[NAGDU] Questions from a Potential Guide Dog User
Cindy Ray
cindyray at gmail.com
Fri May 10 22:59:21 UTC 2019
Iam not seeing anything in the below message. Can you resend, Ms. Berkley? Sorry if I’ve spelled you wrong.
Cindy Lou Ray
Sent from my iPhone
> On May 10, 2019, at 4:18 PM, Elise Berkley via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>
>> On 5/10/19, nagdu-request at nfbnet.org <nagdu-request at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> Send NAGDU mailing list submissions to
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>> nagdu-request at nfbnet.org
>>
>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>> nagdu-owner at nfbnet.org
>>
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of NAGDU digest..."
>>
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>> 1. Re: NAGDU Digest, Vol 170, Issue 7 (Peter Wolf)
>> 2. Re: Sad Eyes (Elise Berkley)
>> 3. Re: Intro New Dog (Tracy Carcione) (Elise Berkley)
>> 4. Questions from a potential future guide dog user. (Sandra Gayer)
>> 5. Re: Questions from a potential future guide dog user.
>> (Aleeha Dudley)
>> 6. Re: Questions from a potential future guide dog user.
>> (Julie Johnson)
>> 7. Re: Questions from a potential future guide dog user.
>> (Nimer Jaber)
>> 8. Does anyone have this (service dog) information? (Peter Wolf)
>> 9. Re: Does anyone have this (service dog) information?
>> (Danielle Sykora)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 06:18:06 -0700
>> From: Peter Wolf <pwolf1 at wolfskills.com>
>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] NAGDU Digest, Vol 170, Issue 7
>> Message-ID: <F6E7FB57-B309-4EFB-95F1-6BEA03BFD23C at wolfskills.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>>
>> Hi Jess,
>>
>> Congratulations!
>> Peter
>>> On May 8, 2019, at 5:00 AM, nagdu-request at nfbnet.org wrote:
>>>
>>> Send NAGDU mailing list submissions to
>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>
>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>> nagdu-request at nfbnet.org
>>>
>>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>> nagdu-owner at nfbnet.org
>>>
>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>>> than "Re: Contents of NAGDU digest..."
>>>
>>>
>>> Today's Topics:
>>>
>>> 1. Intro New Dog (searsdiaz at gmail.com)
>>> 2. Re: Intro New Dog (Madison Martin)
>>> 3. Sad Eyes (Elise Berkley)
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 1
>>> Date: Tue, 7 May 2019 15:48:45 -0400
>>> From: <searsdiaz at gmail.com>
>>> To: <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Subject: [NAGDU] Intro New Dog
>>> Message-ID: <02c301d5050d$e2166590$a64330b0$@gmail.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> I thought I would stop by to introduce my first Seeing Eye dog Shannon.
>>> I'm
>>> in class right now. She is a 2 year old half golden/cross. She is about
>>> 56.5
>>> lbs. To say I am completely sold and impressed with Seeing Eye's training
>>> is
>>> an understatement. Nothing but amazing and positive training methods
>>> without
>>> food which is what I wanted. I've had 2 previous guides from other
>>> schools
>>> and the food method for me just is not something I want to contend with
>>> any
>>> longer. Thanks for reading.
>>>
>>> Jess
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---
>>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 2
>>> Date: Tue, 7 May 2019 20:28:33 -0500
>>> From: "Madison Martin" <maddymartin at mymts.net>
>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>>> Users'" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Intro New Dog
>>> Message-ID: <001501d5053d$5a3c1a90$0eb44fb0$@mymts.net>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>>
>>> Hi Jessica,
>>> Congrads on your new guide!! What's her temperament like so far? Look
>>> forward to hearing more about you and your new guide! Take care,
>>> Madison
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jessica Diaz
>>> via
>>> NAGDU
>>> Sent: May-07-19 2:49 PM
>>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>> Cc: searsdiaz at gmail.com
>>> Subject: [NAGDU] Intro New Dog
>>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> I thought I would stop by to introduce my first Seeing Eye dog Shannon.
