[NFB-Seniors-Discussion] Do you visit APPLVIS - FW: [Tech-VI] Wider Tech Discussions: AppleVis Forums Expand Beyond Apple

[robertleslienewman at gmail.com]

In case any of you applevis reader’s have not seen that the content of applevis is going broader than just Apple products- 

 

RLN 

 

From: tech-vi at groups.io <tech-vi at groups.io> On Behalf Of David Goldfield
Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2024 7:17 PM
To: List <tech-vi at groups.io>
Subject: [Tech-VI] Wider Tech Discussions: AppleVis Forums Expand Beyond Apple

 

AppleVis: Recent Blog Posts - Tuesday, March 19, 2024 at 8:40 AM


Wider Tech Discussions: AppleVis Forums Expand Beyond Apple


Since our launch in 2010, AppleVis has been the premier online community for blind and low-vision users of Apple hardware, software, and services. Our forums have hosted countless conversations around vision accessibility, with members asking questions, exchanging knowledge and expertise, and generally assisting each other with making the most of Apple technologies.

As our community has grown, so too have the interests and needs expressed by our members. Many have voiced a desire for the opportunity to discuss topics that fall outside of our traditional Apple-centric scope, but still revolve around technology that enhances independence and quality of life for the visually impaired.

After carefully weighing community feedback, we've decided to expand the AppleVis forums by adding four new areas dedicated to:

*	Assistive Technology Hardware
*	Windows
*	Android
*	Smart Home Tech

The decision to broaden our boundaries was not taken lightly. We aimed to balance the potential benefits with being thoughtful about avoiding potential downsides that could detract from AppleVis's core Apple accessibility mission.

Some of the key pros that motivated this move include:

1.	Tapping Into Collective Expertise: Our community members possess a vast wealth of knowledge and expertise that extends far beyond just Apple's products and services. These new forum areas will allow that collective wisdom around assistive technology, Windows, Android and more to be shared and leveraged for the benefit of all.
2.	Trusted Voices: Many AppleVis members have built reputations as knowledgeable, trustworthy commentators. These new areas allow those voices to be heard on relevant non-Apple topics.
3.	Strengthening Our Community: For many, AppleVis represents more than just Apple talk - it's a community. These areas present opportunities to connect over additional shared technology interests and experiences.
4.	One-Stop Discussions: Currently, conversations that stray from core AppleVis focus get redirected to other platforms like email or social media. Bringing a wide range of topics under one unified space could make it easier to maintain conversations in a single location.

At the same time, we're aware of potential risks in overextending AppleVis's focus. Some key concerns include:

1.	Dilution of Focus: AppleVis's strength comes from its ultra-specific mission around Apple's products and accessibility. Adding too many broader topic areas risks muddying the waters and taking away from the core purpose that draws people here.
2.	Moderation Challenges: Currently, moderation can focus on keeping conversations productive and centered around AppleVis's key topics. Expanding the range of allowed subjects could make moderation more difficult and time-consuming.
3.	Noise and Discord: Even with the best of intentions, online community spaces with an overly broad scope can sometimes devolve into unproductive arguing, political ranting, and overall negativity that detracts from the positive environment AppleVis strives to maintain.

To mitigate downsides, this broadening of scope will be limited to the forum areas. Other core sections of AppleVis like guides, podcasts, and reviews will remain Apple-specific. Additionally, recent posts from the new forums will be listed separately from Apple-focused content on the home page. Our existing community rules <https://www.applevis.com/help/guidelines>  will fully extend to these new areas, with some sensible adjustments made to account for their non-Apple topics.

This forum expansion should be considered as a pilot initiative for now. Keeping the number of new forum areas small allows us to gauge community interest and work through any moderation challenges before potentially expanding in the future if successful. It is unlikely we would ever add forum areas for more general open discussions that could allow for topics like politics, religion and other divisive social issues, as those can spark negativity counter to the constructive environment AppleVis aims to foster.

Our goal is to thoughtfully broaden AppleVis's scope to meet more needs for our community, while maintaining its foundation as a productive, trustworthy space focused on Apple accessibility.

We're excited about the constructive potential of these new forum areas! But their success will depend on active participation from members like yourself. We hope you'll check them out, engage in the discussions, and let us know what you think of this initiative.

As always, we're grateful to have such an engaged and passionate community. Your support and feedback help shape the evolution of AppleVis into an ever more empowering resource.


Tags


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Comments


Thanks for this! <https://applevis.com/comment/164538#comment-164538> 


By Brooke

10 hours 14 min ago

It's appreciated.

