[NFB-Braille-Discussion] Reading Speed Increases

Sat Mar 18 20:12:51 UTC 2023

Free and low-cost legal services*

On 3/18/23, Sanho Steele-Louchart <sanho817 at gmail.com> wrote:
> For what it's worth, we can sue school districts for failing to
> provide an appropriate public education. It's just hard to find
> attorneys who want to put their time into something that might not net
> them money on the back end. I'm actively considering establishing a
> non-profit to offer free and low-cost to disabled people for this
> exact reason. Perhaps I'd never get one, but having grant-funded legal
> services for those cases that no one else will take for financial
> reasons could be a powerful tool.
>
> Sanho
>
> On 3/18/23, Debbie Gabe via NFB-Braille-Discussion
> <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> I think not based on any research, that many school kids have slow
>> braille
>> speeds because the teachers don't expect them to read faster. I have read
>> the articles that talk about how braille reading is slower than print
>> reading. But these articles were written by people who
>>  Did not know blind people really and had , once again, very low
>> expectations of them. Everything goes back to low expectations and
>> everyone
>> thinks being blind is bad, when if you have proper training, it's not so
>> bad
>> after all.
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: NFB-Braille-Discussion <nfb-braille-discussion-bounces at nfbnet.org>
>> On
>> Behalf Of Sanho Steele-Louchart via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>> Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2023 8:44 AM
>> To: NFB Braille Discussion List <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>> Cc: Sanho Steele-Louchart <sanho817 at gmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [NFB-Braille-Discussion] Reading Speed Increases
>>
>> As a teacher, it was appalling how often I heard TVI's say things
>> like, "The average braille reader reads at 104 words a minute, so we
>> stop teaching at 110."
>>
>> Great. So blind kids should be perpetual third graders. Got it.
>>
>> Sanho
>>
>> On 3/18/23, Debbie Gabe via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>> <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>> But most sighted people, including teachers, still think blind people
>>> aren't
>>> going to do anything, like get a job. They have very low expectations of
>>> their blind students.
>>>
>>> What is shameful is that many sighted teachers of the blind are taught
>>> braille in college using sight. They are not taught to read braille as
>>> blind
>>> people do. They have no idea how fast blind braille readers read and
>>> what
>>> techniques they use for the faster reading speds. They only know how
>>> sighted
>>> people  read braille with their eyes. That's why too often blind kids
>>> who
>>> do
>>> know braille read it with one finger and read very slow, and cannot read
>>> hard copy braille because they get lost on the page when tracking lines.
>>>
>>> A lot of our teachers get their training at a college in Portland. The
>>> woman
>>> who teaches braille is blind herself. But students use a print book and
>>> never feel braille and don't learn how blind people read it.  I guess
>>> that
>>> instructor has low expectations of her sighted graduate students also.
>>>
>>> So the teachers teach the kids braille uncontracted and then
>>> contractions
>>> and they help them with spelling and vocabulary in condjunction with the
>>> regular ed teachers. But when the kids know braille and how to spell,
>>> they
>>> don't continue their learning for more efficiency in reading. Not unless
>>> the
>>> parents know better and push it at their IEP meetings.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NFB-Braille-Discussion <nfb-braille-discussion-bounces at nfbnet.org>
>>> On
>>> Behalf Of Mike Jolls via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>> Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2023 7:35 AM
>>> To: NFB Braille Discussion List <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>> Cc: Mike Jolls <mrspock56 at hotmail.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [NFB-Braille-Discussion] Reading Speed Increases
>>>
>>> JODY
>>>
>>> What you relate is a crime.  That director, and maybe many educators,
>>> need
>>> their heads examined if they think being able to read like that is
>>> acceptable, or if they really think a person can function that way in
>>> the
>>> real world.  Working that way, you won’t be very productive, and you
>>> won’t
>>> last very long.
>>>
>>> To mitigate these attitudes by educators (probably not all, but maybe
>>> many)
>>> parents need to be educated about the possibilities that Braille, and
>>> speech
>>> and computers, brings.  They need to not hide their heads in the sand
>>> when
>>> they have an impaired child, but need to face the problem head on.  The
>>> parents need to understand Braille just as much as the child needs to
>>> understand it, so they can help them when needed.  And the parents need
>>> to
>>> be advocates for the kids.  They need to understand (for example) that a
>>> talking computer isn’t enough, or that reading 20 words a minute with
>>> print
>>> (even though the child can do it) will not help the child.  That way,
>>> when
>>> they hear a cock-and-bull story from an educator, they can tell whether
>>> what
>>> they’re hearing will help their child.