>>> I'm
>>> in class right now. She is a 2 year old half golden/cross. She is about
>>> 56.5
>>> lbs. To say I am completely sold and impressed with Seeing Eye's training
>>> is
>>> an understatement. Nothing but amazing and positive training methods
>>> without
>>> food which is what I wanted. I've had 2 previous guides from other
>>> schools
>>> and the food method for me just is not something I want to contend with
>>> any
>>> longer. Thanks for reading.
>>>
>>> Jess
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---
>>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> NAGDU:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/maddymartin%40mymts.net
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 3
>>> Date: Tue, 7 May 2019 20:13:15 -0700
>>> From: Elise Berkley <bravaegf711 at gmail.com>
>>> To: nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Subject: [NAGDU] Sad Eyes
>>> Message-ID:
>>> <CAJu6SLOEHUPuWbFesyaXfqXdnEmxt-rP0VaC3nfcW=DW0M1pCQ at mail.gmail.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>>>
>>> Hello, listers.
>>> I always wondered why do labs go into "sad eyes" mode. I understand
>>> sometime their eyes are like big, brown buttons and other times, they
>>> have some white in them, giving them a sad look. Can anyone broaden my
>>> knowledge of this? Thanks.
>>> Elise and Becky
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Subject: Digest Footer
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> End of NAGDU Digest, Vol 170, Issue 7
>>> *************************************
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 07:10:29 -0700
>> From: Elise Berkley <bravaegf711 at gmail.com>
>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Sad Eyes
>> Message-ID:
>> <CAJu6SLOt1Cy0Tf6Eozw66vtP9n9Tw1Hc5d8BCxc4NmfBScT2Rw at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>>
>>> On 5/9/19, nagdu-request at nfbnet.org <nagdu-request at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> Send NAGDU mailing list submissions to
>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>
>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>>> nagdu-request at nfbnet.org
>>>
>>> You can reach the person managing the list at
>>> nagdu-owner at nfbnet.org
>>>
>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>>> than "Re: Contents of NAGDU digest..."
>>>
>>>
>>> Today's Topics:
>>>
>>> 1. Re: Sad Eyes (dchandler001 at carolina.rr.com)
>>> 2. Re: Intro New Dog (Tracy Carcione)
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 1
>>> Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 14:04:01 +0000
>>> From: <dchandler001 at carolina.rr.com>
>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Cc: Elise Berkley <bravaegf711 at gmail.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Sad Eyes
>>> Message-ID: <20190508140401.VQCXW.145451.root at dnvrco-web27>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>>
>>> I have a lab golden cross and she's not at all overweight but her face has
>>> a
>>> somewhat jowly look. I think some people think this makes the dog look
>>> sad.
>>> She's very happy nevertheless.
>>> Deb and Tally
>>> ---- Elise Berkley via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> Hello, listers.
>>>> I always wondered why do labs go into "sad eyes" mode. I understand
>>>> sometime their eyes are like big, brown buttons and other times, they
>>>> have some white in them, giving them a sad look. Can anyone broaden my
>>>> knowledge of this? Thanks.
>>>> Elise and Becky
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> NAGDU:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/dchandler001%40carolina.rr.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 2
>>> Date: Wed, 8 May 2019 10:45:55 -0400
>>> From: "Tracy Carcione" <carcione at access.net>
>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>>> Users'" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Intro New Dog
>>> Message-ID: <011001d505ac$be18d570$3a4a8050$@access.net>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>>
>>> Hi Jess.
>>> Congratulations! Bet she's really cute. Is she black or yellow? My
>>> cross
>>> is yellow--a big blond.
>>> Good luck in class.
>>> Tracy
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jessica Diaz
>>> via
>>> NAGDU
>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2019 3:49 PM
>>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>> Cc: searsdiaz at gmail.com
>>> Subject: [NAGDU] Intro New Dog
>>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> I thought I would stop by to introduce my first Seeing Eye dog Shannon.
