[nagdu] People with sight getting guide dogs: was Reasons for choosing a particular guy dog school

Wed Mar 25 14:26:55 UTC 2015

Sandra, I understand your frustration.  However, many of those people
who are receiving dogs have retinitis pigmentosa.  Yes, they see very
well in the little pinhole of vision they have so may read items on
shelves but take out an entire display of something because they
didn't see it.  Every time I have received a dog there have been
people with some useable vision.  If that dog is helpful I will not
judge.  I have also seen totally blind people get a dog and all they
wanted was a dog they could take with them because they didn't use the
dog for independent travel.  I try to understand the needs of the
individual rather than judge whether they should have a dog or not.

I can understand that you are frustrated because you wait to get a dog
while other people get one.  Have you tried working with your school
to prioritize who should get a dog?

On 3/25/15, S L Johnson via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Dona and all:
>
> I just had to respond to this.  I remember well the mid 70s and the argument
>
> of partially sighted people getting guide dogs.  As a total, I am adamantly
>
> apposed to people with sight having guide dogs.  I remember having to be on
>
> a waiting list while sighted people were given dogs before those of us with
>
> no sight.  I've had classes where some people had so much sight they would
> make comments on what my dog was doing from a long distance away.  On
> classes at GDF I found students who were reading the signs on buildings as
> we drove down the road.  To me, someone with that much sight doesn't need a
>
> dog.  I was next to a partial when we were relieving the dogs and she
> laughed at my attempts to clean up after a dog who tended to move around as
>
> she relieved herself, making my cleaning up extremely difficult.  I got so
> mad that I told her since she could see so well, then she could pick it up
> for me.  I remember when I got Tara from GDF and we were in the mall.  A
> trainer got upset when I and another total got lost.  Another trainer said
> well, if These two had as much sight as the rest of them, then maybe they
> wouldn't have gotten lost.   Those sighted students were able to read all
> the signs and see to find their way back to the food court.  I once lived in
>
> an area where there was a high partial with a guide dog.  I would go into
> the store and asked for someone to help me find what I wanted.  The manager
>
> asked why my dog was too stupid to help me.  He said this other customer
> with her dog never needed help.  I later found out she was just on the
> border of legal blindness and could see to read everything on the shelves.
> I was legally blind once and even if I'd been old enough, I never would have
>
> considered a dog until I lost all my sight.  I will agree, some people have
>
> so little vision that it doesn't help them so, a dog is very helpful but,
> for others, it is a waste of a well trained dog that should go to someone
> who really needs it.  I have heard this same thing from many trainers.  They
>
> hate to see their dogs go to a high partial who only wants a well trained
> pet they can take everywhere.  I know this will make a lot of you angry but,
>
> I'm sick and tired of partially sighted people pretending they are really
> blind.
>
> Sandra and Eva
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Applebutter Hill via nagdu
> Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2015 5:26 PM
> To: 'Tara Briggs' ; 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide
> Dog Users'
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Reasons for choosing a particular guy dog school
>
> Tara,
> I went to GDF in '71, because an instructor came to the college I was
> attending and asked the Dean of Women if anyone on campus might benefit
> from
> their services. I was in denial about how blind I was, so I talked to him
> politely, took the application and had a rant about the indignaty of it all
> with my friends.
>
> My friends weren't as mortified that anyone would consider me a candidate
> for a guide dog. I moved forward because one reminded me that I liked dogs
> and held out the carrot that if it didn't work as a guide dog I would still
> have a dog.
>
> When I told my rehab counsellor I was going, he wrote and called the school
> repeatedly telling them why I should not be given a dog. I had some vision
> in the daytime; I was a "girl" and "girls" shouldn't go out at night
> anyway;
> Seeing Eye and Leader Dog would never have approved a "partial" for
> training, and so on.
>
> The last call came while I was already on class and I was called into the
> Director of Trainings office, where I was sure I was going to hear that
> they
> had decided to send me home. John Byfield  simply assured me that he had
> told my counsellor that the school was committed to training me and didn't
> agree with his assessment of my needs. I was one of the first students who
> was not totally blind, and there was a lot all of us had to learn about
> training a person with some usable sight to use a guide dog, and in those
> days, no other school was training people with some sight. One of the GDF
> grads wrote a book about her GDF guide Brandy. The grad had been an art
> teacher, and Seeing Eye refused to take her because she didn't have a job.
> GDF didn't look at things the same way as other schools.
>
> GDF's John Biegel  pioneered the use of the offset handle, and by the time
> I
> got my second dog in '83, it was standard equipment. It was a huge
> improvement and IMO shortened the adjustment time for my second dog. I take
> it for granted now.
>
> I can't remember when they switched to offering ownership, but I do "own"
> Hunter now. It was never much of an issue to me, because they always had my
> back.
>
> GDF has changed much over the years - great advances in the physical
> facility, great puppy program, and on the other hand too much management.
> But, so far, despite my protestations about this or that, they have not
> given me any reason why I should jump ship.
> Donna & Hunter
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tara Briggs via
> nagdu
> Sent: Friday, March 20, 2015 1:33 PM
> To: the National Association of Guide Dog Users NAGDU Mailing List
> Subject: [nagdu] Reasons for choosing a particular guy dog school
>
> Hi all:
> I thought it would be interesting to find out why people chose to go to the
> various guy Doug schools? If you train your own dog, what factors
> contributed towards this decision? I'll start by answering my own question,
> I went to the Seeing Eye because I like their ownership policy. I had also
> attended a couple of their free breakfast at national conventions and
> thought the people seemed really nice. I'm looking forward to everyone's
> replies!
> Tara Briggs
>
> Sent from my iPhone
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-- 
Marianne Denning, TVI, MA
Teacher of students who are blind or visually impaired
(513) 607-6053