[nfb-talk] [Vrstream]Fw:[fcb-l] FW: [acb-l]Stevie Wonderto UN: EaseCopyrights forthe Blind

Tue Sep 28 23:40:07 UTC 2010

guess I might as well state my little opinion here.

 I would not get caught up on one's choice of words if  the overall
message  is something that I agree with. I respect the views of the
individuals who have spoken here, but  "in the dark" need not be
looked upon as some sort of neggitive poke at the  blind. putting
blindness organization aside, I think  it's obvious that Mr. wonder
believes in something  that just makes sense no matter  if you are a
member of the federation or the council. any person who truly believes
in one's self and their abilities believes that they should gain
access to the same information that  their sighted friends, family and
peers get a hold of.

On 9/28/10, BMW <lynnwhite51 at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> there was absolutely nothing wrong with what he said.  He was relating being
> in the dark to be deprived of accessibility to literacy.
>
> I hope that people who are critical have taken the time to have heard the
> speech.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <ckrugman at sbcglobal.net>
> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2010 11:31 AM
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk][Vrstream]Fw:[fcb-l] FW: [acb-l]Stevie Wonderto UN:
> EaseCopyrights forthe Blind
>
>
>> that may very well be but as a blind person himself he should be much more
>>
>> enlightened. I realize that as a musician and song writer there is a
>> tendency for a flare for the dramatic and this writing style and
>> phraseology demonstrates the flare for the dramatic.
>> Chuck
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Wm. Ritchhart" <william.ritchhart at sbcglobal.net>
>> To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, September 24, 2010 7:24 AM
>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] [Vrstream]Fw:[fcb-l] FW: [acb-l]Stevie Wonderto
>> UN: Ease Copyrights forthe Blind
>>
>>
>>> "Living in the dark" is often used when discussing illiteracy.  I guess I
>>>
>>> am
>>> getting soft in some of you folks views.  I don't have a problem with the
>>> statement as I read it.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf Of John Heim
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 2010 11:32 AM
>>> To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] [Vrstream] Fw:[fcb-l] FW: [acb-l]Stevie Wonderto
>>> UN:
>>> Ease Copyrights for the Blind
>>>
>>> The best way to show people that you can stand up for your rights is to
>>> stand up for your rights. That's exactly what Stevie Wonder was doing.
>>>
>>> Intellectual property issues are a matter of competing rights. People
>>> have a
>>>
>>> right to intellectual properties like books, medicines,  and technologies
>>>
>>> if
>>>
>>> it can save their lives or their jobs. On the other hand, the creators of
>>> that intellectual property have a right to be compensated for their work.
>>> Copyright advocates tend to make the counter intuitive argument that by
>>> restricting access to knowledge, there will be more of it. Their
>>> reasoning
>>> is that unless those who develop the knowledge are fairly compensated,
>>> they
>>> won't  bother to develop more knowledge. And, of course, there's a
>>> certain
>>> amount of truth to that.
>>>
>>> The trick is to find the proper balance between  the competing rights of
>>> intellectual property creators and those who need it. IMO, our society
>>> has
>>> drifted far toward favoring the rights of the creators of intellectual
>>> property. Governments in many countries have simply ignored patents on
>>> AIDS
>>> drugs for example. What else can they do? They can't afford to pay the
>>> licensing fee and if they don't manufacture the drugs illegally, millions
>>>
>>> of
>>>
>>> people will die. Even the drug companies have recognized that their
>>> demands
>>> are impossible for some countries to meet and in most cases, they waive
>>> the
>>> licensing fee after the fact.
>>>
>>> Copyright exceptions for the blind came about in the United States when
>>> it
>>> became clear that publishers were not granting exceptions to NLS in a
>>> timely
>>>
>>> manner. NLS would request permission to make a audio version of a book
>>> for
>>> distribution in their own specialized format. But often it would be years
>>> before they heard from the publisher. Sometimes they would never hear
>>> from
>>> the publisher. It was in response to this foot dragging by publishers
>>> that
>>> Congress passed the law that made bookshare.org possible. But, of course,
>>> that only addressed the problem for citizens of the United States.