>>> I'm
>>> in class right now. She is a 2 year old half golden/cross. She is about
>>> 56.5
>>> lbs. To say I am completely sold and impressed with Seeing Eye's training
>>> is
>>> an understatement. Nothing but amazing and positive training methods
>>> without
>>> food which is what I wanted. I've had 2 previous guides from other
>>> schools
>>> and the food method for me just is not something I want to contend with
>>> any
>>> longer. Thanks for reading.
>>>
>>> Jess
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---
>>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> NAGDU:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/carcione%40access.net
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Subject: Digest Footer
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> End of NAGDU Digest, Vol 170, Issue 8
>>> *************************************
>>>
>> Thanks, Chandler.
>> Elise and Becky
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 07:16:43 -0700
>> From: Elise Berkley <bravaegf711 at gmail.com>
>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Intro New Dog (Tracy Carcione)
>> Message-ID:
>> <CAJu6SLNqNrw4ZNS-zR5pW2m2qUKc+SfD4K2VQci0eqL+z7REmA at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>>
>> Hello, Tracy.
>> I hope the best for you and Shannon. Yes, I will agree, the food
>> reinforcement is hard to break; but, I have had Becky for 4 years now,
>> and the trend has been broken. She is good with love when she does
>> something good. Take care and have fun!
>> Elise and Becky
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 4
>> Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 21:43:53 +0100
>> From: Sandra Gayer <sandragayer7 at gmail.com>
>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: [NAGDU] Questions from a potential future guide dog user.
>> Message-ID:
>> <CAJcYH6_x_yAG+g1HjCMQbha9OqrTJ8+kknDM_GpTxAYrrMPw6A at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>>
>> Hello Everyone,
>> I'm new to the list and I use a long cane. I apologise in advance if
>> my questionshave been asked before or seem dim to all of you seasoned
>> guide dog owners.
>>
>> I know guide dogs are taught to guide you around obstacles and find a
>> clear rout but, what if there is no clear rout?
>>
>> I use walls, rails and other edges to know where I am. However, I know
>> that guide dogs are taught to walk in the centre of a path. Does
>> anyone find this disorientating? I get a, sort of, no man's land
>> feeling when I'm in open spaces. Is this something you learn to get
>> used to?
>>
>> I'm a Singer, an Actor and a Broadcast Presenter. I travel to new
>> places quite a lot. I have read that guide dogs thrive on routine.
>> Does that mean that the guide dog wouldn't perform well in new
>> environments?
>>
>> I'm wondering if anyone has come across a person using a guide dog but
>> using a cane on the right side? I just don't see how else I could get
>> information about the ground; slight rises, dips, there is shared
>> curbing in the UK, where I live, and although this means there is no
>> curbe, there is a slight difference in texture to the ground. Also,
>> things like changes in relief are communicated easily through the
>> cane.
>>
>> Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>> Very best wishes,
>> Sandra.
>>
>> --
>> Sandra Gayer DipABRSM, LRSM.
>>
>> Soprano Singer
>> www.sandragayer.com
>>
>> Broadcast Presenter
>> www.rnibconnectradio.org.uk/music-box.html
>>
>> Actor
>> www.visablepeople.com
>>
>> Voiceover Artist
>> www.archangelvoices.co.uk/content/sandra-gayer
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 5
>> Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 15:58:39 -0500
>> From: Aleeha Dudley <blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Questions from a potential future guide dog user.
>> Message-ID: <BAB1C876-7713-4D9F-AD0D-6384490D1780 at gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>
>> Hi Sandra,
>> I have been using a guide dog for almost 5 years now and am also a
>> proficient cane user. Here are some things I?ve ound
>> First, if I am in a situation where I cannot tell what is in front of me and
>> my dog has stopped moving because they can?t find a way around, I carry a
>> small telescoping cane that I can use to figure out what is in our way.
