[nagdu] Rules Regarding Pet Dogs was RE: New Jersey Laws regarding guide dogs being attacked

Sat Aug 23 20:42:07 UTC 2014

Yea, I don’t mind dogs in the workplace or anywhere else, it’s just dogs off leash that are a problem. There are already laws against that, but as I mentioned before, it happens on my campus way too often and for some reason the people who have their dogs off leash are the people who also ignore their dogs until something has already happened.

Laws like the one in NJ insures that if something does happen, it is more than just calling animal control and nothing actually happens. 

Sofia

Sent from Windows Mail

From: Cindy Ray via nagdu
Sent: ‎Saturday‎, ‎August‎ ‎23‎, ‎2014 ‎4‎:‎36‎ ‎PM
To: Cindy Ray via nagdu

I share an office building with two other offices. One of the other tenants has a little yippy dog named Gizmo (I have written about him previously).  Since the office he hangs out in is self-contained, as is mine, I don't worry about him being out and about without his owner, but sometimes he will stand at his office door and bark through the glass at Jenny when we enter/exit the building.  Jenny does not react when we are leaving the building, but when we are re-entering she will sometimes react to the barking.  I don't think it's a big deal largely because he can't get at her, and it gives me a chance to work on dog distractions.

However, on the street is another matter. I am firmly of the belief that people should have more control over their dogs.  Not sure if I posted about this before, but a couple months ago Jenny and I were walking home, and we were about to take a corner around a curved sidewalk. Out of nowhere this dog comes flying across the street at us and seriously distracts Jenny. The owner, still across the street, whines "Archie!  Come back, Archie!"  Without missing a beat I yell over at her to come get her dog.  She just says "what?" (as though it's not illegal - if not unsafe - to have an off-leash dog running around and crossing residential streets.  I yell back to come get her dog.  By this point, thankfully, Jenny is no longer distracted and we're on our way, Archie goes back across the street to his owner, and all I hear is a half-smiley "You stay in the yard, Archie."

I wish I could say this situation is unique, but it isn't.  Over about a one-month period, in addition to Archie, I had another dog come up to Jenny multiple times with its owner standing right there and refusing to put it on a leash, and another dog completely unattended come up to Jenny and I while walking to work.

Dogs are not perfect; occasionally Jenny will do something wholly office-inappropriate (barking at the furnace repairman with his gun-shaped infrared temperature reader, for example).  However, no one has suggested I leave her at home.
The difference is with aggression here.  If rules are broken and the owner doesn't keep the dog - service dog or not - under control, then that is a seriously dangerous situation for everyone, not just a guide dog team.

Daryl

----- Original Message -----
From: Cindy Ray via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
To: Valerie Gibson <valandkayla at gmail.com>, NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sat, 23 Aug 2014 11:58:03 -0600 (MDT)
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Rules Regarding Pet Dogs was RE: New Jersey Laws regarding guide dogs being attacked

Well, here’s the deal. The workplace should have rules and enforce them. If dogs growl at other dogs, then the next step can be lunging/snapping. You can never worry about whose dog created the problem in the first place; you have to put the situation at an end. Mostly people will tell you their dogs or kids are blameless. Mostly, I figure my dog had something to do with it. Sometimes you do know, but if you want more information, you have to ask a neutral third party. At the end of the day though, you gotta protect that dog and ask questions about who done it later. I sure can’t figure out how dogs can be in the workplace if they are pets. There is such a wide range of behaviors among pets.

