleigland at bresnan.net<mailto:sleigland at bresnan.net>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Success stats
>> >
> Message-ID:<auto-000290016377 at fe-2.cluster1.bresnan.net<mailto:auto-00029001
> 6377 at fe-2.cluster1.bresnan.net>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> > The fifty percent is what I've heard and it seems low to me also. I
>> hope
>> it
>> > changes or has changed.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 27
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 12:56:17 -0400
>> > From: "Margo and
> Arrow"<margo.downey at verizon.net<mailto:margo.downey at verizon.net>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
> Message-ID:<00EEE5F0BE5247D9BA2FCD3E80653E45 at meandmyarrow<mailto:00EEE5F0BE5
> 247D9BA2FCD3E80653E45 at meandmyarrow>>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
>> > reply-type=response
>> >
>> > It's from the Onion and the Onion spoofs everyone and everything.
>> >
>> > Margo and Arrow
>> >
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Julie
> Phillipson"<jbrew48 at verizon.net<mailto:jbrew48 at verizon.net>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 11:19 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
>> >
>> >> WHAT WAS NOT SAID ON THIS IS BELOW.
>> >> Hi everyone,
>> >>
>> >> Below is something that if you can't laugh at far out humer then I
> would
>> >> suggest not reading it. The spoof came from a publication in Madison
>> >> Wisconsin that does this kind of thing. Not sure how appropriate it
>> is
>> for
>> >> the list, but sometimes one just needs to be a little crazy!!
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Julie Phillipson
>> >> ----- Original Message -----
>> >> From: "Sean
> Moore"<sean.moore at mediacombb.net<mailto:sean.moore at mediacombb.net>>
>> >> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> >> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> >> Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:38 PM
>> >> Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> What the ...?
>> >>> ----- Original Message -----
>> >>> From: "Arthur
> Nolden"<anolden at tampabay.rr.com<mailto:anolden at tampabay.rr.com>>
>> >>> To:<Undisclosed-Recipient:;>
>> >>> Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:22 PM
>> >>> Subject: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Blind People Are Faking It!
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
>> secret
>> >>>> society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
>> >>>> vicious attack animals in public on a daily basis. These mysterious
>> folk
>> >>>> also have a secret means of communication, while shocking new
> evidence
>> >>>> seems to indicate that they may even possess senses superior to
>> those
>> of
>> >>>> other humans. We're speaking, of course, of the legions of the
>> so-called
>> >>>> blind.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in
> the
>> >>>> first place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of
>> sight,
>> >>>> how does that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and
>> Ronnie
>> >>>> Milsap? How could such men possibly play music if they were blind?
> What
>> >>>> do they take us for-ignorant
>> >>>> saps?
>> >>>> The first issue I must point out is their very public display of
> armed
>> >>>> might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a
> cudgel
>> >>>> on their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them, are
>> >>>> supposed to help them feel their way along. They are painted white,
>> >>>> almost as if the bearer wished to remind passersby of its presence,
> and
>> >>>> the weapon's tip is painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who
> have
>> >>>> studied the mysterious fighting arts of the Orient know that such
>> sticks
>> >>>> may be wielded with deadly force by those with skill.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> >>>> could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> >>>> encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
> blind
>> >>>> also own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of
>> guidance
>> >>>> along city streets. With one word from their scheming masters,
>> these
>> >>>> slavering "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a
>> species
>> of
>> >>>> killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
>> somehow
>> >>>> fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
>> >>>> frightening aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their
>> ability
>> >>>> to communicate with one another unbeknownst to upstanding citizens.
>> >>>> Their secret code consists of a series of raised dots cunningly
>> arranged
>> >>>> into arcane shapes. Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has
> begun
>> >>>> popping up in places that were doubtlessly chosen for their
>> mundane,
>> >>>> everyday outward appearance:
>> >>>> elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
>> like.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
>> attention.
>> >>>> But think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how would
> we
>> >>>> know? Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the
> signs
>> >>>> will change from "second
>> >>>> floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
> into
>> >>>> the chaos of revolution.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
> planning
>> >>>> such a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But can
>> one
>> >>>> group possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to
> use
>> >>>> it to seize power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see
>> the
>> >>>> threat where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary
>> of
>> >>>> the blind menace.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Alan P., Nevada.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> >>>> nagdu:
>> >>>>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediacom
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediaco
> m>
>> > bb.net
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> nagdu mailing list
>> >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
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>> for
>> >>> nagdu:
>> >>>
>> >
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.net
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.ne
> t>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
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>> >>
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> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/margo.downey%40veriz
> o>
>> > n.net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
>> > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >
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> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> >
>> >
>> > End of nagdu Digest, Vol 75, Issue 28
>> > *************************************
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
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>> >
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> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/julielj%40neb.rr.com>
>> >
>> > c
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
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> r>
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>>
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>> _______________________________________________
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> il.com<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%
> 40hotmail.com>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 16:00:30 -0400
>> From: "cheryl echevarria" <cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Greetings and a Thank You
>> Message-ID: <BLU162-ds42FA075EC15FF5D8487CDA1520 at phx.gbl>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>
>> good luck up here. I am in NY, Morristown is in NJ, anyway welcome and
> post when you can.
>>
>> Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
>>
>> Cheryl Echevarria
>> http://www.echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/>
>> 631-456-5394
>>
> reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com>
>>
>> Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel
> CST-1018299-10
>>
>> Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise & Travel,
> Inc.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Robert Martin<mailto:robert.martin at cfu.net>
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
> Users<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 3:56 PM
>> Subject: [nagdu] Greetings and a Thank You
>>
>>
>> Good Morning,
>>
>> For the past couple of months I've been an infrequent contributer but a
> frequent reader of the contributions to this tlist. I have been unable to
> read everything because of my work but I have learned a great deal in
> preparation for my trip to the Seeing Eye to train with a guide dog
> partner.
> Tomorrow I fly to Morristown to begin my training and what I have learned
> from all of you gives me some sense of security and also confidence that I
> have, at a later age in life, made the right decision. Thanks to all of
> you
> for your work and the information you share.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Bob Martin
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
> g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
>>
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> il.com<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%
> 40hotmail.com>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 16:14:56 -0400
>> From: "Dan Weiner" <dcwein at dcwein.cnc.net>
>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>> Users'" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Greetings and a Thank You
>> Message-ID: <20110624201504.6848D972C at tonnant.cnc.net>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>>
>> Hi, Bob.
>>
>> How exciting.
>> I really enjoy hearing about new guide dog users because it reminds me
>> of
> my
>> days as a newbie.
>>
>> I'm Dan Weiner, forty-one-years-old, and a guide dog user for 17 years.
>> I look forward to hearing every detail.
>>
>> Good luck
>>
>>
>> Dan and the Carter Dog
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 5
>> Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 14:15:47 -0700
>> From: Tami Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Success stats
>> Message-ID: <1308950147.3386.53.camel at tamara-desktop>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>>
>> Yeah, it does seem startling when you hear it. I think with some breeds
>> the success rates are lower. Say, with poodles. That may have changed
>> with the programs that now have more experience with the silly creatures
>> since I read that.
>>
>> >From what I have been able to gather, labs have the highest success
>> rate
>> over the other traditional breeds, so many more labs than others. Also,
>> lab/golden crosses. Can't remember where goldens come in off the top of
>> my head.
>>
>> Some of the difference in success rates by breed have to do with health
>> problems or with temperament issues that crop up in an established line
>> from breeding trends that pollute the gene pool. Sigh. I guess it's
>> been a problem with GSDs, and some programs have been able to recover
>> and get their GSD lines back up to snuff by importing breeding stock
>> while others have phased them out. Well, I know that was a big part of
>> why GDB decided to become a purely lab or lab/golden program not too
>> long ago and just phased out their shepherds. They tried poodles for a
>> few years, but between some health issues in their stock and the poodly
>> temperament in the training environment, they finally determined it
>> wasn't cost effective for them to keep at it. Which does make sense.
>>
>> It seems, also, that labs are just easier, both in training and in
>> matching over a variety of potential handlers. As a rule, they're just
>> so gosh darn calm and steady and ridiculously easy to get along with
>> while still being trainable and well-suited for guide work. Some are a
>> bit slower and more mellow than the norm, so they're better suited for
>> people who need that for whatever reason. Some a perkier and feistier
>> and faster than the norm, so that takes care of your adventure-seeking
>> handlers. /smile/ They seem to have the most important strenghts of the
>> other common breeds without some of the traits only some think of as
>> strengths. So, better odds of placing more puppies from any given
>> litter of labs than GSDs or other herding/guarding types. Makes sense,
>> actually, even though I probably don't have the whole picture from the
>> program perspective, especially at a decision-making level. It's
>> interesting to think about, though.
>>
>> I wonder if dobies will make a comeback as guide dogs since breeders
>> seem to be doing well at bringing them back to what they were before the
>> tiny head fiasco. Now I guess collies are having tiny head problems
>> because of breeders who think that's a good idea. Sigh. Anyway, I keep
>> meeting dobies with proportional heads and good temperaments and owners
>> who are so happy the breeders got a clue and turned their practices
>> around so that dobies are dobies. Yay! I'm also noticing more straight
>> GSDs with good temperaments around, too, but the owners tell me you
>> still have to work pretty hard to make sure that's what you get. Still,
>> progress. So I also wonder if with more healthy even-tempered stock
>> available in outside breeding stock, programs will start increasing
>> their shepherd lines. It will be interesting to see. For me, at
>> least. /smile/
>>
>> On Fri, 2011-06-24 at 10:58 -0600, Sheila Leigland wrote:
>> > The fifty percent is what I've heard and it seems low to me also. I
>> hope
> it changes or has changed.
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
>> > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> .net
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 6
>> Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 15:33:12 -0600
>> From: Jeffrey Young <jeff.young8806 at gmail.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Success stats
>> Message-ID: <03D7307E-2EFC-4AE7-9D49-F4F67D33CA2D at gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>>
>> I don't think these numbers are actually as bad as they appear.
>> 1. A certain number of dogs go into the breeding program at TSE which
> accounts for some of the drop off. Also their will be dogs with health
> problems which makes them unfit for guide work.
>> 2. This training they go through is extremely intense. Think about it
> these dogs are like the navy seals of the dog world. I believe the navy
> seals have something like way over 50 percent drop out rates.
>> A trainer at TSE told me that if a dog successfully makes it through the
> puppy raising phase that dog has an 80 percent chance or more of either
> being a breeder or a guide. We can't forget that the breeding is nearly as
> important as the guide work.
