[nfb-talk] Joseph's situation: was: Re: TSA discriminationin Orlando
Eddie Salcido
rednexican at socal.rr.com
Sun Jul 17 23:27:11 UTC 2011
I remember smuggling a stylus onto the plane in my sax bag shortly after
9/11. I put it in the same pouch as the metal sax neck and put everything
in the bell of the sax. It worked.
----- Original Message -----
From: "T. Joseph Carter" <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com>
To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2011 4:09 PM
Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Joseph's situation: was: Re: TSA discriminationin
Orlando
> Terry,
>
> You had folding scissors in the cabin on the plane?! Those are approved
> for checked baggage, but not carry-on. You may carry-on a slate and
> stylus, however.
>
> Joseph
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 10:02:50AM -0400, Powers, Terry (NIH/OD/DEAS) [E]
> wrote:
>>Thankfully I had no trouble with my Apex, folding craft sizzors and nd
>>needle along with the craft project, yarn, ID mate, snacks, medications
>>and plastic ware and cups. I was not questioned about any of my items.
>>The only bad thing that happened was when I got home, 2 of my medication
>>bottles where open and spilled in their case. Thankfully they were in
>>different carying cases or I would have had a mess. I can not say if this
>>happened at security or from being tossed around.
>>
>>Terry Powers
>>
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: bookwormahb at earthlink.net [mailto:bookwormahb at earthlink.net]
>>Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2011 10:10 PM
>>To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Joseph's situation: was: Re: TSA discriminationin
>>Orlando
>>
>>Joseph,
>>I'll discuss more off list perhaps as I'm interested if the TSA even
>>responds and when Scott responds what his reaction is.
>>I am glad you have a complaint in mind. The time and date will help. Oh my
>>is our government bad if you cannot record this stuff. What a way to cover
>>up their treatment. I wasn't aware it was a crime warranting arrest. I
>>thought you just got a ticket or something like that.
>>I do hope something is done. Another idea is to contact your state
>>affiliate president; remember national office is busy and state presidents
>>might be able to help out more.
>>You could also write a letter to your congressmen and tell them what
>>happened.
>>
>>TSA screening of us is a concern of mine as I do not like people touching
>>me and with the media covering these invasive searches, it really really
>>scares me. Also I wonder if you'd be able to get a stylus through
>>security now. I guess they still comfiscate small items like nail clippers
>>and scissors.
>>I wonder if they'd take medical supplies such as needles too?
>>How on earth do people get their notetakers through security now? They
>>don't look like a typical computer and TSA could suspect that you have
>>something in it.
>>
>>Anyway, don't give up and I hope you do get support. As I said Scott is
>>busy and I'd follow up with him in a week if he doesn't respond.
>>I do that with high up busy people whether it be my state president or a
>>college dean.
>>
>>Ashley
>>
>>
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: T. Joseph Carter
>>Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2011 8:19 PM
>>To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Joseph's situation: was: Re: TSA discriminationin
>>Orlando
>>
>>Names were never given to me, no. Neither the female agent who told me I
>>would be subject to additional screening, nor the male agent who performed
>>that screening, nor the male agent who lied to me about the scanner. I do
>>have the date and time I went through, however, and the TSA does record
>>video.
>>
>>Passengers may not record anything going through security.
>>
>>I am filing a complaint in the morning, on my own, as seems to be the
>>general consensus here that I should do. It won't go anywhere without the
>>NFB behind it, since the TSA is not obliged to actually investigate it or
>>anything.
>>
>>Joseph
>>
>>
>>On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 06:37:30PM -0400, bookwormahb at earthlink.net wrote:
>>>Steve, great advice. You have to file a complaint quickly and
>>>thouroughly with out the emotion.
>>>Also, state any staff whom you dealt with. Joeseph, do you have the
>>>officers's names?
>>>Good luck.
