[nagdu] Doggie Paws

Sat Apr 21 22:17:58 UTC 2012

I tend to agree that taking action now in letting the professor and the 
administration know that this is a pattern of behavior and the severity 
of it is probably the best way to go. Too bad it is so late in the term, 
because Mark is probably right, too, that action will not be taken until 
the term has ended and the new one is well under way.

Kicking the offending student out of the class for bad behavior, with a 
failing grade, forcing him to take the class again after nearly 
completing it, might teach him a thing or two about negative 
consequences... This can be a start in the behavioral modification 
process. If just talking to him like he is an adult human with brains to 
get a college education in the first place, isn't working... Then 
negative reinforcement for bad behavior would seem to be called for! 
Flunking a class and having to take it over to get his degree would seem 
to be direct and tangible in this case. Is it too much to hope he would 
be kicked out of school for this sort of offense? /evil grin/

Well, whatever the penalties are for harassment and physical 
interference or abuse of another student are, then that is what he 
should be facing. What would happen if he were breaking other people's 
laptops on the way past their desks? This dog is way more valuable a 
tool than some stinkin' laptop. Would he be allowed to deface the 
textbooks of other students? Again, dog way more valuable and important. 
And so on.

If this student has other underlying issues, then the report could 
prevent those issues from leading to more disastrous problems against 
the guide dog, the student with the dog, another disabled student or 
whatever...

Meanwhile, the behavior is *not* okay, and it could potentially damage a 
valuable mobility tool beyond repair. Also, it amounts to animal cruelty 
being that the tool is also a living being who feels pain when stepped 
on... And would feel a lot of pain if one of those steps causes deep 
physical damage.

Also, most states these days have a Guide Dog Protection law. Sorry I've 
forgotten which state you are in, Juanita, but you can find the texts of 
those laws on the NAGDU website. Here is the web address:

http://www.nagdu.org/laws/usa/usa.html

You can find your state listed and read the text of the law. In many 
states, you can also simply search for Guide Dog Protection Act to find 
the text of the law. As a rule, these laws define specific penalties for 
interference with a guide dog at work, as well as for injuries to a 
guide dog. You may be able to find recourse that way, too.

Sorry you and your dog are having to deal with this sort of thing. Best 
in getting the problem reosolved and staying safe while sitting in 
class. /smile/

