[nagdu] Finding the end of a line with your dog

Tue Jun 25 22:33:08 UTC 2013

Hello, I totally understand what you are saying and I think that 
is the case in most instances.  Unfortunately, as someone 
mentioned in an earlier post, there are rude people in every 
group.  I am just happy to know that the schools are not 
promoting the idea that a guide dog user somehow has the right to 
special treatment like that.

Carol  ----- Original Message -----
From: Star Gazer <pickrellrebecca at gmail.com
To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog 
Users" <nagdu at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Tue, 25 Jun 2013 15:10:21 -0400
Subject: Re: [nagdu] The Differences in Dogs and Canes

Carol, it is doubtful the dog users you know cut in line just to 
piss you off, though some may be.  Using a dog is very different 
then using a cane because you have to be aware of what the dog is 
doing.  So for example you are at the movies.  You want to get in 
line but there isn't just one.  You go to the line you want and 
the movie you want to see is popular.  Your dog stops and you 
reach your hand out only to find an old dude petting your dog.  
Or the line isn't a strait line kids are slightly separated from 
their folks so your dog isn't sure where the end of the line is.  
Is it behind the teenager playing with her phone or the mom who 
may or may not be responsible for the three kids milling around 
her.  You will also sometimes get movie theater staff that want 
to help you and your dog in ways they won't when you have a cane.  
All this can impact the line experience.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jun 25, 2013, at 12:53 PM, Carol Osmar <osmarc at sbcglobal.net> 
wrote:

 Thanks for all your responses.

 So, I believe what all of you are saying is,  it is one of many 
learning processes that is taught but a skill that not everyone 
chooses to practice.  Although you don't have a cane that will 
tap the heel of the last person in line, if you are alert in your 
surroundings you can generally  tell when you are at the back of 
a group of people.  Even with a cane I am not 100 percent 
accurate.
 You have made me feel better about this issue.

 Carol

 ----- Original Message -----
 From: "Larry D.  Keeler" <lkeeler at comcast.net
 To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog 
Users" <nagdu at nfbnet.org
 Date sent: Mon, 24 Jun 2013 22:50:54 -0400
 Subject: Re: [nagdu] The Differences in Dogs and Canes

 Mike, I've seen folks do that with canes as well.  
Unfortunately, rude folks
 come in all shapes and sizes.
 ----- Original Message -----
 From: "Michael Hingson" <Mike at michaelhingson.com
 To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog 
Users'"
 <nagdu at nfbnet.org
 Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 9:03 PM
 Subject: Re: [nagdu] The Differences in Dogs and Canes

 Carol,

 There is no excuse for rudeness anywhere.  If guide dog users 
plow through
 people they are being inconsiderate.

 Dogs do look for ways around obstacles, and people can be 
obstacles.  It is
 up to us as guide dog users to watch our dogs' behaviors to make 
sure they
 are not helping us cut in lines.  We are still in charge and 
need to manage
 our guides.

 Best,

 Michael Hingson

 The Michael Hingson Group, INC.
 "Speaking with Vision"
 Michael Hingson, President
 (415) 827-4084
 info at michaelhingson.com
 To order Michael Hingson's new book, Thunder Dog, and check on 
Michael
 Hingson's speaking availability for your next event please 
visit:
 www.michaelhingson.com

 To purchase your own portrait of Roselle painted by the world's 
foremost
 animal artist, Ron Burns, please visit 
http://www.ronburns.com/roselle

 -----Original Message-----
 From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carol 
Osmar
 Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 05:43 PM
 To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog 
Users
 Subject: Re: [nagdu] The Differences in Dogs and Canes

 Hello All, I am new to the list, and am looking forward to 
learning from
 your discussions.  I am in my 60S and recently retired.  I have 
been a cane
 user all my life, but just recently applied for a guide dog, so, 
I have a
 lot to learn.

 Although I haven't had a dog, I have been around many people 
with guide
 dogs, and I have noticed on many occasions, a blind person with 
a dog will
 plow his way through a crowd to get to the head of the line.  I 
feel this is
 rude.  My question is, Do the schools address the issue of 
curtesy to others
 when using a dog?

 I have never been in New York City,   so I don't know what it is
 like traveling there as a blind person.  Perhaps you would be 
trampled if
 you are not aggressive there.

 Carol  ----- Original Message -----
 From: "Tracy Carcione" <carcione at access.net
 To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog 
Users"
 <nagdu at nfbnet.org Date sent: Mon, 24 Jun 2013 11:05:00 -0400
 Subject: Re: [nagdu] The Differences in Dogs and Canes

 I think a dog is much better for moving easily through a crowd.
 I know
 plenty of people use canes in New York City, but I imagine they 
have to slow
 way down when things get crowded, or whack a lot of ankles.
 Ben just
 slides on through, finding spaces between people.  Ben is one of 
those
 "pushy urban dogs".  Crowds are something of a specialty with 
him, and I
 really appreciate that.
 Tracy

 Great point Nicole as even the best cane user would not find 
such an
 obstacle.

 Steve

 -----Original Message-----
 From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of 
Nicole
 Torcolini
 Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 2:08 PM
 To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog 
Users'
 Subject: [nagdu] The Differences in Dogs and Canes

 Okay, yes, I know that this one has gone round and round before, 
but I had
 something happen today that made me just have to bring it up one 
more  time.
 There is the way of thinking that says that the good cane user 
should be
 able to travel as quickly and as safely with a cane as with a 
dog.
 However,
 unless you wear a full body shield, I just don't think that that 
is true.
 For reasons that I will not discuss here, I was out walking 
today with my
 cane rather than Lexia.  I was traversing a route that I have 
taken
 numerous  times with Lexia.  Lexia usually stays a tiny bit from 
the edge of
 the side  walk.  However, as I was using my cane rather than 
Lexia, I was
 trailing  the  edge.  There is a staircase that comes down from 
a building
 that has a  railing that sticks out farther than the bottom 
step.  With
 Lexia, this had  never before posed a problem as she had cleared 
it as an
 obstacle.
 However,
 I had no way of detecting it without her; it was at hip level.
 As a
 result,
 I ran right into it.  I was not hurt or anything, but it just 
goes to show
 that there are those things that a guide dog, at least a well 
trained one,
 usually detects that a cane cannot.

 Nicole
 _______________________________________________
 nagdu mailing list
 nagdu at nfbnet.org
 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
info for
 nagdu:

http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blinddog3%40ch
 arter.net

 _______________________________________________
 nagdu mailing list
 nagdu at nfbnet.org
 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
info for
 nagdu:

http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/carcione%40acc
 ess.net

 _______________________________________________
 nagdu mailing list
 nagdu at nfbnet.org
 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
info for nagdu:

http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/osmarc%40sbcgl
 obal.net

 _______________________________________________
 nagdu mailing list
 nagdu at nfbnet.org
 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
info for nagdu:

http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/info%40michael
 hingson.com

 _______________________________________________
 nagdu mailing list
 nagdu at nfbnet.org
 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
info for nagdu:

http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/lkeeler%40comc
 ast.net

 _______________________________________________
 nagdu mailing list
 nagdu at nfbnet.org
 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
info for nagdu:

http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/osmarc%40sbcgl
 obal.net

 _______________________________________________
 nagdu mailing list
 nagdu at nfbnet.org
 http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
info for nagdu:

http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/pickrellrebecc
a%40gmail.com

_______________________________________________
nagdu mailing list
nagdu at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
for nagdu:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/osmarc%40sbcgl
obal.net