>> Better my cane be broken than my face. :)
>> I learned very quickly to feel under my feet for the elevation changes and
>> listen for openings in walls or other landmarks. The dog will also learn to
>> recognize familiar turns or landmarks and indicate them with a turn of the
>> head or by pausing.
>> While dogs enjoy routine, there are many dogs that are adaptable to new
>> situations and new routes. My dog is one of these dogs. She loves new areas
>> and situations, and would be very happy if we travelled a lot. Some dogs?
>> routines are, for lack of a better phrase, the lack of routine, if that
>> makes sense.
>> I hope this helps with some of your concerns.
>> Aleeha Dudley
>>
>>> On May 9, 2019, at 3:43 PM, Sandra Gayer via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello Everyone,
>>> I'm new to the list and I use a long cane. I apologise in advance if
>>> my questionshave been asked before or seem dim to all of you seasoned
>>> guide dog owners.
>>>
>>> I know guide dogs are taught to guide you around obstacles and find a
>>> clear rout but, what if there is no clear rout?
>>>
>>> I use walls, rails and other edges to know where I am. However, I know
>>> that guide dogs are taught to walk in the centre of a path. Does
>>> anyone find this disorientating? I get a, sort of, no man's land
>>> feeling when I'm in open spaces. Is this something you learn to get
>>> used to?
>>>
>>> I'm a Singer, an Actor and a Broadcast Presenter. I travel to new
>>> places quite a lot. I have read that guide dogs thrive on routine.
>>> Does that mean that the guide dog wouldn't perform well in new
>>> environments?
>>>
>>> I'm wondering if anyone has come across a person using a guide dog but
>>> using a cane on the right side? I just don't see how else I could get
>>> information about the ground; slight rises, dips, there is shared
>>> curbing in the UK, where I live, and although this means there is no
>>> curbe, there is a slight difference in texture to the ground. Also,
>>> things like changes in relief are communicated easily through the
>>> cane.
>>>
>>> Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>>> Very best wishes,
>>> Sandra.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Sandra Gayer DipABRSM, LRSM.
>>>
>>> Soprano Singer
>>> www.sandragayer.com
>>>
>>> Broadcast Presenter
>>> www.rnibconnectradio.org.uk/music-box.html
>>>
>>> Actor
>>> www.visablepeople.com
>>>
>>> Voiceover Artist
>>> www.archangelvoices.co.uk/content/sandra-gayer
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> NAGDU:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blindcowgirl1993%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 6
>> Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 16:28:52 -0500
>> From: "Julie Johnson" <julielj at neb.rr.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Questions from a potential future guide dog user.
>> Message-ID: <F6E9DC2B861E43ACA300AB2D40A7BD20 at JuliePC>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>> reply-type=original
>>
>> My .02, please know this is just me and everyone has different experiences.
>>
>> Yes, the first time I walked with a dog I did feel a bit untethered. It was
>>
>> a bit exhilarating and disorienting at the same time. I was used to a cane
>>
>> and the info I got from contact with the environment. that was gone and I
>> didn't yet have the experience of recognizing what the dog was indicating.
>> It didn't last long. The dog will indicate the edge of the street, turns,
>> frequently used turns/doors/etc. You can pattern the dog to target places
>> you want or teach the dog to take you to frequently used items like soda
>> machines/mailboxes etc.
>>
>> You will still get all the same tactile information of dips, rises and
>> textures that you are used to now. You will just need to get that info from
>>
>> your feet instead of the cane. I still follow walls, especially in places
>> like malls or large hotels, but I do it by sound instead of contact with a
>> cane. The advantage of the dog is that you can teach the dog to say find
>> the elevator. So maybe the first time in a large hotel you follow the wall
>>
>> around to the other side of the lobby to get to the elevator, but once
>> you're there, you can reinforce this is a great place to be so the dog will
>>
>> then be able to take you straight across the lobby directly to the elevator.
