[NAGDU] Seeing Eye

Mon Mar 18 15:21:01 UTC 2024

I read the first version of Love in the Lead on Talking Book probably in 
the fall of 1979, soon after getting Orin.  I was in NFB about 
two-and-a-half years by then and had been to my first national 
convention.  I remember thinking that the blindness philosophies of the 
two outfits were quite similar, the difference being The Seeing Eye's 
focus on using the guide dog.  I was pleased.

Al

On 3/16/24 01:39, Bonnie Mosen via NAGDU wrote:
> If I'm remembering correctly, it may be on that bone shaped USB drive they give out in class, and I think it used to be on the website, and there are Braille copies in the ancient library at TSE.
> Not only is Love in the Lead a great history of TSE and the guide dog movement, but it tells how the blindness agencies in the US at that time were against what TSE was doing to empower blind people.
> TSE in some respects was truly the first rehab training center even though that wasn't it's purpose.
> Staff had to teach students how to eat and gave women makeup and dressing tips.
> I've heard over the years, but I have no actual evidence of this that this is where some of the NFB's early  philosophy may have come from. Something to do with the formality of calling people Mr. and Ms.
> Cheers
> Bonnie and Eclipse
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Buddy Brannan via NAGDU
> Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2024 4:13 PM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Buddy Brannan <buddy at brannan.name>
> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Seeing Eye
>
> It’s by Peter Putnam, and it’s on BARD. A couple recordings of it, in fact. Seeing Eye used to have a plain text version availble. I have it, not sure if it’s still available from TSE as plain text or not.
>
>
> --
> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV, WRVB670 - Erie, PA
> Email: buddy at brannan.name
> Mobile: (814) 431-0962
>
>
>
>
>> On Mar 15, 2024, at 9:12 PM, Lyn Gwizdak via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>
>> Hi guys,
>>
>> This is great reading about TSE from many graduates. It was 1993 when
>> the first renovation happened. They put a whole new second floor dorm
>> wing expanding the number of student rooms so they no longer had to
>> have 2 people to a room anymore.
>>
>> There's a book about the history of TSE called "Love in the Lead: the
>> 50 year history". Forgot who wrote it.  The book was originally
>> written for TSE 50th anniversary. It has been updated since then. It
>> is available at the school. If anyone wants to read it, call the
>> school. It may be on BARD or from an NLS library for the Blind. I have
>> the print paperback version since I can read regular books with my
>> magnifying glasses. There's great old photos in it.
>>
>> Lyn and Aristotle
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 15, 2024, 8:46 AM Vanessa Lowery via NAGDU
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Dave and I were in class together when he got vanilla. Oh but the
>>> story that I can tell about the employee who worked at The Seeing Eye
>>> who lost his dog. It's a long story so here goes. David had gone into
>>> his room and I guess thought he had put the dog on tiedown. Or at a
>>> minimum had closed his door all the way and was just letting the dog
>>> hang out in the room. Well, his door was not closed all the way. So
>>> unboned Dave, who was beginning to lose his hearing, vanilla snuck
>>> out. Vanilla had it into the room of another student (room unoccupied
>>> at that moment), and stole that students dogs nail bone.
>>>
>>> Vanilla was found by housecleaning staff out in the hallway enjoying
>>> said Nyla bone. Dog was collected and handed over to an instructor.
>>> Bone was collected and taken down into the office that the instructor
>>> used at that time affectionately known as the swamp (Bonnie, you
>>> would remember the swamp).
>>>
>>> Student and dog and who's running the invasion theft had taken place
>>> returned to their room only to find that they couldn't find the not bone.
>>> So Joan Markey is summoned to look for the bone in the room. No luck.
>>> Joan goes down into the swamp, find an bone that wasn't there before,
>>> and determined that it was probably the missing bone.
>>>
>>> In the meantime, Dave discovers that he's missing a dog. I was
>>> downstairs in the foyer waiting to be picked up to go to church. I
>>> hear somebody creeping down the stairs and in a loud whisper calling
>>> the dog. Of course, I am sitting in the foyer many many feet away
>>> hearing this and quietly laughing. Especially because it was Dave.
>>>
>>> Dave disappeared back upstairs, at at some point, he and Van were
>>> reunited. Fast-forward to lunchtime. Dave, Joan, and I sat at the
>>> same table. Or at least I think Dave was also at the table. Anyway at
>>> least most of the involved parties were there, but gosh! That was in
>>> 2004. One of us started telling the story from one of the
>>> perspectives. I can't even remember which perspective. Missing dog,
>>> missing bone, or hearing Dave search for his dog without any luck. As
>>> we all told our segments of the story putting the entire situation
>>> together, our table was in stitches as we laughed and laughed. One of
>>> the funniest memories that I have ever had while at The Seeing Eye!
>>>
>>>
>>> Vanessa and the zoo
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>>> On Mar 15, 2024, at 2:28 AM, Bonnie Mosen via NAGDU
>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>> I met Mr. Whitstock in my first class. I think he had a Shepherd
>>>> named
>>> Meghan.