>>>
>>> OK, so you’re saying the parent’s division is the  place to go to help
>>> parents realize these things?  I’ll have to check that out on the NFB
>>> website.  As I said in an earlier email, I would like my experiences to
>>> help
>>> someone so they don’t have to go through the same things I did.
>>>
>>> Mike
>>>
>>> Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for
>>> Windows
>>>
>>> From: Jody ianuzzi via
>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion<mailto:nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Saturday, March 18, 2023 11:25 AM
>>> To: NFB Braille Discussion
>>> List<mailto:nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>> Cc: Jody ianuzzi<mailto:thunderwalker321 at gmail.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [NFB-Braille-Discussion] Reading Speed Increases
>>>
>>> Many years ago I once heard the Director of special education state that
>>> if
>>> a child can read one letter at a time on a CCTV then they don’t have to
>>> learn braille
>>>
>>> JODY
>>>
>>> To Boldly Go  🖖🏻
>>>
>>>
>>> thunderwalker321 at gmail.com
>>>
>>> "What's within you is stronger than what's in your way."  NO BARRIERS
>>> Erik
>>> Weihenmayer
>>>
>>>> On Mar 17, 2023, at 5:33 PM, Sanho Steele-Louchart via
>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Debbie,
>>>>
>>>> Love everything you said here, but wanted to point out that in fact,
>>>> the average sighted high school senior reads at a minimum of 250 words
>>>> a minute. 240 is actually considered slow for an adult. Source:
>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fschol
>>>> arwithin.com%2Faverage-reading-speed&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04de
>>>> fb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6381475
>>>> 35070848224%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMz
>>>> IiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=pS%2FssjNSuEPyl
>>>> aaWEvFaAEvQauC8RDVEQG%2Fefc%2Fk2Lo%3D&reserved=0
>>>>
>>>>> On 3/17/23, Debbie Gabe via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> Hi Mike,
>>>>> Very well said!
>>>>> I have RP and have been slowly going blind since age 13 or so, when
>>>>> "they"
>>>>> told me I needed glasses. But the glasses never helped so I never
>>>>> used them.
>>>>> I got my driver's license back than and luckily I never hit anybody,
>>>>> although I did have several fender benders. Finally in my 20's it was
>>>>> diagnosed correctly. Then in my late 30's I couldn't read normal size
>>>>> print without a hand held magnifier. Over the decades, I graduated to
>>>>> reading large print books with the magnifier in my hand and finally
>>>>> adding reading magnification glasses to that mix. I gave myself
>>>>> carpal tunnel syndrome from using the magnifier on long bus rides to
>>>>> work in the mornings. I gave myself a neck problem from trying to put
>>>>> my eyes closer to file drawers and computer desktop monitors to see
>>>>> them.  It was such a relief, like you described, when I finally
>>>>> learned braille.  Now I read braille between 40 to
>>>>> 90 words a minute, depending on how focused and alert I am.
>>>>>
>>>>> I once heard Jerry Whittle and Fred Schroeder say that it's difficult
>>>>> for people learning braille when "older" to break 100 words a minute.
>>>>> I keep pushing myself, but never cracked 100. But I'm happy if I can
>>>>> consistently read at 80 words a minute. They say you can read a
>>>>> speech and sound natural if you can read at 150. Sighted people who
>>>>> graduate high school and go to college read at 200 to 250 words a
>>>>> minute. Braille readers who learn when young can get up to 400 and
>>>>> above!
>>>>>
>>>>> The teachers of blind kids , many sighted,  are often very short
>>>>> sighted.
>>>>> They don't realize how reading enlarged print brings on headaches and
>>>>> eye strain and very very slow reading speeds.
>>>>> I used to talk with parents of blind kids about braille. And if I
>>>>> found out their kids were reading magnified print and not braille I
>>>>> suggested that they have teachers measure their reading speed and not
>>>>> compare the results with their "peers" but with the average kid at
>>>>> their grade level (that is sighted peers as opposed to partially
>>>>> blind peers). The parents were always shocked. But the teachers and
>>>>> initially the parents did not want their partially blind  kids to
>>>>> look "blind" by reading braille. But the teachers never told parents
>>>>> the truth and what the research says - that blind people who have
>>>>> satisfying well paid jobs are most likely to use braille on a daily
>>>>> basis.
