[nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays

Sun May 19 22:51:41 UTC 2013

Nope; it sure doesn't. but I use one at work and, although quite long, it's
very handy if Mr. Eloquence can't seem to make himself understood.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jude DaShiell
Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2013 9:55 AM
To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays

Baltimore Maryland inside the National Federation Of The Blind's 
technology lab is a good place to get to especially if you can arrange 
more than one appointment on more than one day.  You'll have time to 
think about questions as a result of earlier appointments and get much 
better informed.  No the Focus 80 3.70 hasn't got even basic notetaking 
capability.

On Sun, 19 May 2013, Tami Jarvis wrote:

> Ah. Thank you so much for that! It's still going to be awhile before I can
> purchase, but I like to know as much as I can so that when the time comes,
I
> can just up and order what I need. The only good thing about the delay is
that
> it increases the odds I can get to somewhere to actually do some hands-on
> exploration of models I am considering.
> 
> I wonder if there is a difference with Linux through Orca, BRLTTY and
liblouis
> and all. I will definitely be asking around about that!
> 
> Thanks again for the good info! You may have saved me from a really
expensive
> mistake!
> 
> Tami
> 
> On 05/19/2013 09:00 AM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
> > The keyboard is a perkins-style keyboard true enough, but it cannot send
> > the entire character set through to your computer.  Only a few different
> > keystrokes used for navigation can go through.  It comes with a keyboard
> > holder for a qwerty keyboard so you can do the rest of your typing on
> > that qwerty keyboard.  What I have is focus 80 3.70, so if you have that
> > model, that's what you get.  Whenever dealing with FreedomScientific,
> > it's wise when you're told some unit has a braille keyboard to ask can
> > the braille keyboard entirely replace a qwerty keyboard connected to a
> > computer.  If the answer comes back no as I expect it will, the braille
> > keyboard isn't a full function keyboard.
> >
> > On Sun, 19 May 2013, Tami Jarvis wrote:
> >
> > > Jude,
> > >
> > > Yikes! I've decided that the Focus 40 Blue, when I can spring for it,
is
> > > the
> > > display for me. Unless I win the lottery and can get the 80. But I was
> > > under
> > > the impression that it has a braille keyboard... Well, I just checked,
and
> > > the
> > > model I'm wanting has one. That, for me, is a key feature! I'm using
an
> > > older
> > > PacMate 440, which is great for reading but not for navigating or
making
> > > notes
> > > without taking my hands off the display, etc., etc. I love the thing
> > > because
> > > it is my first refreshable display and has opened wide horizons for
me,
> > > but...
> > > I whine daily about its lack in the efficiency and convenience
department.
> > >
> > > Could it be that the one you are using at work is an older model? Or
are
> > > you
> > > saying that the perkins keyboard does not allow typing on the
computer?
> > > Or...
> > >
> > > Well, since you are using one and mentioned that issue. Would hate to
> > > wrangle
> > > money and order a new wonder machine only to discover that it doesn't
do
> > > one
> > > of the wonderful things I most need it to! /shudder/
> > >
> > > Thanks for any input you can give!
> > >
> > > Tami
> > >
> > > On 05/17/2013 01:46 PM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
> > > > If the focus 40 and focus 80 are under discussion here, they differ
from
> > > > the versabraille classic p2c in that the p2c has a perkins-type
keyboard
> > > > that can type the whole character set on the computer.  That's
something
> > > > neither of the focus products can do.  I use a focus 80 at work and
my
> > > > employer really ought to find other displays that can replace a
qwerty
> > > > keyboard and screen when necessary because the braille keyboards
will
> > > > sound different than qwerty keyboards and provide a security
advantage
> > > > against anyone picking up keystrokes with a parabolic microphone for
> > > > later decoding.  That having been written, two things a focus
display
> > > > will do are showing formatting and showing spelling easily and
quickly.
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, 17 May 2013, Hyde, David W. (ESC) wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > You can use the same display (those that are standalone devices)
for
> > > > > the
> > > > > same functions as the computer displays.
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
> > > > > majolls at cox.net
> > > > > Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 12:59 PM
> > > > > To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
> > > > > Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
> > > > >
> > > > > Why am I not surprised here.
> > > > > What you're saying is that there's a different tool for a
different
> > > > > task.
> > > > > Too bad each tool is so pricey.
> > > > > I can definitely see for big jobs, you want the 40.  For seeing a
lot
> > > > > of
> > > > > formatting, you'd run out of room with the smaller device.
> > > > > And for portability, you want the smaller device.
> > > > >
> > > > > I was thinking about getting the 40 as a general solution.  It's
> > > > > bigger,
> > > > > but not too big, and you can carry it around.  A smaller device
would
> > > > > be
> > > > > nicer .. less space and weight to take up in the backpack
