From burggraaferik at gmail.com Tue May 5 13:26:30 2020 From: burggraaferik at gmail.com (Erik Burggraaf) Date: Tue, 5 May 2020 09:26:30 -0400 Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? Message-ID: <5eb16986.1c69fb81.236de.8cec@mx.google.com> Hi, I?m working on some web projects for Canadian Federation of the Blind. We are having major issues with mailman communication apparently being regarded as spam. Some addresses can not be subscribed fully because they will not even allow mailman?s confirmation email as far as the spam or junk folder. Others can subscribe, but find as many as 2/3 of list emails redirected to spam or junk. Are there any settings I can look for in mailman that could make us look less junky, or is it time to migrate our entire email communication to groups.io? Thanks for any advice. Erik Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From tyler at tysdomain.com Tue May 5 13:38:00 2020 From: tyler at tysdomain.com (Littlefield, Tyler) Date: Tue, 5 May 2020 09:38:00 -0400 Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? In-Reply-To: <5eb16986.1c69fb81.236de.8cec@mx.google.com> References: <5eb16986.1c69fb81.236de.8cec@mx.google.com> Message-ID: Hello, I highly doubt this is a mailman issue. Depending on where your server is located, a lot of VPS subnets are simply considered spam because they're so easy to spin up and spam from. Your best bet would be to swap to something like groups.io as you previously mentioned, or route all your email through mailchimp or something similar (which can be done via forwarding through postfix). There is a small fee for this, but it's minimal with not a lot of traffic, and for me beats the alternative of not being able to manage. I do this for a couple clients. HTH, On 5/5/2020 9:26 AM, Erik Burggraaf via NFB-Web wrote: > Hi, I?m working on some web projects for Canadian Federation of the Blind. We are having major issues with mailman communication apparently being regarded as spam. Some addresses can not be subscribed fully because they will not even allow mailman?s confirmation email as far as the spam or junk folder. Others can subscribe, but find as many as 2/3 of list emails redirected to spam or junk. Are there any settings I can look for in mailman that could make us look less junky, or is it time to migrate our entire email communication to groups.io? > > Thanks for any advice. > > Erik > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > > _______________________________________________ > NFB-Web mailing list > NFB-Web at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com -- Take Care, Tyler Littlefield (he/him/his) Tyler Littlefield Consulting: website development and business solutions. My personal site My Linkedin @Sorressean on Twitter From david.b.andrews at state.mn.us Tue May 5 13:39:12 2020 From: david.b.andrews at state.mn.us (Andrews, David B (DEED)) Date: Tue, 5 May 2020 13:39:12 +0000 Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? In-Reply-To: <5eb16986.1c69fb81.236de.8cec@mx.google.com> References: <5eb16986.1c69fb81.236de.8cec@mx.google.com> Message-ID: There are a couple things that should help. We run 300 plus lists, and have the odd problem, but nothing that systematic. First your DNS settings need to be correct. Secondly you should use SPF and KIM. Finally there is a setting under Mailman's administration General settings, from_is_list, this is for dmarc, set to munge from, or wrap message. This impacts replying to messages, but unless you use one of those settings some systems will never accept your mail. Dave -----Original Message----- From: NFB-Web On Behalf Of Erik Burggraaf via NFB-Web Sent: Tuesday, May 5, 2020 8:27 AM To: Richard Payne via NFB-Web Cc: Erik Burggraaf Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? This message may be from an external email source. Do not select links or open attachments unless verified. Report all suspicious emails to Minnesota IT Services Security Operations Center. ________________________________ Hi, I?m working on some web projects for Canadian Federation of the Blind. We are having major issues with mailman communication apparently being regarded as spam. Some addresses can not be subscribed fully because they will not even allow mailman?s confirmation email as far as the spam or junk folder. Others can subscribe, but find as many as 2/3 of list emails redirected to spam or junk. Are there any settings I can look for in mailman that could make us look less junky, or is it time to migrate our entire email communication to groups.io? Thanks for any advice. Erik Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From wbsjr at swbell.net Tue May 5 14:44:22 2020 From: wbsjr at swbell.net (Brad Snyder) Date: Tue, 5 May 2020 09:44:22 -0500 Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <18759073-E752-4337-985B-B16E3E802EF7@swbell.net> Try this?. Log into your Mail account via your providers website. go to the spam folder and mark the items as not spam. This is what I do and it fixes the problem once and for all. HTH - Brad - On May 5, 2020, at 08:40, Andrews, David B (DEED) via NFB-Web wrote: ?There are a couple things that should help. We run 300 plus lists, and have the odd problem, but nothing that systematic. First your DNS settings need to