>>
>> Actually most dogs are probably going to already know to find elevators. I
>>
>> live in a tiny town and my dogs don't often see elevators, so when we come
>> across them, I typically have to show them what to do the first time in a
>> new place. Anyway I hope you will understand the idea and how it can apply
>>
>> to lots of other situations.
>>
>> If there is no clear path my dogs will generally stop and refuse to go
>> forward. My older dog will suggest an alternate route from a fair distance
>>
>> back, but I usually have no clue what's ahead and insist we go forward,
>> which ends in doubling back and taking the turn he previously suggested.
>> When the dog stops you will investigate first with a foot, then a hand to
>> check for an overhang if needed. Carrying a folding cane to check things
>> out if a foot or hand doesn't work is also an option. Historically there
>> have been diverse opinions about using a cane and dog together on a
>> continual basis. Some opinions are that if your using a dog you should
>> never need a cane again. Others use a cane and dog together nearly all the
>>
>> time. From what I can tell the cane and dog simultaneous users live in
>> places where the pathways are very uneven and unpredictable like in very old
>>
>> cities or developing countries. If it makes you feel more secure to carry a
>>
>> folding cane and getting it out when you don't understand what the dog is
>> indicating, then I say go for it.
>>
>> On routine...yes, dogs need routine, but that doesn't mean you have to go to
>>
>> the same places, in the same order every day. Different dogs will need
>> different levels of routine, just like people. Some dogs are more flexible
>>
>> than others. I think the most important part of a routine is feeding and
>> relieving, but even that can vary somewhat. Let your program know about
>> your travels and lifestyle and they should be able to find a dog that will
>> thrive in that environment.
>>
>> HTH and welcome to the list!
>> Julie
>> On The Go with Guide-and-Service-Dogs.com
>> http://www.guide-and-service-dogs.com
>> also find my products in the Blind Mice Mega Mall
>> <https://www.blindmicemegamall.com/bmm/shop/Directory_Departments?storeid=1916046>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Sandra Gayer via NAGDU
>> Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2019 3:43 PM
>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> Cc: Sandra Gayer
>> Subject: [NAGDU] Questions from a potential future guide dog user.
>>
>> Hello Everyone,
>> I'm new to the list and I use a long cane. I apologise in advance if
>> my questionshave been asked before or seem dim to all of you seasoned
>> guide dog owners.
>>
>> I know guide dogs are taught to guide you around obstacles and find a
>> clear rout but, what if there is no clear rout?
>>
>> I use walls, rails and other edges to know where I am. However, I know
>> that guide dogs are taught to walk in the centre of a path. Does
>> anyone find this disorientating? I get a, sort of, no man's land
>> feeling when I'm in open spaces. Is this something you learn to get
>> used to?
>>
>> I'm a Singer, an Actor and a Broadcast Presenter. I travel to new
>> places quite a lot. I have read that guide dogs thrive on routine.
>> Does that mean that the guide dog wouldn't perform well in new
>> environments?
>>
>> I'm wondering if anyone has come across a person using a guide dog but
>> using a cane on the right side? I just don't see how else I could get
>> information about the ground; slight rises, dips, there is shared
>> curbing in the UK, where I live, and although this means there is no
>> curbe, there is a slight difference in texture to the ground. Also,
>> things like changes in relief are communicated easily through the
>> cane.
>>
>> Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>> Very best wishes,
>> Sandra.
>>
>> --
>> Sandra Gayer DipABRSM, LRSM.
>>
>> Soprano Singer
>> www.sandragayer.com
>>
>> Broadcast Presenter
>> www.rnibconnectradio.org.uk/music-box.html
>>
>> Actor
>> www.visablepeople.com
>>
>> Voiceover Artist
>> www.archangelvoices.co.uk/content/sandra-gayer
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NAGDU mailing list
>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> NAGDU:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/julielj%40neb.rr.com
>>
>>
>> -----
>> No virus found in this message.