>>>
>>> The World Blind Union has been working for copyright exceptions for the
>>> blind for over 25 years now. The current proposed treaty was drafted in
>>> conjunction with Knowledge Ecology, a group advocating for the rights of
>>> users of intellectual property.  Its a very well crafted document. Like
>>> the
>>> US law that makes bookshare.org possible, the treaty would allow only
>>> non-profits to distribute material and only in a specialized format.
>>> Also,
>>> subscribers would have to prove that they had a reading disability. These
>>> are all the same rules that bookshare.org is subject to.
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Powers, Terry (NIH/OD/DEAS) [E]" <Terry.Powers at nih.gov>
>>> To: "'qubit'" <lauraeaves at yahoo.com>; "'NFB Talk Mailing List'"
>>> <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 2010 7:35 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] [Vrstream] Fw:[fcb-l] FW: [acb-l]Stevie Wonderto
>>> UN:
>>>
>>> Ease Copyrights for the Blind
>>>
>>>
>>>> Living in the dark can be taken at least two ways.  It can mean with no
>>>> sight, but it can also mean in suclusion.  We, the blind, get out and do
>>>> most anything, the same way a sighted person would, in our own way.  We
>>>> do
>>>
>>>> not stay in the dark, we socialize. We do not want the world to think we
>>>> can not stand up for our rights.
>>>>
>>>> Terry Powers
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: qubit [mailto:lauraeaves at yahoo.com]
>>>> Sent: Thursday, September 23, 2010 7:27 AM
>>>> To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] [Vrstream] Fw: [fcb-l] FW: [acb-l]Stevie
>>>> Wonderto
>>>> UN: Ease Copyrights for the Blind
>>>>
>>>> Isn't it true that the word "blind" has more than 1 meaning?  I see
>>>> nothing wrong with what Stevie Wonder said, as I think using the
>>>> metaphore
>>>
>>>> of blindness as applied to the mind is apt.  You lose a lot when you try
>>>> to be too politically correct -- I don't want people to feel like they
>>>> are
>>>
>>>> walking on egg shells when they are around me.  If they think blindness
>>>> is
>>>
>>>> a good metaphore to use, let them use it, and if they ask what I think
>>>> of
>>>> it I can judge then whether the word was misapplied.
>>>> I think no blind person thinks it's great to be blind -- at best, it is
>>>> a
>>>> nuisance, and at worst it can carry negative connotations that can cause
>>>>
>>>> a
>>>
>>>> person to be limited in his life.  Even dealing with the "nuisance"
>>>> definition is a pain.    But everyone has challenges, if not blindness,
>>>> it's
>>>> something else.  One of my brothers never lets me go into a "pity party"
>>>> about blindness, since if I express how something is difficult, he is
>>>> quick to remind me that it's the same as for anyone -- meaning the same
>>>> level of uncertainty and stress applies to everyone, albeit in a
>>>> different
>>>
>>>> way.
>>>>
>>>> Well, anyway, off that soapbox.
>>>> --le
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "BMW" <lynnwhite51 at sbcglobal.net>
>>>> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 7:27 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] [Vrstream] Fw: [fcb-l] FW: [acb-l]Stevie
>>>> Wonderto
>>>> UN: Ease Copyrights for the Blind
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I didn't hear him say it and I just heard the presentation.  And, if he
>>>> did, I think it was a symbolism to show that people who are able to
>>>> access
>>>
>>>> material are, in fact, living in the dark.
>>>>
>>>> Lots of truth to that.
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "David Andrews" <dandrews at visi.com>
>>>> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 3:08 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] [Vrstream] Fw: [fcb-l] FW: [acb-l]Stevie Wonder
>>>> to
>>>> UN: Ease Copyrights for the Blind
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I agree with you John:  we don't know for a fact what Stevie Wonder said
>>>>>and this is to important to be consumed by blindness politics.