>>>> I believe he retired not long after that.
>>>> Dave Loux is such a nice guy.
>>>> He had Abigail when I first met him in 1990.
>>>> When I worked at TSE he had Alice and Vanilla. Vanilla was such a
>>>> sweet,
>>> funny dog.
>>>> She would steal yvonna's toys, and one day after all the toys were
>>>> gone
>>> she tried to take Yvonna.
>>>> I guess she thought the big fluffy golden was a toy dog.
>>>> Cheers
>>>> Bonnie and Eclipse
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Joy via NAGDU
>>>> Sent: Friday, March 15, 2024 11:25 AM
>>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>> Users' <
>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Cc: joy.relton at icloud.com
>>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Seeing Eye
>>>>
>>>> Oh yes, If I'm not mistaken he once had a Saluki which is an
>>>> Egyptian
>>> dog, I think.
>>>> Also do you remember Mr. Whitstock? For those who don't know these
>>> gentlemen, I believe were some of the first blind employees at The
>>> Seeing Eye. Of course, there have been and are others.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Margo Downey via
>>> NAGDU
>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2024 1:01 PM
>>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>> Users' <
>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Cc: Margo Downey <margo.downey at roadrunner.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Seeing Eye
>>>>
>>>> Oh, I remember Zilla and David. Awesome people.
>>>>
>>>> Margo and Tami
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Buddy
>>> Brannan via NAGDU
>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2024 3:50 PM
>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>> Cc: Buddy Brannan
>>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Seeing Eye
>>>>
>>>> Zilla was a sweetheart. Maybe retired when I got Chet, but even if
>>>> she
>>> wasn’t, she was definitely in evidence and was absolutely delightful.
>>> And yeah, David Loux. Great guy.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV, WRVB670 - Erie, PA
>>>> Email: buddy at brannan.name
>>>> Mobile: (814) 431-0962
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Mar 14, 2024, at 2:33 PM, Vanessa Lowery via NAGDU
>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>>> I never met more Frank, but my best friend in North Carolina (my
>>>>> home
>>> state) did get to meet him. Did Krokus was there when I was in
>>> training with my first dog in 1982. So was Dan Booke pronounced
>>> Booker). I never worked with Roger Taylor in class. Nor did I do so
>>> with Gary Matoon. But I did get to know both of them. Gary was a
>>> hoot, and I must confess, I never was one of the victims of a Roger
>>> Taylor prank, but I'm sure that he could be quite ingenious about it.
>>> An and then there was absolutely sweet, gracious ROBERT Woodstock.
>>> What a gentleman. and David Loux. And for us dinosaurs, how many of
>>> you remember the person on the housekeeping staff, zilla husbands.
>>> She had the most wonderful laugh, so we would all do anything to get
>>> her to laugh. And then there was Paul Parsley, the school mom! You either loved her or hated her, but you grew to respect her.
>>>>>
>>>>> Vanessa and the zoo
>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mar 14, 2024, at 1:57 PM, Joy via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>> Hi Jessica,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My first class was in 1976. I didn't meet Mr. Frank. I did meet Mr.
>>> Crocus and Mr. Debeta. Of course, I also got to know Mr. Gary Mattoon.
>>> Please forgive my spelling in the names. Mr. Mattoon trained my
>>> second dog Zenith but Lucas Franc trained Zenith and I together.
>>> Lucas used to call him Atoshi.
>>>>>> Mr. Roger Taylor my first trainer with Vicki (my first Vicki) was
>>>>>> a
>>> story teller. Since my dad was also a story teller I was right at
>>> home. He was also a practical joker. He once swopped the harness of a
>>> 1 hundred pound shepherd for a 40 pound shepherd during dinner. In
>>> those days, I can't remember if we still do this, we hung our dogs'
>>> harness on the back of our chair during dinner when we first started
>>> using them because they were stiff and hadn't yet gotten enough softening by the saddle soap.
>>> Anyway, the man who used the larger shepherd was a very tall man from
>>> Louisiana and he has the wonderful slow southern accent. The woman
>>> who had been matched with the smaller shepherd, and my roommate, was
>>> a smaller woman from Canada. When we got up to leave after dinner and
>>> began to put on our dogs' harnesses I can still hear Joe say
>>> "something sure is wrong here because there's no way this is gonna fit on my dog."
>>>>>> In those days everyone was called by their last names. It was to
>>> maintain an atmosphere of respect.
>>>>>> Once when I was walking down the street with Vicki a man came up
>>>>>> to me
>>> and told me that he was with the police and  wondered if I had a
>>> license to operate my dog. I sputtered for a while and then asked "do you know Mr.
>>> Roger Taylor?". The man started laughing.
