[nfb-db] Other email list for DB persons:

[Janice Toothman]

Marsha,
I have found many deaf-blind groups on the internet and belong to two 
others through google.  There are at leastt least 16 different 
deaf-blind internet groups. Some are more "chatty" and high volume than 
others. For instance, dbtc:  db-talkcity at googlegroups.com  I have found 
to be high volume. where as DBL : deafblind at googlegroups.com is not. 
There are others that are topic oriented, such as the creative writing 
(DBCN:db-cnet at googlegroups.com). I hope this helps.
Janice
On 7/30/2012 4:31 PM, Marsha Drenth wrote:
> List,
>
> I am about a month away from starting my semester. I was down at the campus
> this morning, and I can already tell its going to be an interesting
> semester. There is A LOT of construction going on the campus. So this is
> going to make for a difficult travel situation. In the past I have preferred
> to use my hearing aids while traveling. But with all the construction, its
> so noisy, I just take them out. And take my chances on just not hearing. I
> am beyond frustrated at this point with my ears.
>
> My question, Catherine mentioned below, there are other email lists of DB
> people on the internet. I am interested in learning to navigate this
> challenge I have ahead of me with no vision and very bad hearing. I have
> asked my university to help me secure funding to have an guide from the
> train to my building and back on a daily bases. And I have even taken the
> leap to ask my BVS counselor if they can pay for ASL training. So I would
> like to meet other people like me. This list has been great. I am just
> curious of what other people are out there.
>
> Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!
>
> Marsha
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfb-db-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-db-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Catherine Miller
> Sent: Monday, July 30, 2012 3:24 PM
> To: nfb-db at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Re: [nfb-db] nfb-db Digest, Vol 42, Issue 41
>
> Carrie:  Folks here have given you some good advice.  I agree with them that
> LCB is an excellent facility.  Although I did not attend the center for the
> entire six months training, I have participated in other programs there.
> The executive director, Pam Allen, is a friend and mentor to me.  Pam and I
> regularly consult on matters pertaining to deaf-blindness.  Based on years
> of experience with Pam and the Center, I my hunch is that you are not
> required to cross the streets with your unique combination of hearing loss
> and vision loss.  Rather, I think that, in typical fashion, LCB's staff is
> pushing you to find your own limits, allowing you to tell them when enough
> is enough.  Our search for independence is a powerful motivator.  We can
> surpass our limits, often very successfully, with the right motivation.
> It's unbelievable what we are willing to risk to earn our freedom.  But
> ultimately, you call the shots yourself.  Talk to your O&M instructor; talk
> to your rehab counselor.  If you are determined to attain a higher level of
> mobility than is possible in six to nine months, then think about requesting
> an extension of your length of stay at CB.  I don't want to see you crossing
> the street in uncertainty out of frustration.
>
> Make an appointment with Pam Allen; tell her that I suggested it.  She needs
> to know about the doubts you feel, in order to make adjustments to the
> curriculum if that's what is required.
>
> I congratulate you on your strength of character and your unrelenting desire
> to achieve all that is possible, despite your unique combination of sensory
> disabilities.
>
> It seems to me that a very important question to answer is whether your
> hearing is perfectly stable.  Perhaps it is possible for you to learn to
> determine the directionality of traffice.  But if your hearing, like mine,
> is unstable, whatever you learn will be lost when your hearing changes.
> Likewise, if your hearing aid features adjustments that allow you to turn
> off rear microphones to block out background noise, be sure the settings are
> always in the same position every time you stop to listen for traffic.
>
> You strike me as someone who does not find it easy to ask for help.  But
> please consider whether an SSP might allow you to reach a higher level of
> achievement.  If the answer is "possibly," then help us to organize
> ourselves and a plan that will result in the education of the Federation
> about why we need SSPs.
>
> Carrie, I'm glad you've found the division list.  There are other list with
> other DB people on the Internet.  With your input, we can claim our place
> alongside our blind brothers and sisters.  With the Federation's help, there
> is no limit to what we can accompish.
>
> With best regards,
>
> Cathy Miller
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jul 29, 2012, at 10:11 PM, nfb-db-request at nfbnet.org wrote:
>
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>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>>    1. Re: Crossing Streets? (Marsha Drenth)
>>    2. Re: Crossing Streets? (Alicia Richards)
>>    3. Re: Crossing Streets? (Scott Davert)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2012 22:18:45 -0400
>> From: "Marsha Drenth" <marsha.drenth at gmail.com>
>> To: "'NFB Deaf-Blind Division Mailing List'" <nfb-db at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [nfb-db] Crossing Streets?
