[nfb-talk] How can someone be so ignorant?
Buddy Brannan
buddy at brannan.name
Wed Oct 5 00:57:33 UTC 2011
Hi DW,
I couldn't agree with you more. Note that I am an active NFB member, and I apologize for the actions of some of our more overzealous members. These kinds of things do much to discredit us, not only as individuals but as an organization. Most of us aren't brainwashed, most of us really can and do think for ourselves, most of us really don't march in lock step with every single thing, following like sheep or robots or even robotic sheep, and most of us are, believe it or not, reasonable human beings. As with everything else, it's always a few, unfortunately quite vocal few, who show the whole in a less than positive light. I expect it's the same in the ACB, being made up of human beings.
Peace,
--
Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
On Oct 4, 2011, at 8:38 PM, DW wrote:
> Mr. Lester. Your ignorance is astounding. There are ACB members on this list and believe it or not we are human beings too. To imply that anyone would waste their time being a "plant" as you stated or to even believe ACB would engage in such behavior when they have far more pressing issues to work on is truly insulting and shows just how brain washed you really are. The way you talk one would think that you perceive Marc Mauer as God. Well, news flash! he isn't, but if you feel that way why not send him all your money and worldly possessions them bow before him and beg him for mercy when asking for help finding a place to live. Maybe he'll let you stay at one of the centers. Wouldn't that be fun?
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joshua Lester" <jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu>
> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2011 6:19 PM
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Fwd: Why did the National Federation of the Blind Condemns Lack of Access to New Kindle Fire?
>
>
>> I didn't want to deal with him, right on, because he may have been a
>> spammer, or some ACB plant, set up to attack us.
>> Blessings, Joshua
>>
>> On 10/4/11, T. Joseph Carter <tjcarter at spiritsubstance.com> wrote:
>>> People should feel free to criticize Dr. Maurer or anyone else they
>>> like. It won't make them right, and this guy is obviously dead wrong
>>> and too ignorant to even know WHY he's dead wrong.
>>>
>>> But you could've educated him. He didn't know that Amazon's Kindle
>>> was already an audio book reader. He thought it was a printed book
>>> reader. It does that too, but we didn't so much care about the
>>> Kindle when that's all it did.
>>>
>>> You didn't educate him. And no, I'm not one of those Federationists
>>> who believe you have some moral obligation to educate every fool who
>>> wanders on to our lists, but the option existed and would've been to
>>> the benefit of the blind if you had.
>>>
>>> I've a temper of my own, and there are certain individuals who have
>>> managed to irk me enough that I've pretty much always got a short
>>> fuse where they're concerned. But don't let yourself put any one
>>> person on such a pedestal that they can do no wrong. They'll sooner
>>> or later disappoint you. Even Dr. Maurer, I'm sure.
>>>
>>> Friendly advice, perhaps worth only what you paid for it. *smile*
>>>
>>> Joseph
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Oct 04, 2011 at 03:27:00PM -0500, Joshua Lester wrote:
>>>> I support the NFB, and love everything we stand for.
>>>> I'll just tell all, right here.
>>>> I was interested in the other group, because I was exposed to it, at
>>>> LWSB in Little Rock, Arkansas.
>>>> I went home, and did my research, and didn't like what I found.
>>>> I found the NFB, (thanks, to my former Braille instructor.)
>>>> Now, I've found a home, and I love my NFB family.
>>>> I met Dr Maurer, last year, in Dallas.
>>>> That was my first convention.
>>>> I wouldn't have come out, as hard as I did, if this fool hadn't have
>>>> criticized Dr Maurer.
>>>> That, was the last straw!
>>>> These people shouldn't come on here, and criticize what we stand for.
>>>> Blessings, Joshua
>>>>
>>>> On 10/4/11, Bryan Schulz <b.schulz at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>>> hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> mad as you are, you are another example of how nobody can have a
>>>>> different
>>>>> opinion on these lists.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bryan Schulz
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Joshua Lester" <jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu>
>>>>> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2011 3:12 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Fwd: Why did the National Federation of the Blind
>>>>> Condemns Lack of Access to New Kindle Fire?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Those creeps shouldn't even have access to our lists!
>>>>>> Those losers are a waste of time, but I'm tired of crazies getting on
>>>>>> our
>>>>>> lists!
>>>>>> We had a similar baffoon, on the NABS list, as well.
>>>>>> I'm glad he got banned!
>>>>>> Blessings, Joshua
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 10/4/11, Ray Foret Jr <rforetjr at att.net> wrote:
>>>>>>> Why waste our time with this? Nothing new from the simple minded sapps
>>>>>>> who
>>>>>>> oppose us surely?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>>>> The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Skype name:
>>>>>>> barefootedray
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Facebook:
>>>>>>> facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Oct 4, 2011, at 2:45 PM, Joshua Lester wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi, it's Joshua Lester.