be correct. Secondly you should use SPF and KIM. Finally there is a setting under Mailman's administration General settings, from_is_list, this is for dmarc, set to munge from, or wrap message. This impacts replying to messages, but unless you use one of those settings some systems will never accept your mail. Dave -----Original Message----- From: NFB-Web On Behalf Of Erik Burggraaf via NFB-Web Sent: Tuesday, May 5, 2020 8:27 AM To: Richard Payne via NFB-Web Cc: Erik Burggraaf Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? This message may be from an external email source. Do not select links or open attachments unless verified. Report all suspicious emails to Minnesota IT Services Security Operations Center. ________________________________ Hi, I?m working on some web projects for Canadian Federation of the Blind. We are having major issues with mailman communication apparently being regarded as spam. Some addresses can not be subscribed fully because they will not even allow mailman?s confirmation email as far as the spam or junk folder. Others can subscribe, but find as many as 2/3 of list emails redirected to spam or junk. Are there any settings I can look for in mailman that could make us look less junky, or is it time to migrate our entire email communication to groups.io? Thanks for any advice. Erik Sent from Mail for Windows 10 _______________________________________________ NFB-Web mailing list NFB-Web at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/wbsjr%40swbell.net From burggraaferik at gmail.com Tue May 5 15:18:07 2020 From: burggraaferik at gmail.com (Erik Burggraaf) Date: Tue, 5 May 2020 11:18:07 -0400 Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? In-Reply-To: <18759073-E752-4337-985B-B16E3E802EF7@swbell.net> References: <18759073-E752-4337-985B-B16E3E802EF7@swbell.net> Message-ID: <5eb183b0.1c69fb81.b8990.a2f9@mx.google.com> That would require me to support a prohibitive number of email providers, browser/screen reader/magnifier combinations, and user skill levels. My salary really doesn?t cover work on that scale, ? especially if there?s a server side solution that could significantly reduce the false positive rate. Thanks though, Erik Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Brad Snyder via NFB-Web Sent: May 5, 2020 10:45 AM To: NFB Webmaster's List Cc: Brad Snyder Subject: Re: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? Try this?. Log into your Mail account via your providers website. go to the spam folder and mark the items as not spam. This is what I do and it fixes the problem once and for all. HTH - Brad - On May 5, 2020, at 08:40, Andrews, David B (DEED) via NFB-Web wrote: ?There are a couple things that should help. We run 300 plus lists, and have the odd problem, but nothing that systematic. First your DNS settings need to be correct. Secondly you should use SPF and KIM. Finally there is a setting under Mailman's administration General settings, from_is_list, this is for dmarc, set to munge from, or wrap message. This impacts replying to messages, but unless you use one of those settings some systems will never accept your mail. Dave -----Original Message----- From: NFB-Web On Behalf Of Erik Burggraaf via NFB-Web Sent: Tuesday, May 5, 2020 8:27 AM To: Richard Payne via NFB-Web Cc: Erik Burggraaf Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? This message may be from an external email source. Do not select links or open attachments unless verified. Report all suspicious emails to Minnesota IT Services Security Operations Center. ________________________________ Hi, I?m working on some web projects for Canadian Federation of the Blind. We are having major issues with mailman communication apparently being regarded as spam. Some addresses can not be subscribed fully because they will not even allow mailman?s confirmation email as far as the spam or junk folder. Others can subscribe, but find as many as 2/3 of list emails redirected to spam or junk. Are there any settings I can look for in mailman that could make us look less junky, or is it time to migrate our entire email communication to groups.io? Thanks for any advice. Erik Sent from Mail for Windows 10 _______________________________________________ NFB-Web mailing list NFB-Web at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/wbsjr%40swbell.net _______________________________________________ NFB-Web mailing list NFB-Web at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/burggraaferik%40gmail.com From wbsjr at swbell.net Tue May 5 15:38:01 2020 From: wbsjr at swbell.net (Brad Snyder) Date: Tue, 5 May 2020 10:38:01 -0500 Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? In-Reply-To: <5eb183b0.1c69fb81.b8990.a2f9@mx.google.com> References: <5eb183b0.1c69fb81.b8990.a2f9@mx.google.com> Message-ID: I would think this would be an issue for the individual user to deal with, not you your self. - Brad - On May 5, 2020, at 10:19, Erik Burggraaf via NFB-Web wrote: ?That would require me to support a prohibitive number of email providers, browser/screen reader/magnifier combinations, and user skill levels. My salary really doesn?t cover work on that scale, ? especially if there?s a server side solution that could significantly reduce the false positive rate. Thanks