[NAGDU] Commands was Re: another GDF question

Miranda knownoflove at gmail.com
Mon Feb 18 02:47:42 UTC 2019


Teaching your dog industry specific commands seems very unique. Would you be willing to share a little bit more about your thought process behind this?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 17, 2019, at 7:32 PM, Jordan Gallacher via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Depends on the dog for me.  September was one that for one would anticipate, and two be stubborn.  If she decided on another route to go, chances were good that it would be war to get her to go the way I wanted her to go.  Usually, I got around this by going out to town a different way from the way I return.  Only time this was an issue was going to class one day where she decided on a different route for no reason and would not budge until I gave in not wanting to be late for class.  Belto knew where I usually went and that was really the extent of it.  If I gave him a command to continue on past a usual place, he would keep on going.  Command wise, I usually end up teaching my dogs several commands that only I would know unless someone listening was involved with the railroad industry.
> Jordan 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Mike Hingson via NAGDU
> Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2019 6:48 PM
> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users' <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: mike at michaelhingson.com
> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Commands was Re: another GDF question
> 
> Possibly I'm a fuddy duddie here, but I never want my guide dog to read my mind. That is, I always want him to follow commands and not anticipate. I may go to the same place often or every day, but if I feel my guide is anticipating I will try to find an alternative way to get somewhere just to keep training and me sharp. This was exceptionally challenging while in the World Trade Center, but by finding unusual ways, and yes sometimes round about ways to get somewhere, my dogs' training was sharper and, as I said, so was my training and power of observation. 
> 
> 
> Best Regards,
> 
> 
> Michael Hingson
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Cindy Ray via NAGDU
> Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2019 1:21 PM
> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users' <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: cindyray at gmail.com
> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Commands was Re: another GDF question
> 
> I was just thinking of writing along this same line. The key isn't the number of commands I think. Correct me if I am wrong, but the key is consistency. Use the commands for the thing that you were always training to use them. Be consistent and praise when they have fulfilled the command. Eventually, they do read your mind, I think.
> Cindy Lou Ray
> cindyray at gmail.com
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Rox Homstad via NAGDU
> Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2019 10:20 AM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Rox Homstad <pawpower4me at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Commands was Re: another GDF question
> 
> Ok, i'ma agree to disagree here. If a dog is smart enough to guide, it is smart enough to know hundreds of commands. Soleil, my 8 year old service dog who does guide, hearing, and mobility work knows a lot and she's not a particular shining star of brilliance.  I teach find from the beginning, she finds over 20 objects and can find places -- coffee shops are her specialty. I think it's cuz she's a lab... I should sit down one day and write out a list of the cues she knows. She is 8 and it took her til she was about ... 4 and she started training late at age 3. my biggest issue is remembering things, but now we are at the stage where she really just reads my mind. train for what you need. If you want to do more, then do it. If your dog is stressed, stop, but most guides I've met are guides because they love new things and learning and pleasing their people. 
> 
> 
> Rox'E and the Kitchen Bitches
> Soleil, Rowan
> pawpower4me at gmail.com
> 
>> On Feb 17, 2019, at 9:41 AM, Debra Chandler via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> 
>> <My theory would be that you don't want to overburden your dog with too many different commands.  So leave it might be ok as well as find but too many commands might be confusing to the dog.  
>> Deb and Tally
>> ---- Danielle Sykora via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote: 
>>> I have heard a few different reasons rationalizing why they no longer teach leave it. You would have to contact them directly to get the official response.   The first is that the correction word of no sounds less negative to the public then leave it. The second was something along the lines of well if you are totally blind how would you know the distraction was there ahead of time to tell the dog to leave it. The third reason, the one I heard the most often and that makes the most sense, is that people were using leave it incorrectly. As in, they would walk down the street saying leave it, leave it, leave it over and over so that the dog basically tuned it out. similar to how many pet owners will tell their dog sit, sit, sit, sit while the dog completely ignores them.  
>> 
>> my opinion on these reasons: The first doesn’t exactly make sense to me. I think leave it is less negative than no in terms of what the general public will think. In fact, I often find people respect leave it more when they are petting my dog or allowing their dog to interact with mine, because they recognize that leave it is something many pet owners use to tell their dog to not engage with a distraction. It is like if I say no, they don’t know what I’m correcting my dog for. When I say leave it, they are more likely to associate it with their own actions. Not in all cases of course, but just a trend I have noticed 
>> The second reason is actually ridiculous and I’m kind of shocked that this person said it to me. sorry that is pretty blunt,  but I noticed a bit of a rift between the instructors and students , and the higher ups in the training department and these types of conversations were a little frustrating at times.    While during the dogs puppyhood, leave it will often be used preemptively when the puppy raiser spots a distraction and is reminding the dog not to pay attention to it, leave it essentially turns into more of a correction for inappropriate behavior once the dog gets older. Once the dogs are fully trained, they theoretically should know better than to engage with distractions. So leave it then becomes hey, I know you are starting to get distracted and you better stop now. It does not require vision to notice perked ears, turning of the head, quickening pace, etc. indicating that your dog is beginning to get distracted.