*	 


Thank you <https://applevis.com/comment/164541#comment-164541> 


By Winter Roses

9 hours 31 min ago

I hope this works out, because it can be a great addition to what we already have here. As it regards to other topics such as blindness in general, mobility, independence, self advocacy, religion, politics, I don't think that this would be the right place for these topics. There are many social media platforms and profiles that are already dedicated to facilitating such discussions and friendships. Keeping this website technology focused, for the most part, I think is the right idea. Of course, this is only my personal opinion, but, yeah, Smart move.

*	 


I've not been shy about my frustrations <https://applevis.com/comment/164542#comment-164542> 


By Lottie

9 hours 22 min ago

So being able to discuss things on here that I know fellow community members use, because we talk about them elsewhere, is welcome. I will take part in the pilot and hope this, together with a new spirit of posativity that most of us ar embracing, continues.

*	 


Good work <https://applevis.com/comment/164544#comment-164544> 


By Ollie

8 hours 53 min ago

Thank you for this. I realise it is more work for moderators but I do think it will allow for a fuller and more holistic discussion of technology that supports us as a community, and can quiet the concerns of those apple vis members who get into a panic when we're discussing non-apple products.

Fingers crossed we play nice with the new toys you've given us as, you are quite within your rights to take them away again, especially if we start trying to insert them in to undesirable places.

This modification has drawn me back... For better or worse. :)

*	 


Thanks for this <https://applevis.com/comment/164545#comment-164545> 


By TheBllindGuy07

7 hours 34 min ago

I discovered Applevis back in 2022. I really appreciate the level of conversation we can have when we're talking to the right person here about technical stuff on accessibility. I think being able to actually compare different screen readers on different oses will be helpful if the negativity is reduced at the minimum. I just hope that we're going to see more posts on how to actually do x stuff on x system rather than just complaints on what is not working especially on macos.

*	 


Thumbs up <https://applevis.com/comment/164547#comment-164547> 


By PaulMartz

7 hours 24 min ago

AppleVis Illuminati, thanks for your hard work. Looking forward to the continued exchange of knowledge.

*	 


Is there going to be a… <https://applevis.com/comment/164549#comment-164549> 


By Ollie

6 hours 57 min ago

Is there going to be a slightly easier way to access these topics? Currently they are pretty hidden... Unless I'm missing something. I understand they are not in the main feed, but it would be very useful to have a more direct way in than going to menu/form/specific form etc... Or am I being daft and there is an easier way of doing this?

*	 


Re: Is there going to be a… <https://applevis.com/comment/164550#comment-164550> 


By David Goodwin

6 hours 47 min ago

The most recent posts to the new forums are listed on the site's Home page.

Navigate to the heading at level 2 titled “Latest Non-Apple Posts” and you will find them listed below. There is also a filter present there which can be used to refine the list to only one of the new forum areas.

Hope this helps ☺️

*	 


Awesome, thank you David… <https://applevis.com/comment/164552#comment-164552> 


By Ollie

6 hours 2 min ago

Awesome, thank you David. Much easier. I certainly appreciate all this. It's exciting!

*	 


Honestly not sure how I feel about this <https://applevis.com/comment/164553#comment-164553> 


By Steve Sawczyn

5 hours 56 min ago

While I respect the desire to support the blind/low-vision community more broadly, one of the big advantages to the AppleVis community, in my opinion, was it's focus on Apple products and services and how we might leverage those to live more independent lives. I mean it's right in the name of the site, there's a reason it's not called BlindVis or similar. My concern is that this doesn't turn into a place where someone doesn't feel comfortable coming forward with an iPhone question because they know they'll get a response to the effect that they wouldn't have this problem if they had gone with Android. Having trouble with Safari? Gosh, just switch to Windows and Edge. 

To be fair, I think generalized discussions around all the tools and tech we have available to us is important, but there are already places for those discussions. I certainly hope this expansion goes well, but given the reasons which I feel have made this community such a success, it's just not something I support.

*	 


RE: Honestly not sure how I feel about this <https://applevis.com/comment/164555#comment-164555> 


By AnonyMouse

5 hours 28 min ago

While I understand your concerns, let me clarify that if this were a single listing of postings, your observation would be accurate. However, I’d like to point out that the Apple-related postings are distinct from the Non-Apple postings on the main page. By using the Heading 2 section, you can clearly see the separation between these two segments. iPhone questions will remain exactly as they were and will be placed in the Apple posting area.