>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> Version: 2012.0.2265 / Virus Database: 4365/15297 - Release Date: 07/04/18
>> Internal Virus Database is out of date.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 7
>> Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 15:01:02 -0700
>> From: Nimer Jaber <nimerjaber1 at gmail.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Questions from a potential future guide dog user.
>> Message-ID:
>> <CAF2O2CyXHAXKx2FLDR4k_esU6odprokE2KqGr2a9w_Lhry41kg at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>> Please find my responses below.
>>
>> On Thu, May 9, 2019 at 1:45 PM Sandra Gayer via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hello Everyone,
>>> I'm new to the list and I use a long cane. I apologise in advance if
>>> my questionshave been asked before or seem dim to all of you seasoned
>>> guide dog owners.
>>>
>> Yeur questions are welcome, so please ask. It is important to learn what
>> you can in order to discover whether this lifestyle is right for you. No
>> need for apologies, and you can't ask a dim question.
>>
>>>
>>> I know guide dogs are taught to guide you around obstacles and find a
>>> clear rout but, what if there is no clear rout?
>>>
>> If there is not a clear route, the dog will zigzag until they get through.
>> If there is absolutely no way through, they will stop generally, and they
>> will expect input from you to determine what to do. they may try to turn
>> around. This depends on the situation and the dog, and how the dog was
>> trained to handle these things, or if it was at all.
>>
>>>
>>> I use walls, rails and other edges to know where I am. However, I know
>>> that guide dogs are taught to walk in the centre of a path. Does
>>> anyone find this disorientating? I get a, sort of, no man's land
>>> feeling when I'm in open spaces. Is this something you learn to get
>>> used to?
>>>
>> Some dogs walk in the center. Some hug the right edge, and many hug the
>> left edge. To answer your question, I don't find it disorienting at all.
>> But this depends on you, and the queues you are used to using to navigate
>> your environment. Let me try to explain a bit better:
>>
>> When i was growing up, I did not know about canes, I hated canes when I
>> discovered them, and made it a point to lose them, throw them, and sell
>> them to others to use as they wished. When i walked, I just walked. I did
>> not trail, I just walked. I paid a lot of attention to sounds, textures,
>> smells, etc while walking. I was able to learn a lot from echo location
>> about my environment... I was even able to ride a bike using echo location
>> and my form of navigation. I did trip and fall, I am not and was not
>> superman, but I got up and kept going.
>>
>> This leads me to the question at hand. the way I have always navigated lent
>> itself well to dog travel. Why? because the skills of environmental
>> observation which I used to get around are exactly the skills an individual
>> develops and uses for guide dog travel. This is a struggle for individuals
>> who learned to trail, who learned routes by counting turns or whatever, and
>> who did not learn to generalize routes or environmental information. this
>> is a huge problem with Orientation and Mobility today, particularly many
>> sighted instructors. It is important to not learn routes. It is important
>> to learn concepts of navigation.
>>
>> Anyway, the answer to your question is probably yes, you may be disorinted
>> at first. Dogs navigate around many of the environmental clues that you may
>> be used to using. However as you build your confidence and proficiency, you
>> will begin utilizing different clues. Sounds, elevation changes, smells,
>> the feel of the ground under your feet, time/distance, and other clues,
>> along with possibly GPS aids will become your friend. And your dog will be
>> your ally in the world of navigating the world. With the enhanced skills
>> and your dog's training, you will do well.
>>
>> I do trail sometimes, even now, particularly when trying to find a tight
>> turn or an entrance, but most of the time, telling my dog "left left" or
>> right right" followed with a hand motion and rarely, a bit of persuasion
>> with my voice and a leash tug suffices to make those turns and find those
>> entrances.
>>
>>>
>>> I'm a Singer, an Actor and a Broadcast Presenter. I travel to new
>>> places quite a lot. I have read that guide dogs thrive on routine.
