[nagdu] Guides at NFB training centers
David Andrews
dandrews at visi.com
Sun Aug 30 19:04:00 UTC 2015
The Centers have developed ways of teaching what
they think is necessary, and some of those ways
involve the use of the long white cane. So if you
go there, you are agreeing to their way of doing
things. They don't make you go there, they are
not descriminating against you, you have gone there to take what they offer.
You wouldn't sign up for a class in how to cook
steak, and go to it and say you were a vegetarian, and couldn't cook steak!
Dave
At 09:47 AM 8/30/2015, you wrote:
>I think Dan brings up a good point. Students at
>training centers are told when and where they
>can bring and work their dogs. The centers give
>a reason for such policies, but they are still
>restricting the right of the guide dog user to
>work his/her dog where and when he/she chooses.
>Maybe it is for the benefit of the student and
>maybe not; as you can see from this thread, not
>everyone agrees whether this practice is
>detrimental or beneficial. If the same was being
>done by a different organization, it would be
>considered discrimination by many people. There
>is a difference between a student choosing to
>leave her dog while practiceingcane travel and
>the centers telling her she has no choice but to
>leave herdog in my opinion. IIf I was told to
>leave my dog on tie down in an office because a
>student in a class had a fear of dogs or a
>professor didn not want a dog in a a chemistry
>lab due to safety concerns, it would be
>discrimination. Is this same policy acceptable
>in training centers because leaving the dog
>accomplishes the greater good of learning cane
>travel, because it is assumed that center staff
>know best, or something I am not thinking of? I
>am truly curious. I am sure others view the
>situation differently, but this is how I see
>it. I do think it is important to learn cane
>travel, but not at the cost of having someone
>(most likely who does not truly understand how a
>guide dog functions) interfering with the
>working relationship of a guide dog team.
>Danielle and Thai Sent from my iPhone > On Aug
>30, 2015, at 10:14 AM, Darian Smith via nagdu
><nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote: > > Dan, > I am a
>little confused as to whether or not you are
>seeking knowledge in something you currently
>lack, or stating a fact based upon
>what you’ve found to be true. > If the former
>than I will share what I know to be true with
>you. > Our training centers never ask a student
>to leave their guide in their apartment all
>day. > An individual with a dog guide would
>work their dog from the apartments to the
>center and while in classes the dog would
>stay on tie down in the office of an instructor
>or staff person. That person is in the room
>doing their job but isn’t interacting with
>your dog. You would go from one class to
>another doing the same types of classwork as
>your peers in the program including using a
>cane traveling between your classes and of
>course using your cane during cane travel class
>(orientation and mobility). > You of course
>would visit with your dog between breaks in
>class and at lunch and then pick them back up at
>the end of the day. > there are times where you
>might work on guide dog related travel stuff
>with your dog, but this will not be something
>that you would spend the majority of your time
>doing. > I hope this helps >> On Aug 30,
>2015, at 6:16 AM, Dan Weiner via nagdu
><nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote: >> >> So what happens
>tat the vaunted centers, you leave your dog
>behind in your >> appartment all day or what is
>it, I think it's a travesty but then again
>I'm >> not going to one any time soon so I'll
>leave it up to those going there as >> to the
>level of ttolerance for what I think is an
>incorrect policy. >> Anyway, my opinions asside,
>what is the dog guide policy of the
>Centers? >> >> Cordially, >> Dan W. >> >> >>
>-----Original Message----- >> From: nagdu
>[mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org
><mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org>] On Behalf Of
>Ashley Coleman >> via nagdu >> Sent: Saturday,
>August 29, 2015 8:11 PM >> To: NAGDU Mailing
