[nfbcs] Booting from Linux CD and Accessing the Hard Drive

Steve Jacobson steve.jacobson at visi.com
Fri Apr 9 11:56:39 UTC 2010 

Jim,

Thanks, that is pretty much what I was attempting to say, but you said it clearer. 

Best regards,

Steve Jacobson

On Thu, 8 Apr 2010 20:27:27 -0700, Jim Barbour wrote:

>Hey Steve,

>Not quite.

>Live CDs allow you to boot directly into an environment that you can
>work in. Booting into the live environment doesn't disturb your hard
>disk at all.

>The other kind of CDs are installation CDs, which you boot into an
>environment designed to allow you to install linux.

>Windows doesn't really have a live version of its CDs.

>Make sense?

>Jim

>On Thu, Apr 08, 2010 at 09:53:09PM -0500, Steve Jacobson wrote:
>> Jim,
>> 
>> By "Live cd" version, is it meant that one can boot from the CD while other versions would require a partition with a 
little 
>> space?
>> 
>> Thanks for the information.
>> 
>> Best regards,
>> 
>> Steve
>> 
>> On Wed, 7 Apr 2010 13:01:50 -0700, Jim Barbour wrote:
>> 
>> >Steve,
>> 
>> >I'm not John, but I'll take a shot at this...
>> 
>> >It depends on which distribution of Linux.  For example, grml linux
>> >boots into a nice command line environment, and you can turn on
>> >speakup, which is a dos like screen reader.
>> 
>> >Ubuntu has a live CD versions, and comes with orca.
>> 
>> >Available tools on linux will help manipulate a hard drive and its
>> >partitions (see fdisk, parted, fsck.vfat, and fsck.ntfs)  However,
>> >nothing I'm aware of will pay attention to the contents of those
>> >filesystems.  i.e. no way to fix the registry.
>> 
>> >Talk to you soon,
>> >Jim
>> 
>> >On Wed, Apr 07, 2010 at 12:05:13PM -0500, Steve Jacobson wrote:
>> >> John,
>> >> 
>> >> I assume that you are familiar with booting from a Linux CD from your note below.  What I am wondering is to what 
>> degree could a person boot from a Linux CD with 
>> >> speech as an alternative to "Safe mode" which is generally not accessible?  While this is probably too vague a 
>> question to answer with a "yes" or "no," I assume 
>> >> that one could do some file manipulation on one's hard drive providing the drive was not dammaged, but what 
sorts 
>> of tools would one need to do that?  Do you 
>> >> know of any specific Linux-based tools that are designed to make repairs to the Windows operating system?  For 
>> example, if one were to boot from Linux, the 
>> >> Windows registry would obviously not be loaded into memory, but the files containing the registry should be 
>> accessible if a tool new how to process them.  The idea 
>> >> of booting into Linux from a CD without installing something on the computer is an interesting one.  How easy is 
>> FireFox to use in this environment?
>> >> 
>> >> Best regards,
>> >> 
>> >> Steve Jacobson
>> >> 
>> >> On Wed, 7 Apr 2010 09:36:57 -0500, John G. Heim wrote:
>> >> 
>> >> >It depends on how much you value the data you lost and how much time you're 
>> >> >willing to spend learning some new tricks. And even if it doesn't answer the 
>> >> >original poster's question, there are a lot of people on this list who may 
>> >> >at some point need this kind of information.  It might take some work to 
>> >> >acquire these skills but they would be valuable skills to have.
>> >> 
>> >> >Learning how to make a live linux CD would be a good thing for almost 
>> >> >everybody to know no matter their skill level. If you do on-line banking, 
>> >> >the best, most secure way to do it is to boot a live linux CD and use 
>> >> >firefox.  I would think that just about anybody capable of doing their 
>> >> >banking on-line could also figure out how to download ubuntu and burn it to 
>> >> >a CD if given a pointer or 2.
>> >> 
>> >> >----- Original Message ----- 
>> >> >From: "Kelly Prescott" <prescott at deltav.org>
>> >> >To: "'NFBnet NFBCS Mailing List'" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>> >> >Sent: Monday, April 05, 2010 2:37 PM
>> >> >Subject: Re: [nfbcs] access hard drive
>> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> >>I have also used methods similar, but I think this goes way beyond what 
>> >> >>most
>> >> >> users are willing/able to do.
>> >> >> just use something like carbonite.com and restore from there when you nuke
>> >> >> your windows drive.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> From: nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
>> >> >> Of John G. Heim
>> >> >> Sent: Monday, April 05, 2010 10:29 AM
>> >> >> To: NFBnet NFBCS Mailing List
>> >> >> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] access hard drive
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Here is a link to an accessible, free tool to burn iso images in Windows:
>> >> >> http://isorecorder.alexfeinman.com/isorecorder.htm
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I've been using IsoRecorder for years but I am a Windows XP user. I don't
>> >> >> know about the Windows Vista or Windows 7 versions.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Also, there are many more tools than fsck-fat and parted for restoring 
>> >> >> file
>> >> >> systems in linux. Here is a link to an article about how to use PhotoRec 
>> >> >> to
>> >> >> restore files using linux:
>> >> >> http://www.linux.com/news/enterprise/storage/8257-how-to-recover-lost-files-
>> >> >> after-you-accidentally-wipe-your-hard-drive
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I once re-installed linux on a computer so the HD was repartitioned and