>>>Ashley
>>>
>>>-----Original Message----- From: Steve Jacobson
>>>Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2011 4:01 PM
>>>To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>>>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Joseph's situation: was: Re: TSA
>>>discriminationin Orlando
>>>
>>>If anything good is to come out of this, this must all be thought
>>>through carefully. I think the first thing to do is to find out where
>>>and how to lodge a complaint. The second thing is to think through the
>>>whole situation and figure out which part of what happened can be clearly
>>>proven.
>>>It is very
>>>likely that it will be a lot of Joe's word against their word here.
>>>For example, we do not think that the metal detector went off. Are we
>>>sure, though, and can we prove it? Do they always make a sound? Can
>>>Joe say for certain that he didn't hear it going off given his state by
>>>then? If they claim that the metal detector went off, then their
>>>pat-down is going to be seen as justifiable.
>>>Whether Joe should have been taken behind a screen is then a separate
>>>matter and I don't know what sort of regulations there are.
>>>
>>>Joe, I understand your frustration when people miss the point
>>>completely, but you seem to require that we are 100% cheerleaders or we
>>>are against you.
>>>You don't need cheerleaders, you need people to ask challenging
>>>questions now so you have the answers later. You also need to take
>>>into account the fact that some people take vacations after
>>>conventions, and your case doesn't have a one week statute of
>>>limitations. If you have not done so, you should carefully write down
>>>your experience with as much of the details as you can remember. Your
>>>post here is a pretty good start, but try to get past the anger and
>>>relate events as objectively as you can. Identify the staff with whom
>>>you interacted as much as you can. Someone said you should avoid that
>>>airline, but I don't think the people you dealt with were likely
>>>airline personnel, but it may not be clear to whom they are
>>>responsible. If you are wrong about the metal detector not going off
>>>or even if they claim you are wrong, it puts a lot of doubt on your
>>>case since what they did after would no longer be punitive but
>>>procedure. Was there anyone with you who would be in a good position
>>>to back up your position that you did not set off the metal detector?
>>>Even if it is your word against theirs, it is still worth filing a
>>>complaint. Even if they claim that, for example, the metal detector
>>>went off and they were then following procedure, your complaint at
>>>least shows that they did not communicate with you well which is still
>>>wrong. Over the years we hve helped a number of people with complaints
>>>here in Minnesota, and it just isn't always the case that the first
>>>line of defense is waiting for the national office to get back to you.
>>>
>>>Best regards,
>>>
>>>Steve Jacobson
>>>
>>>On Wed, 13 Jul 2011 11:41:18 -0500, Ray Foret Jr wrote:
>>>
>>>>Joseph, I am not looking to contradict what you are saying; but,
>>>>frankly, I wonder something. did you attempt to telephone Scot
>>>>Labarre? did you attempt
>>>to telephone Dr. Maurer? I myself have successfully reached him a time
>>>or two when I needed to. I understand your anger; and, believe me, I
>>>am not trying to say that what happened to you was right. Neither, for
>>>that matter, is anybody else. I fail to understand how you were
>>>attacked by any leader of the federation on this list. I plead with
>>>you not to let the present anger you feel cause you to believe the
>>>entire federation is against you. Quite naturally, you wish an
>>>emidiate response; and, I'm sure we all would like the same thing.
>>>But, sometimes, a phone call is much faster than e-mail. May I
>>>respectfully suggest that you might get better results if you
>>>telephoned the national
>>>center:
>>>
>>>>410-659-9314
>>>>and got Dr. Maurer on the phone? It can be done. I hope you do not
>>>>hold the view that just because I'm defending the list to the extent I
>>>>am, that I'm
>>>against you. Doubtless, that is hard to see now because of the
>>>emotional closeness of your situation. Try the phone. I suspect that
>>>you will get faster results. Hypothetically, let's say you got hold of
>>>Dr. Maurer this very day. Let's say he agreed to take the case. Do
>>>you seriously imagine that we could haul the TSA in court and make
>>>them pay up on your behalf tomorrow? Not possible. I know you want a
>>>resolution of this matter right now; but, to speak frankly, you're not
>>>going to get it by just sending one or two e-mails and then waiting
>>>letting your anger increase until you think the entire federation is
>>>against you just because you happened to read the personal opinions of
>>>perhaps one or two federation leaders who may or may not agree with
>>>you. Please keep this in mind. Those were their personal opinions
>>>only; NOT, mind you, the actual official positions of the organization.