>>>>>
>>>>> I am retired now, but I still talk to anyone I can about this short
>>>>> sightedness in Hawaii public school system because I think it's a
>>>>> tragedy.
>>>>> Many partially blind kids I have worked with after graduating high
>>>>> school hate reading and they do not read for pleasure ever. And I
>>>>> understand why.
>>>>>
>>>>> So I encourage you to read as much as you can. You can get magazines
>>>>> from NLS in braille. While NLS may have much more audio, I have been
>>>>> able to keep myself supplied in braille reading material.
>>>>> Also, the NFB at NFB.org can send you braille copies of their
>>>>> publications like the Braille Monitor, every month. It would take me
>>>>> more than a month to get through  them so they piled up in my dining
>>>>> room-lol.
>>>>>
>>>>> The thing about reading hard copy braille is that it's the best way
>>>>> to practice techniques for reading speed. But I'm sure you could also
>>>>> do it on a braille electronic display, although it might take longer.
>>>>> Good luck to you.
>>>>> Debbie
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Mike Jolls
>>>>> via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>> Sent: Friday, March 17, 2023 2:56 AM
>>>>> To: NFB Braille Discussion List <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Cc: Mike Jolls <mrspock56 at hotmail.com>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [NFB-Braille-Discussion] Reading Speed Increases
>>>>>
>>>>> Debbie Gabe
>>>>>
>>>>> I read your email with great interest.  I'm 66 years old.  I've been
>>>>> legally blind my entire life.  Due to the educational system I went
>>>>> through, I was taught to read print since I could see (although I'm
>>>>> severely nearsighted and my vision makes me a slow reader).  I did
>>>>> not have the opportunity to learn Braille in my early years.  Being a
>>>>> partially sighted person, the answer was always "make it bigger with
>>>>> magnification", "get a stronger pair of glasses", and so on.  This
>>>>> was the mentality of the sighted community because sight was what
>>>>> they understood.  And so I lived my life, until around age 50, after
>>>>> trying these methods over and over, that I realized that there was a
>>>>> limit to how well I could read if I used my vision.  It dawned on me
>>>>> that if I was ever going to overcome my reading deficiency, I had to
>>>>> find a method that didn't use my eyesight.  What an epiphany that
>>>>> was!!
>>>>>
>>>>> Enter Braille.
>>>>>
>>>>> I started learning Braille at age 50.  It was definitely an
>>>>> "eye-opener", because it did exactly what I realized an alternate
>>>>> method would have to do.
>>>>> It bypassed the vision and removed the barrier that bad vision
>>>>> imposes.  I was hopeful that Braille would allow me to improve my
>>>>> reading speed.  I've been on that quest since then, and as I say, I'm
>>>>> now 66.  Unfortunately, I haven't achieved a reading speed I would
>>>>> like to have (say 150 words per minute), but it's not for a lack of
>>>>> trying.  Perhaps as you say . when you're older and starting out, you
>>>>> may not achieve speeds that a younger person will achieve when they
>>>>> start reading at age 6.  I think this is similar to playing the piano
>>>>> which I started seriously studying at age 60.
>>>>> It's a lot easier to soak it up when you're younger, but that's
>>>>> another topic that could spawn a different conversation, so I'll stop
>>>>> there.
>>>>>
>>>>> These days I read Braille primarily with a Braille display.  You
>>>>> mention that you need to read hardcopy Braille, but I find the supply
>>>>> is
>>>>> limited.
>>>>> The NLS has made the decision that 85 percent of its reading material
>>>>> will be in audible format, and the other 15 percent will either be in
>>>>> electronic braille format or hardcopy braille.  That leaves us
>>>>> readers who are interested in Braille out in the cold.  Bookshare is
>>>>> of course another option.
>>>>>
>>>>> In summary, I wish I had been given the opportunity to learn braille
>>>>> at a younger age, but that's water under the bridge at this point.