>> Message-ID: <1FB9E1719C3849B0A200F7A2D9288C92 at Cptr233>
>> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset="us-ascii"
>>
>> Carrie,
>>
>> Your not the first with a hearing impairment to go to a NFB center. How
>> those other students did I am not sure. From what I have heard, the travel
>> was the hardest of all. I don't have any suggestions on how you would
> cross
>> the streets better. But as a person with a hearing impairment myself, no
>> normally hearing person, can know what we hear, the fear and uncertainty
>> that goes along with that, or can walk in our shoes. Its hard. If anyone
>> here has any good ideas please do share them. Please don't get me wrong,
>> when I say this next part. The NFB centers are awesome in their training.
>> The problem comes when a person, with a hearing impairment attends, they
> are
>> very not well equipped to train a person with both blindness and hearing
>> difficulties. From another friend of mine who attended LCB  quite a few
>> years ago, there was a young lady who had a severe hearing loss. But again
>> had trouble with travel. She left and I think was suppose to go to the
> HKC.
>> I might be wrong here. But when it comes to an NFB center it's the coined
>> training and that is it, any deviation from that causes problems. At one
>> point I looked into going to a training center, specifically an NFB
> center,
>> but because of my hearing impairment. I was not guaranteed that
>> accommodations could be made for that. I am a very independent person, who
>> uses a guide dog too, my cane skills are not what I would be going there
>> for. The program is to be there for all of the training, including cane
>> travel. I spoke to Al spooner, regarding this matter. Its really sad when
> a
>> person with a hearing impairment goes to an NFB center, and who can't have
>> accommodations made for that. Again I might be wrong, so I would like for
>> someone to prove me wrong.
>>
>> Carrie, I do hope you find the information your looking for. Good luck!
>>
>> Marsha
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nfb-db-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-db-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf
>> Of Kerri Kosten
>> Sent: Sunday, July 29, 2012 8:22 PM
>> To: NFB Deaf-Blind Division Mailing List; Ed McDonald; Charlene Smith;
>> Arielle Silverman; Paul Migliorelli (+1 303-552-6970)
>> Subject: [nfb-db] Crossing Streets?
>>
>> Hi Everyone:
>>
>> Though I have been on this list for a long time now, I don't post much.
>> But, I am having a problem I don't really know what to do about and I
>> need to find a solution rather soon.
>> I am a current student at the Louisiana Center for The Blind, the NFB
>> training center. I did very extensive research before choosing this
>> center, and I chose this one because I knew it was the best of the
>> best and I could learn to become independent to the point where I
>> would have the confidence to be able to go anywhere, have the
>> confidence to do anything I wanted, and be able to travel in
>> new/unfamiliar environments without needing to be orientated by a
>> mobility instructor everytime I moved somewhere.
>> Besides this, I much prefer the structured discovery method of
>> learning over the ttraditional route travel method.
>> In addition to being totally blind, I have hearing loss. I basically
>> only have hearing in my left ear. My right ear is completely deaf.
>> This means that I hear sounds pretty well but I have trouble with
>> localization and knowing which direction sounds are coming from.
>> I am at the point in my training where I am having to cross
>> intersections with stoplights. In order to cross these intersections,
>> I am supposed to cross when the parallel traffic is moving. The
>> parallel street is the street that is beside me. When the parallel
>> traffic is moving, the perpendicular traffic (traffic on the street in
>> front of me) can not go.
>> I am having two problems that do not seem to be getting better. First,
>> I am having a lot of trouble telling which street is going. I can hear
>> the traffic. I can hear when it is stopped/idaling. But, I am having
>> trouble telling which street is moving, the one in front of me or the
>> one beside me.
>> At first, my instructor would ask me questions such as "What is
>> moving?" and I would try to tell him/her and then cross at the
>> appropriate time. However, now, since I have been in training for a
>> couple of months, my instructor does not say anything because he/she
>> wants me to make the decision on my own and trust myself.
>> So, what happens is we approach the street. I admit I am terrified
>> because there is so much traffic and I know I have to cross the street
>> on my own. I attempt to listen. I get somewhat of an idea of what
>> street is going. I then become even more scared though and don't
>> cross. We end up just standing at the particular intersection for 20
>> minutes or more and my instructor gets onto me.