>>>Perhaps, before you type your reply to this, perhaps you should pick up
>>>the phone and contact Scott Labarre and Dr. Maurer. You may have to
>>>leave messages for them; but, they've got a lot to do. Still, at least
>>>give it a try. I'm trying to be constructive with regard to your
>>>situation. It's not that I do not believe you, I do. IF I were in
>>>your situation and you in mine, I'd expect you to tell me the same
>>>thing. Don't let your anger blot out your reason.
>>>
>>>
>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>>>
>>>>Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>>>
>>>>Skype name:
>>>>barefootedray
>>>
>>>>Facebook:
>>>>facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>On Jul 13, 2011, at 11:15 AM, T. Joseph Carter wrote:
>>>
>>>>>Ray, my email to Scott LaBarre has gone completely unanswered and, so
>>>>>far
>>>>>as I can tell, completely ignored.
>>>>>
>>>>>And for the ten thousandth time: I WAS NOT OFFERED THE CHOICE of
>>>>>walking
>>>>>alone through the metal detector.
>>>>>
>>>>>The leaders of the Federation who purport to represent it should not be
>>>>>so quick to attack the membership if they dont want their opinions to
>>>>>be
>>>>>taken as
>>>the organizations position. I have their opinions and no other
>>>response.
>>>What am I to think?
>>>>>
>>>>>Joseph
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 08:21:12AM -0500, Ray Foret Jr wrote:
>>>>>>Until now, I have deliberately stayed out of this thread. I wanted to
>>>>>>see if cooler heads would prevail. What seems to have happened is
>>>>>>this.
>>>>>>Joseph, I
>>>wanted to say this to you openly on the list because I want it thoroughly
>>>understood where I'm coming from. On the face of it, it would appear,
>>>based on
>>>your story, that your rights as a blind person, (and a federationist
>>>also),
>>>were violated. Clearly, and without doubt, your rights were indeed
>>>violated. There is
>>>no debate about that; and, it seems to me that everybody on the list
>>>pretty
>>>much agrees with you on that; and, perhaps, to that extent, shares your
>>>own
>>>outrage. The debate, it seems to me, is this. Should this be a matter
>>>for
>>>the federation. Clearly, in your opinion, the answer seems to be and
>>>ought
>>>to be
>>>"yes". However, there are some on this list, (a federation leader or two
>>>among them), who hold the view that, though much wrong was done you, it
>>>is
>>>not
>>>necessarily a federation matter. At this point, perhaps in the impulsive
>>>heat and freshness of your anger, you then attribute the contrary opinion
>>>to yours on
>>>this list upon the part of some as being the "official" position of the
>>>National Federation of the Blind merely because such contrary opinion has
>>>been
>>>expressed by one or more federation leaders. Therefore, in your anger,
>>>(refreshed by such contrary opinions), you now view the federation as
>>>being
>>>against
>>>you; and, you feel that most everyone on this list is against you.
>>>Doubtless, in your pain and anger, you say to yourself, "IF a federation
>>>leader is going to
>>>speak against me, then, surely, this represents the official opinion of
>>>the
>>>federation; and, therefore, it's useless to officially ask the federation
>>>for help
>>>because a leader has spoken against me and his position is the official
>>>position of the federation. IF this is the case, blast the whole thing!
>>>I'm going on my
>>>own and blast what the Federation says!".
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Joseph, let me remind you of something. The National Federation has
>>>>>>NOT, (I repeat and emphasize NOT), taken an "official" position
>>>>>>against
>>>your case or even for it. Let us all recall this. The only thing which
>>>has happened here is that You, Joseph, put to us your experiences at the
>>>airport,
>>>(which, it should go without saying), were very bad and frankly
>>>unnecessary. Some discussion was had about the matter. Some federation
>>>leaders who
>>>just happened to be on this list contributed their personal opinions
>>>regarding this. However, it's just as important to remember what DID,
>>>NOT,
>>>HAPPEN.
