[NAGDU] Dog Distractions

Wed Mar 1 18:59:16 UTC 2017

We guide dog users are, as you have probably noticed, like drunks in a bar,
you say anything and we all have our own opinions based on our experience,
or what we hear, or just based on  whatever we feel like saying at the time.

Now my opinion--lol  I don't have a problem with what  you are  are trying
to do and Jene has summed it up well This may be a temporary fix but....
What I would say though, is having gone through this situation with two out
of four dogs, the severe dog distraction bit, is that you will have to make
a hard decision at some point. Yor saying that when your girl friend is
there she has to help you control your pup indicates to me this is a severe
problem, just saying, based on my expereince, I would probably throw in the
towel. The good news is that everytime I had to do that,and believe me it
killed me to do it...the next time around was smooth sailing at least
comparatively. Whatever you do I wish you only success and happiness with
your doggie. 

I would dither and  just be like a yo-yo, one day I'd say "oh he's perfectly
fine I love him (the dog) so much" then we'd have a distraction and I'd say
"I can't take this any more" then the next day...and so on and so on...

Now what you've told me about your field rep is totally unacceptable, the
man is just pushing you under the rug and trying to act as if you're the
problem, what a jerk.

Dan

-----Original Message-----
From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jean Menzies via
NAGDU
Sent: Wednesday, March 01, 2017 1:48 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Cc: Jean Menzies
Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Dog Distractions

Hi Jordan,

Glad you are finding success. Continue to have faith in yourself, and
continue doing what works for the two of you. You don't need anyone's
approval or permission, and you no doubt will get all kinds of opinions. 
lol. Opinions are all good, but you know yourself, your dog, and your
situation the best. Bottom line is do what works. Continued good luck. It
sounds like you are on the right track.

Jean

-----Original Message-----
From: Jordan Gallacher via NAGDU
Sent: Wednesday, March 1, 2017 9:45 AM
To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Cc: Jordan Gallacher
Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Dog Distractions

The pinch collar has worked wonders so far. I had to remove a couple links
to get it to fit properly, but it is clearly making a difference.
Jordan

