[Nfb-web] html question

Thu Apr 4 21:57:02 UTC 2013

Susie,

Hang in there! It all comes together... Eventually. /smile/

Are you taking classes in this, or are you learning on the job through 
tutorials and such?

I learned on the job when I picked up a web project about the turn of 
the century... I ended up doing more and got hooked. I was still working 
visually then, which did help me see the results of my early attempts at 
css and all. Working visually gave me headaches, though, so I took to 
css and clean HTML because it is just so much more efficient. If I want 
to change something, I only need to change it in one place, and 
everything is all pretty. /smile/

Using plain HTML is also easier for me when I'm programming a web app 
because I can simply think of the elements I want to output... If that 
makes sense. I think in terms of how information is going to be grouped, 
I guess, when deciding whether to use a list or some sort, or a 
paragraph tag or <br>... I like to let the HTML format things because 
that is more universal for the end users and because it saves me time.

Also, it makes troubleshooting and proofing less confusing! Less gunk to 
wade through to find what I missed when my output isn't what I expected. 
/smile/

I learned things in layers... Starting with HTML, then adding CSS. The 
W3 schools are a great resource for that, although they weren't around 
yet when I started. So I read the W3 technical stuff and whatever web 
articles were available. For CSS, I went through the WestCiv 
(http://www.westciv.com/) tutorials on HTML and CSS. I also became a big 
fan of Eric Meyer, who has written gobs on the subject. And I got my 
head wrapped around the DOM (document object model), which makes 
everything just so logical and simple.

The O'Reilly books are also great resources and are on BookShare now. Yay!

When I started programming in ColdFusion, I discovered that most of the 
HTML in coding examples is execrable, so I'm glad I learned that part 
first! I still ignore that part in tutorials because I keep finding 
clunky, badly formed code that just makes things more confusing! Urgh!

Here is how I think of web applications, to keep all the different 
things straight:

The programming code (the Java in your Java server pages) is what makes 
things happen. So it determines what information will be on the 
resulting web page and where it comes from (variables, a database, 
computations in functions, etc.). So I start with writing that.

The HTML causes the results of the program to show up on a web page for 
someone to read. It simply defines the resulting document and its 
elements, which can be logically arranged and grouped in divs 
paragraphs, lists, etc.

The CSS is the pretty. Since it is in a separate style sheet, I usually 
do that last. By then, knowing what is on the web page(s) in the app, 
the styling I need seems to make more sense.

Don't know if that makes sense or is helpful. I'm learning a new thing 
now and feeling that old confusion while I try to wrap my head around 
the various parts... And remember what I knew without confusing myself 
more! Yikes! But I still get the same thrill when my little code blocks 
come together and the right thing happens, so I guess I'm still hooked. 
/grin/

Tami

On 04/04/2013 01:55 PM, Stanzel, Susan - FSA, Kansas City, MO wrote:
> Tommy,
>
> That is a wonderful idea. Thank you so much. Where did you learn everything? I am really just a beginner with all this. I am trying to understand where Java Server pages fit, CSS and not to mention Java code. I don't think my head is big enough for all this.
>
> Susie Stanzel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Nfb-web [mailto:nfb-web-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tami Jarvis
> Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2013 3:23 PM
> To: NFB Webmaster's List
> Subject: Re: [Nfb-web] html question
>
> Hi, Susie.
>
> For glossaries and the like, I prefer to use HTML definition lists, as
> follows:
>
> <dl>
> <dt>
> Term1
> </dt>
> <dd>
> Definition1
> </dd>
> <dt>
> Term2
> </dt>
> <dd>
> Definition2
> </dd>
> </dl>
>
> This will output the results in a visually sensible and readable fashion without your having to fuss with tables. The definition is on a separate line following the term and indented.
>
> You can use the <strong> tag to make the term appear in bold, or use CSS for further styling. Since you're studying something else, you may not want to fuss with CSS, though. I'm a nut for the stuff, so couldn't resist mentioning it. /smile/
>
> hth,
>
> Tami
>
> On 04/04/2013 12:55 PM, Stanzel, Susan - FSA, Kansas City, MO wrote:
>> Good afternoon Everyone,
>>
>> I am learning Java Server Pages. I need to put in a glossary of terms. I first had it with lines simply separated by a <br>. I am now thinking that is probably not very visually attractive. I had the name in bold and the definition simply followed. Do you think I should put it in a table? If so, what would be the simplest way to do it.
>>
>> Susie Stanzel
>>
>>
>>
>>
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