[nfbcs] Career Advice
david hertweck
david.hertweck at sbcglobal.net
Fri Oct 12 02:05:54 UTC 2012
I think another field that one should explore and one field that has been
good for me is embedded software, micro processors.
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Jacobson
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2012 2:11 PM
To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Career Advice
Generally I would agree with both of you, too, but what I would say for my
two cents is that I don't know that I would start out
now as a programmer if I was looking to work for a company. Certainly there
are still programming jobs, but there are not the
jobs there used to be. It is much, much more common now for companies to
buy software that they can use to perform many of the
functions they used to accomplish with in-house systems that were designed
and written by their programmers and analysts. When
companies need to have programming done, it is far more common now to
contract it out or even outsource it to off-shore locations.
However, there is a lot of need yet for people who are skilled in database
design and knowing how to work with databases which
includes a thorough knowledge of SQL. SQL isn't programming but is
rewarding and challenging in its own way. There is quite a
bit being done with networking, too, and there are some blind people who are
involved with network administration.
Of course, if one is thinking of developing software and wants to write it
some themselves, a programming language is very
important. Also, if one has his or her eyes on a specific area where
programming is common, learning a programming language is
still a good idea. I also think there is value to be gained by learning a
programming language and writing something just to get
a sense of what is necessary. I wonder, though, what the success rate is
for blind persons or anyone for that matter, going to
school to learn a programming language and then getting a good job. I am in
a position where I work that occasionally has me
looking at a COBOL program to see what is wrong with it. We still run a
good bit of COBOL here, but the maintenance of COBOL is
contracted out. My value to my company, probably more than programming, is
my in depth knowledge of how the business processes
relate to our computer systems. That has allowed me to take that expertise
and bring it with me as I changed to a different
computer platform, working primarily with databases. Like John, I
anticipated where the need would be and felt I could do all
right in the SQL environment and found reasons to learn quite a bit about
that, some on my own time, so when there was a push in
that direction, I had at least some of the tools I needed. For someone just
starting out in this field, it is very important to
look at the entire field, get some idea of what is interesting and also what
fits ones strengths. One also needs to look at what
one can do for a long enough time to get some understanding of how a given
employer does business even if it isn't ideal, knowing
one might be able to move into something they like better having gained that
experience.
Fifteen years ago, I would never have believed what a mixed bag
accessibility still is. Unfortunately, there are going to be
companies who are using tools that are inaccessible enough to make working
for that company a loosing bet. I still maintain a
hope that things will continue to improve, but it can still be a factor.
Sometimes it is clearly the developers of software who
are to blame, but some of the problem is that screen reader developers just
don't have time to implement newer technologies that
could be accessible because they are so busy chasing the development of the
latest operating systems. I don't know the answer to
that particular problem. Anyway, there are probably no exact answers, but
hopefully our responses provide some useful food for
thought.
Best regards,
Steve Jacobson
On Thu, 11 Oct 2012 13:21:39 -0500, John G. Heim wrote:
>I pretty much agree with everything you say below although I might not
>paint quite such a dark picture. But, yeah, I feel I've
been successful in my career by working harder than everybody else, putting
in extra time to make up for being slower than the
sighted guys, and doing a lot of research on my own time.
>I also agree with the point about keeping your skills up. There is this
>phenomenon I call "backwatering". New technologies tend
to be inaccessible so a blind technologist doesn't get the assignment of
working with them. Slowly, he becomes less and less
crucial to his company because he's working with old technology. Then when
layoffs come around, he's the one to go. And in some
ways, that's only fair. After all, he is the least important member of the
team.
>IMO, its important to be very aggressive in pursuing new technologies. I
>taught myself on my own time almost all the skills I use
in my current job. I am sure there are jobs where that isn't necessary but
they are few and far between. Also, to some degree it
depends on what you want out of your career. I work for the University of
Wisconsin and they don't layoff people very often. But a
few years ago, I went to my boss and said I thought my skills were being
wasted and that I could do a lot more, he said, "What's
your problem? You're still getting paid, aren't you?" But I wasn't satisfied
just pulling down a paycheck. Plus, I figured that
eventually they'd get around to getting rid of me. So I switched jobs and
got into a different department.
>----Original Message-----
>From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of majolls at cox.net
>Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2012 11:31 AM
>To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>Cc: Tracy Carcione
>Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Career Advice
>Working in the computer field is a challenging experience, especially for a
>blind person (well partially sighted in my case).
Here are some things to consider:
>Know your craft thoroughly. Be as prepared with your programming languages
>as you possibly can be. Corporations are looking for
people that can solve a problem quickly and who know where to go look when
they donâ¬"t know the answers. Therefore, you need to
be as knowledgeable as you possibly can be in whatever programming languages
you decide to work in.
> Know your weaknesses and have solutions in place before you go get the
> job. Itâ¬"s a competitive environment out there and the
people that can get the job done right in the shortest amount of time at the
least cost are the ones that seem to rise to the top
at least in my company. You need to know any limitations your disability
places on you and you need to have a solution BEFORE you
go to the job so it doesnâ¬"t hurt you in your career and you can keep up
with the normally sighted people. For example, my
reading speed is about 130wpm. A normal person reads at about 250wpm. You
can see it will take me twice as long reading as
someone else. In my daily job, Iâ¬"m constantly reading code on the
computer monitor. So you can see how a normal person without
any vision issues will finish things before me. Doing your best in this
case is not good enough because youâ¬"ll always be coming
in last. And that equates to less money at your performance review. Trust
me, I have 30+ years of experience to back me up on
this. If you think Braille, for example, will help overcome slow reading,
or using programs such as Jaws, learn it BEFORE you get
to the job so thereâ¬"s no chance of supervisors forming opinions of how you
work.