>>>>>
>>>>> Dave
>>>>>
>>>>> At 01:58 PM 9/21/2010, you wrote:
>>>>>>The truth is that Stevie Wonder is trying to do a very good thing for
>>>>>>blind people all over the world. To attack him for a unfortunate choice
>>>>>>of
>>>>>>words is unfair. It amazes  me how all of a sudden, people on this list
>>>>>>are into PC language.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The truth is that Stevie Wonder's choice of words is not the main issue
>>>>>>here. The real issue is getting those treaty exceptions ratified. As I
>>>>>>explained, the treaty exceptions Mr. Wonder is working for would
>>>>>>essentially allow bookshare.org to go international.  That would be a
>>>>>>very
>>>>>>good thing.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I believe that the NFB is in favor of that too. So is bookshare, and
>>>>>>yes,
>>>>>>so is the ACB.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Gloria Whipple"
>>>>>><fairyfoot at webband.com>
>>>>>>To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 11:11 AM
>>>>>>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] [Vrstream] Fw: [fcb-l] FW: [acb-l]Stevie
>>>>>>Wonderto
>>>>>>UN: Ease Copyrights for theBlind
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Cannot except the truth?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Believe what you want.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Gloria Whipple
>>>>>>>Corrisponding secretary
>>>>>>>Inland Empire chapter
>>>>>>>nfb of WA
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>cell number: 509-475-4993
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>>>>On
>>>>>>>Behalf Of John Heim
>>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 8:19 AM
>>>>>>>To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] [Vrstream] Fw: [fcb-l] FW: [acb-l] Stevie
>>>>>>>Wonderto
>>>>>>>UN: Ease Copyrights for theBlind
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Rubbish is a bit strong, don't you think?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>PS: I saw another article on the same issue and "in the dark" is a
>>>>>>>direct
>>>>>>>quote. Apparently, Stevie Wonder used that term. But again, while it
>>>>>>>might
>>>>>>>not be the best choice of terms, its not a key point. Lets not throw
>>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>baby out with the bath water. Mr. Wonder is going a good thing here.
>>>>>>>If
>>>>>>>you
>>>>>>>have ever wondered why more promenent  blindpeople don't get involved
>>>>>>>in
>>>>>>>blid issues, you may have the reason right here.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Gloria Whipple"
>>>>>>><fairyfoot at webband.com>
>>>>>>>To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 10:01 AM
>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] [Vrstream] Fw: [fcb-l] FW: [acb-l] Stevie
>>>>>>>Wonderto
>>>>>>>UN: Ease Copyrights for theBlind
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>That is why I deleted it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>What rubbish!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Gloria Whipple
>>>>>>>>Corrisponding secretary
>>>>>>>>Inland Empire chapter
>>>>>>>>nfb of WA
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>cell number: 509-475-4993
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>[mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>>>>>On
>>>>>>>>Behalf Of Ray Foret Jr
>>>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 7:48 AM
>>>>>>>>To: Sherri
>>>>>>>>Cc: vrstream at vrstreamusers.org; NFB Talk Mailing List
>>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] [Vrstream] Fw: [fcb-l] FW: [acb-l] Stevie
>>>>>>>>Wonder
>>>>>>>>to
>>>>>>>>UN: Ease Copyrights for theBlind
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I have a problem with his phrase, "live in the dark.  What a picture
>>>>>>>>of
>>>>>>>>blindness.  Yes, we need access to books; but, at this price?  What
>>>>>>>>can
>>>>>>>>one
>>>>>>>>expect from folks who think there's no day or night for the blind?  I
>>>>>>>>must
>>>>>>>>protest!!!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>>>>>The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>A Very Proud and Happy Mac User!!!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>E-Mail:
>>>>>>>>rforetjr at comcast dot net
>>>>>>>>Skype Name:
>>>>>>>>barefootedray
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>On Sep 21, 2010, at 9:15 AM, Sherri wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Passing this along. Thought this was interesting!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Sherri
>>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Edwards, Paul" <pedwards at mdc.edu>
>>>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 9:48 AM
>>>>>>>>Subject: [fcb-l] FW: [acb-l] Stevie Wonder to UN: Ease Copyrights for
>>>>>>>>theBlind
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>From: acb-l-bounces at acb.org [mailto:acb-l-bounces at acb.org] On Behalf
>>>>>>>>>Of
>>>>>>>>John Heim
>>>>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2010 9:46 AM
>>>>>>>>>To: acb-l at acb.org
>>>>>>>>>Subject: [acb-l] Stevie Wonder to UN: Ease Copyrights for the Blind
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Relevant to our recent discussion about people who have "made it".
