[nagdu] On Ownership

Sat May 3 19:49:24 UTC 2014

Hi Marion,
]
	I don't believe I am, as this information can be used as well as misused.
	Let me take, for example, the man who kicked his dog to death and had a felo0ny charge, I believe. Now he can't remain hidden because of the net, but what if he got sober and took anger management classes and psychotherapy; should those reports be enough?
	If he has done these things, he is probably beating himself up every day for what he did to his dog in a drunken rage.
Darla & Happy Huck


-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Marion Gwizdala
Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2014 6:28 AM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Subject: Re: [nagdu] On Ownership

	I would also assert that a criminal background check should not be the only information used to arrive at a decision. The information gleaned should be used in perspective and other mitigating or aggravating information should be considered. I don't know if I am in favor of background checks of any kind. 

Fraternally yours,
Marion


-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Star Gazer
Sent: Friday, May 02, 2014 8:53 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] On Ownership

I was only suggesting that a criminal background check is not the only check worth doing 

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 2, 2014, at 6:36 PM, Cindy Ray <cindyray at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I’m kind of confused about criminal checks leading to financial ones. Maybe it is because I didn’t read Rebecca’s message?
> 
> Cindy
> 
>> On May 2, 2014, at 3:02 PM, Daryl Marie <crazymusician at shaw.ca> wrote:
>> 
>> But then how far would those financial checks go?  Even though Jenny is my responsibility, I am married to someone who historically has had credit problems.  Would a guide dog school checking in to my financial background also breach his confidentiality and deny me the chance to train with a dog because of it?  Does that seem fair?
>> 
>> Daryl and Jenny (who is a little on edge today)
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Star Gazer <pickrellrebecca at gmail.com>
>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users' 
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Fri, 02 May 2014 13:47:33 -0600 (MDT)
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] On Ownership
>> 
>>    Criminal background checks only "get" people who have found heir 
>> way into the criminal justice system. Many many people commit crimes 
>> and are not caught. And, an arrest means absolutely nothing.
>> I wonder if the schools also do finantial background checks as 
>> finantial stress can make people act in ways they normally wouldn't.
>> Not to say that a person under finantial stress would or wouldn't 
>> abuse a dog, just that criminal background checks aren't the only 
>> background checks in town, and may not give a full picture.
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Julie J.
>> Sent: Friday, May 2, 2014 1:49 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] On Ownership
>> 
>> Do any of the programs do criminal background checks?  What about the 
>> references?  Is a reference letter submitted or are these people 
>> called and asked questions?
>> 
>> I feel that the programs should use whatever means necessary to 
>> assess the suitability of a particular person to have a dog and then 
>> let them have the dog.  If there is some concern that the person 
>> won't properly take care of the dog, then that person shouldn't get one.  Once the person has the dog,
>> it's too late to prevent abuse or neglect.   Ownership or no ownership isn't
>> 
>> going to change the condition of the dog.
>> 
>> The only way that ownership can influence how people act toward their 
>> dog is if it's used as a threat.  If you don't do what we say, then 
>> we'll repossess your dog.  the thing with this approach is that it 
>> only works on folks who would have taken proper care of the dog regardless of the ownership policy.
>> People who do bad things are going to do bad things regardless of the rules.
>> 
>> An ownership policy isn't going to prevent abuse, any more than domestic 
>> abuse laws stop spouses from hitting each other.    People who don't commit 
>> abuse don't do it because of a law, they are non abusers because they 
>> feel it's the right way to act.
>> 
>> I'd really like to know what the actual reason is for the various 
>> schools ownership policies.  I've heard obesity, abuse, better follow 
>> up, being able to place the dog after retirement, better service and 
>> all other manner of nonsense.  It doesn't make any sense to me.  How 
>> does the ownership policy affect the school's ability to provide good 
>> service?  It smells like an excuse to me.
>> 
>> It would be interesting to see solid statistics comparing things like 
>> obesity rates, abuse, time between a follow up request and the 
>> provision of service and overall success rates between programs that 
>> retain ownership and those that don't.  My hunch is that there is no 
>> correlation between ownership and these items.  I think the better 
>> indicator is the quality of the applicant screening process, and the 
>> quality of the training at the program
>> 
>> Julie
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/pickrellrebecca%40
>> gmail.c
>> om
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/crazymusician%40sh
>> aw.ca
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cindyray%40gmail.c
>> om
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nagdu mailing list
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/pickrellrebecca%40g
> mail.com

_______________________________________________
nagdu mailing list
nagdu at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.net


_______________________________________________
nagdu mailing list
nagdu at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/djrogers0628%40gmail.com