Cindy

On Aug 23, 2014, at 11:59 AM, Valerie Gibson via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> I agree with barb here.  You don't know what lexia did.  If it was an anxious dog, sometimes having another dog look at it will make it growl.  I don't like pulling the whole, "you didn't see what happened", but when it comes to aggression be it nervous aggression or territorial or otherwise, you kind of have to because, even for a sighted trainer or handler, body language that is nonverbal is super important and you don't know what body language the other dog was giving off, coupled with what your dog was doing unless you were contiously keeping an eye out.  
> 
> Does that mean that it was okay for the dog to growl? by human standards, I'd say no.  And I agree that if the dog was nervous aggressive, the owner should do the dog a favor and not put the dog in a situation where it feels so nervous.  That being said, your dog is not stupid.  I don't mean to sound mean here, but I doubt she's like, "oh no! (sob) Why is the meanie bully growling at me?"  While the dog may be a bully (in a pack position it can't handle) your dog knows why it growled.  They understand their culture better than we do.  
> You might not have known the owner, but you were obviously close enough to hear the growl. you could have asked if the dog was aggresive (though most owners will lie to you about that), or if that dog was nervous around other dogs.  
> 
> I once had a well known person's guide dog growl and snap at my puppy once when he was about 3 months.  Zion may have just looked at this dog, but what was I going to do? Tell this person that she couldn't bring her guide dog around?  
> 
> It can be flustering when a dog growls at your dog, but staying calm is the only thing you can do.  Get in front of yoru dog and adopt a "this dog is mine. don't you come near it" aditude might tell the other dog that you're in charge.  If you're not comfortable doing that, make sure your dog's focus is on you and ignore the dog. This sends a message to your dog that you're not worried, it shouldn't be either.  
> 
> You also never said what the owner of the dog did once the dog growl.  If the owner did nothing, you could ask that he or she control the dog.  I don't care if you don't know this person. it's no excuse for an owner not to keep an eye and ear to what their dog is doing.  
> 
> Just my thoughts.
> On Aug 23, 2014, at 10:23 AM, Nicole Torcolini via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
>> Okay, maybe I should have given more information. I know what makes dogs
>> growl, thank you very much. I was standing in the lobby with Lexia, minding
>> my own business as was Lexia, when the other person came in with the other
>> dog. I do not think that Lexia did anything to make the other dog growl
>> unless she made eye contact with it. Given that the person was not from my
>> building, I could not just go talk to the person. And, for the record, if
>> the dog was alone, that would also have been grounds for reporting it as it
>> is against the rules to leave a dog alone. And, no, it was not the first
>> time that the dog had been there. And, even if it had been, it would not
>> have been an excuse for the dog growling. If you have a pet dog that you
>> know gets excited to the point of growling at other dogs when you take it
>> new places, then you don't take it a place like work where the primary
>> activity is work, not dog behavior.
>> 
>> Nicole
>> 
>> _____  
>> 
>> From: barbandzoe at comcast.net [mailto:barbandzoe at comcast.net] 
>> Sent: Saturday, August 23, 2014 8:59 AM
>> To: clarebearwest at gmail.com; sofiagallo13 at gmail.com; NAGDU Mailing List, the
>> National Association of Guide Dog Users; Nicole Torcolini
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Rules Regarding Pet Dogs was RE: New Jersey Laws
>> regarding guide dogs being attacked
>> 
>> 
>> I don't know what the two were doing, but if your dog can to close and other
>> felt  a bit nervous  they could growl.  If that dog had a toy or food or
>> something he was chewing on, he might think he has to defend it. He maybe
>> was just telling your dog that , this is my space and my people, so don't
>> bother them. 
>> Just because a dog growls doesn't mean they are mean. 
>> If the dog doesn't go to work everyday like yours, this is very exciting and
>> they don't know quit where they fit in.  
>> Was the owner at the dest? If the dog was by himself he may have been
>> frightened of being alone, and then another dog he doesn't know comes by and
>> he gets nervous .  
>> 
>> Talk to the owner, and if the dogs will be crossing paths, maybe you two
>> should let the dogs meet each other. 
>> Barb
>> 
>> Sent from Xfinity Connect Mobile App
>> 
>> 
>> ------ Original Message ------
>> 
>> From: Nicole Torcolini via nagdu
>> To: sofiagallo13 at gmail.com, 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of
>> Guide Dog Users', clarebearwest at gmail.com
>> Sent: August 22, 2014 at 9:54 PM
>> Subject: [nagdu] Rules Regarding Pet Dogs was RE: New Jersey Laws regarding
>> guide dogs being attacked
>> 
>> Sofia,
>> 
>> Are there any rules about pet dogs? Where I work, people are allowed
>> to bring their pet dogs, but there are certain rules that they are supposed
>> to follow. I do not know how many people read the rules, and, of those, how
>> many follow them, but they can get in trouble for not following them. I had
>> an incident  last Friday where one of the pet dogs growled at Lexia. I
>> reported it, and it was supposedly resolved, but they did not say exactly
>> what was done.
>> 
>> Nicole and sweet Lexia who is wondering why the mean doggy growled at her
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of sofia via nagdu
>> Sent: Friday, August 22, 2014 7:31 PM
>> To: Cindy Ray via nagdu; clarebearwest at gmail.com
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu]New Jersey Laws regarding guide dogs being attacked
>> 
>> Hi!
>> 
>> 
>> Here is the New Jersey law: Dusty's Law. I believe it is one of the most
>> comprehensive in the country and NFB helped pass it.
>> 
>> 
>> I go to college in NJ and people from town love to walk their dogs off leash
>> around my campus and ignore them until they have already done something
>> wrong. Nothing beyond getting us distracted has happened yet, but honestly,
>> it’s a recipe for disaster if people not only walk their dogs off leash but
>> also stop paying attention to what they are doing.
>> 
>> 
>> Sofia
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from Windows Mail
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: Cindy Ray via nagdu
>> Sent: ‎Friday‎, ‎August‎ ‎22‎, ‎2014 ‎10‎:‎21‎ ‎PM
>> To: Cindy Ray via nagdu
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Hi everyone! Tonight I was out on a walk with Quincy and for the third time
>> in a week someone's rot Wiler got loose. But this time the dog charged
>> Quincy and attacked him. The Dragos are knocked my mom over. We called the
>> police and they came out and spoke with us. They also spoke with the dogs
>> owners. We have 30 days to file a complaint. I will definitely do that. I
>> was wondering if New Jersey has any laws regarding service dogs being
>> attacked. The reason the dogs keep getting Moose is because their owner does
>> not fix their fence.  Instead, they just temporarily try to prevent the dogs
>> from escaping. The police told them they must get their fence fixed. So
>> hopefully they will. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. By the way,
>> when she was not injured in anyway. I did call the school to let the
>> director know what has occurred. I am hoping that Quincy will not be
>> skittish around other dogs! I am sure the director will call me on Monday
>> morning. Thank you all for your support and help.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
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>> 
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> 
> 
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