>>>>> All I can do is read as much as I can.  But I still stand behind my
>>>>> conviction that to improve reading for a partially sighted person
>>>>> (and certainly for a totally blind person), braille is the answer,
>>>>> and the sooner you embrace it and the more you use it, the better off
>>>>> you'll be.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for posting your email.  It was interesting reading.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mike Jolls
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from
>>>>> Mail<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2
>>>>> Fgo.microsoft.com%2Ffwlink%2F%3FLinkId%3D550986&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce70
>>>>> 1382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%
>>>>> 7C0%7C638147535070848224%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAi
>>>>> LCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=
>>>>> m2yZxOkpNenfQ%2FiNnYOlNV5ZSrU%2BBR4huf1krumKxIU%3D&reserved=0> for
>>>>> Windows
>>>>>
>>>>> From: Debbie Gabe via
>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion<mailto:nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2023 12:28 AM
>>>>> To: 'NFB Braille Discussion
>>>>> List'<mailto:nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Cc: Debbie Gabe<mailto:dgabe808 at gmail.com>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [NFB-Braille-Discussion] Reading Speed Increases
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>> I came into this conversation late. I'm not sure how old you are.
>>>>> I learned braille when I was 55 years old. I practiced every chance I
>>>>> got.
>>>>> I
>>>>> took my braille book to appointments where I thought I might have to
>>>>> wait.
>>>>> I
>>>>> read in my husband's care, on the bus, during TV commercials in the
>>>>> evening, anytime I had a few minutes to spare. Now at 72 years old, I
>>>>> still have not yet broken 100 words a minute, but I am always in the
>>>>> middle of at least 2 braille novels. I make labels for everything in
>>>>> braille. I write notes to myself. For several years, before I finally
>>>>> retired, I taught braille.
>>>>>
>>>>> If you are ""older", then you might not end up reading as fast as
>>>>> someone who learns braille at a younger age, but you can still make
>>>>> it useful and enjoyable.
>>>>>
>>>>> But you do have to practice every single day as much as you can. If I
>>>>> go a couple days without reading braille, I notice my reading speed
>>>>> is so much slower, it frustrates me.
>>>>>
>>>>> And you need to use good reading technique, Read with both hands, all
>>>>> 8 fingers on the line of braille. Don't red with the fingertips, but
>>>>> more between the tips and the pads of the fingers.
>>>>> And you will increase your speed faster if you read hard copy books
>>>>> rather than electronic braille displays where there is only a single
>>>>> line at a time.
>>>>> And keep your touch light, don't "scrub", etc. I'm sure you've heard
>>>>> all those things.
>>>>>
>>>>> Lastly, Jerry Whittle, used to teach braille for over 30 years to
>>>>> adults at the Louisiana Center for the blind. He wrote a bunch of
>>>>> articles that were published in magazines from the NFB: the Braille
>>>>> Monitor, etc. Do a google search for him. He died a while ago, but his
>>>>> articles are still out there.
>>>>> He has several on increasing reading speed.
>>>>>
>>>>> Good luck.
>>>>> And if you are free on the 4th Saturdays of each month, the NFB of
>>>>> Hawaii holds a zoom meeting called All About Braille. I am the host.
>>>>> We discuss anything and everything about braille, , including
>>>>> increasing reading speed.
>>>>> If interested, email me personally at debbiegabe at live.com and I will
>>>>> send you the zoom link. It takes place at 10 am Hawaii time (1 pm
>>>>> west coast time, and 4 pm eastern time).
>>>>>
>>>>> Best.
>>>>> Debbie Gabe
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Ramona via
>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2023 10:05 AM
>>>>> To: Sanho Steele-Louchart via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Cc: Ramona <walhoframona at gmail.com>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [NFB-Braille-Discussion] Reading Speed Increases
>>>>>
>>>>> Reading every day as much as possible is essential. You are not going
>>>>> to give up other forms of reading; you cannot get everything in
>>>>> Braille, anyway. Find a magazine you enjoy in Braille, some books,
>>>>> some business reports-you pick. Two experiences worth sharing: 1. A
>>>>> Braille student came to me for a recipe and took it down using her
>>>>> slate and stylus. She said: I am going to college and want my noses
>>>>> in Braille, but I am too slow. I
>>>>> answered: Make yourself write them with the slate and stylus. Most
>>>>> freshmen do not have notetaking mastered, and you can share your
>>>>> notes with others, so do the best you can and see how fast you
>>>>> improve. At Christmas break she came back for another recipe and wrote
>>>>> it
>>>>> on the slate like a pro. I said:
>>>>> Carolyn, you did it! She barely knew what I was talking about, but
>>>>> she had taken notes with the slate and stylusin in all of her classes
>>>>> for one semester and truly had no more concerns about speed. Second
>>>>> example: We had a student with a phD who was losing vision so was a
>>>>> fast
>>>>> reader in print.