>> >> >> reformatted. Still I was able to get some files back. I used dd to make an
>> >> >> image of the disk and then I worked from that. These tools allow you to 
>> >> >> get
>> >> >> files back from a disk even if you've repartitioned and reformatted as 
>> >> >> long
>> >> >> as the files you want haven't been over written with new files. It takes
>> >> >> some luck and it takes a very long time.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> >> >> From: "Jim Barbour" <jbar at barcore.com>; <0 at barcore.com>; 
>> >> >> <215 at barcore.com>;
>> >> >> <0c at barcore.com>
>> >> >> To: "NFBnet NFBCS Mailing List" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>> >> >> Sent: Friday, April 02, 2010 6:48 PM
>> >> >> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] access hard drive
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>> Kelly, I totally agree that a linux solution can fix the partition
>> >> >>> table. We'll just have to agree to disagree about fsck.vfat doing as
>> >> >>> good a job as available microsoft tools.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> Bryan,
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> If your friend decides to go with a linux solution (which is
>> >> >>> free and accessible, but has a steeper learning curve), then they
>> >> >>> should look for a live CD with the orca screen reader on it.  Googling
>> >> >>> for "orca linux live CD" will help you find one.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> Another way to resize the partition is to use something like "parition
>> >> >>> magic", which will be more friendly, since it's a task oriented
>> >> >>> approach rather than starting with a linux shell.  However, I suspect
>> >> >>> that partition magic is not free, and it is certainly not accessible.
>> >> >>> Googling for "partition magic" will take you to the right place to
>> >> >>> download the software.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> Regardless of whether they go with linux or partition magic, they'll
>> >> >>> need to download an ISO image and burn it to a CD, which is something
>> >> >>> I don't know how to do on a windows machine. I'm sure it's doable, I
>> >> >>> just don't know how.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> If they decide to go with partition magic, they'll need a sighted
>> >> >>> assistant to drive the computer.  They start by putting the partition
>> >> >>> magic cd they just created into the drive, and booting the machine.
>> >> >>> After that, they should just poke around until they find the correct
>> >> >>> item for resizing the partition.  I have high confidence that this
>> >> >>> will be fairly easy to do.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> For linux, your friend should spend a bit of time reading docs about
>> >> >>> how orca works.  Further, they'll want to read docs about parted which
>> >> >>> is aprogram that will do partition management on hard drives.  Again,
>> >> >>> it's important to remember what Kelly says.  There are no safety rails
>> >> >>> here.  If they aren't sure what they're doing, they can completely
>> >> >>> ruin any data on the disk.  (sorry, I know it's dramatic)
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> They'll boot their computer off the live CD, start
>> >> >>> orca, start a terminal, and then run parted.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> I can get into more specifics if you'd like, but start with this and
>> >> >>> see how it goes.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> Jim
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> On Fri, Apr 02, 2010 at 06:37:35PM -0400, Kelly Prescott wrote:
>> >> >>>> I think the linux tools could just resize the partition to fix it.
>> >> >>>> and yes linux can repair the filesystem with just as much reliability as
>> >> >>>> a
>> >> >>>> ms tool.
>> >> >>>> the failing is not with the linux tools, but rather the knowledge of who
>> >> >>>> is
>> >> >>>> using them.
>> >> >>>> Linux has no fail-safes so if you nuke it, you own all the parts.
>> >> >>>> I have repaired many disks/filesystems that commercial and ms tools said
>> >> >>>> were toast!
>> >> >>>> If you want to discuss it voice, you can call me at 419.909.0550 and I
>> >> >>>> will
>> >> >>>> be happy to chat about it.
>> >> >>>> The key is more information.
>> >> >>>> at this point we are making a lot of asumptions and that can be where 
>> >> >>>> our
>> >> >>>> logic falls apart.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> -----Original Message-----
>> >> >>>> From: nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> >> >>>> Behalf
>> >> >>>> Of Bryan Schulz
>> >> >>>> Sent: Friday, April 02, 2010 11:19 AM
>> >> >>>> To: NFBnet NFBCS Mailing List
>> >> >>>> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] access hard drive
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> hi,
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> the problem was the main drive was 500gb and the spare drive is only
>> >> >>>> 250gb.
>> >> >>>> the purpose was to reduce the size so the main drive could be copied to
>> >> >>>> the
>> >> >>>> spare drive so the spare drive could be used in another tower.
>> >> >>>> i think the entire partition was resized instead of making another
>> >> >>>> partition
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> and now it can't be accessed.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> Bryan Schulz
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> >> >>>> From: "Jim Barbour" <jbar at barcore.com>