>>
>> Also, a dog might seem like it will be an excellent guide and then show
> some sort of odd behavior that can't be accounted for which disqualifies
> that dog.
>>
>> Jeff and Hansel
>> On Jun 24, 2011, at 3:15 PM, Tami Kinney wrote:
>>
>> > Yeah, it does seem startling when you hear it. I think with some
>> breeds
>> > the success rates are lower. Say, with poodles. That may have changed
>> > with the programs that now have more experience with the silly
>> creatures
>> > since I read that.
>> >
>> >> From what I have been able to gather, labs have the highest success
> rate
>> > over the other traditional breeds, so many more labs than others.
>> Also,
>> > lab/golden crosses. Can't remember where goldens come in off the top
>> of
>> > my head.
>> >
>> > Some of the difference in success rates by breed have to do with
>> health
>> > problems or with temperament issues that crop up in an established
>> line
>> > from breeding trends that pollute the gene pool. Sigh. I guess it's
>> > been a problem with GSDs, and some programs have been able to recover
>> > and get their GSD lines back up to snuff by importing breeding stock
>> > while others have phased them out. Well, I know that was a big part of
>> > why GDB decided to become a purely lab or lab/golden program not too
>> > long ago and just phased out their shepherds. They tried poodles for a
>> > few years, but between some health issues in their stock and the
>> poodly
>> > temperament in the training environment, they finally determined it
>> > wasn't cost effective for them to keep at it. Which does make sense.
>> >
>> > It seems, also, that labs are just easier, both in training and in
>> > matching over a variety of potential handlers. As a rule, they're just
>> > so gosh darn calm and steady and ridiculously easy to get along with
>> > while still being trainable and well-suited for guide work. Some are a
>> > bit slower and more mellow than the norm, so they're better suited for
>> > people who need that for whatever reason. Some a perkier and feistier
>> > and faster than the norm, so that takes care of your adventure-seeking
>> > handlers. /smile/ They seem to have the most important strenghts of
>> the
>> > other common breeds without some of the traits only some think of as
>> > strengths. So, better odds of placing more puppies from any given
>> > litter of labs than GSDs or other herding/guarding types. Makes sense,
>> > actually, even though I probably don't have the whole picture from the
>> > program perspective, especially at a decision-making level. It's
>> > interesting to think about, though.
>> >
>> > I wonder if dobies will make a comeback as guide dogs since breeders
>> > seem to be doing well at bringing them back to what they were before
>> the
>> > tiny head fiasco. Now I guess collies are having tiny head problems
>> > because of breeders who think that's a good idea. Sigh. Anyway, I keep
>> > meeting dobies with proportional heads and good temperaments and
>> owners
>> > who are so happy the breeders got a clue and turned their practices
>> > around so that dobies are dobies. Yay! I'm also noticing more straight
>> > GSDs with good temperaments around, too, but the owners tell me you
>> > still have to work pretty hard to make sure that's what you get.
>> Still,
>> > progress. So I also wonder if with more healthy even-tempered stock
>> > available in outside breeding stock, programs will start increasing
>> > their shepherd lines. It will be interesting to see. For me, at
>> > least. /smile/
>> >
>> > On Fri, 2011-06-24 at 10:58 -0600, Sheila Leigland wrote:
>> >> The fifty percent is what I've heard and it seems low to me also. I
> hope it changes or has changed.
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nagdu mailing list
>> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
>> >>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
> .net
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
>> > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jeff.young8806%40gmai
> l.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 7
>> Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 14:47:09 -0700
>> From: Tami Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] question about convention and booties.
>> Message-ID: <1308952030.3386.74.camel at tamara-desktop>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>>
>> Tara,
>>
>> You should take your dog to convention while leaving her home at the
>> same time. Does that help? Kidding! It just didn't sound like enough
>> people were informing you of what you should or shouldn't do that I
>> thought I'd make sure you didn't start thinking you could figure it out
>> on your own or anything. /evil grin/
>>
>> As for the booties... Can you think of any functional reason your dog
>> might be showing so much anxiety when you start to put them on? Has
>> something changed in that part of her foot and leg that might cause her
>> discomfort? I dunno. Once I noticed Mitzi was suddenly anti-booty and
>> gave it up until I tried again a few days later after she had been
>> trimmed and had her toenails trimmed. Oh. I seem to recall I had gone a
>> bit long between groomings, so the nails were getting long enough that
>> they affected the way the booties fit and she didn't like it. It might
>> not hurt to examine your dog for hotspots or even just minor scratches
>> or abrasions under the fur that would be hard to notice unless you were
>> looking for them? It never hurts to rule that one out at first, since
>> it's the easiest thing to diagnose if that's what it is.
>>
>> Another thing you might want to think back on is whether anything scary
>> or hurtful happened when she was last wearing the booties without the
>> anxiety. Could there be anythink her doggy brain might now associate
>> with the booties as a bad thing? If that's what's going on with her,
>> getting her to see the booties as "not bad" again might take some time
>> and creativity to resolve. Or another solution that doesn't involve
>> booties. You're doing some of what I would recommend in terms of
>> conditioning her to associate the booties with goodies, so you clearly
>> know what to do.
>>
>> Um... Hot sun on blacktop is too likely to cause pain and even damage in
>> my opinion, even if it's just old grayish blacktop and you only cross
>> one street. I should say "we" instead of "you" there, since it's the
>> rule of thumb I use. When we pop out to dinner in the summer with DD in
>> the pickup, DD will spend the drive muttering about how she's not going
>> to need booties to go from the truck to the sidewalk to an air
>> conditioned hamburger joint or restaurant, while I put the booties on
>> Mitzi as we go. /grin/ Then, of course, when we all get out of the car
>> and walk 3 steps across blacktop to the sidewalk and the door to air
>> conditioning, he will frown thoughtfully at the blacktop and say, "I
>> suppose that would be pretty hot on her pads." We've had a cloudy cool
>> summer so far, so I'll just have to wait a while to find out if we'll
>> still be having that exact conversation every time we go out to dinner
>> for a couple of months. /lol/
>>
>> The only option I can think of to protect your dog's paws from the hot
>> blacktop and sidewalks, if it's that hot, is Musher's Secret (I think
>> that's what it's called), which I keep meaning to try but end up just
>> using the booties instead. Others seem to like it and will surely tell
>> you more.
>>
>> Good luck with the booties and have fun at convention whatever you
>> decide is best for you and your dog. /smile/
>>
>> On Fri, 2011-06-24 at 11:18 -0600, Tara Chavez wrote:
>> > Hello all,
>> > I have a couple of questions. I am currently debating whether or not
>> to
> take
>> > my guide dog with me to convention. I've heard opinions on both sides
> and
>> > wonder what most people do.
>> > I've heard not to take her because I'd end up stressing her out more,
> plus
>> > I'd be worrying more about her and less likely to have fun at
> convention.
>> > I've also heard that I should take her (or at least I think I should)
>> > because of the experience of traveling and navigating the hotel and
>> all
> that
>> > with her by my side. I am curious what a lot of people do. I know as a
> guide
>> > dog user that I am proud of that and I want the world to know that I
> have a
>> > wonderful companion... Thoughts?
>> > My other questions is about booties. I used them a lot last year when
>> I
>> > first came home, but not a whole lot since. Now that it's getting into
> the
>> > 90's and up, I want to be able to work my dog in booties, but she gets
>> > stressed when I put them on. I've tried putting them on and feeding
>> her
>> > dinner, since that was a suggestion from GDB when I asked them. I've
> also
>> > tried clickering her for allowing me to put them on her, but she has
> been so
>> > stressed that she won't accept even high-value reward. Any
>> suggestions?
> I
>> > can't not work my dog because of the heat, can I?
>> > Thank you,
>> > Tara
>> >
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf
>> > Of nagdu-request at nfbnet.org
>> > Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 11:00 AM
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: nagdu Digest, Vol 75, Issue 28
>> >
>> > Send nagdu mailing list submissions to
>> > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> >
>> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>> > nagdu-request at nfbnet.org
>> >
>> > You can reach the person managing the list at
>> > nagdu-owner at nfbnet.org
>> >
>> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> > than "Re: Contents of nagdu digest..."
>> >
>> >
>> > Today's Topics:
>> >
>> > 1. Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Hope Paulos)
>> > 2. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Buddy Brannan)
>> > 3. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Hope Paulos)
>> > 4. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Marion Gwizdala)
>> > 5. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Marion Gwizdala)
>> > 6. Re: Different types of dogs (Tami Kinney)
>> > 7. Re: [Flagdu] what the NFB Should Do! (Dan Weiner)
>> > 8. Re: DIFFERENT TYPES OF DOGS (Tami Kinney)
>> > 9. Re: what the NFB Should Do! (Tami Kinney)
>> > 10. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Tami Kinney)
>> > 11. Re: [Flagdu] what the NFB Should Do! (Tami Kinney)
>> > 12. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Buddy Brannan)
>> > 13. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Tami Kinney)
>> > 14. . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (Arthur Nolden)
>> > 15. Re: . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (Sean Moore)
>> > 16. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (cheryl echevarria)
>> > 17. Re: . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (Julie Phillipson)
>> > 18. Re: . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (Tami Kinney)
>> > 19. Re: . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (cheryl echevarria)
>> > 20. Re: Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze (Marion Gwizdala)
>> > 21. Cloning (Tracy Carcione)
>> > 22. Re: Cloning (PICKRELL, REBECCA M (TASC))
>> > 23. Success stats (Tracy Carcione)
>> > 24. Re: Cloning (Tami Kinney)
>> > 25. Re: Success stats (Tami Kinney)
>> > 26. Re: Success stats (Sheila Leigland)
>> > 27. Re: . O-T: Blind People are Faking it. (Margo and Arrow)
>> >
>> >
>> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 1
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 14:37:45 -0400
>> > From: "Hope Paulos" <hope.paulos at gmail.com>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> > Message-ID: <6B86F91030FB44F6AE73B7A433F26478 at Espy>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> > Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the Trekker
> Breeze
>> > from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> attending
>> > convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment and have
>> > tickets filled out?
>> > Thanks.
>> > Hope and Beignet
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 2
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 14:52:39 -0400
>> > From: Buddy Brannan <buddy at brannan.name>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> > Message-ID: <35856142-62E1-4EEE-B450-71702C4DA917 at brannan.name>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>> >
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
> handy
>> > Paypal link.
>> > --
>> > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> >
>> > > Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
>> Trekker
>> > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment
> and
>> > have tickets filled out?
>> > > Thanks.
