[Nfb-idaho] autable devicefor crossing streets withtraffic lights.

Thu Nov 20 21:11:03 UTC 2008

Ty,

In response to your second question, when the lights are not working,
all bets are off for both drivers and pedestrians.  

Also, I think you are referring to 5th and 6th if indeed you are talking
about the intersections on either end of the parking garage.  7th street
Capital Blvd is broken between Jefferson in front of the capital
building and Washington by the mall between the Hall of Mirrors and the
LBJ Buildings.  

I will ponder your other points.  Have you discussed them with Brian
jain?  This could be helpful.  

Merci!
Brett Winchester KD7JN 
bwinchester at icbvi.idaho.gov
208.639.8386

-----Original Message-----
From: nfb-idaho-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-idaho-bounces at nfbnet.org]
On Behalf Of TYGH HALES
Sent: Saturday, November 08, 2008 12:47 PM
To: NFB of Idaho Discussion List
Subject: Re: [Nfb-idaho] autable devicefor crossing streets withtraffic
lights.

Hi guys, this is Becky, most of you know me or my husband, Ty (speeled
Tygh, but I'll just type it they way it sounds for this post), who is
legally blind & physically challenged. He uses a wheelchair & a white
cane when he travels, especailly when he is crossing a street.

Ty has read these posts, and I told him my thought & he agrees with
everything I am about to comment about.

Thank you, Bill, for sharing your story and making that point.

Ty has has gone across that very same street himself many times. For
those who don't know, 6th & Washington is right between the ICBVI
building & downtown Boise. 
6th street is a one way street that goes from East to west. 7th street,
the next street on the way from the comission to downtown, goes the
opposite direction.
There have been several times that Ty was almost hit while crossing 6th
street. I was witness to this a few of those times. At least two of
those times Ty wasn't hit was because HE was the one who was aware, and
stopped.... right in the middle of the intersection. Meanwhile, the car
just kept on going, not even beginning to stop!
I myself, an able bodied sighted person, was almost hit last year
crossing this very intersection. I had checked to make sure the street
was clear, the nearest car was a full block down the street. apartenly
that wasn't far enough away or something! I got halfway across the
street, and that car almost hit me.

Bill, you are so very right! an audible device would do absolutley
nothing for those types of situations or intersections! 

Here are some other thoughts or questions--

How would a person like Ty, who uses a wheelchair, be able to use it?
Especailly since he drives his chair with one hand & uses his white cane
in the other. 
And, another problem would be that at many intersections, there is only
one wheelchair ramp, which are often pointed into the middle of the
street, not towards the crosswalk. So, because of the way those ramps
are set, a blind wheelchair user would be setting off the device, and
stopping all the traffic in all directions, just because it appeared as
though this person were heading into the inersection, when they were
more likely going to head back towards the crosswalk. Talk about
uncomfortable, frustrating, and embarrassing. What is the point of a
blind wheelchair user having any blindness training, if this device will
cause all traffic to stop before S/he can even get to where S/he can
even start to cross the street. Not to mention the feeling of
independance that would take away. 

My other question: Am I right to understand that the device & the
streetlights working depends on the streetlights working? What happens
if, due to a power outage or accident, or something else, those
streetlights aren't working? or the GPS isn't working for some reason?
What good is the device then? 

Another thought, too bad the device couldn't tell you, while you're
crossing at the crosswalk, if there is a car in the middle of the
crosswalk. Or if there's a car coming to make a right or left turn and
going to hit you! (I can't count how many times that has almost happened
to either me or Ty!). If someone is going to create a device like this
with someone in mind w/o asking that group if they even want/ need it
first, and that device will just be a pain, it should at least have the
capability of alerting us when a car is getting too close! 

In other words, Ty and I agree with Bill in that it would make things
more confusing, and be a nuisance. And, what would be the point of the
device if not all blind persons were able to use it?

Thank you
Becky and Ty Hales 

> From: k7uij at panix.com> To: nfb-idaho at nfbnet.org> Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2008

> 22:48:58 -0800> Subject: Re: [Nfb-idaho] autable devicefor crossing 
> streets with traffic lights.> > Bill:> > Ya got a point there, Judge! 
> (grin)> > Mike> > ----- Original Message -----> From: "Bill Morgan" 
> <billmorgan124 at cableone.net>> To: "NFB OF Idaho Discussion List" 
> <nfb-idaho at nfbnet.org>> Date: 2008/11/08 01:22:23> Subject: 
> [Nfb-idaho] autable devicefor crossing streets with traffic lights.> >

> >> >> > Hello Mike and listers.> > Back in 85 I was struck by a car in

> a non lighted marked cross walk at the corner of 6th and Washington 
> with my guide dog Hart.> > I had started crossing the street with 
> several office workers headed for 9th and Washington.> > In this case 
> my getting hit with or without traffic lights may not of mattered.> > 
> As I was about halfway or a little more across a 69 Plymouth Fury 
> struck me on my right side.> > I knocked my dog with my left side and 
> that put him ahead of me even more where the car missed Hart.> > I was

> hit hard enough that I was thrown up and over the entire hood, up and 
> over the drivers side windshield on to the drivers side roof.> > I 
> then fell on the roof on to the pathment.> > They thought on scene 
> that my neck, back, and right hip and right ankle were broken.> > It 
> turned out that all my damage was mussels, ligaments, and soft tissue,

> and neck damage.> > I was in a wheelchair for 6 months, and in bed for

> 3 months.> > > > It was found that the person driving that hit me, 
> didn't see me until I was coming across his hood.> > He was a 69 year 
> old man that had had laser surgery on his eyes, and was coming home 
> from the surgery.> > He was told not to drive by the doctor, but did 
> anyway.> > > > Now after describing this accident where, and when 
> would I had time to try and listen to a speech device beeping at me, 
> or talking or whatever at me, while concentrating on getting across 
> the street.> > As you can see this device would have been no help even

> if there had been a light.> > The man couldn't see as he should have, 
> so maybe he also besides not seeing several others crossing, me nor my

> guide dog probably wouldn't see a green light turning red all at 
> once.> > > > This is another one of great intentions, but not asking 
> those the device is aimed for what a cross section of blind and 
> visually impaired thought about it.> > > > I do believe there are 
> certain lighted special confusing or really wide heavy trafficked 
> intersections that audible signals are helpful.> > > > However, I do 
> not see how anyone could especially using a cane have to think about 
> line of travel, speed getting across, possible audible signal, traffic

> flows, and now having to listen for this handheld device waiting to 
> see if its going to go off any second telling me I am out of bounds as

> it were.> > Way to much information!> > Overload!> > > > 
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