>>> Does that mean that the guide dog wouldn't perform well in new
>>> environments?
>>>
>> in my experience with dog handling, owners who state that their dogs thrive
>> on a routine really are saying that they themselves are resistant to
>> change, and thrive on routine. I am not minimizng anyone else's
>> experiences, or at least I am not trying to. In my experience though, the
>> dog follows your lead. if you are relaxed, calm, and alive, your dog will
>> be relaxed even if you are walking into a crazy situation or place. if you
>> are not... well, your dog won't be either.
>>
>> Some things to think about would be a routine for deeding... dogs loooooove
>> food, or at least many do. A routine for taking the dog out would be
>> helpful as well. And a routine or habit, even if it is not at the exact
>> time each day, of playing with your dog, massaging your dog, bonding with
>> your dog, grooming your dog is very important. Your dog is a living being,
>> not something you can put aside and ignore whenever you feel like it just
>> so that you can sing and act. Still, with the proper planning and
>> attention, your dog will be just fine.
>>
>>>
>>> I'm wondering if anyone has come across a person using a guide dog but
>>> using a cane on the right side? I just don't see how else I could get
>>> information about the ground; slight rises, dips, there is shared
>>> curbing in the UK, where I live, and although this means there is no
>>> curbe, there is a slight difference in texture to the ground. Also,
>>> things like changes in relief are communicated easily through the
>>> cane.
>>>
>> In rare situations, I I'll use a cane. I almost always carry a cane with me
>> just in case I need it, just in case my dog gets injured. I will never
>> allow myself to be stuck in a situation I cannot get out of. But it isn't
>> usually to detect cracks or elevation changes. those things are usually
>> detectable through the harness handle. If you have a dog with a good pull,
>> and you spend time reading the dog's movements and learning to dance with
>> your dog, you will know and feel even slight movements and indications.
>> Your dog will read you too, and they will pick up on the fact that they may
>> need to slow slightly at elevation changes or something. At first, you may
>> be stumbling and it may be frustrating. You may even take a fall. but
>> things do get better, a lot better.
>>
>>>
>>> Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>>>
>> Please reach out with any further questions.
>>
>>> Very best wishes,
>>> Sandra.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Sandra Gayer DipABRSM, LRSM.
>>>
>>> Soprano Singer
>>> www.sandragayer.com
>>>
>>> Broadcast Presenter
>>> www.rnibconnectradio.org.uk/music-box.html
>>>
>>> Actor
>>> www.visablepeople.com
>>>
>>> Voiceover Artist
>>> www.archangelvoices.co.uk/content/sandra-gayer
>>>
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>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Best,
>>
>> Nimer Jaber
>>
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>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 8
>> Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 17:05:28 -0700
>> From: Peter Wolf <pwolf1 at wolfskills.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: [NAGDU] Does anyone have this (service dog) information?
>> Message-ID: <628273B6-B6CB-4B94-B697-49C680FBC5BD at wolfskills.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>
>> Hi friends,
>>
>> We?re going back over to Europe soon. We?ve had successful experiences
>> there.
>>
>> As you know, Metukah works with my vision. That?s obvious because of my
>> cane and gear. But as I?ve mentioned, my wife also teams with a working
>> dog. But it?s for head injury/navigation issues, not vision. We recently
>> heard that in Europe, someone had an access issue (in a couple of locations)
>> where they were told their dog?s vest had ?the wrong color?. I?ve never
>> heard of this, except recently. In eight working team years, none of us
>> have had that issue here, or when we?ve travelled. At least not yet.
>> Frankly, it?s all about the working relationship, not a vest, to us. We
>> wouldn?t care if changing colors helped us out there, where there is a
>> narrower access window than we have here. (For example, service or not,
>> we?ll pay a ?dog fee? for hotels. However, many of them are dog friendly.