>> > > Hope and Beignet
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 3
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 15:25:26 -0400
>> > From: "Hope Paulos" <hope.paulos at gmail.com>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> > Message-ID: <B192608FE5C8458AA68DB537300A3308 at Espy>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>> > reply-type=original
>> >
>> > Thanks Buddy. Again, you're a life-saver. :)
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Buddy Brannan" <buddy at brannan.name>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 2:52 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
>> >
>> > > Hi,
>> > >
>> > > Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
> handy
>> > > Paypal link.
>> > > --
>> > > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
>> Trekker
>> > >> Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are
>> not
>> > >> attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit
> payment
>> > >> and have tickets filled out?
>> > >> Thanks.
>> > >> Hope and Beignet
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> nagdu mailing list
>> > >> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > >> nagdu:
>> > >>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/hope.paulos%40gmail.c
>> > om
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 4
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 15:27:39 -0400
>> > From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> > Message-ID: <440C123849064754B6CFE0901F9B002B at marion27df4b2a>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
>> > reply-type=original
>> >
>> > Hope,
>> > We attempted to make entries available through Pay pal; however, they
>> do
>> >
>> > not allow raffles and shut it down. We are working to get our account
>> > re-activated so we can collect membership dues. The challenge we would
> face
>> > selling tickets outside of convention is how to accept payment. next
> year,
>> > we will have learned how to use Pay Pal without breaching our user
>> > agreement. If you have any suggestions as to how we can sell tickets
> without
>> >
>> > using Pay Pal, please feel free to make suggestions. We are open to
> allowing
>> >
>> > anyone who wants to support our projects the opportunity to do so!
>> >
>> > Fraternally yours,
>> > Marion Gwizdala, President
>> > National Association of Guide Dog Users (NAGDU)
>> > National Federation of the Blind
>> > 813-626-2789
>> > President at NAGDU.ORG
>> > HTTP://WWW.NAGDU.ORG
>> >
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Hope Paulos" <hope.paulos at gmail.com>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 2:37 PM
>> > Subject: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
>> >
>> > > Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
>> Trekker
>> > > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are
>> not
>> > > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit
>> payment
> and
>> >
>> > > have tickets filled out?
>> > > Thanks.
>> > > Hope and Beignet
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.ne
>> > t
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 5
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 15:28:54 -0400
>> > From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> > Message-ID: <C132140FEFD44563B2E062079C3E80AC at marion27df4b2a>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
>> > reply-type=original
>> >
>> > Buddy,
>> > Unfortunately, we had to shut down that option, as Pay Pal suspended
>> our
>> >
>> > account! You were one of the few that got in before this happened. now
> we
>> > are working to access those funds!
>> >
>> > Marion
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Buddy Brannan" <buddy at brannan.name>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 2:52 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
>> >
>> > > Hi,
>> > >
>> > > Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
> handy
>> > > Paypal link.
>> > > --
>> > > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
>> Trekker
>> > >> Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are
>> not
>> > >> attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit
> payment
>> > >> and have tickets filled out?
>> > >> Thanks.
>> > >> Hope and Beignet
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> nagdu mailing list
>> > >> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > >> nagdu:
>> > >>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.ne
>> > t
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 6
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 12:55:51 -0700
>> > From: Tami Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Different types of dogs
>> > Message-ID: <1308858951.2044.12.camel at tamara-desktop>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Mardi,
>> >
>> > Just remember to collect and save some genetic material from Nala.
>> > Cloning technology is improving, and costs are coming down as R&D
>> > expenses are paid off. Unlike the adaptive tech market in a lot of
>> areas
>> > still. But that's another matter. I'm glad someone else will admit to
>> > seriously wanting to do that. /lol/ Blurting that out in conversation
>> > can generate awkward silence broken by strangled stutterings. I
>> havent'
>> > checked for awhile, but cloning is probably still beyond the means of
>> > the likes of you and I... By the time I need to start looking for
>> > Mitzi's successor, though, who knows? If it is possible for me to take
>> > that route, who knows what I will decide, really? She's only 5, and
>> > genetic health problems could still show up (I'm in denial about
>> that),
>> > etc. Physically, she is healthy and sound, except for some early
>> issues
>> > from bugs, not genes. Her temperament is fantastic, and I love her
>> > poodly brains and even obstinance at work, home and play. Also, as I
>> > keep telling her, she will be helping me raise herself, so that's
>> > vengeance for me for her puppyhood. /lol/ She grins and wags her tail
>> > as if I am being silly. Whether she knows what I am saying or not (I
>> > really do wonder sometimes even when she can't possibly), I get the
>> > impression she generally assumes that if I am talking, I am just being
>> > silly for her amusement. I then begin to wonder if I am a masochist
>> > when it comes to guide dogs. /lol/
>> >
>> > The greater choice in breed and individual is a big plus to
>> > owner-training. Except for the part where you're looking for the right
>> > pup from the breed you've selected, which is really nerve-wracking and
>> > can take a lot of time. Unless you're lucky, which seems to have
>> > happened to me with Mitzi. Maybe that's another reason I just want to
>> > clone her when the time comes. I don't have to turn myself into a
>> wreck
>> > wondering if I will find that elusive new prospect in a puppy... Scary
>> > stuff, that! /smile/
>> >
>> > Glad Shaman is doing well and progressing. He must be pretty adult,
>> > too, by now and building up experience. That's when it starts to be
>> real
>> > fun. /grin/
>> >
>> > On Wed, 2011-06-22 at 17:29 -0700, Mardi Hadfield wrote:
>> > > Hi all, If you need a guide dog and go to a school to get it, you
>> > probably
>> > > don't have a lot of choice in what breed of dog you want. You may be
> able
>> > to
>> > > state a preference,but that is no guarantee that you will actually
>> get
>> > what
>> > > you asked for. I think that for a first time dog user, it is wise to
> let
>> > > the school match you with the dog that they feel is best for
>> you.Maybe
> on
>> > > your second time you can get the kind of dog you want as you will
>> have
> the
>> > > experience of already working with a dog. Of course this is just my
>> > > opinion,but to me it makes sense. On the other hand, if you are an
> owner
>> > > trainer and have a certain preference, go for it!My chosen breed is
> the
>> > > Siberian Husky. This is not the breed for every one! There are many
> cons
>> > and
>> > > some pros. For me, I needed a dog that could keep up with my power
>> > > wheelchair and my very active life style.A breed that did not tire
> easily
>> > > and could go all day. The husky fit the bill for me.Since I already
> had a
>> > > husky service dog,I just trained her as a guide dog. She was a
> wonderful
>> > > guide but had to be retired early as she got Vally Fever. This is a
>> > disease
>> > > limited to the southwest. She died unexpectedly a month after her
>> > > retirement.I was lucky to have found another Husky to train as my
>> next
>> > > guide. This dog has been an exceptional guide dog. She has gone
>> above
> and
>> > > beyond as a guide dog.I don't expect to find another like her.I wish
>> I
>> > could
>> > > have her cloned,but my finances being what they are,well it's just
>> not
>> > > possible. When I was looking for another dog to take over for Nala
>> so
> she
>> > > could retire, I just could not find a husky that could do the job.
> After
>> > > trying several that "washed out",I expanded my search to other
>> breeds.
> I
>> > > found a Belgian Shepherd that had been rescued from a shelter. He
>> was
> the
>> > > one that worked out. He has become a wonderful guide. We had a few
>> > setbacks
>> > > in the beginning but he has worked out very well.To date, Nala,my
> second
>> > > Husky has been the best guide I have ever had,but with time,who
>> knows.
>> > > Shaman may become just as good. He is excellent when it comes to
> traffic
>> > > checks, and has already saved my butt several times! Different
>> people
>> > have
>> > > different needs when it comes to guide dogs. Some need fast
>> dogs,some
> need
>> > > slower dogs. I consider myself very lucky to have found dogs of the
> breeds
>> > > that I like and had them become wonderful guides.But If I were to go
> to a
>> > > school to get a dog sometime in the future, I would probably take
> whatever
>> > > dog they matched me with as it is unlikely that I would get a
> Husky.Have a
>> > > great day, Mardi andShaman and Nala,retired.
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 7
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 16:00:30 -0400
>> > From: "Dan Weiner" <dcwein at dcwein.cnc.net>
>> > To: "'Florida Association of Guide Dog Users'" <flagdu at nfbnet.org>,
>> > "'NAGDU List'" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>, <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>,
>> > "'NFB
>> > Chapter presidents'" <chapter-presidents at nfbnet.org>
>> > Cc: marion.gwizdala at verizon.net
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] [Flagdu] what the NFB Should Do!
>> > Message-ID: <20110623200036.D2A959ABD at tonnant.cnc.net>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>> >
>> > Well, I suppose in that case people really don't know aht to do to
>> make
>> > government have different priorities, that's not just about blind
> people.
>> >
>> > It's easy to see a problem but knowing what to do about it is always a
>> > tricky thing.
>> >
>> > I'm not, of course, saying that people shouldn't join the organized
> blind
>> > movement--smile--just telling you what I think.
>> > People feel powerless. Especially we blind people have spent most of
>> our
>> > lives being told not to do this or not to do that or we can't do
>> things.
>> >
>> >
>> > Dan W. and the Carter Dog
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 8
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 13:02:01 -0700
>> > From: Tami Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] DIFFERENT TYPES OF DOGS
>> > Message-ID: <1308859321.2044.18.camel at tamara-desktop>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Oh! thanks for telling me so. As you may have guessed I love going
>> about
>> > my dog, dogs, my dog, every dog I've ever met... So I'm always glad
>> when
>> > my ramblings turn out to actually be helpful to someone. /smile/
>> >
>> > It's all my own experience and what I've picked up from others or
>> other
>> > dogs I've had, more and more informed by my growing experience as a
>> > guide dog user. So I'm better at evaluating pros and cons of the
>> > various breed and type options in light of what I want in a guide.
>> >
>> > I've liked hearing what most others have said on the matter of
>> > preference itself. It is very, very individual when it comes right
>> down
>> > to it.
>> >
>> > The even more important thing is the individual dog we are matched
>> with
>> > or end up with meets our needs in a way that enhances our lives. Which
>> > seems to happen most of the time, so that's a good thing. Glad you're
>> > enjoying your pup and life as a guide dog handler!
>> >
>> > On Wed, 2011-06-22 at 17:47 -0700, Brittney N. Mejico wrote:
>> > > Tami ,
>> > > Thanks very informative!