>> I don't know whether my issues are with hearing or my fear. My
>> instructor avidly believes I am just letting my fear stop me and does
>> not understand why I am not gaining confidence and beginning to trust
>> myself more. My instructor believes I can do this even with one ear.
>> I guess I am both afraid and unsure. I can sort of tell which street
>> is moving because it seems at times (I don't know if this is accurate
>> or not) but it seems that the perpendicular street (the street that is
>> in front of me) sounds a bit louder and when the parallel street is
>> moving (the one beside me) it sounds sort of quieter/a bit further
>> away from my left ear. Sometimes though, on different streets, for
>> some reason I don't hear this slight sound difference and all the
>> traffic sounds the same to me. I can hear it, it just all sounds the
>> same so I can't tell which street is going. However, I am still afraid
>> to go, so end up just standing there for much longer than I should. I
>> guess I am afraid that it will be the wrong time and if I go it will
>> be the wrong time. So, I don't go, and we end up standing at one
>> intersection for forever.
>> The problem is that I have already been in training for a few months,
>> and students are only in training for up to nine months. I want to do
>> as well as I can here. I do not want to be one of those students who
>> is here for nine months but barely learns anything. That is not why I
>> came here.
>> Also, these particular streets are only about four blocks from the
>> center which is a very short distance. If I can not figure out how to
>> cross these streets, I will never be able to advance very far in
>> travel, and this will really cause me a lot of problems in the rest of
>> my life when I have completed training.
>> How do you all handle street crossings? How do you know which street
>> is moving when you only have hearing in one ear?
>> Is there something else I can listen for? Is there a certain pattern I
>> can listen for or something to help me?
>> Is it possible that I am becoming so terrified/anxious that my fear is
>> affecting my hearing?
>> Is it accurate/true that the perpendicular street sounds louder than
>> the parallel one? Could I use this slight difference in sound to
>> properly judge which street is moving?
>> Could my attitude have something to do with this? Instead of going
>> about this with an excited, positive, can-do attitude, maybe I am
>> being too negative/scared? Could my approach/attitude possibly be
>> affecting things?
>> I should point out that I have not made a bad decision yet when
>> crossing. My instructor has never had to actually stop me. He/she
>> keeps telling me this, but I still feel as if each street crossing I
>> manage is kind of like pulling teeth so to speak because I am so
>> scared and then I end up standing at the intersection for so long.
>> Because of this, rather than gaining confidence with each street
>> crossing, I am instead still terrified.
>> Are there any federationists who have hearing in only one ear or a
>> similar situation that may not be on this list that could possibly
>> help?
>> Is there anyone else I could contact?
>>
>> Thanks so much!
>> Kerri
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nfb-db mailing list
>> nfb-db at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-db_nfbnet.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2012 21:29:52 -0500
>> From: Alicia Richards <alicianfb at gmail.com>
>> To: "NFB Deaf-Blind Division Mailing List" <nfb-db at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [nfb-db] Crossing Streets?
>> Message-ID: <B4AA2A3FF6F0425AAD135A7B94D49B66 at aliciab5324f6e>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>>     reply-type=original
>>
>> Hello, all.  I rarely post to this list, as I am blind, but hearing.
>> However, I'd like to respond to  Kerri's message.  Please forgive the
>> upcoming lengthy message.
>>
>> Kerri, I'm not quite sure what to suggest here.  I will continue to think
>> about it.  I personally feel that the LCB, like most blindness centers
> I've
>> known, has no idea how to handle a client who has a hearing impairment as
>> well as blindness.  I'm not saying LCB is a bad center.  I know it's our
>> best one, actually. You're right about that. I agree with them nine times
>> out of ten.  But I think they are wrong on this issue: that your travel
>> instructor is wrong in this case.  Seriously, your message makes me want
> to
>> take our Center's sleepshade policy, and apply it to hearing.  I'd love to
>> put an earplug in one of your instructor's ears, and see how well he/she
>> could distinguish traffic patterns.
>>
>> First, I truly do not believe this is an  issue of your having a negative
>> attitude, or being too afraid.  Your message clearly shows you have a very
>> positive attitude, and I admire it.  You're ready and more than willing to
>> learn, and want to get the best out of your program.  Not all students do.