>>>>> She was determined to build speed in Braille. She took two hours of
>>>>> braille during the day and read two more hours each evening 7 days a
>>>>> week. It took her about 3 weeks to cover the entire Braille code, and
>>>>> then she began reading whatever she wished. At the end of six months
>>>>> she took a timed reading test and read 150 words per minute. She said
>>>>> the effort was worth the results. That was the right time for her to
>>>>> do it. Students who learn as children keep up their speed pretty
>>>>> easily. If the speed has increased as an adult, you need to keep on
>>>>> reading regularly to maintain it.
>>>>> suggestions on technique: pet the Braille lightly and keep your
>>>>> fingers moving to the right, so you are getting part from context,
>>>>> but do not go back and worry about single words, so your muscle
>>>>> memory is being developped. 2. Get identical texts of Braille and
>>>>> recorded material. Set the player just a little faster than you can
>>>>> read the Braille and make yourself keep up. 3. If you did not get the
>>>>> sense from context, read the entire page again, keeping up your
>>>>> speed, three or four times if necessary. It will come! Mabel Nading
>>>>> and I did lots of testing of speed building at the Iowa Commission
>>>>> for the Blind in the 1970's. Some of our students taught us a lot by
>>>>> their success. Determination and discipline make a huge difference. I
>>>>> think some of this stuff is in the Braille Monitor somewhere.
>>>>> Best,
>>>>> Ramona
>>>>>> On Mar 15, 2023 1:09 PM, Sanho Steele-Louchart via
>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sahar,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you. Agreed on all counts. I really want to move to reading
>>>>>> everything in braille as long as it isn't time-sensitive, but I've
>>>>>> been using my screen-reader at 850 words a minute for almost twenty
>>>>>> years. Going back to 40 or 60WPM is incredibly difficult--especially
>>>>>> given the neurological fatigue that comes with.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sanho
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 3/15/23, Sahar Husseini via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> Practice really is key. I used to tell my students. Sighted people
>>>>>>> see print everywhere. It is literally on everything. You have to
>>>>>>> read braille every day. Some people tell me that's hard to do, but
>>>>>>> that really is what it takes. I never understood how kids took
>>>>>>> braille class for one day a week. I was lucky that everything in
>>>>>>> school was in braille. For me to get faster, I had to read
>>>>>>> everything in braille. Of course, now, I am 110 years old, so I
>>>>>>> don't know that kids get everything in braille these days. It's sad
>>>>>>> how much focus is on audio. Some of us don't comprehend as well on
>>>>> audio. Ok, I'm not quite 110, lol.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Warm regards,
>>>>>>> Sahar Husseini
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>>>>> 7NWU%3D&reserved=0 And remember, "Obstacles don't have to stop you.
>>>>> If you run into a wall, don't turn around and give up.
>>>>>>> Figure out how to climb it, go through it, or work around it."
>>>>>>> Michael Jordan
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of David
>>>>>>> Andrews via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2023 1:26 PM
>>>>>>> To: 'NFB Braille Discussion List'
>>>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Cc: dandrews920 at comcast.net
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [NFB-Braille-Discussion] Reading Speed Increases
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I am not an expert in Braille learning -- however, I remember some
>>>>>>> articles in the Braille Monitor in the 90's about adults learning
>>>>>>> Braille and increasing their speed.  I think the recommendations
>>>>>>> are generally that you need to read each and every day, for an hour
>>>>>>> if possible. I remember one person saying it took them two years to
>>>>>>> build
>>>>> up their speed.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I am not trying to discourage you, but if you go weeks or months
>>>>>>> without reading Braille, you won't get faster.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dave
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Sanho
>>>>>>> Steele-Louchart via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2023 10:56 AM
>>>>>>> To: NFB Braille Discussion List <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Cc: Sanho Steele-Louchart <sanho817 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [NFB-Braille-Discussion] Reading Speed Increases
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Right now, approximately zero minutes a day on average. I have
>>>>>>> weeks where I read 10 pages a day and months where I don't touch
>>>>>>> braille at all. I definitely need to build consistency there. I'm
>>>>>>> currently reading at about 60WPM. Enough to enjoy and understand
>>>>>>> what I'm reading, but nowhere near what I read when I was sighted.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 3/15/23, marianne denning via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Do you know anyone who can watch you as you read and make
>>>>>>>> suggestions?