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 1, 2017, at 9:38 AM, Lisa via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>
> Hi Jordan,
>
>
> I understand you're quite desperate about the situation with your dog. 
> I just would like to stress how dangerous a pinch cdollar is. It can 
> easily do some damage to the dog and it is by no means a method to 
> work on his behaviour or problems. He might react to it because it 
> hurts him. But the only way to solve such a problem is to work on the 
> cause and to do it professionally. A pinch collar is, in my opinion,. 
> just a bad attempt on intimidating the dog.
>
> Lisa
>
>
>> Am 01.03.2017 um 15:30 schrieb Tracy Carcione via NAGDU:
>> Hi Jordan.
>> The pinch collar has to fit properly.  It has to be up on the neck a 
>> bit, not on the shoulders, but not be too tight, either.  I had to 
>> remove one of the links to get it to fit right.
>> Good luck.
>> Tracy
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of NAGDU 
>> President via NAGDU
>> Sent: Wednesday, March 01, 2017 9:10 AM
>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>> Cc: NAGDU President
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Dog Distractions
>>
>> Jordan,
>>
>>    I used a pinch collar on my horse - I mean dog - and it worked 
>> very well. The only thing I caution those considering a pinch collar 
>> is to be very light on the correction. The collar can work well but 
>> it can also hurt the dog if too much pressure is placed on it!
>>
>> Fraternally yours,
>> Marion
>>
>>
>>
>> Marion Gwizdala, President
>> National Association of Guide Dog Users Inc. (NAGDU) National 
>> Federation of the Blind
>> (813) 626-2789
>> President at NAGDU.ORG
>>
>>
>> The National Federation of the Blind knows that blindness is not the
>> characteristic that defines you or your future. Every day we raise
>> expectations because low expectations create barriers between blind 
>> people
>> and our dreams. You can live the life you want! Blindness is not what 
>> holds
>> you back.
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jordan 
>> Gallacher
>> via NAGDU
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2017 6:51 PM
>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>> Cc: Jordan Gallacher
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Dog Distractions
>>
>> Hopefully, the pinch collar will do the trick.  If it does not, I am 
>> going
>> to have to start thinking about returning him.
>> Jordan
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Charlene Ota 
>> via
>> NAGDU
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2017 12:39 PM
>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>> Cc: Charlene Ota
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Dog Distractions
>>
>> Hi, Jordan, I had a very bad situation with my first guide dog many years
>> ago and got no support what-so-ever from the school and the best thing I
>> ever did was to turn her back in even though I had to insist that the 
>> school
>> personnel come get her when they argued with me. Your safety is more
>> important than keeping a dog because the trainer isn't paying attention 
>> or
>> being honest about the situation. I know a lot of time and effort has 
>> been
>> invested in your dog, but I'd encourage you to just take charge, you're 
>> the
>> consumer, and do what's best for you and your safety and your peace of 
>> mind.
>> You're an experienced dog user, you know the experience should be 
>> enriching
>> your life, and your safety is one of the most important factors as well.
>> It's very stressful when you and your dog don't work out and the dog has
>> major behavior issues. From the posts, I can tell there are others who 
>> have
>> experienced similar situations, too, you're not the first, nor 
>> unfortunately
>> will you be the last, but do what's best for you and don't wait till
>> something unfortunate happens to you.
>>
>> All the best to you,
>> Charlene
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jordan 
>> Gallacher
>> via NAGDU
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2017 9:04 AM
>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Cc: Jordan Gallacher <jordanandbelto at gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Dog Distractions
>>
>> He was definitely being a jerk on the phone last week that is for sure. 
>> My
>> experience with the gentle leader on Belto so far has been a mixed bag. 
>> It
>> works great in situations where there might be food on the floor or in 
>> other
>> restaraunts that he is taking to much interest in to going after food, 
>> but
>> for dog distraction issues, it does not work one bit.  I have had him 
>> escape
>> even with that on and he also still has the same issues with being
>> distracted by other dogs.
>> Jordan
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione
>> via NAGDU
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2017 8:54 AM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Cc: Tracy Carcione
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Dog Distractions
>>
>> Hi Jordan.
>> If he's good sometimes, maybe there's hope.  Though escaping is 
>> definitely
>> not good.
>> Have you tried the Gentle Leader?  It didn't work well with my last dog, 
>> but
>> it calms my current dog down  immediately and gets his mind back on the 
>> job.
>> You would use it routinely until you felt the dog was reliably good, then
>> gradually start working without it on but in your pocket.  I don't love 
>> the
>> GL, but it does seem helpful in some situations.
>>
>> Can you go direct to a supervisor at your school, and skip the field rep?
>> The person sounds like a jerk, frankly.
>> Good luck.
>> Tracy
>>
>>> The thing I worry about the most is what would happen if we had
>>> another dog show up on the sidewalk we were headed toward while
>>> crossing a street.  I need to figure out a game plan for that scenario
>>> since the problem is already bad enough at times that if I did not
>>> have someone else such as my girlfriend with me who can get two extra
>>> hands on the leash and get him out of the situation, we would have a
>>> problem.
>>> Not to confuse the situation that I described in my very first e-mail
>>> of this subject, but today was the exact opposite of what often
>>> happens.  All it took this morning while on my way to breakfast was
>>> one correction, and Belto snapped right back to what he was supposed
>>> to be
>> doing.
>>> Jordan
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Danielle
>>> Ledet via NAGDU
>>> Sent: Monday, February 27, 2017 9:26 PM
>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>> Cc: Danielle Ledet
>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Dog Distractions
>>>
>>> You could also try stopping and doing obedience once you know another
>>> dog is present. I think it was my fagie boy who got excited around
>>> other dogs and I would have him do a few doggie pushups. This is a
>>> series of sit and down, sit and down. Only had to do it every so
>>> often.
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 2/27/17, Dan Weiner via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> My god, if this is the case, you need to make a very hard
>>>> decision...I hate this, but it happened to me twice, I had to say to
>>>> myself "If the situation doesn't improve can I live with it or not"
>>>> if the answer is "No,
>>> I can't"
>>>> then you might really start thinking of retirement. It's so
>>>> heart-wrenching I know, but I had to do it and the next dog after
>>>> that was brilliant, so sometimes it can be for the best.
>>>> Sorry you are going through this situation, and if it were me,
>>>> (remember not telling you to do it, just saying what' I'd do) I'd be
>>>> shopping around for another program.
>>>>
>>>> Best wishes to you.
>>>>
>>>> Dan
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jordan
>>>> Gallacher via NAGDU
>>>> Sent: Monday, February 27, 2017 3:01 PM
>>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>>>> Cc: Jordan Gallacher
>>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Dog Distractions
>>>>
>>>> Belto behaves the same way around my aunts dogs unfortunately.  Belto
>>>> has managed to escape from me three times already when he comes near
>>>> other dogs, and my field rep's response to that is oh well, that is