>> > >
>> > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > From: Tami Kinney
>> > > Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2011 2:56 PM
>> > > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > Subject: Re: [nagdu] DIFFERENT TYPES OF DOGS
>> > >
>> > > Brittney,
>> > >
>> > > Were you also informed which preference you were supposed to
>> > > have? /evil grin/
>> > >
>> > > I thought the whole poodle as guide dog notion was pretty iffy when
>> I
>> > > first heard of it, but ended up putting in some time, energy and
> expense
>> > > getting my hands on one anyway for practical reasons. Now I can't
>> > > understand why everybody else isn't running around demanding poodle
>> > > guides... Until I remember that poodles are, you know, poodles.
>> > > Definitely an acquired taste, but addictive once you get hooked.
> Unless
>> > > you want a quiet life, free of excitement and strife. The lack of
>> > > shedding is a big plus in a lot of ways, but the cost of grooming is
> not
>> > > easy on a budget. If you try to save now and then by stretching out
>> > > time between trims, you find yourself doing nothing but grooming the
>> > > poodle. Well, Mitzi has the soft, thick, fine coat and an extra
> measure
>> > > of it at that, so it is absolutely gorgeous and wonerful to the
>> touch
>> > > while being absolutely impossible to keep free of industrial-grade
>> > > snarls close to the skin if you don't keep on it. Also, the poodle
> does
>> > > nto appear to be constructed to curl up in a tidy ball that will fit
>> > > neatly under even a really big chair, so it you're uptight about the
>> > > finer points of etiquette, a girl can really stress herself out
>> about
>> > > that until she finally gives up and loosens up and finds a way to
>> > > achieve the same goals in a way that will actually work. /lol/ From
>> > > what I hear, bear-sized labs will curl up into tidy balls that will
> fit
>> > > under toddler chairs and be perfectly comfortable doing it. I'm
>> > > exaggerating, but I've heard of folks with 90 pound labs that will
>> fit
>> > > places I have not been able to stuff my poodle to begin with, and
>> even
>> > > then bits of her start popping out like they've been spring-loaded,
>> so
> I
>> > > have driven myself nuts on the bus and train desperately trying to
> round
>> > > up legs and noses and stubby tails enough for 7 dogs! She would be
>> > > trying to comply but she sure would sigh a lot. Also, she has a huge
>> > > need to watch *everything* so our rules for keeping her out of the
>> way
>> > > and safe including her being positioned where she can do that
>> without
>> > > moving around. She's a super-mellow poodle, so I am routinely
> assurred,
>> > > but she is still a poodle. That same vigilance and curiosity works
>> out
>> > > wonderfully when we're on the go, so I don't mind adjusting our
> seating
>> > > arrangements to keep her from getting twitchy. /smile/
>> > >
>> > > I've always had a yen for a sheperd guide and I still think they're
>> > > still pretty high on my list. The only thing that that breed loses
>> > > points over is their shedding and tendency to be a bit harder on
> people
>> > > with sensitivities to dander because of its pH or something... I
>> > > wouldn't let that last part stop me getting one, but the shedding
> itself
>> > > seems a bit daunting now that I'm spoiled. Not having a budget
>> crunch
>> > > from profressional grooming all the time would be a big plus, that's
> for
>> > > sure! I might take on shaving and trimming a companion poodle
>> myself,
>> > > but my professional dog requires a professional haircut.
>> > >
>> > > Dobies also thrill me, for many of the same reasons GSDs do, only
>> with
>> > > shorter hair and less shedding and brushing. I'm lazy, so when
>> Mitzi's
>> > > curls are shorn and I can just wipe her off with a damp cloth to
>> spiif
>> > > her up for the most refined restaurant dining, I am happy as can be
> with
>> > > that arrangement. Dobie guide users speak of doing that with the
>> dobie
>> > > coat, so big, big plus!
>> > >
>> > > I would like a dog with less adorability and perhaps a bit more of a
>> > > back-off quality and a rep to add some encouragement. Mitzi has a
>> > > pretty intense stare, but it just doesn't have the same effect on
> people
>> > > as it does when it comes from what looks like a guard/police dog.
> Here,
>> > > at least. The dirty little secret about poodles is that they're used
> as
>> > > guard dogs in other countries because they're a lot like dobies and
>> > > shepherds that way. It's something to bear in mind, especially in
>> > > choosing a poodle for guide work or anything else, really, since
> people
>> > > who have encountered bad-tempered poodles are scared to death of the
>> > > things. They can turn nasty if the temperament is not respected in
>> > > treatment and training. Statistically, they're responsible for more
> dog
>> > > bites than pit bulls. That includes the smaller types, too, I guess,
>> > > and those are more prone to temperament problems due to
>> irresponsible
>> > > breeders. Sigh. Anyway, Mitzi is, in a lot of way, a woolly doberman
>> > > that just doesn't scare people because she's so cu-ute. She does
>> have,
>> > > I have been told a very severe back-off look, but she seems to be
>> more
>> > > likely to use her direct stare and exotic dark eyes to draw people
>> in
>> > > and take control of their minds so that they will do whatever she
> wants
>> > > them to. /lol/ I've never been able to see her eyes, really, and see
> her
>> > > in my mind as not having any, but I can feel that stare and fall
> victim
>> > > to its power. Still, there are times it would be handy to have an
>> > > equally nonaggressive dog that could scare people off properly just
>> by
>> > > looking at them. Mitzi has become quite the pro at dealing with all
> the
>> > > attention and reaching hands with grace and composure, and we've
> worked
>> > > out ways to keep it from getting out of hand, but... It would be
>> nice
>> > > to have my dog admired from a safe distance by people who are
>> inspired
>> > > to keep their hands to themselves. /smile/
>> > >
>> > > Labs come in lower on the preference list simply because I like the
>> > > herding/guarding breeds better, either as guides or as companions. I
>> > > like labs and just get giddy around my labbie friends and family --
>> my
>> > > sister has a 106 lb. black lab Mitzi's age, and he is just so
>> awesome
>> > > and very labby in his manner and personality. Out of habit, when I
>> > > stood beside him, I held my hand over his back to measure him for a
>> > > harness... I would have to be a lot taller. He is a way cool dog and
>> > > just love him. But if someone were to offer me the choice between
>> his
>> > > exact clone and, say, a dobie or shepherd or poodle, I'd pick the
> other
>> > > dog. Still, labs will start moving up my preference scale at some
> point
>> > > for the very traits that make them so popular and numerous. In fact,
> by
>> > > then I will no doubt be wanting an extra mellow, laid back, easy lab
>> > > guide, and I will love having a lab around because they really are
>> > > wonderful dogs.
>> > >
>> > > I just happen to prefer my super-alert, active, busy, difficult
>> poodle
>> > > and want something along the same lines in case she doesn't obey the
>> > > live-forever command and I don't get her cloned. /lol/
>> > >
>> > > I don't know if that is in any way informative, but I always love
> these
>> > > questions because I learn so much about other handlers and the
>> > > differences between breeds and inviduals. So I'll shut up and get to
>> > > reading.
>> > >
>> > > On Mon, 2011-06-20 at 16:21 -0700, Brittney N. Mejico wrote:
>> > > > hello everyone,
>> > > > I always wanted to ask. Does the breed of dog you use as a guide
>> > matter?
>> > > > I know some guide dog users are really particular about a certain
> breed
>> > > > and others don?t care? Why is this? Before I got my guide people
> asked
>> >
>> > > > me what type of dog I wanted and I would ask, ?should I have a
>> > > > preference?? and I was told that I shouldn??t care. Before I start
>> > > > rambleing I just want to know the difference in different breeds?
>> > > > _______________________________________________ nagdu mailing list
>> > > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> >
>> > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>> > > > nagdu:
>> > > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> > .net
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/brittneymejico%40veri
>> > zon.net
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 9
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 13:32:44 -0700
>> > From: Tami Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] what the NFB Should Do!
>> > Message-ID: <1308861164.2044.30.camel at tamara-desktop>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Marion, et al.,
>> >
>> > Agreed, re: article and well-said. I appreciate the humor and the
>> > expression of thanks to the doers, whether it's the bits or the bites
>> we
>> > contribute... While also making a strong statement. /smile/
>> >
>> > As I learn more about the organization -- and thus its warts and those
>> > of some of its people or even groups within the larger organization --
>> I
>> > keep hearing a long ago boss and mentor from my early career: Never go
>> > to the boss with a complaint without also having at least one solution
>> > to offer. Good advice from a wise woman! Having a solution to a
>> problem
>> > is much easier in the context of your job and department or company
>> than
>> > with a large member organization like the NFB, and at least one
>> > organizational wart really sticks in my craw, making it easy to feel
>> > whiney and powerless... But I know how much good I've gotten out of
>> the
>> > past work and the current work, so I am more motivated to do my little
>> > bits to contribute... Very small bits! But those little things to keep
>> > entertained enough to avoid complaining to adamantly about things I
>> > would like to see done or changed, because then I would feel obligated
>> > to help be part of the solution... That thought does shut me up fairly
>> > often. Don't know if that's what my mentor had in mind, but if you're
>> > afraid to complain you do have more time to do other things. /lol/
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 10:08 -0400, Margo and Arrow wrote:
>> > > It's called taking ownership. marion, well-said email and like
>> Cindy,
> I
>> > > think you might want to consider expanding it to a Monitor article.
>> > >
>> > > Margo and Arrow
>> > > ----- Original Message -----
>> > > From: "Cindy Ray" <cindyray at gmail.com>
>> > > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>> Users"
>> > > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 9:49 AM
>> > > Subject: Re: [nagdu] what the NFB Should Do!
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > > Marion, I think that was well said. I think you should enlarge
>> upon
> it
>> > and
>> > > > make a Monitor article out of it. I know that variations have been
> done
>> > > > before, but we can't hear it often enough.
>> > > >
>> > > > Cindy
>> > > >
>> > > > On Jun 23, 2011, at 8:09 AM, Marion Gwizdala wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > >> Dear All,
>> > > >> Please excuse this cross-posting but I think it is important
>> enough
>> > > >> that I wanted to share it with as many of you as possible. When I
> speak
>> >
>> > > >> with many blind people who find out I am a leader in the
> Federation, I
>> > > >> often have them say, "The NFB should ...". You can fill in the
> blank
>> > with
>> > > >> a myriad of suggestions of what needs to be done to improve the
> lives
>> > of
>> > > >> the blind. Generally, my response is, "Are you a member of the
> NFB?"
