[NAGDU] Seeking Feedback Re: Traveling in unfamiliar Areas

Tue Dec 14 16:37:06 UTC 2021

Hi Diane,

You have gotten some great information about using a GPS to assist
with planning new routes. I think if you venture out a little bit,
even if it is just a short walk to an unfamiliar location in your
neighborhood, it will really increase your confidence. Some dogs also
show less distraction when they have more mental stimulation, so it
might even help your dog too.

As for her sniffing, people, and dog distractions, there are a lot of
things you can do to improve that. First, I would try introducing the
Gentle Leader to her from the beginning, as if this were a brand new
tool she has never experienced. Some dogs legitimately don't benefit
from the GL, but some just develop a negative association with it that
can be improved. Try putting it on her (without a leash attached)
right before you feed her, let her eat her meals with it on, and
remove it as soon as she is done. You can do this for a week or so.
Then try putting it on her for short periods of time with the leash
attached. Maybe practice heeling around your house and asking for some
obedience behaviors, and intermittently give her food rewards when she
doesn't try to rub her head against things. Then try going outside and
heeling up and down the sidewalk. You want to give food frequently at
first to create a very positive association, and then you can
gradually reduce the food. Next put it on for short periods of time
while she is working. You can gradually decrease the time she wears
the GL. Also, don't take it off until she is still. Removing the GL
while she is rubbing her face against things will reinforce that
rubbing her face against you will result in you taking off the GL.
Some dogs take to head collars in just a few sessions, while other
dogs need weeks of gradual introduction to be truly comfortable with
it. Also, acclimation to a head collar is most successful when the dog
wears the head collar on a somewhat regular basis. If the dog was
desensitized to wearing a head collar but then you don't use one for
six months, you will probably need to start over. I like to put a head
collar on my dogs a few times a month even if they don't necessarily
need it at the time, just to keep them used to wearing it.

If the GL really ends up being more of a distraction than a help, the
next best thing for sniffing in particular is a collar that sits up
high on the neck along with holding the leash in your right hand. If
you hold the leash in your right hand in the places your dog is most
likely to sniff, you can correct the instant she starts to turn her
head. If the leash is in your left hand, she will be able to turn her
head and sniff for a couple seconds (and thus self reward) before you
can correct with your left hand. If you are using a martingale, you
can tighten it a little to help it stay up higher on her neck. Putting
a flat collar lower on the neck is also a really easy way to keep a
martingale, and in some cases even a slip chain, higher up on the
neck. A prong collar also works well for this. Prongs are actually not
cruel like a lot of people believe, but I wouldn't recommend using one
without knowing the propper fit or on a very sensitive dog.

There are a lot of ways to work on people and dog distractions, but I
don't really want to get into that without knowing the strength and
particulars of your dog's distraction. If it is really an issue for
your safety and public perception of her behavior, contacting the
program for help would be a good choice. You can politely let them
know you didn't feel comfortable with your instructor, so they can
find someone else to assist you. An in person visit from another
instructor may or may not be possible depending on geography, but they
may very well be able to have another instructor provide some tips via
phone, email, or video chat.

