[nagdu] Clicker training

Fri Feb 22 17:13:10 UTC 2013

Lora,

The short answer to your question about self-rewarding behaviors is that 
you use a high-value reward to compete. This is very true, and it is in 
no way that easy. /lol/

When you talk about barking, do you mean vocalizing in harness? Or in 
the apartment/house, or in a big backyard? Technically, vocalizing in 
harness is easier to deal with because you have the dog right there 
where you can get your hands on it. For me, it's been the most difficult 
because it's so danged mortifying. Everybody knows guide dogs don't 
bark, and if we're going to have our dogs in public we can't have them 
creating a disturbance, that will ruin everything for guide dog users 
everywhere, etc., etc. I find it hard to remain calm and collected under 
all that pressure and mortification. Getting excited and acting out of 
excitement is just the best way in the world to ensure the problem will 
persist and get worse before it gets better. As I have learned the hard 
way. Sheesh!

Barking is a social thing, so it really helps to refrain from barking 
yourself. Once the pack leader joins the barking, it's the thing to do, 
with relish and enthusiasm. As I have to remind the spouse frequently 
when our two decide to relieve boredom in the truck. One might to a 
trial bark -- or is it just a little alert? -- but the second he raises 
his voice, guess what? Then I have to bite him to keep him from raising 
his voice more... Well, the monsters have settled down again, but we did 
go through a round or two this summer with all the travel and move and 
everything. Now when we notice the beginnings of an alert, we can calmly 
and firmly say quiet, and they both mostly remember to mind their 
manners. Whew!

Also, it helps to remember that the first task is to get the dog's 
attention away from what it is barking at and to do that in a way that 
is calm and firm and quiet. Barking is also an excited behavior; you 
want to bring the excitement down, not add to it. That I find difficult 
sometimes, especially in situations where I've wanted the barking to 
cease immediately. If I convey my uptightness to the dog, the battle is 
in danger of being lost. I'm uptight, so that means the dog needs to 
watch out for whatever is making me uptight, and it is very important to 
*bark* at whatever it is ... Or so it seems. Thanks to Daisy the crazy 
coonhound, I have had plenty of opportunity to observe responses to my 
responses to barking... Then Mitzi took over Daisy's barking role, which 
was sweet... Then we got the pup, who is still going through phases of 
wanting to find her role in the barking order.

Best technique, beyond staying calm and all that in general, is also to 
remember the social component of barking and that it is above all else a 
communication. I get the best results with say, barking at the deer out 
the window or at someone coming to the front door, if I just join the 
dog and look in the direction it's looking. In fact, I only started to 
get results with Daisy when I started doing that. Of course, she was a 
special case, but I could then just sit with my hand lightly on her back 
or shoulders, waiting for her tension to ease away while I looked out 
the window with her and talked quietly about what was out there (not a 
clue, but that didn't matter).

I actually wish I'd learned all that I learned from Daisy when I was 
training Mitzi, because of time I had to spend recovering from my 
mistakes in the matter of vocalizing. Time machine, anyone? /lol/

Anyway, barking is so complex that if you have a specific question, it 
would be easier to answer. Or someone else can explain better how to 
deal in general. /smile/

Tami

On 02/21/2013 07:25 PM, Lora :) wrote:
> Yes that is what I was referring to as far as pushing the owner. Also
> how are you supposed to redirect self reinforcing behaviors such as
> barking?
>
> On 2/20/13, Julie J. <julielj at neb.rr.com> wrote:
>> LOL Yes, I can see that happening.  It sounds like something Monty would
>> do.
>>
>> Here's how I'd keep the dog from chaining the sequence sniff, target
>> treat.  I'd use different incompatible behaviors.  So Ben sniffs,
>> sometimes ask for a hand target, sometimes a sit or whatever else seems
>> appropriate in the situation.   So he won't connect sniffing with the
>> next behavior and the subsequent click and treat.  I'd also ask him to
>> do the hand target or sit or whatever at random times with random
>> reinforcement outside of sniffing intervention times.  If you know
>> places or situations where he is likely to let his nose wander, be
>> proactive and get him to target your hand before the sniff.  this will
>> probably be the most effective, but it is the hardest to do.
>>
>> There is a funny story about a wheelchair user teaching her service dog
>> a retrieve with clicker. The dog was so excited about this new skill
>> that he practically buried her under mounds of stuff the dog brought her
>> that she didn't ask for.  She did train the dog to bring only requested
>> items. I'll have to see if I can find that article again.
>>
>> Julie
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2/20/2013 7:47 AM, Tracy Carcione wrote:
>>> Julie J, thanks for the very clear explanation of how to begin clicker
>>> training.  No one has explained it so well to me before.  I did look
>>> at a book, but, like you said, it was all "click when your dog
>>> looks..." and not all that helpful for a blind person.
>>>
>>> Ben is a sniff monster.  A friend thinks using the clicker might help
>>> fix that, and I understand how I could, say, ask him to touch my hand
>>> when he starts sniffing.  I get that process.  But Ben is very smart.
>>> He's also a wise guy, with his own agenda.  Might he think "hmm, if I
>>> sniff, and she asks me to touch her hand, and I get a treat, then, if
>>> I sniff more, I'll get more treats?"
>>> Maybe this is what the originator of this thread meant by the dog
>>> pushing over on the person.
>>> Tracy
>>>
>>>
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