>List,the National Association of Guide Dog
>Users >> Cc: Ashley Coleman >> Subject: Re:
>[nagdu] Guides at NFB training centers >> >> Hi,
>I know that these centers do a great job in
>regards to teaching. Please >> make sure that
>your dog get as much exercise as normal. Also,
>live a radio >> or TV on so that your dog has
>something calming to listen to. Check with >>
>your trainers to find out when they would like
>you to use a cane. Honestly, >> I would rather
>work with my dog than a cane. I would have a
>difficult time >> leaving Landon behind in my
>room all day. JMO. >> >> Ashley
>Coleman, >> >> >> >>>> On Aug 29, 2015, at
>19:07, Aleeha Dudley via nagdu
><nagdu at nfbnet.org> >>> wrote: >>> >>> Hello
>all, >>> I will be attending the Louisiana
>center for the blind in September. I >> know
>what their policy on dogs is, but I would like
>to hear from those who >> have attended centers
>with your dogs. How was it? What can I do to
>reduce >> the stress on my dog from being left
>all day? >>> Thanks. >>> Aleeha >>> >>> Sent
>from my iPhone >>>
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> >> >> >>
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> >>> = >> >>> Papa is right, BJJ was known as
>Gracie Jiu Jitsu when it was first >>>
>introduced to America, but as others started
>teaching and opening >>> their own academies it
>became known as Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. As a >>>
>woman, I would have to disagree with the claim
>that it's not effective >>> as self defense,
>primarily because many of the positions that we
>learn >>> to defend are those where we we would
>find ourselves during a sexual >>> assault. SERE
>and a large portion of Special Forces training
>involves >>> BJJ and a lot of them use the
>Gracie Combatives technique. One of my >>> good
>friends recently went through a test for a local
>police >>> department where he had to enter a
>house with 4 assailants, pretend of >>> course,
>and his job was to subdo them as best as he
>could. They >>> stopped the test after he put
>the first guy to sleep using a choke and >>>
>dislocated another's shoulder. I don't know
>about the Army Ranger, but >>> I have several
>UFC fighters on my team, and they all have won
>using >>> one art or another, be it BJJ,
>striking, or whatever. If you are >>> stepping
>into the octogon, it's best to have training
>both standing >>> and on the ground. >>>
>= >> >>>> On 8/30/15, Poppa Bear via
>Sportsandrec <sportsandrec at nfbnet.org
><mailto:sportsandrec at nfbnet.org>> wrote: >>>>
>Not a problem Cara, take care. >>>> = >> >>>>
>-----Original Message----- >>>> From:
>Sportsandrec
>[mailto:sportsandrec-bounces at nfbnet.org
><mailto:sportsandrec-bounces at nfbnet.org>] On
>Behalf Of >>>> Carly Mihalakis via
>Sportsandrec >>>> Sent: Saturday, August 29,
>2015 11:23 PM >>>> To: Sports and Recreation for
>the Blind Discussion List >>>> Cc: Carly
>Mihalakis >>>> Subject: Re: [Sportsandrec]
>Greetings >>>> = >> >>>> Evening, Poppa, >>>>
>= >> >>>> Thank you for that explanation! >>>>
>CarAt 12:06 AM 8/30/2015, you wrote: >>>>>
>Brazilian Jujitzu is an off shoot of a martial
>art made very famous by >>>>> the Gracey family
>who were originally from Brazil and
>adapted >>>>> traditional jujitsu to their own
>style. In the early days of MMA/UFC >>>>> the
>Gracie family were pretty much unstoppable and
>as their popularity >>>>> spread they and their
>students established dojoes throughout the US
>as >>>>> well as other countries. Brazilian
>Jujitsu also known as BJJ on most >>>>> message
>boards and in most training gyms is now a day's
>considered to >>>>> mainly be a ground game
>geared towards the octagon or MMA/UFC style
>of >>>>> fighting. The training is big on locks,
>pens and many grappling >>>>> techniques with
>some striking. Sometimes opponents will start on
>their >>>>> knees or even back to back. There is
>a blindBJJ practitioner who has >>>>> even one
>some pro MMA matches. As far as a self defense
>martial art >>>>> sport, many argue that it is
>the least geared towards self defense, but >>>>>
>at the same time, I think that when it comes
>down to a student who >>>>> knows BJJ versus a
>person who has no formal martial art training,
>the >>>>> odds are in the trained persons favor.