>> >> >>>> To: "NFBnet NFBCS Mailing List" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>> >> >>>> Sent: Friday, April 02, 2010 10:00 AM
>> >> >>>> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] access hard drive
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> > The point is that they boot off the live linux CD.  This gives them an
>> >> >>>> > environment to work in that isn't making use of their windows boot 
>> >> >>>> > disk
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> > If they aren't a linux user, this does have a rather high learning
>> >> >>>> > curve.
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> > However, I'm not really sure that this solution meets the needs of
>> >> >>>> > Bryan's friend.  If I understand correctly, this friend has a
>> >> >>>> > corrupted mbr and possibly a corrupted filesystem they want to repair,
>> >> >>>> > so they can copy files from the disk.
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> > Linux can rewrite the MBR, but probably not repair the vfat table.
>> >> >>>> > My experience is that LInux's tools for repairing vfat filesystems are
>> >> >>>> > not as reliable as the ones MS provides.
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> > Bryan, can you explain further what the exact problem is?
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> > Jim
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> > On Fri, Apr 02, 2010 at 09:32:41AM -0500, Bryan Schulz wrote:
>> >> >>>> >> as most, he doesn't use linux.
>> >> >>>> >> how is that supposed to work with windows machines?
>> >> >>>> >>
>> >> >>>> >> Bryan Schulz
>> >> >>>> >>
>> >> >>>> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kelly Prescott"
>> >> >>>> >> <prescott at deltav.org>
>> >> >>>> >> To: "'NFBnet NFBCS Mailing List'" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>> >> >>>> >> Sent: Friday, April 02, 2010 9:00 AM
>> >> >>>> >> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] access hard drive
>> >> >>>> >>
>> >> >>>> >>
>> >> >>>> >> >use a linux rescue disk and you can do it with that.
>> >> >>>> >> >you can also copy and resize partitions with it.
>> >> >>>> >> >so you could take all data from one partition and put it on the new
>> >> >>>> >> >drive
>> >> >>>> >> >and resize the new partition.
>> >> >>>> >> >
>> >> >>>> >> >
>> >> >>>> >> >2 choices are:
>> >> >>>> >> >grml http://www.grml.org and system rescue cd
>> >> >>>> >> >http://www.sysrescd.org
>> >> >>>> >> >the grml is probably better as if you have a hardware synthesizer it
>> >> >>>> >> >will
>> >> >>>> >> >most likely be able to speak from boot.
>> >> >>>> >> >
>> >> >>>> >> >the best thing about these solutions is they are free!
>> >> >>>> >> >
>> >> >>>> >> >
>> >> >>>> >> >-----Original Message-----
>> >> >>>> >> >From: nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> >> >>>> >> >Behalf
>> >> >>>> >> >Of Bryan Schulz
>> >> >>>> >> >Sent: Friday, April 02, 2010 2:11 AM
>> >> >>>> >> >To: nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> >> >>>> >> >Subject: [nfbcs] access hard drive
>> >> >>>> >> >
>> >> >>>> >> >hi,
>> >> >>>> >> >
>> >> >>>> >> >a friend wants to know if there are programs that will recreate the
>> >> >>>> >> >mbr
>> >> >>>> >> >master boot record and fat file allocation table so files can be
>> >> >>>> >> >copied from
>> >> >>>> >> >a hard drive that has not been reformatted yet.
>> >> >>>> >> >
>> >> >>>> >> >Bryan Schulz
>> >> >>>> >> >_______________________________________________
>> >> >>>> >> >nfbcs mailing list
>> >> >>>> >> >nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> >> >>>> >> >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> >> >>>> >> >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> >> >>>> >> >for nfbcs:
>> >> >>>> >>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/prescott%40deltav.or
>> >> >>>> g
>> >> >>>> >> >
>> >> >>>> >> >
>> >> >>>> >> >_______________________________________________
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>> >> >>>> >>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/b.schulz%40sbcglobal
>> >> >>>> .net
>> >> >>>> >>
>> >> >>>> >>
>> >> >>>> >> _______________________________________________
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>> >> >>>> >>
>> >> >>>> >
>> >> >>>> > _______________________________________________
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>> >> >>>> net
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> _______________________________________________
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>> >> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/prescott%40deltav.org
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
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>> >> >>>
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>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
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>> >> >>
>> >> >>
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>> >> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> >_______________________________________________
>> >> >nfbcs mailing list
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>> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> _______________________________________________
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>> >> 
>> 
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>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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