Regarding any trolling within the postings, we are committed to minimizing toxicity. This approach won’t differ significantly from the past, where discussions about Android or Windows occasionally occurred. Such discussions have always been part of AppleVis. As long as the dialogue remains respectful and peaceful, we encourage open conversations. If people wish to express their enthusiasm for Windows or Android, those topics will be appropriately categorized and won’t appear in the Apple-related postings on the main page.

I hope this explanation alleviates your concerns.

*	 


Steve Sawczyn <https://applevis.com/comment/164556#comment-164556> 


By Holger Fiallo

5 hours 21 min ago

Agree. Also regarding the comment by Thomas in a perfect world but this is not. I think that concern is valid.

*	 


Concerns <https://applevis.com/comment/164557#comment-164557> 


By David Taylor

5 hours 8 min ago

Hi, Firstly, I often think that I wish there was a place like Applevis for other operating systems, and in that aspect, and the willingness to want to be open, I applaud this. However, there is now an equivalent forum for Android, and this could be perceived as stepping on their tows, and also, while Apple is in the name, people who aren't in the know won't think of this as a place for other tech. This will mean that eventually, the name will have to be changed, and then we won't have the place Apple users would find so easily. There are literally loads of places people can talk tech in general already. I am all in favour of being able to talk about other operating systems in terms of how you use them to complete a task relevant to your apple product, like using iTunes on a PC for instance, even Apple Software on Windows, but I also do fear this site eventually turning into another huge, rambling thing that gets harder and harder to navigate. Please keep the nice focus, and don't make this the Facebook of the blind tech world, where there are thousands of unrelated things that you have to find your way through to get to what you want.

*	 


An exciting day for AppleVis. <https://applevis.com/comment/164558#comment-164558> 


By Andy Lane

5 hours 3 min ago

Personally I think this is a great move. I always thought AppleVis should start a WindowsVis, AndroidVis etc etc site to facilitate people wanting to share knowledge about other platforms but this is a great workaround that achieves the same goal. I’m sure its going to be a success and vastly increase the depth of knowledge and sharing in the community.

*	 


There are a few references… <https://applevis.com/comment/164559#comment-164559> 


By Ollie

4 hours 55 min ago

There are a few references to preexisting windows/android resources here. I hope it's not out of line to ask where they are? Often I've been told there are other forums to talk about such things without being directed to said forums. Hopefully the new apple vis will negate a need for me to find them, but it would also be useful to know where to look should I have questions about windows, windows hardware or other assistive technology or technology with accessibility built in, the new zoom H1E, H4E and H6E come to mind.

*	 


Worth a try. smile <https://applevis.com/comment/164560#comment-164560> 


By Bruce Harrell

4 hours 52 min ago

Sounds like a good pilot project. I say, give it a try. See what happens. Maintaining separateness will help, I expect, and I'm curious to browse the new forum areas to see what's hot in our parallel universes. I would be surprised if Applevis lost focus, though. I suspect most of us value too much what we have to let it be harmed. After all, wink, we're a pretty vocal crowd, don't you think?

*	 


I don't know I agree with this <https://applevis.com/comment/164566#comment-164566> 


By Dennis Long

2 hours 36 min ago

I don't know I agree with this. I love this has been a place to discuss Apple products and get help.

*	 


Three things coming to my mind: <https://applevis.com/comment/164568#comment-164568> 


By Enes Deniz

2 hours 9 min ago

1.	Being able to exchange knowledge, opinions and ideas on other operating systems and a broader range of topics with folks I have already discussed Apple-related matters and am acquainted with, sounds great.
2.	As long as the site's name and domain remains the same, the impression will still be that it is primarily intended to host Apple-related content, hopefully preventing a possible loss of content quality or shift of focus.
3.	I would still love to have other websites like windowsvis.com and visiondroid.com with a main website linking them to each other. Users would continue to have one single account and could sign into all the websites with it from the home page of that main site. We already have websites like accessibleandroid.com hosting content on Android. What inspired me to think of that is WhatsApp's Communities feature where one may opt to join each one of the community's subgroups and leave them whenever one desires without having to leave the community altogether. I do know this requires a significant amount of time and resources to have the infrastructure needed for such a complex endeavor.

*	 


I love this <https://applevis.com/comment/164569#comment-164569> 


By Joshua

2 hours 9 min ago

This is an awesome idea, good job guys
Now if you don’t mind I’m going to get used to the new layout

*	 


Little tip for navigating to heading level 2 where this is place <https://applevis.com/comment/164570#comment-164570> 


By Ollie

2 hours 4 min ago

On mac, VO U brings up the rotor. Use arrow keys until voiceover says headings then press the number 2. This will list all headings of level 2 on the page. There may be a faster way of doing this but this is the solution I found to speed up navigation.