though, Erik Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Brad Snyder via NFB-Web Sent: May 5, 2020 10:45 AM To: NFB Webmaster's List Cc: Brad Snyder Subject: Re: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? Try this?. Log into your Mail account via your providers website. go to the spam folder and mark the items as not spam. This is what I do and it fixes the problem once and for all. HTH - Brad - On May 5, 2020, at 08:40, Andrews, David B (DEED) via NFB-Web wrote: ?There are a couple things that should help. We run 300 plus lists, and have the odd problem, but nothing that systematic. First your DNS settings need to be correct. Secondly you should use SPF and KIM. Finally there is a setting under Mailman's administration General settings, from_is_list, this is for dmarc, set to munge from, or wrap message. This impacts replying to messages, but unless you use one of those settings some systems will never accept your mail. Dave -----Original Message----- From: NFB-Web On Behalf Of Erik Burggraaf via NFB-Web Sent: Tuesday, May 5, 2020 8:27 AM To: Richard Payne via NFB-Web Cc: Erik Burggraaf Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? This message may be from an external email source. Do not select links or open attachments unless verified. Report all suspicious emails to Minnesota IT Services Security Operations Center. ________________________________ Hi, I?m working on some web projects for Canadian Federation of the Blind. We are having major issues with mailman communication apparently being regarded as spam. Some addresses can not be subscribed fully because they will not even allow mailman?s confirmation email as far as the spam or junk folder. Others can subscribe, but find as many as 2/3 of list emails redirected to spam or junk. Are there any settings I can look for in mailman that could make us look less junky, or is it time to migrate our entire email communication to groups.io? Thanks for any advice. Erik Sent from Mail for Windows 10 _______________________________________________ NFB-Web mailing list NFB-Web at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/wbsjr%40swbell.net _______________________________________________ NFB-Web mailing list NFB-Web at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/burggraaferik%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ NFB-Web mailing list NFB-Web at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/wbsjr%40swbell.net From burggraaferik at gmail.com Tue May 5 15:48:53 2020 From: burggraaferik at gmail.com (Erik Burggraaf) Date: Tue, 5 May 2020 11:48:53 -0400 Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? In-Reply-To: References: <5eb183b0.1c69fb81.b8990.a2f9@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <5eb18ae6.1c69fb81.f3d02.b8c1@mx.google.com> If it were only a small subset of users yes, but since it?s many users experiencing the issue over a wide array of configurations and user skill levels we need to do what we can to mitigate it on the server. Best, Erik Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Brad Snyder via NFB-Web Sent: May 5, 2020 11:39 AM To: NFB Webmaster's List Cc: Brad Snyder Subject: Re: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? I would think this would be an issue for the individual user to deal with, not you your self. - Brad - On May 5, 2020, at 10:19, Erik Burggraaf via NFB-Web wrote: ?That would require me to support a prohibitive number of email providers, browser/screen reader/magnifier combinations, and user skill levels. My salary really doesn?t cover work on that scale, ? especially if there?s a server side solution that could significantly reduce the false positive rate. Thanks though, Erik Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Brad Snyder via NFB-Web Sent: May 5, 2020 10:45 AM To: NFB Webmaster's List Cc: Brad Snyder Subject: Re: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? Try this?. Log into your Mail account via your providers website. go to the spam folder and mark the items as not spam. This is what I do and it fixes the problem once and for all. HTH - Brad - On May 5, 2020, at 08:40, Andrews, David B (DEED) via NFB-Web wrote: ?There are a couple things that should help. We run 300 plus lists, and have the odd problem, but nothing that systematic. First your DNS settings need to be correct. Secondly you should use SPF and KIM. Finally there is a setting under Mailman's administration General settings, from_is_list, this is for dmarc, set to munge from, or wrap message. This impacts replying to messages, but unless you use one of those settings some systems will never accept your mail. Dave -----Original Message----- From: NFB-Web On Behalf Of Erik Burggraaf via NFB-Web Sent: Tuesday, May 5, 2020 8:27 AM To: Richard Payne via NFB-Web Cc: Erik Burggraaf Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? This message may be from an external email source. Do not select links or open attachments unless verified. Report all suspicious emails to Minnesota IT Services Security Operations Center. ________________________________ Hi, I?m working on some web projects for Canadian Federation of the Blind. We are having major issues with mailman communication apparently being regarded as spam. Some addresses can not be subscribed