>>>> your problem.  It gets worse.  He also has said to me you do not have
>>>> a clue what you are doing.  Belto happens to be my third dog, and he
>>>> is the only dog that I have ever had a major problem like this.  Both
>>>> of my previous dogs I could fix most of the problems I had without
>>>> needing help from the school.  September only became an issue after
>>>> she was attacked, and when I finally got the school I received her
>>>> from to get their act together and they took her in for evaluation,
>>>> they saw all the same problems I was seeing.  I have a letter ready
>>>> to go out to the school where I received Belto from, and if I have
>>>> to, I will send it.
>>>> Jordan
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Alysha via
>>>> NAGDU
>>>> Sent: Monday, February 27, 2017 1:44 PM
>>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>>>> Cc: Alysha
>>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Dog Distractions
>>>>
>>>> Hi Jordan,
>>>> I have dealt with this problem as well, although it started a few
>>>> months after class for me. First, I tried a clicker approach as
>>>> recommended by an instructor from my school. I taught my dog the word
>>>> "look" meant he should turn to look at me. As soon as he did, I
>>>> clicked and gave him a treat. We first practiced this while walking
>>>> with no dogs around and then worked up to doing it when a dog was
>>>> nearby. This helped redirect his attention back to me during the
>>>> distraction. If the dog was far enough away, this method really
>>>> seemed to help, but we still had problems when dogs came close enough
>>>> to pass us on the sidewalk.
>>>>
>>>> I called the school again after it became clear that the clicker
>>>> alone wouldn't solve our problems, and they recommended using a prong
>>>> collar. I was pretty against this because I thought it was cruel, but
>>>> I really wanted to preserve our partnership since everything else
>>>> about my dog's work was great. So I sucked it up and gave it a try.
>>>> It really helped a lot. I just had to give him a few corrections with
>>>> the prong collar, and he got the idea that going after dogs was not
>>>> OK. I know the prong collar would not have worked on my first dog
>>>> since he was very sensitive, but my current guide is a lot more
>>>> confident. He doesn't like it when I put on the prongs, but he still
>>>> wags his tail and enjoys working even when he is wearing it.
>>>>
>>>> Today, I still use a combination of the word "look" rewarded by
>>>> click/treat to redirect his attention and the prong collar to correct
>>>> him if he lunges or barks at another dog. I won't say that his dog
>>>> distractions are completely gone. I think it's something we will
>>>> always have to work on. But he has gotten so much better now with the
>>>> combination of those 2 tools. The key for us was intense and
>>>> consistent practice. Our neighborhood has tons of dogs, so it was
>>>> easy to go out every day and work on the distractions.
>>>>
>>>> How does your dog interact with other dogs he knows? I was worried my
>>>> dog was aggressive when he lunged and barked/growled at other dogs,
>>>> but after getting to know him and observing him interact with other
>>>> dogs, I truly don't believe he would actually start fighting with
>>>> another dog. If you believe your dog would bite another dog, that
>>>> could be a very serious problem. I would seriously demand the school
>>>> send someone to observe and help you with this.
>>>>
>>>> I really hope you're able to find a solution that works for you. It's
>>>> a shame that your dog was exhibiting this behavior in class, and the
>>>> instructors didn't do anything about it. I think this is one of the
>>>> toughest behaviors to manage in a guide dog. I know many handlers
>>>> that have this problem, and I think the schools need to really step
>>>> up their game when it comes to working on this.
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>> Alysha
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jordan
>>>> Gallacher via NAGDU
>>>> Sent: Monday, February 27, 2017 2:22 PM
>>>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>> Cc: Jordan Gallacher <jordanandbelto at gmail.com>
>>>> Subject: [NAGDU] Dog Distractions
>>>>
>>>> I am having a bit of a problem with Belto that even the school cannot
>>>> figure out how to solve.  I received Belto last February, and even
>>>> during training, he would lunge at and/or try to chase other dogs
>>>> possibly trying to attack them.  My instructor during class did
>>>> nothing to work on this behavior nor did he give me any suggestions
>>>> on how to solve the issue or at least calm it down a bit.  Everytime
>>>> I have contacted the school about the issue, I get a different
>>>> answer, and since my instructor I had in class is also my field rep,
>>>> I am not getting anywhere when it comes to solving Belto's behavior
>>>> around other dogs.  Anyone have any suggestions on what I can try to
>>>> calm this problem a bit?  I have tried the gentle leader, but that
>>>> does not seem to be solving the problem other than being able to tell
>>>> what he is doing sooner.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> Jordan and Belto
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> NAGDU:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/alyshaj%40comcast.
>>>> n
>>>> et
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> NAGDU:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jordanandbelto%40g
>>>> m
>>>> ail.co
>>>> m
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> NAGDU:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/dcwein%40dcwein.cn
>>>> c
>>>> .net
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> NAGDU:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/singingmywayin%40g
>>>> m
>>>> ail.com
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> How far you go in life depends on your being tender with the young,
>>> compassionate with the aged, sympathetic with the striving and
>>> tolerant of the weak and strong. Because someday in your life you will
>>> have been all of these.
>>> George Washington Carver
>>> Email: singingmywayin at gmail.com
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> NAGDU:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jordanandbelto%40gm
>>> ail.co
>>> m
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> NAGDU:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/carcione%40access.n
>>> et
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NAGDU mailing list
>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> NAGDU:
>>
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jordanandbelto%40gmail.co
>> m
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NAGDU mailing list
>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> NAGDU:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/caota4%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NAGDU mailing list
>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> NAGDU:
>>
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jordanandbelto%40gmail.co
>> m
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NAGDU mailing list
>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> NAGDU:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NAGDU mailing list
>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> NAGDU:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/carcione%40access.net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NAGDU mailing list
>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>> NAGDU:
>>
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/dreamymarmot93%40yahoo.de
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NAGDU mailing list
> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> NAGDU:
>
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jordanandbelto%40gmail.co
m

_______________________________________________
NAGDU mailing list
NAGDU at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NAGDU:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jemenzies%40shaw.ca 

_______________________________________________
NAGDU mailing list
NAGDU at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NAGDU:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/dcwein%40dcwein.cnc.net