>I have a client who is an Army >>>>> Ranger
>graduate and he went to the local BJJ gym for a
>while and when >>>>> it came to the octagon he
>said that he got his butt kicked. As a >>>>>
>Ranger, I doubt that the BJJ students would be
>as successful in a >>>>> street fight though,
>but you never know. Also, depending on the gym
>the >>>>> physical training can be very intense
>and extremely competitive. The >>>>> Graceies
>were a rough and tumble family and they were
>also surfers in >>>>> Brazil. As with many
>surfers there is a kind of brotherhood, lingo
>and >>>>> even dress code and a lot of the time
>it translates into BJJ. Even when >>>>> it comes
>to the BJJ clothing and gear it is more
>fashionable, bad >>>>> boyish and more spendier
>than other martial arts. I know that I
>wasn't >>>>> asked the question, but as on most
>boards the allowance is given to >>>>> answer a
>little out of order, I hope I didn't cause any
>offence. >>>>> -----Original Message----- From:
>Sportsandrec >>>>>
>[mailto:sportsandrec-bounces at nfbnet.org
><mailto:sportsandrec-bounces at nfbnet.org>] On
>Behalf Of Carly Mihalakis >>>>> via Sportsandrec
>Sent: >>>>> Saturday, August 29, 2015 10:38 PM
>To: Sports and Recreation for the >>>>> Blind
>Discussion List Cc: >>>>> Carly Mihalakis
>Subject: Re: [Sportsandrec] Greetings Evening,
>Marana, >>>>> What does Brazilian Jiu Jitsu look
>like? What identifies that this >>>>> martial
>art derives from Brazil?, At 03:33 PM 8/26/2015,
>you wrote: >>>>>> Hello and Welcome. What type
>of martial arts do >you do? I'm in >>>>>
>California and train Brazilian >Jiu Jitsu, which
>is the best thing I've >>>>> ever >done in my
>life. >>>>> Looking forward to having
>you >along. On 8/26/15, Audrey Farnum via >>>>>>
>Sportsandrec <sportsandrec at nfbnet.org
><mailto:sportsandrec at nfbnet.org>> wrote: > >Hi
>Little Dove. > > >>>>> Welcome to the list.
>I=C3=A2=80=99m a >rower from Oklahomaoma City.
>Jus= >> t wanted >>>>> to let >you > know that
>we have an Oklahoma Sports and >Rec
>Division. >>>>> You hopefully saw the >
>notice >somewhere, but in case you missed
>it, >>>>> we are >having a meeting tonight > by
>Conference call. >The toll free >>>>> number is
>1-877-394-5901 and the >access > code is
>9610225. We=C3=A2=80= >> =99re >>>>> starting
>at >7:30. It will probabbably be a small group >
>since >>>>>> we=C3=A2=80=99re still getting ng
>off the ground, but we=C3=A2=80=99d = >>> love
>for you to >>>>> get > i> involved. Call in
>tonight >if you can. >>>>> Hope to talk to
>you! > > >Regards. > > Audrey T. >>>>> Farnum >
>www.nfbok.org <http://www.nfbok.org/> >> >On Aug
>26, 2015, at >>>>> 3:59 PM, LittleDove Cole
>via >Sportsandrec >> <sportsandrec at nfbnet.org
><mailto:sportsandrec at nfbnet.org>> >>>>>>
>wrote: >> >> Hi. I just wanted to write in
>and >say hello. I have just >>>>> joined the >>
>mailing >> >list and i cannot wait to meet u
>all. Im from >>>>>> oklahoma and i do martial >>
>arts. I am really >excited to hear about >>>>>
>everyone elses sport >passions and >> meet others who r blind. >> >>
David Andrews and long white cane Harry.
E-Mail: dandrews at visi.com or david.andrews at nfbnet.org
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