[nagdu] Why I decided not to owner train.

Tue Sep 23 04:53:12 UTC 2014

Raven, yes, you are correct. Some people mind the annual health checks and
field rep visits, but I don't. As I said, I would if things did not go as
well. I would also mind if it was more intrusive, such as dropping by with
only a five minute notice.
	As for bad behavior from being in the kennel, Lexia luckily did not
have too much of that. The one thing that she did have we nipped in the bud,
and she was rid of it before even leaving the training center. As for food
refusal, the trainers offered our dogs food from their hands several times
during training. They also would lay kibble on the ground. One day, one of
the trainers cracked up for apparently no reason. When I asked what was
going on, the trainer told me that Lexia was literally weaving around the
kibble on the ground as though it was a mind field. She does not shred
things. During training, we were required to leave our dogs in our rooms for
a few of the lectures. We were also given instructions on how to get our
dogs used to being alone, such as starting with shorter times and leaving a
radio or something on. Lexia luckily never really had any separation
anxiety. She is always happy to see me when we have been separated, but
whose dog is not?

Nicole and Lexia

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Raven Tolliver
via nagdu
Sent: Monday, September 22, 2014 2:27 AM
To: Danielle Antoine; NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide
Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Why I decided not to owner train.

I agree with all that has been said here.
As excited as attending GEB was, I personally would like to avoid attending
a program for my next dog. Whether I owner train or have my successor dog
privately trained will just depend on where I am in life when I retire my
dog years ahead. I didn't have a bad experience, just an incredibly
stressful one, which is a given no matter your training situation.
But I am greatly disturbed by the number of sick or sensitive dogs cropping
up, and I would like to avoid dealing with it the next go-round. Between
sensitive tummies, bowel diseases, skin and ear allergies/infections, and
dogs seemingly going downhill around 5 or 6, I don't find any of it normal
or acceptable.
I would love to work with a naturally-reared canine. I have even secured 2
natural-rearing golden retriever breeders nearby. They sell their dogs for
very affordable prices, and they said they would freeze the price, so that
if I still want one of their dogs for guide training in the future, they
will give me the dog for the current going price. Got it in writing, of
course!
I also want my next dog to avoid the kennel environment and be trained
without positive punishment, and I would like to have more input in the
things my dog is trained to do. The first 3 months of having my dog was a
crash course in reversing some of the effects of being a kennel dog, and
also training my dog to do things he wasn't taught.
Don't beg; don't scavenge; don't shred stuff; don't go in the garbage; don't
take food from people; find the chair, find the trash can, find the counter;
Stay put for 5 minutes, 10 minutes, 20 minutes, and so on. Don't disobey the
stay, even in the face of distraction, and being by yourself isn't so
horrible. And on and on. He picked up on all of it very quickly,
fortunately.
Programs seem to be all for shortening the formal guide training periods
anyway, so I fear we're all going to be training our own dogs soon. From 6
months, to 4 months, to 2 months, where does it stop?
I am also disturbed by the age at which schools are turning dogs out.
As someone who has trained dogs, though it was for a short 15 months, I see
the night-and-day difference between working with an adolescent and working
with an adult, and the stress it puts on a dog when people expect more out
of them than what they are capable of. Fortunately, I attended a program
that doesn't adhere to this trend.
About the Big Brother thing, I think Nicole was saying that some people,
herself not included, consider the annual health/work report and visits from
field reps are Big Brother-esque. Yeah, I get it. GEB would appreciate it if
grads completed their health and work reports, and even give an incentive,
but I personally opt out. If people wanna schedule a visit, whatever.
I think more owner trainers and even private trainers are cropping up
because people are realizing that there is an alternative. Everyone can't or
doesn't want to attend a guide dog program for a number of reasons. So if
you can't, train your own, or hire someone to do it.
And I don't encourage anyone for settling less than what they want. If you
want it badly enough, you will go after it and make it happen. And that is
what I see in the people who decide to go through the painstaking process of
securing and training their own dogs.

On 9/21/14, Danielle Antoine via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Right on the money Vivianna. I totally agree!
>
>
> On 9/21/14, debby phillips via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Nicole, with Seeing Eye, from the time I finish my training I own my 
>> dog.  I don't have to report to the school until I'm ready for my 
>> next dog if I don't want to.  Sometimes, or so it used to be, that if 
>> an instructor was in your area they might call and ask if you'd like 
>> a visit.  Even that doesn't happen anymore.  If the school gets a 
>> call about abuse, they will then check with the graduate, explaining 
>> that they received a call, and asking if they might be of assistance.  
>> If there is abuse, Seeing Eye refers the matter to Animal Control, or 
>> whoever the authority is in the city or county where the graduate 
>> lives.  One of the reasons I chose not to go to GDB in the first 
>> place was I didn't want the annual report and yearly follow up.  I 
>> want to call my school when I need their help, not when they think I 
>> should.  But that's personal preference.  So if you feel like that's 
>> "Big Brother" then perhaps you need to consider whether that's where 
>> want to get your dogs.  I wouldn't go to a school that I didn't like, 
>> or agree with, mostly.  It's too important a decision, because I 
>> would be receiving a dog that might be with me for the
>> next ten years.    Peace,    Debby and Neena
>>
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--
Raven
"if God didn't make it, don't eat it." - John B. Symes, D.V.M.
http://dogtorj.com

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