>>>>>>>> Many people have increased reading speed. How much time do you
>>>>>>>> spend reading each day?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Sanho
>>>>>>>> Steele-Louchart via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2023 11:13 AM
>>>>>>>> To: NFB Braille Discussion List
>>>>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Cc: Sanho Steele-Louchart <sanho817 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [NFB-Braille-Discussion] Reading Speed Increases
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Mike,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks. I'm compiling the list now in text and braille for people
>>>>>>>> to use as they wish.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To clarify, I'm not looking for techniques. I'm looking for how
>>>>>>>> long it takes to increase speed and by what amount we can do so.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Warmth,
>>>>>>>> Sanho
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 3/15/23, Mike Jolls via NFB-Braille-Discussion
>>>>>>>> <nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> I have been working on increasing Braille reading speed as well .
>>>>>>>>> here are my tips
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Don't scrub
>>>>>>>>> Light touch
>>>>>>>>> Read things that don't have words that are too difficult at first
>>>>>>>>> All fingers on the Braille as you read.
>>>>>>>>> Both hands start the line and move together across the line  -
>>>>>>>>> but right eventually separates from left and finishes while left
>>>>>>>>> goes to next line ready to read (this means there's no time lost
>>>>>>>>> between right hand finishing and next line starting to be read)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hmmm . practicing the frequently read words . I'd be interested
>>>>>>>>> in getting a list of those myself.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Another tip, make sure you practice reading every day.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And here are a couple of more things (if you're reading on a
>>>>>>>>> braille display with a screen reader such as Jaws) Put the
>>>>>>>>> braille display in "auto advance" mode and read a document.  The
>>>>>>>>> screen reader will automatically advance to the next line and
>>>>>>>>> refresh the display with the next line of text.  This will force
>>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>>> to keep up.
>>>>>>>>> You may need to set the auto advance speed so it's slow enough at
>>>>>>>>> first so you can keep up with it.  Then as you get better, set it
>>>>>>>>> a bit faster.  It's like taking a shorthand class where the
>>>>>>>>> teacher keeps making you go faster.
>>>>>>>>> You do get faster as time goes on.  I'm still working on this.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Second tip for the braille display.  In your screen reader
>>>>>>>>> software, set the left and right panning buttons so that forward
>>>>>>>>> panning is the LEFT button, not the right button.  By default (at
>>>>>>>>> least in Jaws), Jaws has assigned the forward pan function to the
>>>>>>>>> right panning button on the display.  But this means that you
>>>>>>>>> have to move your hand to the right side of the display in order
>>>>>>>>> to pan.  And when you're on a short line, it takes a second or
>>>>>>>>> two to do that.  Result is that you lose a couple of seconds
>>>>>>>>> every time you have to move your hand to the right side of the
>>>>>>>>> display.  By switching the forward pan function to the left
>>>>>>>>> button, you don't have to move your right hand to the end of the
>>>>>>>>> display to press the pan forward button.  Your left hand is
>>>>>>>>> always there on the left button, so it takes less time to pan
>>>>>>>>> forward.  This will save a little time (every bit helps) but the
>>>>>>>>> majority of your time savings
>>>>> will be in the tips before this one.