>>>The National Federation of the Blind did NOT formally refuse to aid you.
>>>The organization did not do so.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Now, the last of my remarks are directed to the rest of us. There is
>>>>>>no
>>>>>>doubt, in my mind at least, that most of us here feel that Joseph was
>>>wronged. We're all with him on that. Some of us posit that he should
>>>have
>>>been allowed to keep his cane; while, others of us, myself included, feel
>>>that he
>>>could have done without it for the very short walk through what is
>>>essentially a straight line. So, who is right and who is wrong? I posit
>>>that this is a matter
>>>we each need to determine for ourselves. Some of us will feel one way,
>>>some of us another. This is an extremely delicate balancing act which,
>>>if
>>>we are all
>>>honest with ourselves, we will never get right all of the time. Perhaps,
>>>as a matter of course, Joseph should seek official help from the
>>>federation
>>>if he feels
>>>that there is a compelling necessity to obtain it. Only then can he be
>>>assured of the "official" position of the organization one way or the
>>>other. Meantime,
>>>all we all have are the various opinions of this and any other lists on
>>>which Joseph is. We should, in my own view, back him as much as we can;
>>>but, then
>>>too, we should not allow human emotion to cloud our judgement about such
>>>matters. There's all types on this list; and, we are all at bering
>>>degrees
>>>of
>>>independence and also at varying degrees of thinking about that
>>>independence. I suspect that both frankness and some caution are what
>>>are
>>>wanted
>>>here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Thank you very much.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>>>The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Skype name:
>>>>>>barefootedray
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Facebook:
>>>>>>facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>On Jul 13, 2011, at 7:11 AM, Powers, Terry (NIH/OD/DEAS) [E] wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I do not intend to start up a big stir, but Joseph, what do you have
>>>>>>>against walking a few steps, straight and then receiving your cane.
>>>>>>>I
>>>>>>>have a little
>>>sight, but I know I could do it with a blindfold. Its only 5 or 6 steps!
>>>You mean you can not walk anywhere in your home, with out your cane? You
>>>can
>>>even feal the threshold of the entrence, as you walk over it.
>>>>>>>I do this, with no sighted guide and stay on the other side, until I
>>>>>>>get my cane back. Coming back, I was also asked to take off my
>>>>>>>shoes.
>>>>>>>I was
>>>surprised, but did not complain, even though I have medical problems that
>>>make it hard to bend over. I wanted to make it through, so I did what I
>>>guess
>>>everyone else had to do and I made it through.
>>>>>>>Terry Powers
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>From: T. Joseph Carter [mailto:carter.tjoseph at gmail.com]
>>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2011 9:22 PM
>>>>>>>To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] TSA discrimination in Orlando
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I gave them my cane for scanning and asked to have it returned to me
>>>>>>>so
>>>>>>>I could travel through the metal detector. I was told that I had to
>>>>>>>take the
>>>agent's arm. I said I was fine with the cane, and that the cane would
>>>not
>>>set off the metal detector. I was told that I could not do that, even
>>>after offering
>>>them the copy of their own regulations saying that I could and should.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>What followed was punitive action taken because I tried to assert my
>>>>>>>right to travel with a cane, not an arm. You'd think punishment for
>>>>>>>using a cane
>>>rather than a sighted guide is right up the NFB's alley.