>> I don't think you're afraid of independent travel, but simply of street
>> crossings.  And I don't think it's you not trusting yourself.  I truly
>> believe it's about your hearing impairment, and you very naturally wanting
>> to be safe.  Your fear, in my opinion, is nothing more than inteligent
>> self-preservation, which any normal human would have.  I'm glad you've
>> consistently made the right decision about when to cross thus far, but it
>> sounds as if your hearing is not trustworthy enough to be counted on all
> the
>> time, and personally, that's a gamble I would not want to take.  Whether
>> parallel or perpendicular traffic is quiet or loud doesn't seem to be
>> relevant, if you're not able to tell which direction it is moving, through
>> no fault of your own, by the way.  From my bits of experience with those
> who
>> are hearing impaired and blind, it seems like the biggest mistake hearing
>> people make is to assume that hearing has to do with loud and quiet only.
>> We often don't factor in things like directionality.  I know I certainly
>> didn't until I started meeting people who were in situations similar to
>> yours.
>>
>> I'm pretty sure this is not at all what you want to hear, but I'll say it
>> anyway.  Most blind and hearing impaired people I know use street-crossing
>> cards if they can't distinguish between perpendicular and parallel
> traffic.
>> It's a card that has writing on it that says you are blind and hearing
>> impaired, and need assistance to cross the street.  Yes, I know, on the
>> surface this would seem to go against our philosophy of independence, as
>> well as your desire to be so.  But, if you listen to Dr. Jernigan's
> speech,
>> "The Nature of Independence," he basically says that the most independence
>> is obtained by employing whatever alternative techniques you need to in
>> order to live and travel safely and effectively.  To me, you using your
>> limited hearing to try and distinguish between perpendicular and parallel
>> traffic is neither safe or effective, as your email shows.   I view a
> street
>> crossing card the same way I do a blind person using a white cane.  Many
> are
>> resistent at first.  But a white cane is needed for blind people to travel
>> safely and effectively.  For some blind and hearing impaired people, so is
> a
>> street crossing card.  It's simply another alternative technique. Again, I
>> say, I don't think you have a negative attitude or are too afraid.
>>
>> This is where I think the deaf-blind division needs to help educate
> places,
>> especially our own training centers, in regards to people with both
>> blindness and hearing issues.  LCB is most likely to listen to fellow
>> Federationists, people they know share their positive philosophy of
>> blindness.  Cathy and Rox, if I remember correctly, you both live in
>> Louisiana, and I know you both have great attitudes and philosophy of
>> blindness.  Do either of you know anyone or have any connection to LCB?
>> Since you guys live in that state, do you think there's anything you could
>> do here?
>>
>> Kerri, I will continue to think about this, but I really wanted to respond
>> and say that I don't think your problems here have anything to do with
> your
>> attitude or lack of self-confidence.
>>
>> Alicia
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 3
>> Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2012 23:11:04 -0400
>> From: Scott Davert <scottdavert at gmail.com>
>> To: Alicia Richards <AliciaNFB at gmail.com>,    NFB Deaf-Blind Division
>>     Mailing List <nfb-db at nfbnet.org>
>> Subject: Re: [nfb-db] Crossing Streets?
>> Message-ID:
>>     <CAOHXxEaCGtahNLUhGkSs_nP19UKNHqKRCDPRw7uLUkhNt+8ing at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>>
>> Hello Kerri.
>> First, I'm glad you have decided to post and I hope others will offer
>> their perspective as well. As I'm only one person and am not an o and
>> m specialist, I may not be the best person to ask, though I am a
>> person who has gone through some of what you're dealing with now when
>> I was receiving training.
>> Your fear is not what is holding you back, in my opinion. I had the
>> same fear, and I had that fear for a good reason, though the
>> instructors I were working with at the time kept trying to get me to
>> cross a street using my hearing. I am almost totally deaf in my right
>> ear and severe loss in my left. I tell you all of this before I say
>> what I have to say so that you know where I'm coming from. I'm not
>> you, and I am not walking in your shoes, no pun intended, but my
>> experiences are similar. I had most of my struggles in blindness
>> training centers with respect to mobility for the same reason.
>> Only hearing out of one ear is going to make it almost impossible to
>> localize traffic in such a way that you can use the information. Sure,
>> you can try to turn your head to determine what's going on, but with
>> traffic moving fast, by time you've figured out where it may be coming
>> from, it's gone. And while you may be able to detect more quiet or
>> more noisy traffic surges, that will not help you reliably determine
>> where the surge is coming from. Some traffic surges are louder than
>> others, no matter whether they're perpendicular or parallel to you.
