[NAGDU] follow command

Thu Aug 30 16:01:11 UTC 2018

I'm Deafblind and teach all of my dogs to follow.  When we are done, if the person is still nearby and the dog isn't clear that we are going on without them the thing I will do, is to point to the person and say "forward, on by."
On by is a cue I use in Urban Mushing, and transfered it to guidework. It means I see that thing whatever the dog is pointing out/is interested in, and we are moving on, so pay attention.   In urban mushing the dog is 8-12 feet in front of me and whatever thing I'm on--bike, skates, skis so I am unable to physically move her head away from the distraction or use any kind of leash cues because they are working on a towline made of bunjee.  So On by works great and then my dog is very clear about what I want her to do.  My issue with following is that Soleil and now Rowan will find an alternative route if the route the sighted person takes is not safe enough for me.  The sighted person thinks the dog is getting distracted but really the dog is just trying to do her job.  On Tuesday I was leaving a middle school where I teach and I was working Rowan at the time.  I was having her follow my interpreter and we got to the steps and the interpreter went down them and Rowan stopped, looked at the steps, looked at me and decided I was going to do the ramp instead-- I had been dizzy all that morning-- so she was probably not wanting to take any chances, lol.  

 Rox and the kitchen Bitches: 
Soleil, Rowan pawpower4me at gmail.com  

> On Aug 30, 2018, at 10:34 AM, Danielle Sykora via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> My dog is generally very good at following, though  he does follow people he knows better than people he has never met in chaotic environments. He did have an understanding of follow  when I got him but I definitely needed to refine it some within the first few months home. 
> Personally I really like the follow command for several reasons. I don’t have any hearing loss but I still find it very difficult to hear people talking in very loud environment particularly when they are facing away from me while walking. I also tend to be a little anxious in very loud environment where I can’t hear much of what is going on around me, so having a dog keep track of someone who I want to stay with is extremely helpful. I generally prefer that people walk behind me and let my dog work, but it is much easier to simply have my dog follow in unfamiliar environments that I really don’t need to learn how to navigate independently for whatever reason. Some people are really bad at giving directions and it is confusing and frustrating for both me and my dog to try to navigate unfamiliar environments with people trying to give directions that can barely tell their left from right. I also like to use follow when I am having a conversation with someone because it means my dog will stay close to them. Follow is also useful when walking with other service dog teams again in unfamiliar environments or whenhaving a conversation. For example my roommate uses a service dog and neither of our dogs knows how to walk on our right side. It would be kind of impossible to use cited guide, and she has some degree of hearing loss that would make it unlikely she would hear me calling out to her to ask for directions or something if I was out of herline of sight. I would often have my dog follow her when we were walking together on campus or in a store so that we wouldn’t get separated.
> I have a very confident dog  that I know can think for himself all too well. I never have an issue with him just following random people all of a sudden. Sometimes if someone is walking next to me in a boring familiar environment, my dog will slow down to try to sneakily let the person go in front of him and do the work. If this happens I simply ask the person I’m walking with to match my pace and walk at my side or to walk a few steps behind me. Likewise my dog will sometimes try to rush ahead of the person he is following in fun exciting environment so I use thesteady command to get him to walk more slowly. I do prefer that the person I’m following makes some kind of noise like snapping their finger, or that they let me know when they are going to turn. This doesn’t always happen but it is obviously great when people comply. Thai is normally great at following but he can occasionally veer off to show me a potential target or to take what he thinks is a better path. I don’t ever harshly correct this initiative but I will stop and have him focus on the person he is following again. I may even allow the person he is following to say his name occasionally in an excited tone  which is something I usually don’t encourage 
> Of course when my dog is following, I still expect him to stop at curbs, avoid obstacles, etc and will correct or rework mistakes as I would if he were not following. The only issue I’ve noticed my dog having with follow that there was no clear queue that would tell him when to stop following people. Sometimes I would have him follow someone for part of a route and then we would need to go in opposite directions, and then my dog would get confused why all of a sudden I didn’t want him to follow anymore. Thai sometimes will follow someone if I’ve been talking to them without me giving the command. I had really good intentions to teach him a command that would essentially release him from a follow, but I haven’t really had the time to proof it yet.
> Danielle and Thai 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Aug 30, 2018, at 10:50 AM, Cindy Ray via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Most of my dogs have felt it was necessary to follow anyone with whom I was talking, so when they would leave I would stand there for a while until we could be sure we were oriented. Could hat be a brain problem?
>> Cindy Lou Ray
>> cindyray at gmail.com
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Dan Weiner via NAGDU
>> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2018 8:48 AM
>> To: Melissa Allman via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Cc: Dan Weiner <dcwein at dcwein.cnc.net>
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] follow command
>> 
