[nagdu] airline placement of dogs and bulkhead related issues

Thu Dec 27 18:09:22 UTC 2012

When the one guy said it was their policy, I said, show me. He said it was on their web site. Their policy is; that isn't in it.

CL

On Dec 27, 2012, at 11:37 AM, Michael Hingson wrote:

> Margo,
> 
> Cindy is right.  It's really not a loophole, but rather it's uninformed
> flight crews.  They don't know their own policies.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Margo and Arrow
> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2012 09:15 AM
> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] airline placement of dogs and bulkhead related issues
> 
> Michael, I agree with what you're saying. I am just saying that the
> Southwest policy itself has loopholes that crew members could try to use and
> apparently they did with Cindy. 
> 
> Margo and Arrow
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Michael Hingson <info at michaelhingson.com>
> To: "'Nagdu Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> Date: Thursday, December 27, 2012 11:16 am
> Subject: [nagdu] FW: airline placement of dogs and bulkhead related issues
> 
>> 
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Concerning the issue of flight crews having wiggle room with the ACAA 
>> language, in reality, there still is no loophole.  Some airlines can 
>> try to insist that our dogs must be by the window to prevent emergency 
>> exits from rows.  If a guide dog is placed under the seat in front of 
>> us in a non-bulkhead row even this issue mostly goes away since then 
>> the blockage is no worse than people's feet being in the isle.
>> 
>> By the way, I believe the most important reason for not sitting in the 
>> bulkhead at ANY TIME is a safety one.  Dogs sitting in bulkhead rows 
>> can bounce around during turbulent conditions while dogs under the 
>> seat in front cannot.  In addition, it is easier to control a dog 
>> confined in this manner than one who has more room to move and panic 
>> in the bulkhead.  Even on small short-range aircraft there is room to 
>> put most dogs under the seat in front of us.  I always fly this way 
>> whether it be on Southwest, American, or any other airline.  Flight crews
> do not actually have a say in the matter.
>> 
>> 
>> Best,
>> 
>> 
>> Michael Hingson
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Ray
>> Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2012 07:05 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Southwest Airlines: Customers with Disabilities
>> 
>> It does leave them a little loophole, but they really can't with a 
>> straight face say it is their policy that you are to sit in the 
>> bulkhead with your dog. It really isn't and cannot be. Their response 
>> to my complaint said that tye are aware of it. And their crew is going 
>> to say what they will no matter what their policy is because they, and 
>> may other folks, too, believe that we must do as we are told and will want
> to intimidate us.
>> 
>> CL
>> 
>> On Dec 26, 2012, at 8:34 PM, Margo and Arrow wrote:
>> 
>>> Well, that's great, but, this lea"es loopholes open for crew members 
>>> to
>> state the dog would obsthuct evacuation unless the dog is in the 
>> bulkhead or whatever designated seating they designate.
>>> 
>>> Southwest should have a clause stating that people are not required 
>>> to sit
>> with their assistance animals in the bulkhead but can choose their 
>> seating except for exit rows, I guess.
>>> 
>>> Margo and Arrow
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: Steven Johnson <blinddog3 at charter.net>
>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>> Date: Wednesday, December 26, 2012 7:02 pm
>>> Subject: [nagdu] Southwest Airlines: Customers with Disabilities
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Cindy,
>>>> You may already have this information, but their on-line 
>>>> information
>> states:
>>>> 
>>>> Trained Assistance Animals
>>>> 
>>>> Southwest Airlines welcomes trained assistance animals on all of 
>>>> our flights. Except when too large to be safely accommodated, a 
>>>> trained assistance animal traveling with and providing assistance 
>>>> to a Customer with a disability will be accommodated in the 
>>>> aircraft cabin. In accordance with federal safety regulations, the 
>>>> animal must be positioned so as not to obstruct Customers' 
>>>> expeditious evacuation in the unlikely event of an emergency.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> http://www.southwest.com/html/customer-service/unique-travel-needs/
>>>> in
>>>> dex-pol
>>>> ._html
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>>> for
>> nagdu:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/margo.downey%40v
>>>> er
>>>> izon.net
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nagdu mailing list
>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
>>> for
>> nagdu:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cindyray%40gmail.
>>> co
>>> m
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/info%40michaelhings
>> on.com
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/margo.downey%40veri
>> zon.net
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nagdu mailing list
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/info%40michaelhingson.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nagdu mailing list
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cindyray%40gmail.com