>> > The
>> > > >> most frequent answer is "No!" This opens the door for me to share
> that
>> > > >> the Federation is a membership organization - a grass roots
> Movement
>> > in
>> > > >> which each member must be actively involved in order for us to
> improve
>> > > >> our lives. It is not dr. Maurer; it is not the Board of
>> Directors;
> it
>> > is
>> > > >> not the people who work at the National Center for the Blind; it
>> is
> not
>> >
>> > > >> our divisions, our affiliates, or our chapters! It is each and
> every
>> > > >> member of the movement! I then invite them to become a member of
> the
>> > NFB
>> > > >> and hear the same tired excuses of not being a joiner, not
>> > > > having enough time, not wanting to choose sides, not agreeing with
> the
>> > > > philosophy, yah dah yah dah yah dah yawn! "In other words," I say,
> "you
>> > > > want someone else to solve your problems for you and are unwilling
> to
>> > > > help. Is that right?" Of course, they think I am a rude,
>> obnoxious,
>> > > > belligerent Federationist, what my wife and I would call "C.B." -
>> > > > Confirmation Bias - the bias that "All Federationists are (fill in
> the
>> > > > blank!" and this experience confirms this belief!
>> > > >> I praise those of you who have joined me in our effort to improve
>> > the
>> > > >> lives of the blind. You have not made it someone else's problem
>> to
>> > solve;
>> > > >> you have made it yours! To paraphrase the words of Mahatma Gandhi
>> ,
>> > "You
>> > > >> are the change you want to see in the world!" Thank you for your
>> > service
>> > > >> and for joining me on the barricades! On to Orlando!
>> > > >>
>> > > >> Fraternally yours,
>> > > >> Marion Gwizdala, President
>> > > >> National Association of Guide Dog Users (NAGDU)
>> > > >> National Federation of the Blind
>> > > >> 813-626-2789
>> > > >> President at NAGDU.ORG
>> > > >> HTTP://WWW.NAGDU.ORG
>> > > >> _______________________________________________
>> > > >> nagdu mailing list
>> > > >> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>> > > >> nagdu:
>> > > >>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cindyray%40gmail.com
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>> > > > nagdu:
>> > > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/margo.downey%40verizo
>> > n.net
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 10
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 13:38:25 -0700
>> > From: Tami Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> > Message-ID: <1308861505.2044.35.camel at tamara-desktop>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Hope and Buddy,
>> >
>> > I'm afraid we had to remove the PayPal button from the site... Turns
>> out
>> > they don't allow using their service for raffles, so now we know. But
>> > for this year, we've had to make adjustments. Those who paid through
>> > PayPal before they informed us how very displeased they are do have
>> the
>> > tickets they bought and paid for. We're planning and researching how
>> to
>> > deal with some of those fundraising activities through the website for
>> > everyone's convenience.
>> >
>> > Hope, if you want to know more, you can contact Marion at
>> > president at nagdu.org or Toni Whaley at treasurer at nagdu.org to see if
>> you
>> > can still get tickets. Come to think of it, it passed off my radar
>> when
>> > we decided to not use the website until we had a solution next year.
>> > But I still want that Breeze! /smile/
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 14:52 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> > > Hi,
>> > >
>> > > Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
> handy
>> > Paypal link.
>> > > --
>> > > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
> Trekker
>> > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment
> and
>> > have tickets filled out?
>> > > > Thanks.
>> > > > Hope and Beignet
>> > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 11
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 13:56:54 -0700
>> > From: Tami Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] [Flagdu] what the NFB Should Do!
>> > Message-ID: <1308862614.2044.47.camel at tamara-desktop>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Yeah, I'm pretty new to be told that kind of crap all the time, so I
>> > just keep on getting real mad and obstinate. But I started noticing
>> way
>> > too early on how often the constant battery would affect my thinking
>> and
>> > decision-making, even though i know better! I am amazed -- and fairly
>> > weary -- by how much work I have to put in just to keep myself from
>> > starting to assume all those negative things about myself just because
>> > I'm blind.
>> >
>> > That experience does give me a greater appreciation for anyone who has
>> > been told that from childhood on for just getting up in the morning!
>> > Especially from my own age range and on. I realize that whatever the
>> > pros and cons of progressive vision loss, with the crossover to using
>> > noticeable adaptive methods and tools, the biggest benefit to me over
>> my
>> > lifetime until earlier this century has been that people weren't
>> > treating me like I was blind! Also, driving and reading print a page
>> at
>> > a glance provided many opportunities to go, do, learn which are more
>> > difficult and time-consuming now. So that's something I have benefited
>> > from especially in the context of my own generation. But i thought the
>> > way girls and women were treated then was bad and oppressive... Then I
>> > picked up a new skinny white friend in the 21st century, when women
>> can
>> > do stuff like think and make decisions officially, and discovered what
>> > *real* oppression is like. Then I started learning how much better
>> > things are now! Yikes! Well, they're getting better all the time,
>> > because we're all just soldiering on together and each in our way, so
>> > the adventure continues.
>> >
>> > Still, I can't truly grasp some of the attitudes of blind people
>> toward
>> > blindness, towards other blind people and towards themselves,
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 16:00 -0400, Dan Weiner wrote:
>> > > Well, I suppose in that case people really don't know aht to do to
> make
>> > > government have different priorities, that's not just about blind
> people.
>> > >
>> > > It's easy to see a problem but knowing what to do about it is always
>> a
>> > > tricky thing.
>> > >
>> > > I'm not, of course, saying that people shouldn't join the organized
> blind
>> > > movement--smile--just telling you what I think.
>> > > People feel powerless. Especially we blind people have spent most of
> our
>> > > lives being told not to do this or not to do that or we can't do
> things.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Dan W. and the Carter Dog
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 12
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 17:10:14 -0400
>> > From: Buddy Brannan <buddy at brannan.name>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> > Message-ID: <3A19B225-D79A-4497-9F65-264DCAB3F698 at brannan.name>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>> >
>> > So wait. I was able to buy tickets with Paypal and got a payment
>> > confirmation, so did I get them or am I outa luck?
>> > --
>> > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Jun 23, 2011, at 4:38 PM, Tami Kinney wrote:
>> >
>> > > Hope and Buddy,
>> > >
>> > > I'm afraid we had to remove the PayPal button from the site... Turns
> out
>> > > they don't allow using their service for raffles, so now we know.
>> But
>> > > for this year, we've had to make adjustments. Those who paid through
>> > > PayPal before they informed us how very displeased they are do have
> the
>> > > tickets they bought and paid for. We're planning and researching how
> to
>> > > deal with some of those fundraising activities through the website
>> for
>> > > everyone's convenience.
>> > >
>> > > Hope, if you want to know more, you can contact Marion at
>> > > president at nagdu.org or Toni Whaley at treasurer at nagdu.org to see if
> you
>> > > can still get tickets. Come to think of it, it passed off my radar
> when
>> > > we decided to not use the website until we had a solution next year.
>> > > But I still want that Breeze! /smile/
>> > >
>> > > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 14:52 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> > >> Hi,
>> > >>
>> > >> Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
> handy
>> > Paypal link.
>> > >> --
>> > >> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > >> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >>> Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
> Trekker
>> > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment
> and
>> > have tickets filled out?
>> > >>> Thanks.
>> > >>> Hope and Beignet
>> > >>> _______________________________________________
>> > >>> nagdu mailing list
>> > >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >>>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> nagdu mailing list
>> > >> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> > .net
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 13
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 14:38:01 -0700
>> > From: Tami Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> > Message-ID: <1308865081.2044.49.camel at tamara-desktop>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Buddy, you are in the running for the Breeze, no worries. As is anyone
>> > else who paid before we had to cease and desist. Sorry for the
>> > confusion!
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 17:10 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> > > So wait. I was able to buy tickets with Paypal and got a payment
>> > confirmation, so did I get them or am I outa luck?
>> > > --
>> > > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Jun 23, 2011, at 4:38 PM, Tami Kinney wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > Hope and Buddy,
>> > > >
>> > > > I'm afraid we had to remove the PayPal button from the site...
>> Turns
> out
>> > > > they don't allow using their service for raffles, so now we know.
> But
>> > > > for this year, we've had to make adjustments. Those who paid
>> through
>> > > > PayPal before they informed us how very displeased they are do
>> have
> the
>> > > > tickets they bought and paid for. We're planning and researching
>> how
> to
>> > > > deal with some of those fundraising activities through the website
> for
>> > > > everyone's convenience.
>> > > >
>> > > > Hope, if you want to know more, you can contact Marion at
>> > > > president at nagdu.org or Toni Whaley at treasurer at nagdu.org to see
>> if
> you
>> > > > can still get tickets. Come to think of it, it passed off my radar
> when
>> > > > we decided to not use the website until we had a solution next
>> year.
>> > > > But I still want that Breeze! /smile/
>> > > >
>> > > > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 14:52 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> > > >> Hi,
>> > > >>
>> > > >> Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even
>> a
>> > handy Paypal link.
>> > > >> --
>> > > >> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > > >> Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >> On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> > > >>
>> > > >>> Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
> Trekker
>> > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment
> and
>> > have tickets filled out?
>> > > >>> Thanks.
>> > > >>> Hope and Beignet
>> > > >>> _______________________________________________
>> > > >>> nagdu mailing list
>> > > >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> info
> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > > >>>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >> _______________________________________________
>> > > >> nagdu mailing list
>> > > >> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > > >>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> > .net
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 14
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 18:22:23 -0400
>> > From: "Arthur Nolden" <anolden at tampabay.rr.com>
>> > To: <Undisclosed-Recipient:;>
>> > Subject: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> > Message-ID: <31BE0B810A9449B28F6C885AD16CD11C at yourc6417768d6>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Blind People Are Faking It!
>> >
>> > Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
>> secret
>> > society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
> vicious
>> > attack animals in public on a daily basis. These mysterious folk also
> have a
>> > secret means of communication, while shocking new evidence seems to
> indicate
>> > that they may even possess senses superior to those of other humans.
> We're
>> > speaking, of course, of the legions of the so-called blind.
>> >
>> > Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in the
> first
>> > place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of sight, how
>> does
>> > that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and Ronnie
>> Milsap?
> How
>> > could such men possibly play music if they were blind? What do they
>> take
> us
>> > for-ignorant
>> > saps?
>> > The first issue I must point out is their very public display of armed
>> > might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a cudgel
> on
>> > their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them, are
> supposed to
>> > help them feel their way along. They are painted white, almost as if
>> the
>> > bearer wished to remind passersby of its presence, and the weapon's
>> tip
> is
>> > painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who have studied the
> mysterious
>> > fighting arts of the Orient know that such sticks may be wielded with
> deadly
>> > force by those with skill.
