[NAGDU] PigeonsRE: Escalators, and how different schools handle them?
S L Johnson
SLJohnson25 at comcast.net
Wed Jul 19 18:39:57 UTC 2017
Jenine:
Poor Mike, the abuse he took from his students. When I was doing wheelchair
training with him, I drove over his foot. It is a good thing he was wearing
heavy boots so I really did not do serious damage. I bet he never took
another escalator with you. I was never able to pick up the dog by the back
strap of the harness. I think it would be hard for a lot of women
especially with the heavier dogs. Having to bend over would also cause me
to lose my balance too.
Little golden retrievers do love anything that is flying around. Just ask
Tara and Eva how many times they got distracted by the ducks and geese from
the pond behind my house. Many tenants feed them so they just wander
around our housing complex. Both the golden girls had their share of duck
and geese distractions before they learned to ignore them.
I do have a funny pigeon story. When I was in college I was walking to
church one morning and my golden grabbed a pigeon in his mouth. I sure had
a struggle to get Hogan to drop his prize. I ended up being late for the
pre-service rehearsal. The director laughed when I told him what caused the
delay and said that Hogan just wanted to bring an offering to church. These
dogs can sure get into trouble sometimes.
Sandra and Eva the golden duck hunter
-----Original Message-----
From: Tracy Carcione via NAGDU
Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2017 11:43 AM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Cc: Tracy Carcione
Subject: [NAGDU] PigeonsRE: Escalators, and how different schools handle
them?
> pigeons are evil little sky rats placed on earth to get adorable little
> Goldens in big big trouble.
ROFL! Thanks Jeanine! Those are both great stories.
Tracy
-----Original Message-----
From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jenine Stanley
via NAGDU
Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2017 5:38 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Cc: Jenine Stanley
Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Escalators, and how different schools handle them?
OK, Iâ?Tll weigh in on this one. I was taught a couple different methods at
GDF but I like the one I was initially taught. Of course since my first 2
dogs came from Pilot, I learned their old method of simply walking on and
off. Back then we worked the dogs on and off.
At GDF we were taught much like what Danielle described. You approach, using
your right hand and foot to explore, then step on with the dog slightly
behind your left leg so it can jump on. When you feel the hand rail flatten
out, give slack in the leash and let the dog jump off.
I was the person Buddy was referring to regarding the GDF method of picking
the dog up. Mike Sergeant used to teach this, until he had the unfortunate
luck to be the instructor working with me and my Lab/Poodle cross. He was
trying to show me how to pick her up by the backstrap so her front feet
cleared the comb thing. I told him before starting this that Iâ?Td lose my
balance and that I have really crappy upper body strength for this kind of
maneuver. Sure enough, Heâ?Ts standing slightly behind my dog, I grab her
backstrap and try to lift, she pulls forward in this sort of pieruette move
and i lose my balance. I shove my butt against the side of the escalator,
which is still moving and hit him first with my left elbow and then with my
right fist as I try to stop myself from spinning around and landing backward
on my butt at the end of the escalator. I was also laughing so hard I could
hardly stand it as Iâ?Td hit him in. Well, an area no one should be hit in.
He let me off the hook and another instructor worked with us the old school
way. Everyone was happier.
On my last class we were doing the subway. At the end of the one subway
route in Queens thereâ?Ts a long escalator to the street. As we got to the
top, my instructor, from a couple steps behind us uttered a loud expletive.
OK, nothing new in NYC, especially Queens, but what the heck?
At the top of the escalator was a pizza box and about 100 pigeons. Roger
loves pigeons. Letâ?Ts just say he flew off that escalator. Luckily the
instructor and I were ready. We walked back and forth by the pizza box and
pigeons, who didnâ?Tt even move, for about 5 minutes until Roger understood
that pigeons are evil little sky rats placed on earth to get adorable little
Goldens in big big trouble.