>>>>>>>> Look at what this idiot just sent, to the entire NFB of Arkansas!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>>>>>>>> From: terrysteve at suddenlink.net
>>>>>>>> Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2011 13:59:48 -0500
>>>>>>>> Subject: Why did the National Federation of the Blind Condemns Lack of
>>>>>>>> Access to New Kindle Fire?
>>>>>>>> To: tosheeler at cox.net, bkshfreeman at gmail.com, bfreeman0420 at gmail.com,
>>>>>>>> vtscott at cox.net, leaann1967 at gmail.com, j.scholes at sbcglobal.net,
>>>>>>>> bogan1265 at yahoo.com, geofynder at gmail.com, Gogetm00 at aol.com,
>>>>>>>> hayleyksch at gmail.com, dave.mehler at gmail.com, walkercutoff at att.net,
>>>>>>>> Donna.Walker at arkansas.gov, Matt.Lyles at arkansas.gov,
>>>>>>>> lyles_j at sbcglobal.net, honestblindman at gmail.com, pat.nfb at att.net,
>>>>>>>> bkkindle at yahoo.com, Teddey3000 at aol.com, james.worley at cox.net,
>>>>>>>> twedwards1111 at gmail.com, anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com, deweycoursey at cox.net,
>>>>>>>> lizngraves at yahoo.com, erp at uark.edu, mika_hooper at yahoo.com,
>>>>>>>> Matteri at cox.net, donbrey at gmail.com, trinitymlovell at gmail.com,
>>>>>>>> clj_smith at yahoo.com, arspurplegirl at cox.net, delreal93 at yahoo.com,
>>>>>>>> ctroby at uark.edu, e.yarberry at gmail.com, jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu,
>>>>>>>> gvwright2 at juno.com, lhwayland at sbcglobal.net, joshcrunkleton at gmail.com,
>>>>>>>> showard826 at gmail.com, jsexson at live.com, sflesher at yahoo.com,
>>>>>>>> diane403bill at suddenlink.net, abhoxeng at yahoo.com, hoxeng at aol.com,
>>>>>>>> barefootinar at yahoo.com, peter-hoffman at att.net, kaylaltodd at gmail.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Get a grip folks! There are many devices designed, manufactured and
>>>>>>>> sold
>>>>>>>> that are not "blind friendly". And rightly so! It was stated that "The
>>>>>>>> feasibility of including accessibility in similar products has been
>>>>>>>> demonstrated." As a result of this statement there must be devices of
>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>> nature that are "blind friendly". So the blind apparently do have this
>>>>>>>> technology available to them. And just to put a point on it, the
>>>>>>>> Kindle
>>>>>>>> Fire
>>>>>>>> is a PERSONAL devise, not a community device. There are dozens of
>>>>>>>> devices
>>>>>>>> that use touch screens. None of these are "blind friendly". I doubt if
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> technology now exists to make them "blind friendly".
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This tirade by Dr. Marc Maurer, President of the National Federation
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> Blind, is typical of individuals that get so fanatical about an issue
>>>>>>>> they
>>>>>>>> have loose touch with the reality of the real world in their
>>>>>>>> unrealistic
>>>>>>>> search for and unworldly and unobtainable utopia. I have books on my
>>>>>>>> shelf
>>>>>>>> that the blind cannot read; must all my books be audio? I have clocks
>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>> home that the blind cannot use to tell the time; must all my clocks be
>>>>>>>> talking. I drive a car that the blind cannot drive. This is not me
>>>>>>>> being
>>>>>>>> unsympathetic to the blind or to the cause of the blind, it is me
>>>>>>>> being
>>>>>>>> realistic in my reality. There is technology that the blind cannot use
>>>>>>>> because they are blind. Sorry, FACT! There is technology that cannot
>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>> made
>>>>>>>> available to the blind due to our level of technology at this time.
