[nagdu] Over here command

Jewel herekittykat2 at gmail.com
Fri Aug 23 17:52:27 UTC 2013 


Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 23, 2013, at 11:21 AM, Deanna Lewis <DLewis at clovernook.org> wrote:

> Hi Shanna,
> When you were talking about the doors and the command "over here" it got me thinking. You said that the way you did it was like Seeing Eye does, but what is their technique? What do other schools teach for having the dog move to the right side so that you can open a door when the hinges are on the left side? So that you can heal the dog through without them getting hit by the door. I hope this makes sense /smiles/.
> I feel that I am pretty lenient with Pascal, since he is my first dog. But, I want to be more strict with my successor dogs. Pascal has very good behavior, but he is also a bit spoiled! And he's very stubborn!
> Deanna and Pascal
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Shanna Stichler
> Sent: Friday, August 23, 2013 1:40 AM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Changing the rules when you get home (was I'm back)
> 
> With my program dogs, I think I stuck to the school rules at first for each one. Once I got to know the dog better, then I deviated from those guidelines when I needed to. I have never used GDB's "over here" 
> command, which is when the dog switches sides in order to go through doors opening toward the team. I found that it just wasn't practical for me, so I came up with a method that sounds pretty similar to what TSE uses, actually. :D I also did clicker work with my dogs, and this was before GDB was using clicker training in their program. Oh, and I always, always switched their food to something I liked better.
> 
> I think mostly, the schools have all these rules because they want to cover every possible eventuality, if that makes sense. Mostly, they're sound enough, but it's fine to come up with different methods that work better for us when we get home. JMO though, of course.
> 
> Shanna and Diamond
> On 8/22/2013 3:26 PM, Shannon Dyer wrote:
>> This is really sound advice, Tracy. While in class, we are in a controled environment. Therefore, the school rules can and do work for us. However, once we get home, and our dogs have to function in the environment we're used to, things can change.
>> 
>> Like you, I stopped doing the door thing pretty quickly after coming home with each of my dogs. I've also never understood heeling the dog off a bus. Too much of a chance of injury, IMO.
>> 
>> Shannon and Ace
>> On Aug 22, 2013, at 11:20 AM, "Tracy Carcione" <carcione at access.net> wrote:
>> 
>>> I usually change the rules when I get home, if I find the school rules aren't working for me.  I say, give the school rules a fair try, because they may have some real value, but chuck them if they don't work for me.
>>> One example is what I think of as the TSE pirouette, a maneuver for opening a door and going through it with the dog.  I gave it a fair try at the school, but shortly after I got home I went back to the way I'd been doing things and totally forgot it.
>>> Another example is that, many years ago, GDB taught that I should heel the dog off of a bus.  I did that, until I stepped into a hole, or smashed into a pole right outside the door--I'm sure both these things happened--then I decided it was a stupid thing to do and have worked the dog off the bus ever since.
>>> IMO, while many of the rules I've been taught in class do have value, some others seem to have been made up by people with no practical experience in the world I live in, and I will use my good judgement to decide which are which.
>>> Tracy
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sheila Leigland" 
>>> <sleigland at bresnan.net>
>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2013 3:11 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] I'm back
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> hi lyn well stated. I know a handler that goes out of the way to do everything differently than the school trains to do. I do know that some things work better for some dogs than others but the principles are still the same.
>>>> On 8/21/2013 11:41 AM, L Gwizdak wrote:
>>>>> Hi Chantel,
>>>>> I don't think Jenny said that ALL Pilot grads were idiots. LOL! I've seen my share of poor handlers since 1971!  they came from all schools.  Part of what I've seen is that grads will sometimes decide that the school is full of crap when the school asks you to do things in a certain way when you get home with a new dog.  the grad blows off the school and does things as they please - not realizing that the school tells you things because they do really know better what has worked and not worked for grads when they get home.
>>>>> 
>>>>> At TSE, EVERYTHING done has a purpose!  Even the simple things like going to the dining room for meals.  At lunch time, all the employees and guests have lunch with us during the week.  For us students, they have us come in after the staff and guests are already eating and they are seated near the door in the first section of the dining room.  We are required to work our dogs past these tables with people eating at them.  This arrangement sets up a situation that we will find when we go to restaurants.  Every day, we are practicing how to work the dogs in a restaurant type setting.  In lecture, our dogs are in harness and lying quietly at our feet.  This is like if wwe were at a meeting we would go to when we get home.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I do think some schools are more thorouogh in some things than other schools.  I see that some other schools do not place a premium on getting dogs out of the way when we are sitting in a meeting where we sit at tables. Some of the dog users just let their dogs lie on the floor in the way where they get tripped over.  The Seeing Eye is a real stickler on this issue of making sure our dogs are out of the way - under chairs or the table where they will not be tripped over.
>>>>> 
>>>>> But many problems are from lax handling by new users AND long-time handlers because they don't think about what they are doing.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Lyn and Landon
