[NAGDU] Obedience and "down"

[Julie Johnson]

Is this dog a GSD, or perhaps a Doberman?  I'm  guessing by what you are 
sharing that he is a high drive dog, with a lot of initiative, and self 
confidence    If I'm write, then I think the problem is that he needs a 
reason for your commands to make sense.  Sit for the sake of sitting 
probably doesn't make any sense to him, no need for it, so why do it.

My Doberman is like this.  I don't do long sessions of rote obedience.  It 
works better if I work it into our daily routine...I'm making the bed, she's 
practicing down stay.  I'm cooking, she's in the dining room in a stay.  I'm 
brushing the other dog, she's sitting...or whatever.  If I give her 
obedience commands mixed in with our daily routine, then she's agreeable. 
If I tried to do one long marathon session, she'd mutiny about 3 minutes in.

I look at it like this, I can work against her nature or I can work with 
her.  She's a very smart dog.  She doesn't need all the practice at 
obedience to be good at it.  Obedience practice is purely for her to keep in 
the habit of listening to me.  If she listens and respects me, then I'm good 
with it.  If that means obedience gets sprinkled in throughout the day for 
her to feel like she's doing something useful and for it to make sense to 
her, then that's okay with me.

Also increasing the intensity of corrections probably isn't going to help. 
I think upping the corrections is likely to lead down the path of physical 
power struggle.  That is not a good place to be.  You don't want the sole 
reason for your dog to behave to land squarely on how hard you can correct 
if he doesn't comply.  The first time you need him to do something when he's 
off leash and he realizes you can't correct, you have lost.  His compliance 
of your commands needs to be reliant on his respect and admiration of you. 
Corrections may be a part of that, but it's a mistake to rely solely on 
them.  It's also a mistake to rely solely on food.  They are both extremes.

What is your reasoning behind wanting a perfectly aligned sit or down? 
There are ways to improve these behaviors, but for me I only have so much 
time and energy in a day.  I put my effort where it is going to have the 
highest pay off.  Personally I don't care if my dogs lie in the library lion 
position, on their side, or whatever else way they choose. What I want is 
for them to be out of the way, in the same place, until I release them.

So maybe the long and short of all of this is to ask yourself why am I doing 
obedience with my dog?   Then  is what I'm doing getting the results I want? 
And finally is there a better way of getting what I want, while working with 
my dog instead of against him?

Julie
On The Go with Guide-and-Service-Dogs.com
http://www.guide-and-service-dogs.com
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-----Original Message----- 
From: Andy B. via NAGDU
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 10:37 AM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Cc: Andy B.
Subject: [NAGDU] Obedience and "down"

Hi,



I am having a slight issue with the down command, especially in daily
obedience. It appears that he gets bored with the idea, then does nothing to
respond. Usually a light to moderate leash correction fixes the problem for
that instance of the down command. However, subsequent ones require harsher
corrections, or giving him a break for a while. We can usually get through
4-5 exercise routines before he gets bored with it. Here is what I normally
do each day:

Heal-come-set 3 times, sit-down 4 times, 3 sets of rest, sit-down 4 more
times (he gets bored here), heal-come-sit 3 times, then sit-down a few more
times, and wrap it up with a few rests or sit-downs. What is the best way to
get him interested in doing this again? A high collar correction was
recommended for every instance of disobedience, and for extra measure of
discipline, give him a high collar even if he does what is required, but my
mind still thinks it is a little harsh. How do you get over this problem? He
also falls out of perfect form. Is there a way I can enforce good obedience
form? For example, when he sits, most of the time he sits facing me and
slightly to the left of my left shoulder. When he lays down, he sticks his
butt out so his head is pointed at me, and lays on his left side so he can
look at me. He should be on the left at all times, not in these weird
positions.



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