Jenine Stanley
Sent from... My Other Dimension
> On Jul 18, 2017, at 4:21 PM, S L Johnson via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
>
> Hello:
>
> In 1994 I had a dog seriously injure her right back paw when she got
> it caught in a broken part of one of the treads on an escalator. The
> horror fear and screams she and I let out will never leave my mind.
> The vet did his best to reconstruct the shredded pads of her paw but
> she never could put all her weight on it. That horrible day was her
> last day to be a guide dog and she was only 7 years old. I never
> would have taken her on that escalator but I had no way of knowing
> that it had not been properly maintained. That is something that as a
> blind person we will never know until the unthinkable happens. I
> will always take the stairs or find an elevator. I do understand that
> sometimes an elevator is way off in a corner but it is a much safer
> option. Many people were critical at the conventions when I would not
> take my dog on the escalators but I want to keep them safe.
> When I got Eva from Pilot they asked if I wanted to use them and I
> said never so they did not have me do it on class. However, I do know
> that it was part of Eva's training. If I was ever faced with the
> situation of escalator or not getting up or down to where I needed to
> go, I would pick Eva up. fortunately for me she is only 55 pounds not
> one of the larger dogs. I have not put any of my dogs on an escalator
> since that horrible day. A year later I was with friends and we
> parked in a parking garage at a market where the only way down was an
> escalator. I was so nervous that I picked up my new guide dog and
> carried her down the escalator. Someone mentioned putting booties on
> the dogs paws but I would think that would be dangerous because the
> bootie could get caught and the paw injured too. All the booties I
> have seen are a bit big and sloppy on the dogs paws. The bottom line
> is to keep the dog as safe as possible and everyone has to make the
> decision for themselves as to whether or not to take the risks of using
> escalators.
>
> Sandra and Eva
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Buddy Brannan via NAGDU
> Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2017 2:12 PM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Cc: Buddy Brannan
> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Escalators, and how different schools handle them?
>
> Hi,
>
> My understanding is that GDF doesn't teach the picking your dog up by
> the backstrap thing anymore. (I think that an instructor may have had
> an uncomfortable reminder of wy that's maybe not the best idea ever,
> but I'm not sure. ...)
>
> --
> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
> Mobile (preferred): (814) 431-0962
> Phone: (814) 860-3194
> Email: buddy at brannan.name
>
>
>
>> On Jul 18, 2017, at 12:04 PM, Heather Bird via NAGDU
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> David, you mentioned picking up your dog by the chest strap. I have
>> heard that some schools teach you to pick the dog up at the end, but
>> I have never seen it done. None of the schools I have attended
>> teaches it that way, or at least they did not at the time I attended
>> their training programs. Could you refresh my memory as to which
>> school Clair Rose is from? Also, what exactly is the procedure that
>> you were taught? I've been taught to work the dog up to the
>> escalator, where they will stop at the near side of the plate. Then
>> you touch the hand rail and verify that the escalator is running away
>> from and not towards you, and to confirm the slope, up or down of the
>> steps.
>> Then, you drop the harness handle and make a very short leash,
>> pulling your dog up pretty close to you. Then you heal your dog
>> across the metal plate, stopping right at the far edge. Then you give
>> your dog the command to heal or to come with you. I use "let's go."
>> Then you step quickly and decisively onto the moving steps, bringing
>> your dog along with you to make sure that they move briskly and
>> smoothly over the gap from where the stairs issue.
>> Then you stand beside your dog, and very slightly ahead of them, with
>> their leash wrapped around your arm to keep them from moving ahead of
>> you or dropping back behind you. You ride with your right arm
>> extended out far in front of you and your hand on the right hand rail
>> so that you will know right away when the slope starts to level out,
>> indicating that you are approaching the end of the escalator. When
>> you are getting close you remind your dog to stay, in my case, "rest"
>> then when you judge that you are about one or two steps from the gap,
>> you tell your dog "break" and give them the full length, all the
>> slack, of the short configuration of the working leash.