>> Here in the US because of ?pet? behavior, we only tell a hotel we?re coming
>> with a working dog *after* being assigned a clean room, so we don?t get a
>> room that dogs have misbehaved in). Anyhow, do any of you know about this,
>> and what ?color? seems to be more culturally acceptable over there in the
>> EU, or specific counries within it? We?re going to Switzerland, Italy, and
>> possibly France and Germany on the back end. I would never put up with this
>> here, but rules are different over there.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Peter
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 9
>> Date: Thu, 9 May 2019 21:26:28 -0400
>> From: Danielle Sykora <dsykora29 at gmail.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Does anyone have this (service dog) information?
>> Message-ID: <F820777A-3413-4AF3-B4D7-535DF3EF38DC at gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>
>> This isn't really answering your question, but I was just told less than a
>> week ago that my dog wasn't a service dog because her vest wasn't a specific
>> color, in the US. Well she doesn't wear a vest at all if we are being
>> technical. I know a service dog handler with a psychiatric service dog who
>> spent a semester in Italy last year and she didn't run into any situation
>> where the color of the vest was brought up.
>> You might find that if a particular country has service dogs primarily from
>> one program, people might be more familiar with whatever color that program
>> uses.
>> Danielle
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On May 9, 2019, at 8:05 PM, Peter Wolf via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi friends,
>>>
>>> We?re going back over to Europe soon. We?ve had successful experiences
>>> there.
>>>
>>> As you know, Metukah works with my vision. That?s obvious because of my
>>> cane and gear. But as I?ve mentioned, my wife also teams with a working
>>> dog. But it?s for head injury/navigation issues, not vision. We recently
>>> heard that in Europe, someone had an access issue (in a couple of
>>> locations) where they were told their dog?s vest had ?the wrong color?.
>>> I?ve never heard of this, except recently. In eight working team years,
>>> none of us have had that issue here, or when we?ve travelled. At least
>>> not yet. Frankly, it?s all about the working relationship, not a vest, to
>>> us. We wouldn?t care if changing colors helped us out there, where there
>>> is a narrower access window than we have here. (For example, service or
>>> not, we?ll pay a ?dog fee? for hotels. However, many of them are dog
>>> friendly. Here in the US because of ?pet? behavior, we only tell a hotel
>>> we?re coming with a working dog *after* being assigned a clean room, so we
>>> don?t get a room that dogs have misbehaved in). Anyhow, do any of you
>>> know about this, and what ?color? seems to be more culturally acceptable
>>> over there in the EU, or specific counries within it? We?re going to
>>> Switzerland, Italy, and possibly France and Germany on the back end. I
>>> would never put up with this here, but rules are different over there.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Peter
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> NAGDU:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/dsykora29%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Subject: Digest Footer
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NAGDU mailing list
>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
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>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> End of NAGDU Digest, Vol 170, Issue 9
>> *************************************
>>
> Hello, Sandra.
> I have had my guide dog for 4 years now and, believe it or not, I was
> visually impaired for 15 years before I decided to get a guide. When I
> first got her, I was so nervous because I felt like my travel control
> was out of my hands and in this animal. But, the way they train them,
> and most importantly the bond you will grow with your guide, makes it
> really pleasurable. I wanted to add that whenever we come to a decline
> in the sidewalk, incline, a bump in the sidewalk, and even obstacles
> on the walk (sticks, piles of leaves, etc.), Becky will stop. When she
> stops, I drag my foot from straight out and pull it back in to me.
> This way, I can feel what is in front of us. If I don't feel anything,
> I use my cane, feel what is in front of us, and give her the "forward"
> command to keep going. She will walk us around the obstacle, and we
> are on our way. Becky will even stop and "show" me if there are
> low-hanging branches branches from a tree. It took quite a while for
> me to become comfortable with all of this, but I can travel faster,
> and don't feel vulnerable when I travel.
> Take your time to make this decision for your life. Take care and keep
> us updated on your decisions.
> Elise and Becky
>
> _______________________________________________
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