>>>>>>>>> This one will take a bit of getting used to, but I have it from
>>>>>>>>> another blind user that this is the way to go.  Saving the second
>>>>>>>>> or two on each line seems to make sense, so give it a try.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hope I've explained this adequately and good luck.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Incidentally, for those in the NFB group, any comments are
>>>>>>>>> welcome regarding what I've said.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Sent from
>>>>>>>>> Mail<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%
>>>>>>>>> 2
>>>>>>>>> F%2Fgo.microsoft.com%2Ffwlink%2F%3FLinkId%3D550986&data=05%7C01%7
>>>>>>>>> C
>>>>>>>>> %7Ce37a3aaed6ee435c3afb08db25df392a%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaa
>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>> aaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638145412887823824%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjo
>>>>>>>>> i
>>>>>>>>> MC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000
>>>>>>>>> %
>>>>>>>>> 7C%7C%7C&sdata=lOSGQm%2ByWoLlJDiblRKf0uzexumbEea%2F2sehqJybhHk%3D
>>>>>>>>> &
>>>>>>>>> reserved=0> for Windows
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> From: Sanho Steele-Louchart via
>>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion<mailto:nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 15, 2023 8:15 AM
>>>>>>>>> To: NFB Braille Discussion
>>>>>>>>> List<mailto:nfb-braille-discussion at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>> Cc: Sanho Steele-Louchart<mailto:sanho817 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> Subject: [NFB-Braille-Discussion] Reading Speed Increases
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi, all,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Is there any kind of a science to when and by how much
>>>>>>>>> significant reading gains will happen? I'm currently reading
>>>>>>>>> braille at about a fifth the speed I want to. I'll practice as
>>>>>>>>> much
>>>>>>>>> as I need to.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Warmth,
>>>>>>>>> Sanho
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> He/Him
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fn
>>>>>>>>> f%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7
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>>>>>>>>> 0 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
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>>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
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>>>>>>>>> f%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7
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>>>>>>>>> v
>>>>>>>>> QkhqGsyjms%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>>> f%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7
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>>>>>>>>> 4%2FDDg%3D&reserved=0 rg To unsubscribe, change your list options
>>>>>>>>> or get your account info for
>>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>>>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fn
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>>>>>>>>> bnet.org%2Fmailman%2Foptions%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.or&d
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>>>>>>>>> FaX%2BHFzmo%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>>>>> g/s
>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>> nho817%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> He/Him
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>> b%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7f
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>>>>>>>> your account info for
>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnf
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>>>>>>>> /ma
>>>>>>>> rianne%40denningweb.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnf
>>>>>>>> b%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7f
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>>>>>>>> net.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.or&da
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>>>>>>>> your account info for
>>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnf
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>>>>>>>> %3D&reserved=0
>>>>>>>> /sa
>>>>>>>> nho817%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>> n%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe
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>>>>>>> account info for
>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfb
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>>>>>>> d
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>>>>>>> 8
>>>>>>> E%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>>> saharhusseini%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfb
>>>>>>> n%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe
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>>>>>>> et.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org&dat
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>> =05%7C01%7C%7Ce37a3aaed6ee435c3afb08db25df392a%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb4
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>>>>>>> D
>>>>>>> &reserved=0 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your
>>>>>>> account info for
>>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfb
>>>>>>> n%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe
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>>>>>>> et.org%2Fmailman%2Foptions%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org%2F&d
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>> ta=05%7C01%7C%7Ce37a3aaed6ee435c3afb08db25df392a%7C84df9e7fe9f640af
>>>>>>> b
>>>>>>> 435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638145412887823824%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3
>>>>>>> d
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>>>>>>> %
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>>>>>>> 8
>>>>>>> E%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>>> sanho817%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> He/Him
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbn
>>>>>> et%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe
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>>>>>> 3Y6Fa8E%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>> .org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org&data=0
>>>>>> 5%
>>>>>> 7C01%7C%7Ce37a3aaed6ee435c3afb08db25df392a%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaa
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>>>>>> %7C&sdata=lOQl8jfow9giGirilg8Y2B3U9gz%2FH0EXfFqgRAIxyaY%3D&reserved=
>>>>>> 0 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>> for
>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbn
>>>>>> et%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe
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>>>>>> =05%7C01%7C%7Ce37a3aaed6ee435c3afb08db25df392a%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb43
>>>>>> 5a
>>>>>> aaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638145412887823824%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJ
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>>>>>> C%7C%7C&sdata=hLHWsszMn%2BYExrNoKTdYQVWgSDfu%2FMO4A74wQ%2F%2Fn8Z4%3D
>>>>>> &r
>>>>>> eserved=0
>>>>>> lhoframona%40gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Ramona
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbne
>>>>> t.org%2<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F
>>>>> %2Fnfbnet.org%252>
>>>>> Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org&data=05%7C01%
>>>>> 7C%7Ce3
>>>>> 7a3aaed6ee435c3afb08db25df392a%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1
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>>>>> irilg8Y
>>>>> 2B3U9gz%2FH0EXfFqgRAIxyaY%3D&reserved=0
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbne
>>>>> t.org%2<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F
>>>>> %2Fnfbnet.org%252>
>>>>> Fmailman%2Foptions%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org%2Fdgabe808%2540gmail.
