[nfbcs] Java Accessibility was RE: Why Java? was: Software Developer position open

Wed Oct 3 16:11:21 UTC 2012

OK ... I should have stated that a Java application will work with screen readers if the User Interface in Java is written using the appropriate class of controls that sends out the appropriate UI accessibility information.  I believe SWT is one such set of UI components.  It has been my experience in industry, however, that developers in the corporate environment are interested in speed, performance, etc, and unfortunately accessibility with them takes a back seat if it impacts that model.  At our shop, developers have said that they don't want to write the UI's in SWT because ... I'm getting this second hand ... performance is sluggish.  Therefore, they worked with other classes of UI components.  And I'm pretty sure ... this has been a few years ago ... that their UI controls chosen did NOT send out the necessary information like SWT did.  Therefore, the Java UI was not, as I recall, accessible.

That's what I'm talking about.  If care isn't exercised and the UI isn't written using controls which support accessibility, you're not going to get it.  And that's the downfall.  If your developer doesn't use the correct classes, you may find yourself out in the cold.

---- "Nicole B. Torcolini Home" <ntorcolini at wavecable.com> wrote: 
> Please read all of the messages in the thread and make sure that you know
> what you are talking about before making blanket statements. The following
> is not true:
> 
> For example, in Windows, a Java program doesn't work with Jaws ... or any
> screen reader for that matter ... that is if all you do is install Java,
> start running a program written in that language, and expect it to work with
> Jaws.
> 
> If you use the SWT    library, then you do not need Access Bridge.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Mike Jolls
> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2012 6:27 PM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Why Java? was: Software Developer position open
> 
> Another consideration for Java .. besides it having support for the native
> O/S User Interface controls ... is that use of it is free.  It's a free
> download and all you have to do is go out and buy a book to learn it.  There
> are also good editors out there that support development.  And there is a
> very large community in case you have questions.
> 
> There are other reasons why Java is good to use too, such that each release
> version of Java has pre-built classes that allow you to "hit the ground
> running" ... meaning that you can ... after learning these pre-defined
> software modules ... use them to do specific functions without having to
> write every line of code yourself.  I remember once when I had to ... for
> work ... write a program that was going to connect to a remote server and
> upload a set of files to the server.  In the Java version we were using at
> the time, there were classes already developed and distributed that took the
> files, compressed them, put them into a "zip" ... or compressed file (that
> was one class that contained the zip functions).  Next, I used a different
> set of class methods ... prebuilt ... that would connect to the remote
> server, upload the files, and disconnect.  All you had to provide was the
> name of the server, some connection parameters such as userid and password,
> and the directory on the remote server where you wanted your file or files
> deposited.  Having these pre-built functions sure saved a lot of time, and
> the company I work for didn't have to pay to get the software development
> toolkit.
> 
> One downfall to using Java is that it doesn't automatically interface with
> all operating system ...  not like C or C++ for example ... from an
> accessibility standpoint.  For example, in Windows, a Java program doesn't
> work with Jaws ... or any screen reader for that matter ... that is if all
> you do is install Java, start running a program written in that language,
> and expect it to work with Jaws.  You have to go get the Java Access Bridge,
> load that on the machine along with your screen reader, and THEN Jaws will
> work with the Java screens you develop.  So it does take some investigation
> to figure out how to make Java accessible.
> 
> Provided that work that is done with Java is with the understanding that you
> have to pay attention to some details to get it to be accessible, Java is a
> good, full featured, language.  It has enough classes pre-built that you can
> do quite a bit with it.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Aaron Cannon
> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2012 6:45 PM
> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
> Subject: [nfbcs] Why Java? was: Software Developer position open
> 
> Hi John.
> 
> I actually am curious why Java was chosen as the language for the Braille
> Blaster project.  Is there any particular reason it was chosen over some
> other cross-platform language such as Python or even C?  Was it as simple as
> being the language you knew, or was there more to it than that?
> 
> Not criticizing the choice.  Just curious.  I think the language it's
> written in is much less important than the fact that it simply exists, and
> I'm thrilled to hear that the APH is sponsoring its development.
> 
> Aaron
> 
> 
> On 10/1/12, John J. Boyer <john.boyer at abilitiessoft.com> wrote:
> > That is one person's opinion. There are lots of organizations using 
> > Java, including the Daisy Consortiumj, Bookshare and Apache.
> >
> > If you wish to pursue this topic further, please change the subjectg 
> > line.
> >
> > John
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 01, 2012 at 02:17:08PM -0700, Ronald Smith wrote:
> >> Steve,
> >>
> >> I think Leo LaPort stated that Java is dead!
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Steve Jacobson" <steve.jacobson at visi.com>
> >> To: "NFB in Computer Science Mailing List" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> >> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2012 1:50 PM
> >> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Software Developer position open
> >>
> >>
> >> >John,
> >> >
> >> >I am going to forward this to our "jobs" list as well.
> >> >
> >> >Best regards,
> >> >
> >> >Steve Jacobson
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >On Mon, 1 Oct 2012 15:38:02 -0500, John J. Boyer wrote:
> >> >
> >> >>O
> >> >>A software developer with extensive Java experience is needed to 
> >> >>work on the BrailleBlaster project. This work will be done under 
> >> >>contract with the American Printing House for the Blind (APH), 
> >> >>which is collaborating on the project. Knowledge of Braille is 
> >> >>desirable but not required, since it can be learned. BrailleBlaster 
> >> >>is an open source project which aims to dramatically increase the 
> >> >>availability of Braille and tactile graphics. It covers both 
> >> >>literary and technical material. It is freely downloadable. Please 
> >> >>send questions and resumes to john.boyer at abilitiessoft.com
> >> >
> >> >>--
> >> >>John J. Boyer; President, Chief Software Developer Abilitiessoft, 
> >> >>Inc.
> >> >>http://www.abilitiessoft.com
> >> >>Madison, Wisconsin USA
> >> >>Developing software for people with disabilities
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >>_______________________________________________
> >> >>nfbcs mailing list
> >> >>nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> >> >>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> >> >>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
> >> >>for
> >> >>nfbcs:
> >> >>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/steve.jacobson%4
> >> >>0visi.com
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >_______________________________________________
> >> >nfbcs mailing list
> >> >nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> >> >http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> >> >To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info 
> >> >for
> >> >nfbcs:
> >> >http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/ronsmith131%40gma
> >> >il.com
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> nfbcs mailing list
> >> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >> nfbcs:
> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/john.boyer%40abili
> >> tiessoft.com
> >
> > --
> > John J. Boyer; President, Chief Software Developer Abilitiessoft, Inc.
> > http://www.abilitiessoft.com
> > Madison, Wisconsin USA
> > Developing software for people with disabilities
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nfbcs mailing list
> > nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> > nfbcs:
> >
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/cannona%40fireantproducti
> ons.com
> >
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nfbcs mailing list
> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nfbcs:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/majolls%40cox.net
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nfbcs mailing list
> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nfbcs:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.co
> m
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nfbcs mailing list
> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nfbcs:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/majolls%40cox.net