>>>>> "Asking who's the man and who's the woman in an LGBT relationship 
>>>>> is like asking which chopstick is the fork" - Unknown
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chantel Cuddemi" 
>>>>> <jawsgirl87 at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog 
>>>>> Users'" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 20, 2013 11:59 AM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] I'm back
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Jenny,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I am a Pilot grad, and I went through the achievement walk twice, 
>>>>>> and I had to stay for extra training.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> So, are you saying that all Pilot grads are idiots? Pilot's name 
>>>>>> is engraved on Motley's harness.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Chantel and Motley.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Snow 
>>>>>> White Dove
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 20, 2013 2:20 PM
>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] I'm back
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I got Shasta at Pilot.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I was and am astounded by their training of their dogs and their students.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I know they have a fowl reputation.  but when I was there, I saw why.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> There were a couple of women ther that never should've gotten 
>>>>>> their dogs because they didn't have to go through the full 
>>>>>> achievement walk to determine whether they are fit for a dog.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Basically what I'm trying to say, politely, but truthfully is, 
>>>>>> that the reputation of Pilot is marred only by the idiots they let 
>>>>>> go home with dogs they sshouldn't have giving to people.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> For any questions on the details of this opinion.  Please email me 
>>>>>> off list so as to not clutter the list.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I just have to say this.  Pilot is, in my opinion, being 
>>>>>> considered a less than desirable school ecause of the idiots that 
>>>>>> are seen because they're obviously not suited to have a dog and Pilot's name is on that harness.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> No one sees Pilot on the harnesses of those who handle their dogs 
>>>>>> well and just blend in.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Anyway, I'm done gushing over my experiences.  Please don't feel 
>>>>>> offended by anything I might have said.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> If I've overstepped my bounds with the moderators.  Please know 
>>>>>> that apologize.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>> On Aug 19, 2013, at 7:34 PM, Marsha Drenth <marsha.drenth at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Jenny,
>>>>>>> congratulations!
>>>>>>> What an interesting name..Where did you get Mr Shasta? I don't 
>>>>>>> remember
>>>>>> what school you apply to. Sorry.
>>>>>>> May you both have many years of wonderful working relationship together.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Marsha drenth
>>>>>>> Sent with my IPhone
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Aug 19, 2013, at 7:02 PM, Snow White Dove <jlperdue3 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Wanted to write to tell you all that I finally did it.  I know
>>>>>> Cynprobably let you guys know already, but I figured I'd write myself.
>>>>>>>> I came home August 9th with an English Black lab named Shasta.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> He's a wonderful worker and has a great personality, but boy I 
>>>>>>>> wasn't
>>>>>> sure of the personality part in the beginning or whether I could 
>>>>>> handle him at all.
>>>>>>>> If he had not been on leash I think he'd have bounced off the 
>>>>>>>> walls all
>>>>>> on his own steam.
>>>>>>>> He settled down, and things are pretty cool now, but being 19 
>>>>>>>> months old,
>>>>>> he's a chewer.  I've had him on leash since I got him, and 
>>>>>> everything was fine till I got home with my brand new leather 
>>>>>> leash which he chewed in half in a perfectly streight line in two seconds flat.
>>>>>>>> Needless to say, I was embarrassed to call the school to order a 
>>>>>>>> new
>>>>>> leash, but more embarrassed when the head trainer answered the 
>>>>>> phone. He was cool about it, well for him, and said to give him a 
>>>>>> couple of weeks to get more leashes as theyn were out.
>>>>>>>> I'm hoping they'll just give me a new one, but I don't think 
>>>>>>>> I'll be that
>>>>>> lucky.
>>>>>>>> Also, he appears to be a dog, but is a beaver.  He eats anything 
>>>>>>>> wooden
>>>>>> outside, and I can't seem to break him of it.  I've said no, leash 
>>>>>> corrections, drop it and removed sticks and twigs from his mouth.  ug.
>>>>>>>> Hope to hear from you guys soon.  I just did a mass delete 
>>>>>>>> before I wrote
>>>>>> you all, so if you wrote me about Shasta, please forgive me and 
>>>>>> send it again.
>>>>>>>> Have a great day.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Jenny
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>> 
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>>>>> 
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> 
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> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.comThe Guide Dog Foundation teaches two methods, which students can choose from or depending on personal preference or situational preference. The first is to put your back to the door and lead the dog through with the harness released. The second is to say switch and guide the dog behind and to the right side while switching the leash to the right hand behind the back. To return to heel, one would just say switch and go in reverse. I use both ways, depending on if I have something in my hands or how busy the area is, because the first method is not as fast and can be bothersome when there are lots of people, but it is good if my hands are full. 
-Jewel

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