[nagdu] Suggestions needed!

Sat Aug 17 05:37:15 UTC 2013

Of course, it wouldn't be fool proof! I'm sure some teams might pass tests 
and such and then fall apart. This issue is kind of a difficult one.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tami Jarvis" <tami at poodlemutt.com>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, August 17, 2013 1:11 AM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Suggestions needed!


> Well, if there were a way for that to be administered that would actually 
> work, it could be worth consideration, at least. There is the question of 
> how that is paid for and by whom, to begin with. Where would the testing 
> take place? And so on.
>
> Also, to what extent would the test guarantee that the dogs continue to be 
> well-behaved and that the handlers continue to maintain that part of the 
> training and so on.
>
> Also, how is that certification then used? Do we have to show it 
> everywhere we go? Is that a good idea? Can we produce a proof of this 
> certification that cannot be forged?
>
> I've seen some proposed sample tests that seem sensible and reasonable, 
> with fairly specific requirements for the testing. However, there is still 
> the problem of administration and financing on a large scale. So I have 
> never come up with an idea of how to even start there. Maybe someone else 
> has?
>
> On 08/16/2013 08:27 PM, Nicole Torcolini wrote:
>> Would requiring some kind of behavior  test be considered too much
>> certification?
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Larry D. 
>> Keeler
>> Sent: Friday, August 16, 2013 8:13 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Suggestions needed!
>>
>> Tami, I think the formost issue with me is does the dog behave when asked
>> and does the handler know how to handle the dog! Grooming and general 
>> health
>> is also important because iether the dog may be bringing its own pets 
>> with
>> it or sometimes, Not always, it can reflect badly on the handler. A 
>> handler
>> may be slipping in maintaining the dogs appearance due to lack of money,
>> time or just lack of interest. I know that many folks will disaggree with 
>> me
>> but I also think that an ID, tradmark harness or for owner trained teams
>> some kind of state issued sticker be obtained so that a service dog can 
>> be
>> distinguished from any other dog. A perfect example is my dughters 
>> friend.
>> She has a jack Russell terrier named Trouble! She is a owner trained 
>> hearing
>> dog. The dog is cute and well behaved but, I can forsee many folks 
>> confusing
>> her with a pet. For me, I wonder wher the line between being private 
>> about
>> why you need a dog and what that dog does for you conflicts with the 
>> general
>> publics seeming need to declare there dogs as service dogs! At some 
>> point,
>> there has to be a clear line instead of the big grey void folks seem to 
>> have
>> now. I met a woman at the train station last year on the way to 
>> convention.
>> William and I were taking the train and I sure hope she wasn't! At least 
>> she
>> wasn't in our car! Anyway, she had a little terier, and the thing barked,
>> growled and tried to come at our dogs! She had to walk down the tracks 
>> quite
>> away down the tracks and her dog was still going off! Interestingly, she
>> claimed it was for PTSD. That thing would have caused it instead of
>> relieving it! I really didn't know how to handle the situation other than
>> william and I controlling our dogs while hers cut loose! I mean, who or 
>> how
>> do you report a situation where the dog is clearly in dubious territory
>> iether because of its or the handlers lack of controlling behavior? At 
>> least
>> with guide dogs you can call a school or talk to a friend and check to 
>> see
>> if the behavior is normal for a service dog! And, I can tell good owner
>> trainers because they keep there dogs under control. I wonder what or how
>> penalties can be assessed to folks who are not being truthful about the
>> service or lack of services that the dog performs. As long as there is no
>> requirment that can't be faked or we are not required to have some proof
>> that the dog does the service. we'll always have folks sneaking 
>> nonservice
>> animals under the wire!
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Tami Jarvis" <tami at poodlemutt.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, August 16, 2013 10:39 PM
>> Subject: [nagdu] Suggestions needed!
>>
>>
>>> Okay, following up on Ken's suggestion, I opened my mouth and now have
>>> a writing project. I blame Ken! /grin/
>>>
>>> Seriously, I do think it might be nice to have some semi-formalized
>>> collection of those rules of etiquette that most of us here just take
>>> for granted and that we work so diligently to follow. The
>> "responsibilities"
>>> part of our rights and responsibilities. Most of those I have learned
>>> from a lot of you, whether it's what you learned from your schools or
>>> the experience of years of real world guide dog use. So this seemed a
>>> good place to ask again! /smile/
>>>
>>> What do we -- with "we" being responsible, considerate service dog
>>> users -- consider important when we take our dogs into public? What is
>>> good etiquette in our dogs? What is good etiquette for us humans?
>>>
>>> I'm thinking of a couple of categories for the dogs:
>>>
>>> 1) Grooming and health
>>> 2) public behavior
>>>
>>> For the humans... I haven't figured out neat categories for that yet.
>>> I'm thinking of good dog management -- keep the dog out of the aisle,
>>> stuff like that. Maybe a bit about how to manage lines and so forth.
>>>
>>> I think I'll include a "what to do when..." As we have seen from the
>>> convention debriefing... Not everybody knows that it's bad form to
>>> walk off and leave the smelling mess for someone to step in. Ugh! And
>>> what about those times your perfectly well trained dog goes klepto in
>>> the supermarket? I say pay for it; others say, "oh, well." I've only
>>> had to buy an unintended stuffed animal, if anyone is wondering. /lol/
>>>
>>> I have a few items I might address for interactions with other service
>>> dog users... Hm...
>>>
>>> Anyway, if anyone has suggestions they would like to see included, you
>>> can write me off list at tami at poodlemutt.com. It might also be fun to
>>> discuss some of these things on the list. I'm thinking of the recent
>>> discussion about riding in cabs. We all have different ways of doing
>>> the same thing and smoothing over the rough spots we encounter in a
>> crowded busy world.
>>>
>>> Tami
>>>
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>>
>>
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