>>>>>>>>>--- Stevie Wonder to UN: Ease Copyrights for the Blind
>>>>>>>>>GENEVA (AP) -- Stevie Wonder pressed global copyright overseers on
>>>>>>>>>Monday
>>>>>>>>to
>>>>>>>>>help blind and visually impaired people access millions of science,
>>>>>>>>history
>>>>>>>>>and other audiobooks, which they cannot read in electronic form.
>>>>>>>>>The blind singer told the U.N.'s 184-nation World Intellectual
>>>>>>>>>Property
>>>>>>>>>Organization that more than 300 million people who ''live in the
>>>>>>>>>dark''
>>>>>>>>want
>>>>>>>>>to ''read their way into light,'' and the current copyright system
>>>>>>>>>denies
>>>>>>>>>them an equal opportunity.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The current legal framework means that institutes for the blind in
>>>>>>>>different
>>>>>>>>>countries may be required to make multiple audiobook versions of the
>>>>>>>>>same
>>>>>>>>>work, said Richard Owens, WIPO's director of copyright and
>>>>>>>>>electronic
>>>>>>>>>commerce.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Owens said this leads to higher costs that are passed on to the
>>>>>>>>>listeners.
>>>>>>>>>It also limits access to blind and partially blind people in poor
>>>>>>>>countries,
>>>>>>>>>which cannot afford to make their own versions of everything from
>>>>>>>>>science
>>>>>>>>>textbooks to best-sellers, he said.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The U.N. agency has been trying for six years to revamp its global
>>>>>>>>copyright
>>>>>>>>>framework so that it better accounts for new media, such as
>>>>>>>>>audiobooks.
>>>>>>>>For
>>>>>>>>>the blind and visually impaired, the goal is to create a
>>>>>>>>>clearinghouse
>>>>>>>>>so
>>>>>>>>>that published material can be traded around the world and
>>>>>>>>>translated
>>>>>>>>>into
>>>>>>>>>new, readable formats.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>But the problem of access for such copyrighted material goes to the
>>>>>>>>>heart
>>>>>>>>of
>>>>>>>>>a growing crisis in the world of copyright protection, as the
>>>>>>>>>Internet
>>>>>>>>>increasingly muddies laws that were created for traditional media.
>>>>>>>>>Whereas
>>>>>>>>>wide exceptions exist for books in Braille, WIPO officials say there
>>>>>>>>>is
>>>>>>>>>confusion over how these benefits can be translated into the digital
>>>>>>>>>age.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Proponents of a new agreement say the same benefits that digital
>>>>>>>>>books
>>>>>>>>>provide most consumers -- lower costs and better storage and
>>>>>>>>>accessibility -- should be extended to those with disabilities. The
>>>>>>>>>United
>>>>>>>>>States and European nations that export large amounts of published
>>>>>>>>material
>>>>>>>>>are somewhat hesitant because of concerns over an erosion of
>>>>>>>>>intellectual
>>>>>>>>>property rights, and want to avoid a binding treaty.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Wonder called for a compromise and teased the diplomats.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>''Please work it out. Or I'll have to write a song about what you
>>>>>>>>>didn't
>>>>>>>>>do,'' said the 60-year-old singer known for such hits as
>>>>>>>>>''Superstition''
>>>>>>>>>and ''I Just Called to Say I Love You.''
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Complicating the talks are the demands of African countries, which
>>>>>>>>>are
>>>>>>>>>seeking even larger copyright loopholes. They want their libraries
>>>>>>>>>and
>>>>>>>>>academic institutions to be able to skip licensing agreements so
>>>>>>>>>that
>>>>>>>>>they
>>>>>>>>>can provide audiobook access for larger communities.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Wonder, who has sold tens of million of albums, said any agreement
>>>>>>>>>should
>>>>>>>>>respect the authors ''who labor to create the great works that
>>>>>>>>>enlighten
>>>>>>>>and
>>>>>>>>>nourish our minds, hearts and souls.'' He insisted on a practical
>>>>>>>>>solution
>>>>>>>>>so that blind and visually impaired people get ''the tools to think
>>>>>>>>>their
>>>>>>>>>way out of poverty.''
>>>>>
>>>>>                         David Andrews:  dandrews at visi.com
>>>>> Follow me on Twitter:  http://www.twitter.com/dandrews920
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
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>>>>
>>>>
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