>> Think about it this way: if there is a bus that takes off
>> perpendicular to you when the light changes, that's going to be more
>> noisy if only a few quiet vehicles were at that same crossing. You
>> could very easily have the same results if the bus or any other noisy
>> vehicle were parallel to you. I tried to do this as well. I even went
>> so far as to take this theory in to practice and cross against a
>> light. Because, like you, I had the fear and was told by others that I
>> had to get over it. What I learned though is that there is that fear
>> is sometimes there for a very good reason. In the case of analyzing
>> traffic patterns with one ear, I am hear to tell you from both a
>> logical and personal standpoint that there is no safe way to do so. In
>> the words of my friend and an O and M specialist Gene Bourquin, who
>> has over 20 years of experience in working with people who have both
>> vision and hearing loss, with regard to this type of crossing told me
>> the following. "what you're trying to do is both biologically and
>> physically impossible". Audiologists I have been to who are educated
>> on the effects of both vision loss concur.
>> SO what is there to do in this situation? With your hearing, which is
>> much like mine, nothing. Alternative methods of doing this must be
>> looked in to and perhaps an O and M instructor who has experience in
>> working with people who have a combined vision and hearing loss needs
>> to be consulted.
>> For me, the solution was to use a street crossing card. Essentially,
>> the card has a graphic of someone holding someone else?s' elbow and
>> assisting the person with a cane across the street. It also says in
>> text something to the effect that I'm blind and hard of hearing.
>> Please tap me on the shoulder if you can help me cross.
>> Also, if you're with friends who do have normal hearing, you can
>> always walk with them, and just grab an elbow to get across the
>> street. Or, have them verbally tell you when they're crossing. If it's
>> too noisy, have them tap you on the shoulder when they're crossing. A
>> true friend never minds such a minor thing.
>> Is that independence you may be asking? Well, I decide which streets I
>> cross, work a full time job, navigate around my local area I've
>> relocated to without too much difficulty, and have a fairly active
>> life. I had trouble getting used to the idea of someone I don't know
>> helping me across the street, but I've gotten used to it over the
>> years. This is what has worked for me. That doesn't mean it's the best
>> solution for you, and I'm certainly not going to sit here and say
>> that's what you have to do. The only thing I would say is that you
>> must work with your O and M instructor to find an alternative
>> solution. If this individual isn't educated in working with people
>> with both these losses, it's time for that person to reach out to
>> professional resources who do have the experience to garner the
>> knowledge necessary to help you succeed. If he/she cannot do this,
>> perhaps they should stick to working with people who are blind only,
>> as it's a different world for those of us who have a hearing loss to
>> go along with it. You cannot get accurate information from something
>> that isn't able to take in that information accurately. That's so
>> basic I would think most people with any sort of disability education
>> should understand.
>> Finally, I can tell from your writing that you're a very motivated
>> person in your training and that you have the strong urge to succeed.
>> Remember that just because you do not do things the same way as your
>> classmates, as long as you make your own choices and can get from
>> point a to point b, that's all that matters. I'm sorry that this may
>> not be the exact solution you wanted, but I hope you will at least
>> take my idea into consideration. Again, you can't gain confidence on
>> something that you cannot reliably detect due to your ears. Blaming
>> you for this is much like blaming a person who is mainly blind in one
>> eye but has site in the other for not seeing stairs and tripping on
>> them. You can't make them do what their body will not allow them to.
>> Finally, I?d pass these 2 article references on to your instructor. I
>> find it rather unprofessional that he/she didn?t bother to do a bit of
>> research on their own, but that?s another message for another day.
>> While these articles  have the word deaf-blind in them, they apply to
>> anyone who has trouble localizing traffic patterns that is blind. This
>> would include you and I.
>> I sincerely wish you the best of luck on your quest for your
>> independence. Remember, just because you?re not always doing things
>> the same exact way as your peers, it does not make you any less of a
>> person. You can still do everything they do and mostly in the same
>> way.
>>
>> Scott
>> References:
>> Bourquin, E., Hogan, S., & Sauerburger, D. (2010). Street Crossing
>> Signs: Travelers Who are Deaf-Blind Obtaining Assistance when
>> Pedestrians are not Present. AER Journal, 3(4), 139-145.
>> Bourquin, E., & Moon, J. (2008). Studies on Obtaining Assistance by
>> Travelers Who are Deaf-Blind. Journal of Visual Impairment &
>> Blindness, 102(6), 352-361.