>>>>>>>> Touch
>>>>>>>> screens in use by many devices again come to mind. Can't we focus on
>>>>>>>> what
>>>>>>>> can be done and what needs to be done. Not on minor issues as that
>>>>>>>> below?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dr. Maurer should rethink his position regarding Amazon, waste not his
>>>>>>>> energy on such nonsense and concentrate on those things which actually
>>>>>>>> help
>>>>>>>> our cause. Senselessly attacking anything that is not "blind friendly"
>>>>>>>> actually hurts the cause. Using some common sense in choosing the
>>>>>>>> issues
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> tackle is important to our cause.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lets tone down the rhetoric and concentrate on issues that help our
>>>>>>>> blind
>>>>>>>> friends and make the public aware of their real needs and not insist
>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>> unnecessary requirements that turn the public against us and out cause
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> make us look like foolish fanatics. Stop hurting our cause with self
>>>>>>>> serving
>>>>>>>> rhetoric.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Steve Terry
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>> From: <tosheeler at cox.net>
>>>>>>>> To: <bkshfreeman at gmail.com>; <bfreeman0420 at gmail.com>;
>>>>>>>> <vtscott at cox.net>;
>>>>>>>> <leaann1967 at gmail.com>; <j.scholes at sbcglobal.net>;
>>>>>>>> <bogan1265 at yahoo.com>;
>>>>>>>> <geofynder at gmail.com>; <Gogetm00 at aol.com>; <hayleyksch at gmail.com>;
>>>>>>>> <dave.mehler at gmail.com>; <walkercutoff at att.net>;
>>>>>>>> <Donna.Walker at arkansas.gov>; <Matt.Lyles at arkansas.gov>;
>>>>>>>> <lyles_j at sbcglobal.net>; <honestblindman at gmail.com>;
>>>>>>>> <pat.nfb at att.net>;
>>>>>>>> <bkkindle at yahoo.com>; <Teddey3000 at aol.com>; <james.worley at cox.net>;
>>>>>>>> <twedwards1111 at gmail.com>; <anmolpbhatia at yahoo.com>;
>>>>>>>> <deweycoursey at cox.net>;
>>>>>>>> <lizngraves at yahoo.com>; <erp at uark.edu>; <mika_hooper at yahoo.com>;
>>>>>>>> <Matteri at cox.net>; <donbrey at gmail.com>; <trinitymlovell at gmail.com>;
>>>>>>>> <clj_smith at yahoo.com>; <hayleyksch at gmail.com>;
>>>>>>>> <arspurplegirl at cox.net>;
>>>>>>>> <delreal93 at yahoo.com>; <ctroby at uark.edu>; <e.yarberry at gmail.com>;
>>>>>>>> <jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu>; <gvwright2 at juno.com>;
>>>>>>>> <jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu>; <lhwayland at sbcglobal.net>;
>>>>>>>> <joshcrunkleton at gmail.com>; <showard826 at gmail.com>;
>>>>>>>> <jsexson at live.com>;
>>>>>>>> <sflesher at yahoo.com>; <diane403bill at suddenlink.net>;
>>>>>>>> <abhoxeng at yahoo.com>;
>>>>>>>> <hoxeng at aol.com>; <barefootinar at yahoo.com>;
>>>>>>>> <Terrysteve at suddenlink.net>;
>>>>>>>> <peter-hoffman at att.net>; <kaylaltodd at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, October 02, 2011 6:19 PM
>>>>>>>> Subject: Fwd: National Federation of the Blind Condemns Lack of Access
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> New Kindle Fire
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> From: "Freeh, Jessica" <JFreeh at nfb.org>
>>>>>>>>> To: Alpidio Rolon <arguza at attglobal.net>, Amy Buresh
>>>>>>>>> <amy.buresh74 at gmail.com>,
>>>>>>>> Art Schreiber <blindart at samobile.net>, Beth Rival
>>>>>>>> <erival at comcast.net>,
>>>>>>>> Bill
>>>>>>>> Packee <alaskanfb at yahoo.com>, Bob Kresmer <krezguy at cox.net>, Carl
>>>>>>>> Jacobsen
>>>>>>>> <office at nfbny.org>, Cassandra McNabb <cemcnabb21 at yahoo.com>, Cathy
>>>>>>>> Jackson
>>>>>>>> <cathyj at iglou.com>, Charlene Smyth <cs.nfbwv at verizon.net>, "Christine
>>>>>>>> G.
>>>>>>>> Hall" <c.tessa4 at comcast.net>, Dan Hicks <danjhicks at yahoo.com>, Daniel
>>>>>>>> Burke
>>>>>>>> <burke.dall at gmail.com>, Don Galloway <dgalloway627 at gmail.com>, Donna
>>>>>>>> Wood
>>>>>>>> <donnajwood at cox.net>, Duane Iverson <diverson at samobile.net>, Elsie
>>>>>>>> Dickerson
>>>>>>>> <elsiedickerson at ymail.com>, Frank Lee <francois57 at comcast.net>,
>>>>>>>> Franklin
>>>>>>>> Shiner <fshiner at myfairpoint.net>, Fred Schroeder <fschroeder at sks.com>,
>>>>>>>> Garrick Scott <gscott at nfbga.org>, Gary Ray <ghraynfbofnc at charter.net>,
>>>>>>>> Gary
>>>>>>>> Wunder <gwunder at earthlink.net>, Grace Pires <silvara at cox.net>, "J.W.