>>>>>>>Apparently though, it's not.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I'll be pursuing it on my own. But as Mike so eloquently put it, I'm
>>>>>>>"not a-gonna win" if I do that. I will do it anyway, though, because
>>>>>>>it is the right thing
>>>to do. We fought for the right to our canes, and if we haven't got the
>>>guts to defend that right, then we don't really have it after all.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I'll just hope that when I lose, I don't manage to set any new
>>>>>>>precedents that we don't in fact have a right to our canes. I don't
>>>>>>>know that I could
>>>prevent that going it alone, but several people have made it quite clear
>>>that punishment for using a white cane just isn't the NFB's fight.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Joseph
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On Tue, Jul 12, 2011 at 05:56:43PM -0400, bookwormahb at earthlink.net
>>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>>>Joeseph,
>>>>>>>>I'm sure there is more to the story; its clear they did extra
>>>>>>>>screening
>>>>>>>>as a punishment.
>>>>>>>>But what rights were violated? Where did they insist upon sighted
>>>>>>>>guide?
>>>>>>>>I thought you gave up your cane for scanning and walked through the
>>>>>>>>scanner without it?
>>>>>>>>So where does this sighted guide come in? If you walk five steps
>>>>>>>>without your cane, it's a straight shot, and you didn't have a
>>>>>>>>guide.
>>>>>>>>I never had a guide when going through a security metal detector
>>>>>>>>whether at a federal building, at the Capitol for a concert, or the
>>>>>>>>Pentagon.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I was a little upset when they wanted me to give up my cane last
>>>>>>>>time
>>>>>>>>I
>>>>>>>>flew as well.
>>>>>>>>But after I walked through the scanner without setting it off, it
>>>>>>>>was
>>>>>>>>returned to me promptly.
>>>>>>>>If you file a complaint with TSA, let us know how it goes.
>>>>>>>>Ashley
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>-----Original Message----- From: T. Joseph Carter
>>>>>>>>Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 11:28 PM
>>>>>>>>To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] TSA discrimination in Orlando
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>So what you're saying, Brian, is that you're willing to be
>>>>>>>>intimidated
>>>>>>>>into giving up your rights, because the big boogeyman TSA agents can
>>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>>too much to you if you don't do exactly what they say, whether it's
>>>>>>>>illegal or flies in the face of every battle we have fought long and
>>>>>>>>hard for as an organization?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Just want to be sure I understand here. Because the TSA said that
>>>>>>>>of
>>>>>>>>nearly 3,000 blind people going through the airport, I'm the only
>>>>>>>>one
>>>>>>>>who insisted that I had a right NOT to be led around like a child,
>>>>>>>>denied the use of my cane for travel.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Joseph
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 09:07:58PM -0400, Brian Miller wrote:
>>>>>>>>>Hi Peter,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I don't think anyone feels that Joe was treated well, or with the
>>>>>>>>>respect he deserves, but security checks are a serious hassle and a
>>>>>>>>>drag for everyone, and indignities abound. I think solidarity
>>>>>>>>>across
>>>>>>>>>the board, and not just for blind people, is in order.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I merely say that for me using my cane to walk a few feet through
>>>>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>>>metal detector is not worth fighting over -- the last thing I need
>>>>>>>>>is
>>>>>>>>>to end up on a "no fly" list. The point is, you are exactly right
>>>>>>>>>that the blind have been fighting, and getting arrested, and going
>>>>>>>>>to
>>>>>>>>>jail, for years over our right to have our mobility devices, and
>>>>>>>>>we've
>>>>>>>>>won some, and lost many others. I think we need to figure out
>>>>>>>>>where
>>>>>>>>>to focus our energies to maximize independence while recognizing
>>>>>>>>>that
>>>>>>>>>we face a very difficult environment in which to make our arguments
>>>>>>>>>when it comes to security.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Heck, we still don't, and maybe never will, have the right to sit
>>>>>>>>>in
>>>>>>>>>the emergency row -- now that makes me feel more like a child than
>>>>>>>>>does a quick guide through the magnetometer .
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Not long ago Dr. Fred Schoeder was denied the right to fly to a
>>>>>>>>>meeting because he was traveling alone... Granted, this was not in
>>>>>>>>>the
>>>>>>>>>United States, but that kind of right of freedom of movement, is
>>>>>>>>>something I'm willing to lie down on the tarmac for and go to
>>>>>>>>>jail....