>>>>> com&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce37a3aaed6ee435c3afb08db25df392a%7C84df9e7fe9f6
>>>>> 40afb43
>>>>> 5aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638145412887823824%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8ey
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>>>>> ata=51r9IFc9PelM6Dou5PCp%2FYVy0UQ3CO9DQrOSE3tX2j4%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
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>>>>> %2Fnfbnet.org%252>
>>>>> Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org&data=05%7C01%
>>>>> 7C%7Ce3
>>>>> 7a3aaed6ee435c3afb08db25df392a%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1
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>>>>> irilg8Y
>>>>> 2B3U9gz%2FH0EXfFqgRAIxyaY%3D&reserved=0
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbne
>>>>> t.org%2<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F
>>>>> %2Fnfbnet.org%252>
>>>>> Fmailman%2Foptions%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org%2Fmrspock56%25
>>>>> 40hotma
>>>>> il.com&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce37a3aaed6ee435c3afb08db25df392a%7C84df9e7fe
>>>>> 9f640af
>>>>> b435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638145412887823824%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d
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>>>>> &sdata=ILJ5EGBKUtwFgvQA9MvWy%2FEFd%2ByED3r6Kf%2B6ox6VwKU%3D&reserved=
>>>>> 0
>>>>>
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>>>>> t.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org&data=0
>>>>> 5%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aa
>>>>> aaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638147535071004464%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWI
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>>>>> 7C%7C%7C&sdata=Ka%2Fy01to6DoZ5lI%2F5o%2FLt1RCWP%2BaoRY49fySUcFTYcw%3D
>>>>> &reserved=0 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your
>>>>> account info for
>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbne
>>>>> t.org%2Fmailman%2Foptions%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org%2Fdgabe
>>>>> 808&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe9f6
>>>>> 40afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638147535071004464%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZ
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>>>>> Y%3D&reserved=0
>>>>> %40gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
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>>>>> t.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org&data=0
>>>>> 5%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aa
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>>>>> &reserved=0 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your
>>>>> account info for
>>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbne
>>>>> t.org%2Fmailman%2Foptions%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org%2Fsanho
>>>>> 817%2540gmail.com&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%
>>>>> 7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638147535071004464%7CUnk
>>>>> nown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haW
>>>>> wiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=WvOf2995YzKptvfIk%2F7JJVjrL%2F
>>>>> 38TvSzrH5oTADFNbs%3D&reserved=0
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> He/Him
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbnet
>>>> .org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org&data=05%
>>>> 7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaa
>>>> aaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638147535071004464%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiM
>>>> C4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C
>>>> %7C&sdata=Ka%2Fy01to6DoZ5lI%2F5o%2FLt1RCWP%2BaoRY49fySUcFTYcw%3D&reser
>>>> ved=0 To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>> info for NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbnet
>>>> .org%2Fmailman%2Foptions%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org%2Fthunder
>>>> walker321%2540gmail.com&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd
>>>> 5409%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638147535071004464%7
>>>> CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1
>>>> haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=MscirOGwKFLYS3UBBoh8gX5Gbm0Y
>>>> C3cN1AMEq8e5R%2FI%3D&reserved=0
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbnet.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638147535071004464%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=Ka%2Fy01to6DoZ5lI%2F5o%2FLt1RCWP%2BaoRY49fySUcFTYcw%3D&reserved=0
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbnet.org%2Fmailman%2Foptions%2Fnfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org%2Fmrspock56%2540hotmail.com&data=05%7C01%7C%7Ce701382d54b04defb9fc08db27cd5409%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C638147535071004464%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=e3o9%2BrRkmzLu%2B3WUQ7VHUPGdPTEr4PZW7GzFnRsMR30%3D&reserved=0
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org/dgabe808%40gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org/sanho817%40gmail.com
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> He/Him
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org/dgabe808%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NFB-Braille-Discussion mailing list
>> NFB-Braille-Discussion at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> NFB-Braille-Discussion:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-braille-discussion_nfbnet.org/sanho817%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> --
> He/Him
>


-- 
He/Him