>> Very interesting, I did use follow extensively when I was a university student with my dog Evan, I had to work on it a bit with help from willing family  members and friends, but frankly Evan got to the point I'd just talk to a person, ask for help and he'd just follow the person I was talking with or asked for help, I did ask them to keep talking or to tell me when they turned left or right but usually they didn't, and he just got to be very good at it. It was a great
>> 
>> 
>> way to maintain my safety and independent mobility while having someone help me to places I didn't necessarily know.  I frankly haven't got my dogs since to be as good as Evan was, of course people who knew me  during the Evan Era--smile  get vry disappointed if my dogs don't just instantly do as Evan did--smile.  As far as a dog following just at random, I never had much of a problem with it, I would just gently redirect the dog or whatever. It is a good skill and I think it's great if your dog can do it, though some are better than others and some just won't. Especially since I have a hearing issue, not being able to hear on the left side, it would have been impossible for me to go places with people without being guided if I didn't have a dog with a good follow. I just can't tell where people are usually--smile. As I've said though, My first two dogs , Grant and Evan, were by far the best, Carter and Parker have not been as tenacious about it. Then again I've had to go most places myself nowadays so I don't get as much practice.
>> 
>> Warmest regards,
>> Dan the man and Parker the nut
>>> On 8/30/2018 9:30 AM, Melissa Allman via NAGDU wrote:
>>> Even when I do use follow, I still need the person to talk to me so that I can make sure my dog is following them in particular especially when she's following someone she really doesn't know and there are a million people around. Half the time she walks faster than the people she's supposed to be following or they are so nervous about it that they keep slowing and looking behind them and sometimes trying to make physical contact with me so I'm pretty selective about when I use it for that reason.
>>> 
>>> Melissa R. Allman, Esq.
>>> Senior Specialist, Advocacy and Government Relations The Seeing Eye, 
>>> Inc.
>>> P.O. Box 375, Morristown, NJ 07963-0375 (mail)
>>> 10 Washington Valley Road, Morristown, NJ 07960-3412 (deliveries)
>>> 973-539-4425 ext. 1724,     Fax:  973-525-1081 mallman at SeeingEye.org
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Ray 
>>> via NAGDU
>>> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2018 9:25 AM
>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>>> Cc: Cindy Ray
>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] follow command
>>> 
>>> I think that following has its advantages, especially if someone has a hearing loss. When I worked as chaplain service organist at the V.A. Hospital in Topeka, KS though, I followed too much and ended up having to work Jet out of it a little. She was a good dog, and I think it was sort of a disservice to her to have her follow as much as she did. So I guess I feel like Tracy about this. It is good to have that command in our toolbox, but I like the idea of just getting the person to speak to us occasionally so I can keep track. That is what I am currently doing without a dog.
>>> Cindy Lou Ray
>>> cindyray at gmail.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via 
>>> NAGDU
>>> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2018 8:15 AM
>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users' 
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] follow command
>>> 
>>> My dog Ben didn't like to follow much.  He figured his way was best.  I loved his initiative, so I just asked whoever we were with to say something occasionally so we could stay reasonably close.
>>> Krokus tends to over-follow.  He's happy to let someone else do the work, as we were discussing the other day.  Really, I'd rather have a dog who has the initiative and self-confidence not to follow.
>>> I've found, over my 7 dogs, that young dogs often need encouragement to develop the self-confidence to solve problems without a lot of help, and  I praise them up when they do it, so I wouldn't grumble at a dog for not following.  But that's me.
>>> Tracy
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Janell via 
>>> NAGDU
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2018 8:56 PM
>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>>> Cc: nellie at culodge.com
>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] follow command
>>> 
>>> We did the follow command with the trainer but then when I went to the mall yesterday with my mom she was having no part of it.  Then my mom was frustrated and then Rosy was too so she kind of shut down.  I am so used to Sully who is very strong willed and confident and then Rosy is very sensitive and tender hearted so I am having an adjustment too.  Rosy is an absolute doll and I think we will work well together but we have to get accustomed to each other.
>>> 
>>> Thanks for any advice!  😊
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Cindy Ray via 
>>> NAGDU
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2018 7:47 PM
>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users' 
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Cc: Cindy Ray <cindyray at gmail.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] follow command
>>> 
>>> How much do you want Rosy to follow? You could get her in the habit if you aren't careful. I did that with a dog. But you can do this by practicing.
>>> Get someone to help you and then tell her to follow. Then reward her in whatever way you reward her.
>>> 
>>> Cindy Lou Ray
>>> cindyray at gmail.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Janell via NAGDU
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2018 7:43 PM
>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Cc: nellie at culodge.com
>>> Subject: [NAGDU] follow command
>>> 
>>> I have my new guide dog Rosy.  She is doing quite well but she just doesn't have the "follow" command down.  Any suggestions from anyone?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Thanks, Janell
>>> 
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