>>>>>>>>>Maybe not a jail in Thailand, though *smile*
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>In any case, I don't think Alicia, or any of us, are trying to
>>>>>>>>>miminize the fight we all face.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Brian M
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>[mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>>>>>>On Behalf Of Peter Donahue
>>>>>>>>>Sent: Monday, July 11, 2011 11:30 AM
>>>>>>>>>To: Alicia Richards; NFB Talk Mailing List
>>>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] TSA discrimination in Orlando
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Hello Alicia and everyone,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The next time you pass through a TSA Check point we'll cut both of
>>>>>>>>>your feet off and demand that you walk through like anyone else.
>>>>>>>>>Blind
>>>>>>>>>people have fought long and hard to be allowed to keep their canes
>>>>>>>>>and
>>>>>>>>>dogs with them at all times while passing through TSA check points
>>>>>>>>>and
>>>>>>>>>on planes themselves.
>>>>>>>>>Blind people were arrested and went to jail to insure these rights
>>>>>>>>>are
>>>>>>>>>protected and we don't need our own people telling us that it's not
>>>>>>>>>a
>>>>>>>>>big deal.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Peter Donahue who along with Mary took their last flight ever on a
>>>>>>>>>commercial airliner and can look forward to avoiding TSA screeners
>>>>>>>>>in
>>>>>>>>>the future!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>>From: "Alicia Richards" <alicianfb at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2011 11:37 PM
>>>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] TSA discrimination in Orlando
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I agree with Mike and others here. Yes, the TSA has been given too
>>>>>>>>>much power. It's shameful that they can perform such invasive
>>>>>>>>>patdowns, violating one's personal space and dignity. but as Ryan
>>>>>>>>>said, that's not a blindness issue: they can do that to anyone.
>>>>>>>>>And,
>>>>>>>>>I've never understood people's issue with giving up their cane for
>>>>>>>>>30
>>>>>>>>>seconds, taking someone's hand to walk five steps through the
>>>>>>>>>security
>>>>>>>>>check, and then have their cane handed right back to them. I
>>>>>>>>>question
>>>>>>>>>someone's mobility training if they are unable to walk five steps
>>>>>>>>>without their cane, and also can't help but wonder if they're
>>>>>>>>>exhibiting what I believe was once called, "rebellious
>>>>>>>>>independence,"
>>>>>>>>>by refusing to take the hand or arm of a TSA official for that very
>>>>>>>>>brief time. But to each their own. Joseph, I'll be curious if you
>>>>>>>>>get a reply from Scott LaBarre about this?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Alicia
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus
>>>>>>>>>signature database 6282 (20110710) __________
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>http://www.eset.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>>>nfb-talk:
>>>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/pdonahue2%40
>>>>>>>>>satx.r
>>>>>>>>>r.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>>>nfb-talk:
>>>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/brian-r-mill
>>>>>>>>>er%40u
>>>>>>>>>iowa.edu
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>>>nfb-talk:
>>>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/carter.tjose
>>>>>>>>>ph%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>>nfb-talk:
>>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%4
>>>>>>>>0earthlink.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>for
>>>>>>>>nfb-talk:
>>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/carter.tjosep
>>>>>>>>h%40gmail.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>>>nfb-talk:
>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/terry.powers%40nih.gov
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>>>nfb-talk:
>>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/rforetjr%40att.net
>>>>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>>nfb-talk:
>>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/carter.tjoseph%40gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>nfb-talk:
>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/rforetjr%40att.net
>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>nfb-talk:
>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/steve.jacobson%40visi.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>nfb-talk:
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>nfb-talk:
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/carter.tjoseph%40gmail.com
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>nfb-talk:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/bookwormahb%40earthlink.net
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>nfb-talk:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/terry.powers%40nih.gov
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>nfb-talk mailing list
>>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>nfb-talk:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/carter.tjoseph%40gmail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> nfb-talk mailing list
> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nfb-talk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org/rednexican%40socal.rr.com
More information about the nFB-Talk
mailing list