>> Your dog will leap off the end, with a small jump over the gap, but
>> not one so big as to pull the handler off balance. You pick up your
>> toes and step across the gap at about the same time that your dog is
>> jumping off. You move along with your dog forward and off of the
>> metal plate, then pick up the harness handle and continue on. This
>> was pretty much the same procedure I was taught at GEB, Fidelco and
>> the Seeing Eye. I do not know if GEB or Fidelco have changed since I
>> was working with them, but I just did escalators last summer at TSE
>> and what I currently do is in line with what they are teaching most
>> or all of their students at this time. I have heard that some schools
>> absolutely refuse to teach their teams to do escalators, and I
>> understand that some schools teach it, but use different methods.
>> So,
>> I am interested in the methods that are being used by other programs.
>> I believe that extremes are foolish in most cases. Absolutely
>> outright forbidding grads to use escalators, ever, under any
>> circumstances and never exposing the dogs to them, seems to me very
>> negligent. On the complete opposite end of the continuum would be the
>> completely lax attitude of a program that would give little or no
>> guidance for handling escalators, assuming them to be safe and having
>> no dedicated commands or specialized procedures for teams to
>> negotiate escalators. So, a school teaching them, but doing so with
>> prudent caution seems to be the most sensible and also seems to be
>> how the majority of schools are doing it these days. I've always
>> taken my dogs on escalators and I will always continue to do so, but
>> I will also always maintain a healthy respect for them and treat them
>> with caution.
>> For instance, at convention, I used the escalators rather than the
>> stairs for almost every single instance of floor changes that we did,
>> because Ilsa absolutely adores escalators and loves finding them for
>> me, and asking her to locate them was a great way to quickly get from
>> the main hotel to the main convention area or from the far flung
>> meeting rooms to the transition from the convention space to the
>> entertainment and sleeping room portion of the hotel. However, when I
>> was helping a wheelchair user who could stand and walk a little bit,
>> I put Ilsa's leash around a railing, far from the escalator, so that
>> she could not try to follow me, and I helped the friend to stand on
>> the escalator and ride down. Then I folded the wheelchair and carried
>> it down as I rode the escalator. Then I ran up the stairs, collected
>> Ilsa and then road down with her. I could have physically carried the
>> chair down while riding with Ilsa, but I would not have had
>> appropriate control over her to help to ensure her safety, so I
>> worked her and carried the chair separately and it worked just fine.
>> Last comment, it is not generally advisable to work your dogs on the
>> moving sidewalks, but I think it is important to know how they work
>> just in case of emergencies. I was once working through an airport
>> with an individual who knew very little English.
>> We were in a hurry to catch our plane and they wanted to take me to
>> an elevator at one point, which was about ten minutes of walking out
>> of our way. I told them that my dog could do escalators and that I
>> did not have time to go and take an elevator. We did the escalator
>> fine, then we encountered what the man referred to as an escalator.
>> It sounded like an escalator. I didn't feel a hand rail, but I
>> thought that perhaps it was very wide to accommodate people with
>> suitcases, so I stepped on. I realized right away that it was a
>> moving sidewalk. I immediately asked English speaking passengers
>> along with me on the sidewalk questions about how long it was and how
>> close we were to the end. I made Frieda stand and stay using the rest
>> command and I moved quite a ways ahead of her. I pointed my toes
>> slightly up so that they would clear the gap and warn me so that I
>> could step off. The audible warning that the walkway was ending was a
>> good ten seconds before you actually reached the end so it was not a
>> good marker of the end of the moving belt we were standing on. I
>> timed it such that as I was exiting I gave Frieda the command to jump
>> off, and she did so, and it worked just fine. I would not recommend
>> intentionally taking these moving sidewalks with a guide dog, but my
>> knowledge of how they worked from riding them with a cane and my
>> school's training regarding escalators helped me to make a
>> potentially dangerous situation a heck of a lot safer, for which I am
>> very grateful.
>>
>>
>>
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