>> >
>> > In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> > could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> > encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
>> blind
> also
>> > own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of guidance
> along
>> > city streets. With one word from their scheming masters, these
>> slavering
>> > "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> >
>> > Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a species
>> of
>> > killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
>> somehow
>> > fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
> frightening
>> > aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their ability to
> communicate
>> > with one another unbeknownst to upstanding citizens. Their secret code
>> > consists of a series of raised dots cunningly arranged into arcane
> shapes.
>> > Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has begun popping up in
>> places
>> > that were doubtlessly chosen for their mundane, everyday outward
> appearance:
>> > elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
>> like.
>> >
>> > This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
>> attention.
> But
>> > think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how would we
>> know?
>> > Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the signs will
> change
>> > from "second
>> > floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
>> into
> the
>> > chaos of revolution.
>> >
>> > At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
>> planning
> such
>> > a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But can one
>> group
>> > possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to use it to
> seize
>> > power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> >
>> > No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see the
> threat
>> > where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary of the
>> blind
>> > menace.
>> >
>> > Alan P., Nevada.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 15
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 18:38:06 -0400
>> > From: "Sean Moore" <sean.moore at mediacombb.net>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> > Message-ID: <C5461A4DD88D4166ACE61067E467507E at aspireone>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>> > reply-type=original
>> >
>> > What the ...?
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Arthur Nolden" <anolden at tampabay.rr.com>
>> > To: <Undisclosed-Recipient:;>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:22 PM
>> > Subject: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
>> >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Blind People Are Faking It!
>> > >
>> > > Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
> secret
>> > > society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
> vicious
>> > > attack animals in public on a daily basis. These mysterious folk
>> also
> have
>> >
>> > > a secret means of communication, while shocking new evidence seems
>> to
>> > > indicate that they may even possess senses superior to those of
>> other
>> > > humans. We're speaking, of course, of the legions of the so-called
> blind.
>> > >
>> > > Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in
>> the
>> > > first place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of
>> sight,
> how
>> >
>> > > does that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and Ronnie
>> > > Milsap? How could such men possibly play music if they were blind?
> What do
>> >
>> > > they take us for-ignorant
>> > > saps?
>> > > The first issue I must point out is their very public display of
>> armed
>> > > might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a
>> cudgel
> on
>> > > their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them, are
> supposed
>> > > to help them feel their way along. They are painted white, almost as
> if
>> > > the bearer wished to remind passersby of its presence, and the
> weapon's
>> > > tip is painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who have studied
>> the
>> > > mysterious fighting arts of the Orient know that such sticks may be
>> > > wielded with deadly force by those with skill.
>> > >
>> > > In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> > > could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> > > encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
> blind
>> > > also own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of
> guidance
>> > > along city streets. With one word from their scheming masters, these
>> > > slavering "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> > >
>> > > Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a
>> species
> of
>> > > killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
> somehow
>> > > fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
>> > > frightening aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their
> ability
>> > > to communicate with one another unbeknownst to upstanding citizens.
> Their
>> > > secret code consists of a series of raised dots cunningly arranged
> into
>> > > arcane shapes. Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has begun
> popping
>> >
>> > > up in places that were doubtlessly chosen for their mundane,
>> everyday
>> > > outward appearance:
>> > > elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
> like.
>> > >
>> > > This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
> attention.
>> > > But think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how would
>> we
>> > > know? Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the
>> signs
>> > > will change from "second
>> > > floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
> into
>> > > the chaos of revolution.
>> > >
>> > > At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
> planning
>> > > such a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But can
> one
>> > > group possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to
>> use
> it
>> > > to seize power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> > >
>> > > No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see the
>> > > threat where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary
>> of
> the
>> > > blind menace.
>> > >
>> > > Alan P., Nevada.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediacom
>> > bb.net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 16
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 21:39:14 -0400
>> > From: "cheryl echevarria" <cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> > Message-ID: <BLU162-ds8084A15951C07A96F9600A1520 at phx.gbl>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> > well you can do it this way, just have a paypal button, doesn't have
>> to
> be
>> > for raffles. Just put in the information for payment of donation or
>> > whatever, doesn't have to say raffle.
>> >
>> > Then e-mail the contact person and let them know off list that it was
> for
>> > the Raffle.
>> >
>> > There are ways around it.
>> >
>> > Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
>> >
>> > Cheryl Echevarria
>> > http://www.echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/>
>> > 631-456-5394
>> >
> reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com>
>> >
>> > Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel
> CST-1018299-10
>> >
>> > Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise & Travel,
> Inc.
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: Tami Kinney<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 4:38 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
>> >
>> > Hope and Buddy,
>> >
>> > I'm afraid we had to remove the PayPal button from the site... Turns
>> out
>> > they don't allow using their service for raffles, so now we know. But
>> > for this year, we've had to make adjustments. Those who paid through
>> > PayPal before they informed us how very displeased they are do have
>> the
>> > tickets they bought and paid for. We're planning and researching how
>> to
>> > deal with some of those fundraising activities through the website for
>> > everyone's convenience.
>> >
>> > Hope, if you want to know more, you can contact Marion at
>> > president at nagdu.org<mailto:president at nagdu.org> or Toni Whaley at
>> > treasurer at nagdu.org<mailto:treasurer at nagdu.org> to see if you
>> > can still get tickets. Come to think of it, it passed off my radar
>> when
>> > we decided to not use the website until we had a solution next year.
>> > But I still want that Breeze! /smile/
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 14:52 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> > > Hi,
>> > >
>> > > Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even a
>> > handy Paypal link.
>> > > --
>> > > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
> Trekker
>> > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are not
>> > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit payment
> and
>> > have tickets filled out?
>> > > > Thanks.
>> > > > Hope and Beignet
>> > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> >
> .net<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40co
>> > mcast.net>
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
>> > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%40hotma
>> >
> il.com<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%
>> > 40hotmail.com>
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 17
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 23:19:46 -0400
>> > From: "Julie Phillipson" <jbrew48 at verizon.net>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> > Message-ID: <4DAE90F955164F5AB7709851EC36B4D1 at acer4d025c48b8>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>> > reply-type=response
>> >
>> > WHAT WAS NOT SAID ON THIS IS BELOW.
>> > Hi everyone,
>> >
>> > Below is something that if you can't laugh at far out humer then I
>> would
>> > suggest not reading it. The spoof came from a publication in Madison
>> > Wisconsin that does this kind of thing. Not sure how appropriate it is
> for
>> > the list, but sometimes one just needs to be a little crazy!!
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Julie Phillipson
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Sean Moore" <sean.moore at mediacombb.net>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:38 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
>> >
>> > > What the ...?
>> > > ----- Original Message -----
>> > > From: "Arthur Nolden" <anolden at tampabay.rr.com>
>> > > To: <Undisclosed-Recipient:;>
>> > > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:22 PM
>> > > Subject: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> Blind People Are Faking It!
>> > >>
>> > >> Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
> secret
>> > >> society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
> vicious
>> >
>> > >> attack animals in public on a daily basis. These mysterious folk
>> also
>> > >> have a secret means of communication, while shocking new evidence
> seems
>> > >> to indicate that they may even possess senses superior to those of
> other
>> > >> humans. We're speaking, of course, of the legions of the so-called
> blind.
>> > >>
>> > >> Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in
> the
>> > >> first place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of
>> sight,
>> > >> how does that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and
> Ronnie
>> > >> Milsap? How could such men possibly play music if they were blind?
> What
>> > >> do they take us for-ignorant
>> > >> saps?
>> > >> The first issue I must point out is their very public display of
> armed
>> > >> might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a
> cudgel on
>> >
>> > >> their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them, are
> supposed
>> >
>> > >> to help them feel their way along. They are painted white, almost
>> as
> if
>> > >> the bearer wished to remind passersby of its presence, and the
> weapon's
>> > >> tip is painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who have studied
> the
>> > >> mysterious fighting arts of the Orient know that such sticks may be
>> > >> wielded with deadly force by those with skill.
>> > >>
>> > >> In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> > >> could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> > >> encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
> blind
>> > >> also own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of
> guidance
>> > >> along city streets. With one word from their scheming masters,
>> these
>> > >> slavering "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> > >>
>> > >> Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a
>> species
> of
>> > >> killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
> somehow
>> > >> fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
>> > >> frightening aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their
> ability
>> > >> to communicate with one another unbeknownst to upstanding citizens.
> Their
>> >
>> > >> secret code consists of a series of raised dots cunningly arranged
> into
>> > >> arcane shapes. Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has begun
>> > >> popping up in places that were doubtlessly chosen for their
>> mundane,
>> > >> everyday outward appearance:
>> > >> elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
> like.
>> > >>
>> > >> This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
> attention.
>> > >> But think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how would
> we
>> > >> know? Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the
> signs
>> > >> will change from "second
>> > >> floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
> into
>> > >> the chaos of revolution.
>> > >>
>> > >> At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
> planning
>> > >> such a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But can
> one
>> > >> group possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to
> use it
>> >
>> > >> to seize power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> > >>
>> > >> No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see
>> the
>> > >> threat where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary
>> of
> the
>> >
>> > >> blind menace.
>> > >>
>> > >> Alan P., Nevada.
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> nagdu mailing list
>> > >> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > >> nagdu:
>> > >>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediacom
>> > bb.net
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 18
>> > Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 21:31:13 -0700
>> > From: Tami Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> > Message-ID: <1308889873.2959.55.camel at tamara-desktop>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > OMG! ROTFL! Heard the audio version a couple of days ago, but it just
>> > never stops being hysterical. Especially the way my new screen reader
>> > does it. I think I might have sprained something laughing!
>> >
>> > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 18:22 -0400, Arthur Nolden wrote:
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Blind People Are Faking It!
>> > >
>> > > Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
> secret
>> > society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
> vicious
>> > attack animals in public on a daily basis. These mysterious folk also
> have a
>> > secret means of communication, while shocking new evidence seems to
> indicate
>> > that they may even possess senses superior to those of other humans.
> We're
>> > speaking, of course, of the legions of the so-called blind.
>> > >
>> > > Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in
>> the
>> > first place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of sight,
> how
>> > does that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and Ronnie
> Milsap?
>> > How could such men possibly play music if they were blind? What do
>> they
> take
>> > us for-ignorant
>> > > saps?
>> > > The first issue I must point out is their very public display of
>> armed
>> > might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a cudgel
> on
>> > their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them, are
> supposed to
>> > help them feel their way along. They are painted white, almost as if
>> the
>> > bearer wished to remind passersby of its presence, and the weapon's
>> tip
> is
>> > painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who have studied the
> mysterious
>> > fighting arts of the Orient know that such sticks may be wielded with
> deadly
>> > force by those with skill.