>>
>>
>> On 7/29/12, Alicia Richards <alicianfb at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Hello, all.  I rarely post to this list, as I am blind, but hearing.
>>> However, I'd like to respond to  Kerri's message.  Please forgive the
>>> upcoming lengthy message.
>>>
>>> Kerri, I'm not quite sure what to suggest here.  I will continue to think
>>> about it.  I personally feel that the LCB, like most blindness centers
> I've
>>> known, has no idea how to handle a client who has a hearing impairment as
>>> well as blindness.  I'm not saying LCB is a bad center.  I know it's our
>>> best one, actually. You're right about that. I agree with them nine times
>>> out of ten.  But I think they are wrong on this issue: that your travel
>>> instructor is wrong in this case.  Seriously, your message makes me want
> to
>>> take our Center's sleepshade policy, and apply it to hearing.  I'd love
> to
>>> put an earplug in one of your instructor's ears, and see how well he/she
>>> could distinguish traffic patterns.
>>>
>>> First, I truly do not believe this is an  issue of your having a negative
>>> attitude, or being too afraid.  Your message clearly shows you have a
> very
>>> positive attitude, and I admire it.  You're ready and more than willing
> to
>>> learn, and want to get the best out of your program.  Not all students
> do.
>>> I don't think you're afraid of independent travel, but simply of street
>>> crossings.  And I don't think it's you not trusting yourself.  I truly
>>> believe it's about your hearing impairment, and you very naturally
> wanting
>>> to be safe.  Your fear, in my opinion, is nothing more than inteligent
>>> self-preservation, which any normal human would have.  I'm glad you've
>>> consistently made the right decision about when to cross thus far, but it
>>> sounds as if your hearing is not trustworthy enough to be counted on all
> the
>>> time, and personally, that's a gamble I would not want to take.  Whether
>>> parallel or perpendicular traffic is quiet or loud doesn't seem to be
>>> relevant, if you're not able to tell which direction it is moving,
> through
>>> no fault of your own, by the way.  From my bits of experience with those
> who
>>> are hearing impaired and blind, it seems like the biggest mistake hearing
>>> people make is to assume that hearing has to do with loud and quiet only.
>>> We often don't factor in things like directionality.  I know I certainly
>>> didn't until I started meeting people who were in situations similar to
>>> yours.
>>>
>>> I'm pretty sure this is not at all what you want to hear, but I'll say it
>>> anyway.  Most blind and hearing impaired people I know use
> street-crossing
>>> cards if they can't distinguish between perpendicular and parallel
> traffic.
>>> It's a card that has writing on it that says you are blind and hearing
>>> impaired, and need assistance to cross the street.  Yes, I know, on the
>>> surface this would seem to go against our philosophy of independence, as
>>> well as your desire to be so.  But, if you listen to Dr. Jernigan's
> speech,
>>> "The Nature of Independence," he basically says that the most
> independence
>>> is obtained by employing whatever alternative techniques you need to in
>>> order to live and travel safely and effectively.  To me, you using your
>>> limited hearing to try and distinguish between perpendicular and parallel
>>> traffic is neither safe or effective, as your email shows.   I view a
> street
>>> crossing card the same way I do a blind person using a white cane.  Many
> are
>>> resistent at first.  But a white cane is needed for blind people to
> travel
>>> safely and effectively.  For some blind and hearing impaired people, so
> is a
>>> street crossing card.  It's simply another alternative technique. Again,
> I
>>> say, I don't think you have a negative attitude or are too afraid.
>>>
>>> This is where I think the deaf-blind division needs to help educate
> places,
>>> especially our own training centers, in regards to people with both
>>> blindness and hearing issues.  LCB is most likely to listen to fellow
>>> Federationists, people they know share their positive philosophy of
>>> blindness.  Cathy and Rox, if I remember correctly, you both live in
>>> Louisiana, and I know you both have great attitudes and philosophy of
>>> blindness.  Do either of you know anyone or have any connection to LCB?
>>> Since you guys live in that state, do you think there's anything you
> could
>>> do here?
>>>
>>> Kerri, I will continue to think about this, but I really wanted to
> respond
>>> and say that I don't think your problems here have anything to do with
> your
>>> attitude or lack of self-confidence.
>>>
>>> Alicia
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nfb-db mailing list
>>> nfb-db at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-db_nfbnet.org
>>>
>>
>>
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>>
>> End of nfb-db Digest, Vol 42, Issue 41
>> **************************************
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