>> The third reason is the only one that I think makes sense. I can certainly see people using leave it way too often, to the point where it  doesn’t have much meaning for the dog anymore.
>> Personally, I don’t agree with the decision to remove this command from the vocabulary. I started using leave it immediately with my dog once home. Well to be totally honest, I  used it in class as well out of habit.  
>> 
>> Danielle, Thai, and Jackie
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Feb 16, 2019, at 10:25 PM, Miranda via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> I wonder why they do not teach leave it any longer. I also wonder why other schools do not teach commands such as back, under, off, up/stand, drop it or give, about, etc.? I also wonder why some schools may not specifically teach the dogs to find such designated objects as elevators, stairs, seats, curbs (great when you’re looking for a curb that might not be add a street crossing such as a couple curbs that we deal with on the route to our internship). These are commands that I definitely would find useful.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Feb 16, 2019, at 5:04 PM, Danielle Sykora via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Most schools teach the same commands up to a point, and then start 
>>>> to differ somewhat. I think GDF teaches the most commands of any 
>>>> program, or at least they used to in my experience. A few commands 
>>>> have been dropped... long story. I wrote down all of the commands my 
>>>> dog knew for no apparent reason after coming home from class in 
>>>> November, so here you go.
>>>> 
>>>> Obedience
>>>> 1.    Sit
>>>> 2.    Down
>>>> 3-4.    Up/stand
>>>> 5.    Stay
>>>> 6.    Come
>>>> 7.    Whistle recall: comes to the sound of a whistle
>>>> 8.    Off
>>>> 9.    Heel: stands on left side facing forward
>>>> 10.    Walk: walks on a loose leash on left side
>>>> 11.    Switch: comes from a heel position to stand on right side, usually
>>>> when going through doors with hinges on the left
>>>> 12.    Touch: touches nose to hand
>>>> 13.    Leave it: Officially, GDF no longer teaches students to use this
>>>> command for reasons that don’t totally make sense to me. However, 
>>>> this command is used while the dogs are puppies so they are familiar 
>>>> with it.
>>>> 14.    Under: lays under a chair or table
>>>> 15.    Up front: goes in front of handler off a curb or into the grass,
>>>> given prior to the “get busy” cue
>>>> 16.    Get busy
>>>> 17.    Drink
>>>> 18.    Out/drop it: drop whatever is in your mouth
>>>> 19.    quiet
>>>> 20. OK: releases from previous command
>>>> 
>>>> guiding commands/tasks
>>>> 21.    Forward
>>>> 22.    Left: 90 degree turn to the left
>>>> 23.    Right: 90 degree turn to the right
>>>> 24.    Halt: slow to a stop
>>>> 25.    About: 180 degree turn while guiding
>>>> 26.    back
>>>> 27.    Inside: go through a door, jump in the car, and find the entrance
>>>> to a building
>>>> 28.    Outside: go through a door, jump out of the car, and find the exit
>>>> of a building
>>>> 29.    Over left: move to the left or walk on the left side of a
>>>> sidewalk/street/hallway
>>>> 30.    Over right: move to the right or walk on the right side of a
>>>> sidewalk/street/hallway
>>>> 31.    Careful: used to warn of an upcoming difficult spot to work, or as
>>>> a correction when not working an obstacle correctly
>>>> 32.    Follow: follows a designated person
>>>> 33.    Steady: slow down/pull less
>>>> 34.    Hup up: walk more quickly, or move closer to whatever the dog is
>>>> trying to show the handler
>>>> 
>>>> Find the…
>>>> 35.    curb
>>>> 36.    Seat: this can be a specific seat have sat in before, or any empty
>>>> seat available
>>>> 37.    Stairs up
>>>> 38.    Stairs down
>>>> 39.    Door
>>>> 40.    Bed (place): goes and lays in bed
>>>> 41.    Bus
>>>> 42.    van
>>>> 43.    garbage/trash
>>>> 44.    The way: used to tell a dog to find a clear path through a crowd,
>>>> the safest way around an obstacle that blocks the entire sidewalk, 
>>>> and similar situations
>>>> 45.    Button: elevator button or crosswalk button
>>>> 46.    Elevator
>>>> 47.    Escalator up
>>>> 48.    Escalator down
>>>> 49.    ramp
>>>> 50.    Counter: checkout counters
>>>> **Graduates are strongly encouraged to teach additional find 
>>>> commands throughout class and once home, teaching the dogs to target 
>>>> frequently used rooms, buildings, and stores.** **GDF also formally 
>>>> teaches leash guiding, which is a concept, not a command.** 
>>>> **Commands may vary slightly from instructor to instructor.**
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Danielle, Thai, and Jackie
>>>> 
>>>>> On 2/16/19, Madison Martin via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> Hi all, I was just wondering, out of curiosity, what commands does 
>>>>> GDF teach their guide dogs? Do all schools tend to teach their dogs 
>>>>> the same commands?
>>>>> Look forward to hearing back from you guys! Thanks
>>>>> 
>>>>> Madison
>>>>> 
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