>Know that the job will eventually change, and sooner than later. In my
>job, new technologies are always coming up. The company
is looking for faster and better ways of doing things. And that means
theyâ¬"re trying new programming languages, new things to
make us meaner and leaner programmers. And that means that you have to
learn quickly, and probably more often than you would
like. You may be required (not by your employer but just by the fact that
you have to keep up) to spend extra hours in the
evening learning if you donâ¬"t have enough time during the day. The years
of learning a few things for your job and doing that
for 5-10 years are gone. Figure on having to relearn your job every couple
of years depending on what new thing is coming out.
You have to ask yourself if you feel like keeping up like that all the
time, or if your disability will put limitations on you
there. You are definitely under pressure in these situations.
>Be prepared to work overtime. If youâ¬"re in a professional job such as I
>am and youâ¬"re not as fast as others, itâ¬"s going to
take you more hours to do the same work in a time-frame that an employer
considers normal. Iâ¬"ve come to the conclusion I can
probably never please my employer. Or, if you have to do the training
thing, you may not get it all done in the course of 8
hours. In my job, an 8 hour day is the thing of the past. I work more like
a 10 hour day just to stay even .. to make up for my
poor eyesight. Even with technology such as screen magnification and
speech, and Braille, I still work a 10 hour day. With the
demands of the job, itâ¬"s just the standard.
>So consider all these things. Perhaps you can assess your situation and
>justify going into computer programming. It is a good
career, but to keep up and compete is a challenge. Itâ¬"s even moreso with
a vision disability in my opinion.
>I don't want to throw cold water on things, but I've had a lot of
>frustration in my career. It's no fun when you come in second
most of the time and people seem to move ahead of you and nothing seems to
work.
>---- Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net> wrote:
>> When I was looking for work with my programming certificate, I got an
>> offer from the IRS, but the salary was very low, and any programming
>> would have to be approved by head office in DC. I declined the offer,
>> and soon got a much better one. Even though I started at a low,
>> trainee salary, it was still significantly better than the IRS was
>> offering. Though perhaps IRS salaries are the same across the country,
>> and only low when compared to average New York salaries.
>> Tracy
>>
>> > I googled tfor info on the program. A link is below. A one paragraph
>> > summary is as follows...
>> >
>> >> Program Description: The Programming curriculum prepares clients to
>> >> work
>> > in a wide range of programming
>> >> environments including .NET and JAVA, and other application
>> >> projects as
>> > well. Certification exams for JAVA and
>> >> Microsoft Certified Professional Developer (MCPD) are offered
>> >> through the
>> > program. Some prior programming
>> >> experience is helpful, but not necessary to be successful in this
>> >> course.
>> > This program often offers the opportunity to get
>> >> a commitment for employment with the Internal Revenue Service.
>> >
>> > http://lwsb.org/index.php/general-overview/vocational-catalog/#conte
>> > nt
>> >
>> > Wasn't it this list where we just had a huge debate about java? I'm
>> > thinking java programming might be making a huge comeback in writing
>> > apps for mobile phones. But I'll admit I don't really know what I'm
>> > talking about. I would note, however, that the link above indicates
>> > that the Lions web site itself is written in php, not .net or java.
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tracy
>> > Carcione
>> > Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2012 9:38 AM
>> > To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>> > Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Career Advice
>> >
>> > Hi Daniel.
>> > I got a programming certificate, after I found I was going nowhere
>> > with my college degree. I looked around, and found a certificate
>> > course that taught the languages employers were looking for at the
>> > time. It was local, not out-of-state.
>> > If you do go to Lions World, try to make sure that they are teaching
>> > languages that will actually be in demand.
>> > Learning programming was a very good move for me. I have a secure
>> > job that pays well, and is usually interesting. I'm not sure if the
>> > IRS job pays well, or is interesting.
>> > My brother is also a blind programmer, working for subcontractors to
>> > the government. He gets paid OK, but gets laid off every few years.
>> > So your results may vary. But I think he'd rather be programming
>> > than having a rather dull but secure IRS job.
>> > HTH.
>> > Tracy
>> >
>> >> Hello Everyone:
>> >>
>> >> I hope this is the appropriate forum for this question.
>> >>
>> >> I am legally blind with a background in engineering and manufacturing.
>> >> After
>> >> talking with many blind engineers, I find that many of them are
>> >> thriving computer programmers.
>> >>
>> >> I am now trying to decide whether to go to Lions World in Little
>> >> Rock to take their 10 month computer programming course. My
>> >> counselor at my states agency for the blind wants me to go to Lions
>> >> World but to take one of their IRS courses, which would in essence
>> >> be a guaranteed job with the Feds.
>> >>
>> >> I am the type of person who could do any job, at least that is what
>> >> my aptitude tests tell me.
>> >>
>> >> What is life like for blind computer programmers? Do most work for
>> >> employers or as freelancers/contractors? Are there any languages in
>> >> particular I should focus on? Are there any other ways of learning
>> >> computer programming as a blind person than going out of state?
>> >> Learning on my own is just not working for me.
>> >>
>> >> Any advice you can give would be appreciated.
>> >>
>> >> Regards
>> >>
>> >> Daniel Garcia
>> >> Northville, MI
>> >>
>> >>
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