[NAGDU] [GuideDogs] applying for a guide dog

Dan Weiner dcwein at dcwein.cnc.net
Sun Sep 1 21:45:49 UTC 2019


Well I have met people who are excellent guide dog travelers who feel 
uncomfortable or  don't do as well with a cane...but still I do agree 
with he general consensus, you need to have some knowledge of your 
surroundings to orient or is it orientate? yourself.


Dan


On 9/1/2019 4:14 PM, Marianne      via NAGDU wrote:
> I totally agree with Dave here. There have been many times throughout my over 30 years of owning a guide dog that I have had to use a cane. Those cane skills and my orientation skills allow me to be an excellent traveler with my guide dog. It does nothing but enhance my skills.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Sep 1, 2019, at 1:50 PM, David Andrews via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>
>> You said "I always do sighted guide except for O&M."  If you don't practice with the cane you will never be any good.  You may say, it doesn't matter since I intend to get a dog. I think the better you are with a cane -- the better you w2ill be with a dog!
>>
>> Dave
>>
>> At 06:18 PM 8/29/2019, you wrote:
>>> Hi all,
>>> Thank you for your thoughts, I really appreaciate it.
>>> I just wanted to clarify some things.
>>> I'm waiting for my instructor to tell me that I'm ready for a guide dog, I
>>> don't want to apply and then find out that I'm not ready for a guide dog.
>>> My instructor wasn't doing an assessment, we've been having regular lessons
>>> together for a while. I always do sighted guide except of course during O&M
>>> lessons of course. I'm honestly fine with my pace, it's my instructor who
>>> wants me to walk faster. I don't know how long my cane is; it's comfortable
>>> for me to use though. I understand the O&M concepts, I've been getting
>>> training for years. The 3 routes thing is from GDF not from my instructor.
>>> Mike, I've done tones and tones of research to decide on GDF, and I'm not
>>> going to apply to other schools just to apply to other schools. GDF is the
>>> only one that appeals to me.  Hope this helps
>>> Madison
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: GuideDogs at yahoogroups.com [mailto:GuideDogs at yahoogroups.com]
>>> Sent: August-29-19 5:40 PM
>>> To: GuideDogs at yahoogroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: [GuideDogs] applying for a guide dog
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The cane is their bread and butter.
>>>
>>> I think it is good to have both skills. However, I am a really bad cane
>>> traveler.
>>>
>>> Give me a dog any day!
>>>
>>> Truie
>>>
>>> From: GuideDogs at yahoogroups.com [mailto:GuideDogs at yahoogroups.com]
>>> Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 5:49 PM
>>> To: GuideDogs at yahoogroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: [GuideDogs] applying for a guide dog
>>>
>>> Hi Madison, Your instructor is, frankly, way off. First, people walk all
>>> different speeds with their dogs-some extremely slow, some extremely fast
>>> and most of us somewhere in between. Further more, a dog is not limited to
>>> only one speed. Sometimes, I fly around with my dogs, almost at a fast jog
>>> or slow run; sometimes, we walk like the old lady that I sometimes am. It
>>> sounds like when you walk with a sighted person, you feel more confident vs.
>>> when you walk by yourself. Therefore, it stands to reason that you have the
>>> ability to walk faster, and you simply would do that once you trust your dog
>>> and feel confident he/she can guide you as well, probably better, than these
>>> sighted guides. Nevertheless, if you always walked at a very slow speed, or
>>> a very fast one, dogs also walk at different speeds. My Radar and Chelsea
>>> had two speeds: extremely fast or asleep. <LOL> I was young, energetic and a
>>> little crazy and I flew right along with them.
>>>
>>> Noah and Angel walked at a more reasonable pace and were usually steady, but
>>> happy to speed up a bit if we needed too or slow down.
>>>
>>> Cheddar loves to fly but is disciplined enough that he can slow it down when
>>> need be.
>>>
>>> As for applying to GDF or any other school, what are you waiting for?
>>> You've been talking about this for several years now. You're not going to be
>>> accepted at GDF or any other school the day your application hits their
>>> desk-it takes time, perhaps another year or more to get into a school. I
>>> would think you'd have more than enough time given that time-frame to
>>> complete the three routes your mobility instructor deems to be so important.
>>>
>>> Furthermore, your instructor is, obviously, pretty darn ignorant about what
>>> a dog guide can do and so the school will be a better source of when you are