Good luck,
Danielle

On 12/14/21, Richard via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 	Hi Diane;
> Gps can be a big help but it certainly isn't the total answer.  It will
> often give you a route from one destination to another which will work but
> other routes may be less complicated.  There is an app called blind square
> that I haven't tried that friends say is a good gps app for a i-phone.  I
> personally am using a gps made by humanware which is a stand alone unit.  I
> like the treck primarily because I don't have to work with my touch screen
> if I want to make some changes while on route.  Its rather pricey so I'd
> start out with an app or two for your phone.
> As for convention, I have had instructors say that convention is a very
> stressful time for dogs partially because the area is unfamiliar to both
> you
> and your dog and there are lots of distracting people and dogs around to
> complicate the situation.  Don't be to hard on yourself, think of travel as
> a great adventure.  Who knows what interesting things you might find if you
> get lost?
> Richard
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Diane Graves via NAGDU
> Sent: Monday, December 13, 2021 10:38 PM
> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: rdgraves2007 at gmail.com
> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Seeking Feedback Re: Traveling in unfamiliar Areas
>
> This is awesome information Tracy! I am excited to check out some of these
> apps and the  website you referenced. Thank you so much!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via
> NAGDU
> Sent: Monday, December 13, 2021 9:46 AM
> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Seeking Feedback Re: Traveling in unfamiliar Areas
>
> Hi Diane.
> I want to add a couple things about convention I forgot to say.
> Some people choose not to take their dog to convention.  They don't want to
> deal with relieving, sniffing, dog distractions, etc.  Or they feel that
> their dog may find the crowds with lots of canes too stressful.  It's an
> option.
> Also, all the larger schools send reps to convention, and graduates can
> arrange an appointment to get help with whatever during convention.  Some
> people also use it to get a Juno walk or check out another school, if
> they're considering switching.
>
> About GPS:
> I use an iPhone.  There are also apps for Android, but I don't know them.
> I use an app called Nearby Explorer.  I've also used BlindSquare.  They
> both
> work similarly.  They tell me what street I'm walking on, what street is
> coming up, what direction I'm headed, and nearby points of interest, though
> sometimes "nearby" is not actually true.  They don't tell me if a street
> has
> a sidewalk, or if there are traffic signals.  Nearby Explorer can give
> directions to a place, but, even when I choose walking directions, it may
> tell me to cross a busy street at a place where there is no traffic signal.
>
> It can also be a bit distracting at first.  I used to stop and mess with
> the
> app, getting it started, and my dog would stand there wondering why we
> weren't moving.  But now I'm a bit smoother at starting it in a place where
> it won't confuse him.
> I mainly use it to tell where I am in an unfamiliar area where I know where
> I'm going, generally, and how to get there, but don't know all the street
> names or perhaps when I've reached the street I want.
>
> Apple-vis.com is a site for blind iPhone users that has reviews and
> comments
> about accessibility of lots of apps, including GPS.  It's a tremendous
> resource.
> Tracy
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Diane Graves via
> NAGDU
> Sent: Sunday, December 12, 2021 10:00 PM
> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
> Cc: rdgraves2007 at gmail.com
> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Seeking Feedback Re: Traveling in unfamiliar Areas
>
> Thank you so much for this Tracy. This is really helpful. Can you explain
> how you, as a blind person, use GPS? Is there an app for your phone that is
> user friendly for the blind? I guess I always thought GPS consisted of a
> bunch of maps and outlines and similar graphics? Which GPS method do you
> use?
>
> Thanks so much again,
> Diane Graves
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via
> NAGDU
> Sent: Sunday, December 12, 2021 9:24 AM
> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Seeking Feedback Re: Traveling in unfamiliar Areas
>
> Hi Diane.
> I'm sorry your first guide dog experience hasn't been all one might wish,
> and especially sorry to hear you had a bad fall.  And yet you have
> persevered!
> How is your dog at following?  In large, unfamiliar airports, I usually ask
> for help when I'm checking in, or when I arrive at the airport, if I've
> checked in on line.  Airports have people whose job it is to help people
> get
> places.  They'll give you a person, and then the dog follows him/her to
> where you need to go.  I usually tip the person when we've gotten to the
> gate I need.  You can do the same when you get out of the plane, or you can
> just follow the crowd, who are all headed down to baggage and outside, same
> as you.  If I'm uncertain, I ask someone passing by, and they usually set
> me
> straight.  They may even be headed the same place as I am, so I can follow
> them.
>
> Convention hotels are usually very big and somewhat confusing, but there
> are
> lots of people to ask directions from.  There's usually some orientation
> info in the agenda too, and I think I remember an orientation walk as one
> of
> the first events, too.  Anyway, I take deep breaths to stay calm, listen up
> for clues, ask directions, and always stay patient with my dog, and it all
> works out.
>
> You could practice going new places in your town.  Walk somewhere you
> usually don't, for instance.  GPS can be helpful when doing this, though
> you
> still have to pay attention, because it won't tell you if an area has
> sidewalks or traffic signals.  But it can be fun.  And I used to do it
> without GPS, just remembering how far I'd gone in a direction, so, if I had
> to, I could turn around and retrace my route.  It can be fun.
>
> Sometimes, when I'm looking at doing something new or going some place that
> sounds complicated, I get all anxious.  Then I do it and it's fine, and I
> feel a bit silly for worrying about it, but I also feel joyously free.  "I
> was worried, but I did it, and it was good!"  It's empowering.
> Tracy
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Diane Graves via
> NAGDU
> Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2021 10:56 PM
> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
> Cc: rdgraves2007 at gmail.com
> Subject: [NAGDU] Seeking Feedback Re: Traveling in unfamiliar Areas
>
> Good Evening All,
>
>
>
> I must admit that I am a little hesitant to post this here, as I know there
> are many more confident and well seasoned guide dog users in this forum
> making me a bit concerned about expressing my vulnerabilities. (smile)
> However I am hoping I can get some pointers which will increase my comfort
> level as I prepare to travel to the national convention in July.
>
>
>
> I'll first offer a bit of background, so that you'll have a clear
> understanding of my situation. I can't recall whether I have posted this
> here before as I am on several groups pertinent to guide dog users, so my
> apologies for any redundancies.
>
>
>
> I didn't decide to transition from cane to dog until I was in my fifties. I
> requested home training at the time, because my husband was in poor health,
> and I didn't want to be gone for weeks at a time. I now believe that this
> was likely a huge mistake for my first dog. I didn't have a good rapport
> with the instructor who was sent, as he was very condescending and
> intimidating from the start. Suffice it to say, I probably didn't get the
> intensity of training that I needed.
>
>
>
> My girl and I have been together for going on five years now, and the
> learning curve has been slow. We've made progress, but, for the most part,
> we have traveled in areas  which are familiar to me. We did experience a
> pretty severe fall, a couple of months into our relationship, which I now
> think was largely my own fault. I think she was trying to worn me of some
> steps that I wasn't aware of, and I wasn't picking up on the cue. That did
> little to increase my confidence, and so there is a fear that still lingers
> in unfamiliar environments. I have not traveled with her in large airports,
> or unfamiliar cities. Mostly we travel to and from work and to the
> occasional restaurant and/or medical appointment.
>
> Izzo is a big "sniffer" and is easily distracted by other dogs and people.
> Putting the gentle leader on her almost makes things worse. She hates it
> and
> will begin rubbing her face on me and everything else in her reach trying
> to
> get it off.
>
>
>
> I am really anxious about traveling to the convention in New Orleans this
> summer and keeping us both safe. I would appreciate any pointers or
> feedback
> on how I might best prepare for this, and increase my level of competence.
>
>
>
> Thanks In Advance,
>
> Diane Graves
>
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