>> > >
>> > > In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> > > could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> > encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
>> blind
> also
>> > own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of guidance
> along
>> > city streets. With one word from their scheming masters, these
>> slavering
>> > "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> > >
>> > > Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a
>> species
> of
>> > killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
>> somehow
>> > fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
> frightening
>> > aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their ability to
> communicate
>> > with one another unbeknownst to upstanding citizens. Their secret code
>> > consists of a series of raised dots cunningly arranged into arcane
> shapes.
>> > Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has begun popping up in
>> places
>> > that were doubtlessly chosen for their mundane, everyday outward
> appearance:
>> > > elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
> like.
>> > >
>> > > This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
> attention.
>> > But think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how would we
> know?
>> > Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the signs will
> change
>> > from "second
>> > > floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
> into
>> > the chaos of revolution.
>> > >
>> > > At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
> planning
>> > such a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But can
>> one
>> > group possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to use
> it to
>> > seize power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> > >
>> > > No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see the
>> > threat where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary of
> the
>> > blind menace.
>> > >
>> > > Alan P., Nevada.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 19
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 05:47:57 -0400
>> > From: "cheryl echevarria" <cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> > Message-ID: <BLU162-ds13BBC737B2BC34501713C2A1520 at phx.gbl>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> > it is funny ART, you are funny.
>> >
>> > Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
>> >
>> > Cheryl Echevarria
>> > http://www.echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/>
>> > 631-456-5394
>> >
> reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com>
>> >
>> > Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel
> CST-1018299-10
>> >
>> > Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise & Travel,
> Inc.
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: Julie Phillipson<mailto:jbrew48 at verizon.net>
>> > To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
>> > Users<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 11:19 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
>> >
>> > WHAT WAS NOT SAID ON THIS IS BELOW.
>> > Hi everyone,
>> >
>> > Below is something that if you can't laugh at far out humer then I
>> would
>> > suggest not reading it. The spoof came from a publication in Madison
>> > Wisconsin that does this kind of thing. Not sure how appropriate it is
> for
>> >
>> > the list, but sometimes one just needs to be a little crazy!!
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Julie Phillipson
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Sean Moore"
>> > <sean.moore at mediacombb.net<mailto:sean.moore at mediacombb.net>>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:38 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
>> >
>> > > What the ...?
>> > > ----- Original Message -----
>> > > From: "Arthur Nolden"
>> > <anolden at tampabay.rr.com<mailto:anolden at tampabay.rr.com>>
>> > > To: <Undisclosed-Recipient:;>
>> > > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:22 PM
>> > > Subject: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> Blind People Are Faking It!
>> > >>
>> > >> Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
>> > secret
>> > >> society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
>> > vicious
>> > >> attack animals in public on a daily basis. These mysterious folk
>> also
>> > >> have a secret means of communication, while shocking new evidence
> seems
>> >
>> > >> to indicate that they may even possess senses superior to those of
>> > other
>> > >> humans. We're speaking, of course, of the legions of the so-called
>> > blind.
>> > >>
>> > >> Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in
> the
>> > >> first place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of
>> sight,
>> > >> how does that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and
>> > Ronnie
>> > >> Milsap? How could such men possibly play music if they were blind?
> What
>> >
>> > >> do they take us for-ignorant
>> > >> saps?
>> > >> The first issue I must point out is their very public display of
> armed
>> > >> might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a
> cudgel
>> > on
>> > >> their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them, are
>> > supposed
>> > >> to help them feel their way along. They are painted white, almost
>> as
> if
>> >
>> > >> the bearer wished to remind passersby of its presence, and the
> weapon's
>> >
>> > >> tip is painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who have studied
> the
>> > >> mysterious fighting arts of the Orient know that such sticks may be
>> > >> wielded with deadly force by those with skill.
>> > >>
>> > >> In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> > >> could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> > >> encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
> blind
>> >
>> > >> also own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of
>> > guidance
>> > >> along city streets. With one word from their scheming masters,
>> these
>> > >> slavering "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> > >>
>> > >> Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a
>> species
>> > of
>> > >> killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
>> > somehow
>> > >> fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
>> > >> frightening aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their
>> > ability
>> > >> to communicate with one another unbeknownst to upstanding citizens.
>> > Their
>> > >> secret code consists of a series of raised dots cunningly arranged
> into
>> >
>> > >> arcane shapes. Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has begun
>> > >> popping up in places that were doubtlessly chosen for their
>> mundane,
>> > >> everyday outward appearance:
>> > >> elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
>> > like.
>> > >>
>> > >> This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
>> > attention.
>> > >> But think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how would
> we
>> > >> know? Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the
> signs
>> > >> will change from "second
>> > >> floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
> into
>> >
>> > >> the chaos of revolution.
>> > >>
>> > >> At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
> planning
>> >
>> > >> such a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But can
>> > one
>> > >> group possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to
> use
>> > it
>> > >> to seize power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> > >>
>> > >> No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see
>> the
>> > >> threat where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary
>> of
>> > the
>> > >> blind menace.
>> > >>
>> > >> Alan P., Nevada.
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> nagdu mailing list
>> > >> nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > >>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > >> nagdu:
>> > >>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediacom
>> >
> bb.net<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40m
>> > ediacombb.net>
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.net
>> >
> <http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.ne
>> > t>
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
>> > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nagdu:
>> >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%40hotma
>> >
> il.com<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%
>> > 40hotmail.com>
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 20
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 08:30:47 -0400
>> > From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> > Message-ID: <B560BFA05E674B108AC90002C499A6FB at marion27df4b2a>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
>> > reply-type=original
>> >
>> > Cheryl,
>> > Thanks for the info. we are not going to pursue this for year, as I
>> > believe it would probably raise some red flags with Pay Pal. We will
>> > consider this option for next year's *drawing*!
>> >
>> > Marion
>> >
>> > this
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "cheryl echevarria" <cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 9:39 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> >
>> >
>> > > well you can do it this way, just have a paypal button, doesn't have
> to be
>> >
>> > > for raffles. Just put in the information for payment of donation or
>> > > whatever, doesn't have to say raffle.
>> > >
>> > > Then e-mail the contact person and let them know off list that it
>> was
> for
>> > > the Raffle.
>> > >
>> > > There are ways around it.
>> > >
>> > > Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
>> > >
>> > > Cheryl Echevarria
>> > > http://www.echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/>
>> > > 631-456-5394
>> > >
>> >
> reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com>
>> > >
>> > > Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel
>> > > CST-1018299-10
>> > >
>> > > Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise &
>> Travel,
>> > > Inc.
>> > > ----- Original Message -----
>> > > From: Tami Kinney<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> > > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 4:38 PM
>> > > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Question about raffle for Trekker Breeze
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Hope and Buddy,
>> > >
>> > > I'm afraid we had to remove the PayPal button from the site... Turns
> out
>> > > they don't allow using their service for raffles, so now we know.
>> But
>> > > for this year, we've had to make adjustments. Those who paid through
>> > > PayPal before they informed us how very displeased they are do have
> the
>> > > tickets they bought and paid for. We're planning and researching how
> to
>> > > deal with some of those fundraising activities through the website
>> for
>> > > everyone's convenience.
>> > >
>> > > Hope, if you want to know more, you can contact Marion at
>> > > president at nagdu.org<mailto:president at nagdu.org> or Toni Whaley at
>> > > treasurer at nagdu.org<mailto:treasurer at nagdu.org> to see if you
>> > > can still get tickets. Come to think of it, it passed off my radar
> when
>> > > we decided to not use the website until we had a solution next year.
>> > > But I still want that Breeze! /smile/
>> > >
>> > > On Thu, 2011-06-23 at 14:52 -0400, Buddy Brannan wrote:
>> > > > Hi,
>> > > >
>> > > > Go to the NAGDU site. You can buy tickets there, and there's even
>> a
>> > > handy Paypal link.
>> > > > --
>> > > > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>> > > > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > On Jun 23, 2011, at 2:37 PM, Hope Paulos wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > > Hi all. I don't know who sent the information for winning the
> Trekker
>> >
>> > > Breeze from Nagdu, but I have a question. Are those of us who are
>> not
>> > > attending convention eligible to win? If so, how can we submit
>> payment
> and
>> >
>> > > have tickets filled out?
>> > > > > Thanks.
>> > > > > Hope and Beignet
>> > > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > > > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > > > >
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> info
> for
>> >
>> > > nagdu:
>> > > > >
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name<
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name>
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>> > > nagdu:
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> >
> .net<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40co
>> > mcast.net>
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org<http://www.nfbnet.or
>> > g/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org>
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > > nagdu:
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%40hotma
>> >
> il.com<http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cherylandmaxx%
>> > 40hotmail.com>
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.ne
>> > t
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 21
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 10:18:15 -0400
>> > From: "Tracy Carcione" <carcione at access.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: [nagdu] Cloning
>> > Message-ID: <9b4cadb7cfeb707c2f4ff952f8abca3c.squirrel at mail.panix.com>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>> >
>> > I heard a story about cloning on NPR a few weeks ago. A police
> department
>> > tried cloning a police dog with a really super nose and other great
>> > characteristics. The clones noses were just so-so, not the same as the
>> > original. I thought that was interesting.
>> > I've sometimes wished I could clone one of my dogs. But it might still
>> > not be the same. And I'd miss getting to know the wonderful uniqueness
> of
>> > the next dog. Vive la difference! It is in the natural order of things
> to
>> > have to let go of the old and embrace the new.
>> > Tracy
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 22
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 14:20:47 +0000
>> > From: "PICKRELL, REBECCA M (TASC)" <REBECCA.PICKRELL at tasc.com>
>> > To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>> > Users'" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Cloning
>> > Message-ID: <AAE38548E198F64B8E345439B68CCC781260AE37 at TSEAMB02>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>> >
>> > Keep in mind with cloning, you are not cloning souls. We all have them
> We
>> > also are not cloning experiences and interpertations on experiences.
>> We
> all
>> > have those too.
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf
>> > Of Tracy Carcione
>> > Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 10:18 AM
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: [nagdu] Cloning
>> >
>> > I heard a story about cloning on NPR a few weeks ago. A police
> department
>> > tried cloning a police dog with a really super nose and other great
>> > characteristics. The clones noses were just so-so, not the same as the
>> > original. I thought that was interesting.
>> > I've sometimes wished I could clone one of my dogs. But it might still
>> > not be the same. And I'd miss getting to know the wonderful uniqueness
> of
>> > the next dog. Vive la difference! It is in the natural order of things
> to
>> > have to let go of the old and embrace the new.