fully because they will not even allow mailman?s confirmation email as far as the spam or junk folder. Others can subscribe, but find as many as 2/3 of list emails redirected to spam or junk. Are there any settings I can look for in mailman that could make us look less junky, or is it time to migrate our entire email communication to groups.io? Thanks for any advice. Erik Sent from Mail for Windows 10 _______________________________________________ NFB-Web mailing list NFB-Web at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/wbsjr%40swbell.net _______________________________________________ NFB-Web mailing list NFB-Web at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/burggraaferik%40gmail.com _______________________________________________ NFB-Web mailing list NFB-Web at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/wbsjr%40swbell.net _______________________________________________ NFB-Web mailing list NFB-Web at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/burggraaferik%40gmail.com From tyler at tysdomain.com Tue May 5 16:00:00 2020 From: tyler at tysdomain.com (Littlefield, Tyler) Date: Tue, 5 May 2020 12:00:00 -0400 Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? In-Reply-To: References: <5eb183b0.1c69fb81.b8990.a2f9@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <03982363-aa15-2e5f-dd65-45a236819e1d@tysdomain.com> When you run mailing lists for multiple users, you don't get to say "deal with this yourself," especially if the email isn't even hitting their junk folder. There are solutions to be done server side to ease the pain for everyone involved, and then it's a question of taking care of the end-users still affected. On 5/5/2020 11:38 AM, Brad Snyder via NFB-Web wrote: > I would think this would be an issue for the individual user to deal with, not you your self. > > - Brad - > > On May 5, 2020, at 10:19, Erik Burggraaf via NFB-Web wrote: > > ?That would require me to support a prohibitive number of email providers, browser/screen reader/magnifier combinations, and user skill levels. My salary really doesn?t cover work on that scale, ? especially if there?s a server side solution that could significantly reduce the false positive rate. > > Thanks though, > > Erik > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > > From: Brad Snyder via NFB-Web > Sent: May 5, 2020 10:45 AM > To: NFB Webmaster's List > Cc: Brad Snyder > Subject: Re: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? > > Try this?. > Log into your Mail account via your providers website. go to the spam folder and mark the items as not spam. This is what I do and it fixes the problem once and for all. > > HTH > > - Brad - > > On May 5, 2020, at 08:40, Andrews, David B (DEED) via NFB-Web wrote: > > ?There are a couple things that should help. We run 300 plus lists, and have the odd problem, but nothing that systematic. > > First your DNS settings need to be correct. Secondly you should use SPF and KIM. Finally there is a setting under Mailman's administration > General settings, from_is_list, this is for dmarc, set to munge from, or wrap message. > > This impacts replying to messages, but unless you use one of those settings some systems will never accept your mail. > > Dave > > > -----Original Message----- > From: NFB-Web On Behalf Of Erik Burggraaf via NFB-Web > Sent: Tuesday, May 5, 2020 8:27 AM > To: Richard Payne via NFB-Web > Cc: Erik Burggraaf > Subject: [NFB-Web] Help with mailman? > > This message may be from an external email source. > Do not select links or open attachments unless verified. Report all suspicious emails to Minnesota IT Services Security Operations Center. > > ________________________________ > > Hi, I?m working on some web projects for Canadian Federation of the Blind. We are having major issues with mailman communication apparently being regarded as spam. Some addresses can not be subscribed fully because they will not even allow mailman?s confirmation email as far as the spam or junk folder. Others can subscribe, but find as many as 2/3 of list emails redirected to spam or junk. Are there any settings I can look for in mailman that could make us look less junky, or is it time to migrate our entire email communication to groups.io? > > Thanks for any advice. > > Erik > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > _______________________________________________ > NFB-Web mailing list > NFB-Web at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/wbsjr%40swbell.net > > > _______________________________________________ > NFB-Web mailing list > NFB-Web at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/burggraaferik%40gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > NFB-Web mailing list > NFB-Web at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/wbsjr%40swbell.net > > > _______________________________________________ > NFB-Web mailing list > NFB-Web at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-web_nfbnet.org > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFB-Web: > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfb-web_nfbnet.org/tyler%40tysdomain.com -- Take Care, Tyler Littlefield (he/him/his) Tyler Littlefield Consulting: website development and business solutions. My personal site My Linkedin @Sorressean on Twitter