Tami

On 04/21/2012 10:55 AM, Tina Thomas wrote:
> I agree that procedures at the university level can take some time. However,
> sometimes just letting the offending person know that action will be taken
> against them can detour them from continuing the undesired behavior. The
> that Juanita and some of her classmates have already spoken to this guy and
> he still doesn't seem to get it tells me there are some other issues going
> on with him and getting in his face is not going to stop him. However, if
> someone with authority speaks to him, and let him know the consequences of
> his he might be more out to listen.
> Tina and D.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Mark J. Cadigan
> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 10:31 AM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Doggie Paws
>
> Hi Juanita
>
>
>
> I'd agree that reporting this man to the authorities is the proper course of
> action, however, I don't know if it will have any affect. If your school
> schedule is anything like mine, there is only 2 weeks left in the semester,
> and it takes a long time for official complaints to work there way threw the
> process.
>
>
>
> If I was you, I would take the direct approach, get in his face, and tell
> him to cut it out. I'd tell him that if the dog gets injured in any way by
> his actions he would e held criminally responsible. I'd also inform him that
> there are several students in your class willing to back you up.
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tina Thomas"<tinadt at sbcglobal.net>
> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 12:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Doggie Paws
>
>
>> Hi Juanita-
>> Sounds like this guy is trying to get your dog to react to his bad
>> behavior
>> in a negative way. Unfortunately the public can be very silly and
>> misinformed on  a lot of issues and guide dogs are one of those issues.
>> The
>> next time he steps on your dog's paw, I would inform him that you have
>> filed
>> a harassment complaint against him  with the department chair, the campus
>> police as well as the university disciplinary   committee. This guy needs
>> to
>> know that you mean business and his behavior is intolerable. This is one
>> of
>> those situations where the guide dog user needs to take a hard line and
>> let
>> the offending person know that your not going to stand for this kind of
>> treatment and you know how to remedy it if the behavior doesn't stop.
>> Tina and D.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
>> Of Juanita Herrera
>> Sent: Friday, April 20, 2012 10:48 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Doggie Paws
>>
>> There is this one guy who steps on her every single time we meet for
>> class.
>> I have told him so many times to watch out for my dog but it's as though
>> it
>> goes in one ear and out the other. It's quite frustrating.
>>
>> On 4/19/12, Lisa belville<missktlab1217 at frontier.com>  wrote:
>>> yeah, it's hard to hear their howls of pain, but what's better is the
>>> whole mushy gushy "Oh, I didn't see him there," Yada Yada Yada.  I
>>> understand a dark dog on a dark floor in a dark room, but in a well
>>> lit classroom in broad daylight is a bit harder, though I think it's
>>> just a case of people not used to seeing dogs, and the dog just not
>>> even making it past their cursory glances.
>>>
>>>
>>> 1st Law of Procrastination: that which can be done will be done . . .
>>> TOMORROW!!
>>> Lisa Belville
>>> missktlab1217 at frontier.com
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Tami Kinney"<tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2012 7:45 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Doggie Paws
>>>
>>>
>>>> actually, nearly getting stepped on a time or two did wonders for
>>>> Mitzi's firm conviction that she *needed* to sprawl all over the
>>>> place. /lol/ Fortunately, nobody got hurt, but she started being
>>>> really good at figuring out how to be more out of the way. We still
>>>> have a heck of a time
>>>>
>>>> in crowded places like the bus or train or in waiting rooms, where
>>>> there isn't really an under. Often, when she shows me a seat, she
>>>> will pick one where she can be tucked away but still watch the
>>>> action. But I will remain
>>>>
>>>> permanently nervous about long, black poodle legs! /smile/
>>>>
>>>> Tami
>>>>
>>>> On 04/19/2012 11:29 AM, Lisa belville wrote:
>>>>> Oh boy, I had this issue in college, too.  Pretty much every desk
>>>>> has one
>>>>>
>>>>> of those rack things people used to use for putting their books and
>>>>> things on back in the day.  The best thing for me was to sort of
>>>>> parallel
>>>>>
>>>>> park Hunter so he'd be positioned on his belly with his paws tucked
>>>>> up under him as much as possible.  I'd also try putting him at an
>>>>> angle so his head would be under the desk next to my feet and his
>>>>> back part would be closer to the front of the desk where I could
>>>>> block his paws if I had to.
>>>>>
>>>>> Hunter was a very long dog, though, and this wasn't always possible.
>>>>> It sounds mean, but getting stepped on accidentally once or twice
>>>>> actually illustrated the point to Hunter more strongly than I could
>>>>> by keeping him
>>>>>
>>>>> tucked in.    Not saying you should let people tromp all over your
>> girl's
>>>>> feet or anything.
>>>>>
>>>>> Lisa
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 1st Law of Procrastination: that which can be done will be done . . .
>>>>> TOMORROW!!
>>>>> Lisa Belville
>>>>> missktlab1217 at frontier.com
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Juanita Herrera"
>>>>> <juanitaherrera1991 at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2012 10:50 AM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Doggie Paws
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> William, I don't use a backpack. I carry all my stuff in my purse,
>>>>>> and I'm not a big fan of placing my purse on the ground.
>>>>>> Robert, Thank you. I would do that if our desk chairs didn't have
>>>>>> anything under them. However, under the chairs they decided to put
>>>>>> a weird looking basket thing so it is hard to fit my dog.
>>>>>> Has anyone figured out a method to convince their pups to tuck in
>>>>>> their paws? Her body fits perfectly fine under my desk. The only
>>>>>> thing that sticks out are her paws.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 4/19/12, Robert Hooper<hooper.90 at buckeyemail.osu.edu>  wrote:
>>>>>>> Hello all:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> At my university, I traverse a number of different seating
>>>>>>> arrangements. In many class rooms, we have the standard table
>>>>>>> attached to chair arrangement in rows. The chairs have no
>>>>>>> cross-bars, so I just shove Bailey under my chair. I also get a
>>>>>>> seat close to a wall. He likes to take up as much space as
>>>>>>> possible, so he sprawls out a bit, however I've never really had
>>>>>>> the problems I anticipated. I recommend putting the dog under the
>>>>>>> chair. I don't have to do any odd positioning with my legs or
>>>>>>> anything--they just stay
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>> either side of the dog. In a lecture hall, I lay him sideways in
>>>>>>> front of me if he won't fit--it makes it hard for people to sit
>>>>>>> next to me on either side, but oh well.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Robert Hooper
>>>>>>> Hooper.90 at buckeyemail.osu.edu
>>>>>>> The Ohio State University
>>>>>>> 0653 Buckeye-Cuyahoga CT
>>>>>>> 653 Cuyahoga Court
>>>>>>> Columbus, Ohio 43210
>>>>>>> (740) 856-8195
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>>>> On Behalf Of Laurel
>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2012 10:22 PM
>>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>> Users
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Doggie Paws
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hey Juanita. Stockard loves to put her paws out and stretch out too.
>>>>>>> Sometimes I try to sit on the side of the class room, I'm in
>>>>>>> college too, and there's usually not as much traffic on the sides.
>>>>>>> I also use my feet to help keep her rained in. At GDB they had me
>>>>>>> put Stockard in a down position on my left, so what I do is put
>>>>>>> her down on my left, and put my left leg kind of stretched out on
>>>>>>> the other side of her. I let her stick her feet out, but keep my
>>>>>>> foot on the other side of her feet so people see me and step over.
>>>>>>> Some people get annoyed, but they all never seem to mind when they
>>>>>>> realize why my leg is way out there, to protect Stocky's feet. If
>>>>>>> I don't wanna sit in an uncomfortable way, then I just tuck
>>>>>>> Stockard's front feet, because it's usually her front feet that
>>>>>>> shee sticks out, I tuck them behind my foot and keep her feet
>>>>>>> between her and my leg with my leg out
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> over
>>>>>>> her a little bit.
>>>>>>> That might help too, just depends. But really it helps the most if
>>>>>>> you sit on the side or in the very back or something maybe.
>>>>>>> Laurel and Stockard
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 4/18/12, Hannah Chadwick<sparklylicious at gmail.com>  wrote:
>>>>>>>> It's probably because you're dog is humungous lol
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>>>>> On Behalf Of Mark J. Cadigan
>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2012 7:06 PM
>>>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>>> Users
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Doggie Paws
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I don't know why, however, people never step on my dog. It's not
>>>>>>>> like he will move either. If you are about to step on him, he
>>>>>>>> will just stare you down. Maybe people feel the eyes on them,
>>>>>>>> look down, and decide to watch there footing.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>> m
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
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