> > > > >
> > > > > So maybe the answer is to get the 40 first, and see how it works
> > > > > carrying
> > > > > it around.  The HIMMS isn't too big, and it does have the ability
to
> > > > > be a
> > > > > standalone notetaker plus connect via Bluetooth or USB.  Plus it
has
> > > > > the
> > > > > SD card option for external storage.  Then if I find it's too big
for
> > > > > carrying around, I could always try to get the 18 or 20 cell
variety
> > > > > HIMMS
> > > > > that is just smaller.  But I get it ... you may need more than one
> > > > > depending on what you do.
> > > > >
> > > > > This is kind of like guitars.  When I got into playing, I asked
> > > > > someone
> > > > > ... "is there one guitar that does it all?".  He just laughed.
"No, I
> > > > > have 7 and they play slightly different tones.  I use them each
for a
> > > > > different application".  I didn't understand until I started
playing
> > > > > in
> > > > > earnest.  Now I have 3 main guitars that I use.  Each is used in a
> > > > > different application.
> > > > >
> > > > > Too bad Braille Displays are so expensive.  My wife is going to
LOVE
> > > > > your
> > > > > answer.  I can see her rolling her eyes and saying ... "Here we go
> > > > > again!!".
> > > > >
> > > > > Final note .. I take from the answers I'm hearing that a display
with
> > > > > the
> > > > > built-in note taking functions (such as the HIMMS) is prefereable
so
> > > > > you
> > > > > can use them standalone without being connected to anything.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks for the replies.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ---- Robert Jaquiss <rjaquiss at earthlink.net> wrote:
> > > > > > Hello:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >        If I had to choose between an 18 and 40 cell display, I
would
> > > > > > choose 40 cells especially if it had some basic notetaking
> > > > > > capabilities. Having a display that can connect with either USB
or
> > > > > > Bluetooth is a good idea. If you want to read NLS books, these
are
> > > > > > formatted for 40 cells. If you want to carry your display with
you
> > > > > > and
> > > > > > use it with a phone, then a smaller display is probably better.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Regards,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Robert
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
> > > > > > majolls at cox.net
> > > > > > Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 9:31 AM
> > > > > > To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
> > > > > > Subject: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Hi everyone
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Wanted to get your input on what works best as a general purpose
> > > > > > Braille Display.
> > > > > > Would you want one that is just a dumb terminal, or one that has
> > > > > > some
> > > > > > notetaking capability built into it?
> > > > > > I also wanted to find out what gives better efficiency ... 18
cells
> > > > > > or
> > > > > > 40 cells
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So the first Braille display I tried was the Freedom Focus 40
blue.
> > > > > > Liked it alot, but it has to be hooked up to another device such
as
> > > > > > IOS or Windows PC to work.  No smarts in the device at all.
> > > > > > Next I heard about the HIMMS Edge 40.  Now there's something
> > > > > > interesting.  I can connect it like the Freedom, it can be a
slave.
> > > > > > I
> > > > > > can use it as a dumb terminal or I can disconnect it and do some
> > > > > > basic
> > > > > > notetaking tasks with it without it being connected to anything.
> > > > > > Price is about the same as the Freedom model.  Is the
flexibility
> > > > > > good
> > > > > > to have?  I guess that depends on where you go with it.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > As I recall, HIMMS has the 40 cell model, but it also has the
OnHand
> > > > > > which is an 18 cell model.
> > > > > > So, of those that use Braille Displays, do you prefer a 40 or 18
> > > > > > cell?
> > > > > > Is an 18 cell adequate or are you complaining constantly because
you
> > > > > > don't have enough cells and you're constantlyhitting the advance
> > > > > > button?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The 18 cell models are cheaper, that's why I'm asking.  I'm
> > > > > > thinking,
> > > > > > however, that the 40 cell model would be better ... more braille
> > > > > > until
> > > > > > you hit the advance key.  Also, the notetaking features built
into
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > HIMMS mean you don't have to carry the display plus the iPad or
> > > > > > iPhone.  You could just carry the device alone.  I'm kind of
leaning
> > > > > > toward the HIMMS but I'd like some info from people that
actually
> > > > > > have
> > > > > > one .. or other devices.  Tell me what you like and what you
don't
> > > > > > like.  $3000 is a lot of money to spend so I wanted to get some
> > > > > > practical advice.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So what configuration do most of you use?  Let me know.
> > > > > >
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---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
> > > > About to block another web browser version?  Ask yourself what Tim
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> > > >
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> > jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
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