*	 


If you're using single-key… <https://applevis.com/comment/164572#comment-164572> 


By Tyler

1 hour 44 min ago

If you're using single-key Quick Nav on macOS (or a Windows screenreader) simply pressing the number 2 should take you to the next heading at that level, so if you were, for example, browsing the latest Apple-centric posts and wanted to jump to the non-Apple-centric posts, simply pressing the number 2 should take you right to that heading. At least that's how I'm currently doing it.

*	 


This is an interesting idea. <https://applevis.com/comment/164574#comment-164574> 


By Brad

1 hour 14 min ago

I like it, I do like the idea of seperat sites so people can have podcasts on how to do thing x for their own OS but if that doesn't happen this is a good idea and i'll be using it.

Change is coming and that's a good thing.

*	 


Devil comes out to play <https://applevis.com/comment/164575#comment-164575> 


By Siobhan

1 hour 8 min ago

Applevis does not have the moderator capacity to handle what's going to happen. for one thing, the one line of Who uses Alex? Then the comment line of the same, is not enforced at all. A minor peeve I admit, however if you go by headings, reading the same subject and comment, you've read it all before getting to the comment. I'm therefore suggesting better moderator leadership so as besides one line responses to questions, when topics get either heated, or even the bullying aspect (perceived) as what's been going on, let not the topic be "closed", yet keep an eye on it. I mean if things are closed, how are others who may agree with a now closed topic speak up? Should they create another one thereby necessitating another "closed" sign when things get to much to handle? Besides these suggestions, what's wrong with having other language speaking forums at least being submitted, translated, then when someone speaks such, moderate a person to do these tasks? If this is supposed to grow, I watered it, now see where the seeds are to sprout. I'm not much however despite some spelling errors which are beyond my control in the subject line of comments, I'm volunteering to whip this into some semblance of an Apple or other tech company enthused to see this. I have naysayers and all I'll say is, bring it.

*	 


I actually agree. <https://applevis.com/comment/164578#comment-164578> 


By Brad

34 min 44 sec ago

I'll fully admit I do feel Siobhan can be a bit full of herself as i'm sure she feels I don't have thick enough skin, but on this I do agree.

I don't understand the part about who uses alix, i'm assuming it was a post here, but do actually think topics shouldn't be closed, *unless* the people are just throwing insults around or just going around and around in general.

Having said that, the issue is we'd then have threads that are thousands of comments long and that probably wouldn't be a good idea.

I can honestly say I don't know how to handle this and will leave it to others who care more about it than I do.

I'm really liking this non apple discussion part of the site and hope it thrives.

*	 


@Siobhan. <https://applevis.com/comment/164581#comment-164581> 


By Brad

27 min 15 sec ago

I've just read the who uses alex thread and it's not the same thing on both lines, it's similar but the person does expand a little on why they like the voice.

*	 


You're correct, <https://applevis.com/comment/164584#comment-164584> 


By Siobhan

13 min 29 sec ago

They do by a sentence or two. I'm just looking for comments and subject as we were asked to do so awhile back stating our problem, not just, my phone won't work. Despite me being full of myself, I do my best to describe what I need and go into detail in the body of the comment. Again, this is my own opinion so it doesn't work with how people want, it's an annoyance and I'll just shut up. Hell men tell me that all the time. Where's the duct tape? :)

*	 


Subject Line for Siobhan <https://applevis.com/comment/164585#comment-164585> 


By OldBear

9 sec ago

I usually write what I would want for a subject line in the comment, then cut and paste it in the subject field after correcting any misspellings. I don't know exactly why you are not able to correct misspellings in the subject line, but for me it is because a single line field in my browser doesn't invoke spell check, where as the multi-line comment fields do.
That being said, I don't have any complaints or gripes or worries about the change/expansion. I'm also looking forward to what people post in the non-Apple hardware blind-tech threads.

*	 


Oh ok. <https://applevis.com/comment/164586#comment-164586> 


By Brad

9 sec ago

I've not spent a lot of time on this website so wasn't aware that was a thing.

I'm sorry you've gone through that stuff with men, perhaps some theropy might help, give you someone to talk to about how to calm down if you need to, or to stand your ground without yelling.

I understand that's off topic and @Siobhan if you want me to delete that paragraph let me know, but this stuff should always be taken siriously.

*	 

https://applevis.com/blog/wider-tech-discussions-applevis-forums-expand-beyond-apple

 

 

 

David Goldfield,

Blindness Assistive Technology Specialist

 

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