>>>>>>>> Smith"
>>>>>>>> <jwsmithnfb at verizon.net>, James Antonacci <president at nfbp.org>,
>>>>>>>> Jeannie
>>>>>>>> Massay <Jmassay1 at cox.net>, Jennifer Dunnam
>>>>>>>> <jennifer.dunnam1829 at gmail.com>,
>>>>>>>> Joe Ruffalo <nfbnj at yahoo.com>, John Batron <jbatron at maine.rr.com>,
>>>>>>>> John
>>>>>>>> Fritz
>>>>>>>> <johnfritz at centurytel.net>, Joy Harris <joy.harris at dwx.com>, Joyce
>>>>>>>> Scanlan
>>>>>>>> <joyce.scanlan at earthlink.net>, Ken Rollman <gatorbumps at rushmore.com>,
>>>>>>>> Kim
>>>>>>>> Williams <rkvend at aol.com>, Kimberly Flores <kflores at nfb-texas.org>,
>>>>>>>> Larry
>>>>>>>> Posont <president.nfb.mi at gmail.com>, Lynn Majewski
>>>>>>>> <majla at verizon.net>,
>>>>>>>> Mary
>>>>>>>> Willows <mwillows at sbcglobal.net>, Melissa Riccobono
>>>>>>>> <melissa at riccobono.us>,
>>>>>>>> Michael Barber <michael.NFBI at gmail.com>, Michael Freeman
>>>>>>>> <k7uij at panix.com>,
>>>>>>>> Mika Pyyhkala <pyyhkala at gmail.com>, Nani Fife <nanifife at aol.com>, Pam
>>>>>>>> Allen
>>>>>>>> <pallen at lcb-ruston.com>, Parnell Diggs <parnell at sccoast.net>, Patti
>>>>>>>> Chang
>>>>>>>> <pattichang at att.net>, Rena Smith <realhappygirl1 at gmail.com>, Ron Brown
>>>>>>>> <rb15 at iquest.net>, "Gardner, Ron" <RGardner at nfb.org>, Sam Gleese
>>>>>>>> <SGleese at city.jackson.ms.us>, Scott LaBarre <slabarre at labarrelaw.com>,
>>>>>>>> Terry
>>>>>>>> Sheeler <tosheeler at cox.net>
>>>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2011 13:50:08 -0700
>>>>>>>>> Subject: National Federation of the Blind Condemns Lack of Access to
>>>>>>>>> New
>>>>>>>> Kindle Fire
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> CONTACT:
>>>>>>>>> Chris Danielsen
>>>>>>>>> Director of Public Relations
>>>>>>>>> National Federation of the Blind
>>>>>>>>> (410) 659-9314, extension 2330
>>>>>>>>> (410) 262-1281 (Cell)
>>>>>>>>> cdanielsen at nfb.org
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> National Federation of the Blind Condemns
>>>>>>>>> Lack of Access to New Kindle Fire
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Baltimore, Maryland (September 29, 2011): The National Federation of
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> Blind commented today on the release of Amazon's new Kindle Fire,
>>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>>> cannot be used by people who are blind.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Dr. Marc Maurer, President of the National Federation of the Blind,
>>>>>>>>> said:
>>>>>>>>> "Blind Americans have repeatedly asked Amazon to include
>>>>>>>>> accessibility
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> the blind in its Kindle product line. The feasibility of including
>>>>>>>>> accessibility in similar products has been demonstrated. The
>>>>>>>>> Department
>>>>>>>>> of Education and the Department of Justice have made it clear that
>>>>>>>>> Kindle
>>>>>>>>> devices cannot be purchased by educational institutions, libraries,
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>> other entities covered by this country's disability laws unless the
>>>>>>>>> devices are fully accessible. Despite all this, Amazon has released
>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>> brand new Kindle device, the Kindle Fire, which cannot be used by
>>>>>>>>> people
>>>>>>>>> who are blind. Enough! We condemn this latest action by Amazon and
>>>>>>>>> reiterate that we will not tolerate technological discrimination.
>>>>>>>>> The
>>>>>>>>> National Federation of the Blind seeks nothing less than equal access
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> all technology for blind people. It is one of the most critical
>>>>>>>>> civil
>>>>>>>>> rights issues facing blind Americans in the twenty-first century, and
>>>>>>>>> we
>>>>>>>>> will do everything in our power to see that this right is secured."
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ###
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> About the National Federation of the Blind
>>>>>>>>> With more than 50,000 members, the National Federation of the Blind
>>>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> largest and most influential membership organization of blind people
>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>> the United States. The NFB improves blind people's lives through
>>>>>>>>> advocacy, education, research, technology, and programs encouraging
>>>>>>>>> independence and self-confidence. It is the leading force in the
>>>>>>>>> blindness field today and the voice of the nation's blind. In
>>>>>>>>> January
>>>>>>>>> 2004 the NFB opened the National Federation of the Blind Jernigan
>>>>>>>>> Institute, the first research and training center in the United
>>>>>>>>> States
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> the blind led by the blind.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>
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>>
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