>>> "ready" to begin guide dog work. Applicants have been told that they need
>>> more work, to become more confident-whatever, and you'd not be the first or
>>> last for that if, indeed, it happened.
>>>
>>> It seems to me it's time to get serious about whether you really, really
>>> want a dog guide or not. If not, that's fine; however, just make that
>>> decision without all these excuses and delays.
>>>
>>> Maybe spending a little more time with people who have and work dogs would
>>> be helpful and a lot less time listening to some mobility instructor who,
>>> apparently, slept right through the education, experience and training about
>>> guide dogs. <sigh>
>>>
>>> Historicly, and apparently still, O&M instructors have not been overly
>>> enthusiastic about dog guide work. They learned the cane, seem to prefer the
>>> cane and seem to endorse the cane over a dog guide. I'm not sure why this is
>>> as they do receive dog guide instruction and education, and there is no
>>> reason in the world an O&M can not work with a student using a dog but, for
>>> whatever reason, this mentality remains.
>>>
>>> Jessie L. Rayl, Ed.D., LPC
>>>
>>> <mailto:Jrayl114 at comcast.net> Jrayl114 at comcast.net
>>>
>>> FB: Eaglewings10
>>>
>>> From: GuideDogs at yahoogroups.com [mailto:GuideDogs at yahoogroups.com]
>>> Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 5:53 AM
>>> To: GuideDogs at yahoogroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: [GuideDogs] applying for a guide dog
>>>
>>> Hi Madison,
>>> Just what do you think a guide dog is, if not a sighted guide?
>>> The word guide should give you a clue.
>>>
>>> Really, this is ridiculous, and I have to agree with David, perhaps your
>>> continuing mobility training is doing nothing but fattening the instructor's
>>>
>>> wallet.
>>>
>>> Oh yes, it may be getting you out of the house and allowing you to become
>>> familiar with the streets in your neighborhood, but you are learning those
>>> routs with a cane, not a dog.
>>> With a cane you tend to rely on land marks, things your cane hits along the
>>> way.
>>> A dog is going to take you around and past those landmarks treating them as
>>> obstacles to be avoided.
>>>
>>> As for your walking speed:
>>> In my last class, I was first given a little female that I had to push down
>>> the sidewalk, and even once drag across the street because she was just too
>>> darn slow.
>>> When the senior trainer asked me what I thought of her, my response was,
>>> "She's a good dog, just not the right one for me."
>>> I was allowed to do what I called test drive two other dogs.
>>> The first one was faster than the female but when urged to get along and
>>> move faster, the only thing that sped up was his tail wagging.
>>> He was in permanent meander down the street mode.
>>> When I told Baron "Forward" he picked right up, and I knew I was going for a
>>>
>>> walk.
>>> Halfway down the first block I said to the trainer, "Now there's the pull I
>>> was looking for."
>>> Not only was his pull just right, but I could feel every move he made as he
>>> avoided things along the rout.
>>>
>>> Some dogs walk faster than do others, just like people, and any school worth
>>>
>>> their salt knows that and trains each dog accordingly.
>>>
>>> Maybe you should spend more time walking with your instructor as the guide
>>> instead of getting used to what's around you with a cane.
>>>
>>> And what's this learning three routs about?
>>>
>>> I'm just wondering about this entire set-up someone talked you into.
>>>
>>> PJ.
>>>
>>> ----Original Message-----
>>> From: 'Madison Martin' maddymartin at mymts.net [GuideDogs]
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 28, 2019 6:59 PM
>>> To: friends at guidedogs.groups.io ; chat at guidedogusersinc.org ;
>>> GuideDogs at yahoogroups.com ; 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of
>>>
>>> Guide Dog Users'
>>> Subject: [GuideDogs] applying for a guide dog
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>> I just wanted to clearify something. I'm not actually currently applying to
>>> GDF because I have to work more on my O&M before I can apply. That's what my
>>> O&M instructor told me. I need to work mainly on my confidence and my pace,
>>> I'm a slow walker (except when I'm walking sighted guide). My instructor
>>> told me that my slow pace won't work with a guide dog. However, when my
>>> instructor tells me that I'm ready (and once I have 3 routes) then I'm
>>> deffenetly applying to GDF. I just thought that I should clearify things, in
>>> case anyone thought that I am actually currently going through GDFs
>>> application process.
>>> Madison
>>
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