>> > Tracy
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
>> > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pickrell%40ta
>> > sc.com
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 23
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 11:44:15 -0400
>> > From: "Tracy Carcione" <carcione at access.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: [nagdu] Success stats
>> > Message-ID: <e41fac95e159265db497442342f4b9d2.squirrel at mail.panix.com>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>> >
>> > In the latest Seeing Eye annual report, they talk about working to
> improve
>> > their success rate from birth to a successful match. The report said
> that
>> > 80% of the dogs that enter training make it through. It also said that
>> > they have lowered the number of puppies they need to breed in order to
>> > have enough for training, but, looking at the numbers, it looks like
>> > roughly 2 to 1--509 pups born, 254 partnered with students.
>> > I remember reading, ages ago, that only 50% of guide dog puppies make
>> it
>> > through, and these stats look about the same, to me.
>> > I would really like to know if GDB's new methods have changed that
>> ratio
>> > significantly. I'm also curious if it's about the same at other
>> schools.
>> > 50% seems pretty poor to me, but maybe that's just how it is. Anyway,
>> > these sorts of stats interest me, and I thought they might interest
>> > others, too. If anyone else has different stats, I'd love to find out
>> > more.
>> > Tracy
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 24
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 09:24:44 -0700
>> > From: Tami Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Cloning
>> > Message-ID: <1308932684.2091.34.camel at tamara-desktop>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > True! Since I plan to have several years before I have to make a
>> > decision, I can have fun with idea of doing it because I really do
>> adore
>> > my poodle girl and want to hang on to her forever... When the time
>> > comes, and it's a *real* decision, who knows? As a lifelong sci-fi
>> nut,
>> > it's just really exciting that we can now discuss the pros and cons
>> > seriuosly because we're not just making things up that will never be
>> > possible. /smile/
>> >
>> > On Fri, 2011-06-24 at 10:18 -0400, Tracy Carcione wrote:
>> > > I heard a story about cloning on NPR a few weeks ago. A police
> department
>> > > tried cloning a police dog with a really super nose and other great
>> > > characteristics. The clones noses were just so-so, not the same as
>> the
>> > > original. I thought that was interesting.
>> > > I've sometimes wished I could clone one of my dogs. But it might
>> still
>> > > not be the same. And I'd miss getting to know the wonderful
>> uniqueness
> of
>> > > the next dog. Vive la difference! It is in the natural order of
>> things
> to
>> > > have to let go of the old and embrace the new.
>> > > Tracy
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 25
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 09:30:36 -0700
>> > From: Tami Kinney <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>> > To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Success stats
>> > Message-ID: <1308933036.2091.39.camel at tamara-desktop>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>> >
>> > Tracy, I read the older stats you mentioned when I was researching the
>> > notion of owner-training, and they were awfully daunting since I was
>> > looking for one dog which meant I needed a 100 percent success rate to
>> > have a guide dog. And this was how it was working out for people who
>> > actually knew what they were doing? /lol/ There was also an equally
>> > daunting ratio of returns after the match or early retirements... I
>> got
>> > the dog I found anyway and figured that I'd just start training her
>> and
>> > see what happened.
>> >
>> > Anyway, thanks for sharing the updated info. I do have a vague item
>> > penciled in way down on my to do list to look into what changes there
>> > have been over time at various programs, so I'm glad someone else does
>> > that, too, and lets others know. Cool!
>> >
>> > On Fri, 2011-06-24 at 11:44 -0400, Tracy Carcione wrote:
>> > > In the latest Seeing Eye annual report, they talk about working to
> improve
>> > > their success rate from birth to a successful match. The report said
> that
>> > > 80% of the dogs that enter training make it through. It also said
>> that
>> > > they have lowered the number of puppies they need to breed in order
>> to
>> > > have enough for training, but, looking at the numbers, it looks like
>> > > roughly 2 to 1--509 pups born, 254 partnered with students.
>> > > I remember reading, ages ago, that only 50% of guide dog puppies
>> make
> it
>> > > through, and these stats look about the same, to me.
>> > > I would really like to know if GDB's new methods have changed that
> ratio
>> > > significantly. I'm also curious if it's about the same at other
> schools.
>> > > 50% seems pretty poor to me, but maybe that's just how it is.
>> Anyway,
>> > > these sorts of stats interest me, and I thought they might interest
>> > > others, too. If anyone else has different stats, I'd love to find
>> out
>> > > more.
>> > > Tracy
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> > .net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 26
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 10:58:23 -0600
>> > From: Sheila Leigland <sleigland at bresnan.net>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Success stats
>> > Message-ID: <auto-000290016377 at fe-2.cluster1.bresnan.net>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>> >
>> > The fifty percent is what I've heard and it seems low to me also. I
>> hope
> it
>> > changes or has changed.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Message: 27
>> > Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2011 12:56:17 -0400
>> > From: "Margo and Arrow" <margo.downey at verizon.net>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> > Message-ID: <00EEE5F0BE5247D9BA2FCD3E80653E45 at meandmyarrow>
>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1;
>> > reply-type=response
>> >
>> > It's from the Onion and the Onion spoofs everyone and everything.
>> >
>> > Margo and Arrow
>> >
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Julie Phillipson" <jbrew48 at verizon.net>
>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 11:19 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> >
>> >
>> > > WHAT WAS NOT SAID ON THIS IS BELOW.
>> > > Hi everyone,
>> > >
>> > > Below is something that if you can't laugh at far out humer then I
> would
>> > > suggest not reading it. The spoof came from a publication in Madison
>> > > Wisconsin that does this kind of thing. Not sure how appropriate it
>> is
> for
>> >
>> > > the list, but sometimes one just needs to be a little crazy!!
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Julie Phillipson
>> > > ----- Original Message -----
>> > > From: "Sean Moore" <sean.moore at mediacombb.net>
>> > > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>> Users"
>> > > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> > > Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:38 PM
>> > > Subject: Re: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >> What the ...?
>> > >> ----- Original Message -----
>> > >> From: "Arthur Nolden" <anolden at tampabay.rr.com>
>> > >> To: <Undisclosed-Recipient:;>
>> > >> Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2011 6:22 PM
>> > >> Subject: [nagdu] . O-T: Blind People are Faking it.
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>>
>> > >>>
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Blind People Are Faking It!
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Citizens, hear us well. Our great nation is being undermined by a
> secret
>> >
>> > >>> society of individuals who carry deadly white truncheons and lead
>> > >>> vicious attack animals in public on a daily basis. These
>> mysterious
> folk
>> >
>> > >>> also have a secret means of communication, while shocking new
> evidence
>> > >>> seems to indicate that they may even possess senses superior to
> those of
>> >
>> > >>> other humans. We're speaking, of course, of the legions of the
> so-called
>> >
>> > >>> blind.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Let's assume for a minute that we swallow this "blindness" hoax in
> the
>> > >>> first place. If these people are somehow bereft of the gift of
> sight,
>> > >>> how does that explain the works of Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles and
> Ronnie
>> >
>> > >>> Milsap? How could such men possibly play music if they were blind?
> What
>> > >>> do they take us for-ignorant
>> > >>> saps?
>> > >>> The first issue I must point out is their very public display of
> armed
>> > >>> might. Every individual laying claim to sightlessness carries a
> cudgel
>> > >>> on their person at all times. These "canes," as they call them,
>> are
>> > >>> supposed to help them feel their way along. They are painted
>> white,
>> > >>> almost as if the bearer wished to remind passersby of its
>> presence,
> and
>> > >>> the weapon's tip is painted a chillingly suggestive red. Those who
> have
>> > >>> studied the mysterious fighting arts of the Orient know that such
> sticks
>> >
>> > >>> may be wielded with deadly force by those with skill.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> In a surprise attack, strategically placed squads of the "blind"
>> > >>> could quickly overwhelm our police forces. Their fearsome nature
>> > >>> encompasses more than just personal weaponry. Many of the alleged
> blind
>> > >>> also own large, vicious attack dogs for the supposed purpose of
> guidance
>> >
>> > >>> along city streets. With one word from their scheming masters,
>> these
>> > >>> slavering "guide" dogs could become guided missiles!
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Indeed, most of these fearsome beasts are German shepherds, a
> species of
>> >
>> > >>> killer wolf invented by twisted, Fascist dog breeders, which has
> somehow
>> >
>> > >>> fallen into this most suspect faction of the disabled. The most
>> > >>> frightening aspect of this diabolical conspiracy by far is their
> ability
>> >
>> > >>> to communicate with one another unbeknownst to upstanding
>> citizens.
>> > >>> Their secret code consists of a series of raised dots cunningly
> arranged
>> >
>> > >>> into arcane shapes. Known as "Braille," this demonic alphabet has
> begun
>> > >>> popping up in places that were doubtlessly chosen for their
>> mundane,
>> > >>> everyday outward appearance:
>> > >>> elevators, building directories, automated teller machines and the
> like.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> This system seems rational enough, and does not attract undue
> attention.
>> >
>> > >>> But think! If the messages on the signs changed suddenly, how
>> would
> we
>> > >>> know? Next year, next month, next week, maybe even tomorrow, the
> signs
>> > >>> will change from "second
>> > >>> floor" to "STRIKE NOW! STRIKE HARD!" and our nation will be thrown
> into
>> > >>> the chaos of revolution.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> At this juncture, there is no hard evidence that the blind are
> planning
>> > >>> such a revolution. We hope to have such evidence very soon. But
>> can
> one
>> >
>> > >>> group possess such an overwhelming element of surprise and fail to
> use
>> > >>> it to seize power? And can their goals be anything but evil?
>> > >>>
>> > >>> No, I say! I maintain that true blindness lies in failing to see
>> the
>> > >>> threat where it must obviously lie, and we must be vigilantly wary
> of
>> > >>> the blind menace.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Alan P., Nevada.
>> > >>>
>> > >>>
>> > >>>
>> > >>> _______________________________________________
>> > >>> nagdu mailing list
>> > >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for
>> > >>> nagdu:
>> > >>>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sean.moore%40mediacom
>> > bb.net
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> _______________________________________________
>> > >> nagdu mailing list
>> > >> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > >> nagdu:
>> > >>
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jbrew48%40verizon.net
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nagdu mailing list
>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for
>> > > nagdu:
>> > >
>> >
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/margo.downey%40verizo
>> > n.net
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
>> > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> >
>> >
>> > End of nagdu Digest, Vol 75, Issue 28
>> > *************************************
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nagdu mailing list
>> > nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
>> >
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>
>>
>> End of nagdu Digest, Vol 75, Issue 32
>> *************************************
>
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