>>>>>> There are some things which have changed and become more modern at
>>>>>> The
>>> Seeing Eye, but, to me, the one thing that remains the same is the
>>> emphasis on quality of breeding and training of dogs. In my
>>> experience, if you come with an attitude that you want to learn how
>>> to work with your new partner and ask lots of questions you end up
>>> with a partner who will work with you for years. There are going to
>>> be some partnerships which don't work, but I believe that it is the
>>> minority of the partnership. Of course, that isn't much comfort if you are the one experiencing the issue at the time.
>>>>>> Also, in 2005 I collapsed with a burst aneurism in my brain and
>>>>>> was in
>>> intensive care for a month and then in rehab for another month before
>>> I came home. My husband called The Seeing Eye and got advice as to
>>> what to do to help Belle adjust to the new situation. The support was
>>> incredible.  I was not aware of anything for about a month but my
>>> husband had the support that he needed. Once I began to recover The
>>> Seeing Eye was there to support Belle and I as we began to work together again.
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Jessica Sears
>>>>>> via NAGDU
>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2024 6:54 AM
>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>> Users <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Cc: Jessica Sears <jlsears86 at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Seeing Eye
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am so fascinated by old Seeing Eye stories we are sharing. I
>>>>>> would
>>> love to hear more from people on how things really have changed from
>>> early 80's to now. I wonder if anyone is here that met the real Morris?
>>>>>> Jess
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, Mar 14, 2024 at 12:49 AM Suzette May via NAGDU
>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi Everyone,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I went to The Seeing Eye in September/October of 2022 for my
>>>>>>> guide, a large, long, male Sable German Shepherd named Boden.  I
>>>>>>> had Lukas Franck as my instructor and Joan Markey was our class manager.
>>>>>>> Anyone remember the high school route? Well, Lukas was quite fond
>>>>>>> of that one and I think I did that beast about 3 or 4 times. They
>>>>>>> haven't had that as a route for years but we did it.  I think
>>>>>>> that thing was uphill both ways.  It sure felt like it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As far as retirements go,  I know Lukas retired at the end of
>>> September.
>>>>>>> Lee Johnson retired earlier in 2023, I think. I was sad to hear
>>>>>>> Jeff McMullen retired. Joan Markey started at The Seeing Eye
>>>>>>> within a few years of Lukas so that might happen in a year or two.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nice to see all the different schools on here.  It's interesting
>>>>>>> hearing everyones stories.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Suzette May*
>>>>>>> *PS139.13 at gmail.com <PS139.13 at gmail.com>*
>>>>>>> *512-564-0152*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 13, 2024 at 1:00 PM Julie A. Orozco via NAGDU <
>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi everyone,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thank you for all the comments about Seeing Eye. It is great to
>>>>>>>> know I
>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>>> have an excellent class manager who will answer questions and
>>>>>>>> listen to concerns. I'll tell a little more of my story below in
>>>>>>>> case more reassurances are forth coming.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I retired my second dog in the fall of 2021 shortly before my
>>>>>>>> daughter
>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>> born. I did not complete the application process for my third
>>>>>>>> dog for a while after that because well, motherhood. So I
>>>>>>>> haven't worked a dog in almost 2 and a half years, which is the
>>>>>>>> longest I've gone without the harness in my hand since 2008. I
>>>>>>>> only had to wait like 5 months between
>>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>> first and second dogs.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> My life has changed completely in the last several years. I am a
>>>>>>>> mom of a toddler now, and I feel like I need a unicorn of a dog.
>>>>>>>> I live outside of Washington DC and take the metro a lot, walk a
>>>>>>>> ton, and definitely deal with plenty of chaos and crowds. But I
>>>>>>>> need a dog that will be gentle and forgiving of my toddler and
>>>>>>>> tolerant of young children in general, since
>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>> looks like we'll be taking her to day care on a daily basis.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I am so nervous. Not only do I feel like I'm looking for a dog
>>>>>>>> that might not exist, but I also fear a mismatch. I know
>>>>>>>> everyone has them, but I haven't had one yet. My first two dogs
>>>>>>>> were great matches, and my second dog in particular was an
>>>>>>>> amazing worker and could pretty much read my mind.
>>>>>>> So,
>>>>>>>> I'm not sure I can get that level of awesome in a dog again. The
>>>>>>>> Seeing
>>>>>>> Eye
>>>>>>>> is a new school for me, and although I've seen great dogs come
>>>>>>>> out of there, I'm still nervous. I will be spending three weeks
>>>>>>>> away from my family to
>>>>>>> do
>>>>>>>> this, and I want that time to count.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There is truly nothing like working a dog though. Even with the
>>>>>>>> rideshare denials and the airline forms, I have to do it. I have
>>>>>>>> to try and do my best to make it work. I do plan on asking lots
>>>>>>>> of questions when I'm there,
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> I'm not shy. So hopefully that will help.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm so glad there are so many happy Seeing Eye graduates on this
>>> list.
>>>>>>>> Hearing about your experiences is definitely helping. So thank
>>>>>>>> you, and thanks for reading.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Julie
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Julie A. Orozco J.D.
>>>>>>>>
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