[nfbcs] nfbcs Digest, Vol 108, Issue 16
Odawo Samuel
odawosamuel at gmail.com
Tue May 21 10:08:49 UTC 2013
My name is Samuel Ochieng’ Odawo.
I am a thirty-three year old Kenyan male, totally blind and a holder
of a bachelors degree in education (special education) and French
language.
I reside in Mombasa, Kenya.
I was born and bred in siaya county and later moved to Nakuru when I
joined secondary school.
I am the ninth borne in a family of twelve, now eight to Zachary
Oluoch and Patricia Adero both of whom never had any proper formal
education or formal employment and only engaged in subsistence
farming. However, my father who was a polygamist then, is also a jua
kali artisan.
I became blind at the age of six months due to a measles attack
according to the accounts of my mother Patricia.
My mother passed away in 2003.
I was brought up by my mother and was very close to her.
I enrolled in St. Oda primary school for the blind in 1987 and did my
Kenya certificate of primary education exam in 1996 passing with
flying colours.
I was admitted to the Salvation Army Thika high school for the blind
in 1997 and sat for my Kenya certificate of secondary education in
2000 and excelled.
I then joined Kenyatta University in 2002 to study for my bachelors
degree and graduated in 2007 with a second class upper.
Despite hailing from a very poor background and having gone through
very tough experiences since childhood, I have chosen to maintain a
very courageous and persistent spirit, always putting my trust in God.
My parents struggled paying my school fees right from primary school.
We would walk long distances with mother to school.
Many times I reported to school late due to lack of school fees.
I could have decided to stay at home and expect to be helped by my
older brothers and sisters but I chose not to give up in my education.
When I was admitted to secondary school, my father sold the only cow
that we had to pay school fees and thereafter it was left to God to
provide the way forward.
By the time I got to form two with my mother still back in the village
and myself now with my elder brother in Nakuru, there was no one
willing to take me to school seeing there was no money to pay school
fees.
Fortunately, I had already confessed Jesus Christ as Lord and my faith
in him had grown strong.
I decided to go to school in Thika by my self.
I had no money to pay school fees even money for transport I was only
given by my friends.
This went on until form four. As a matter of fact I don’t even know
who payed the money for my registration for the KCSE exams. Sometimes
when schools closed, I would remain behind in school for lack of money
for transport and be given by my teachers. I even spent at the bus
stop twice on my way home since I did not have enough money and was
waiting for friend who worked for a bus company to give me a lift
home.
It took the help of my friends, wellwishers and a fund raising to join
university.
After a real struggle in campus having to go repeatedly to beg for the
exam card since I always had huge arrears, I graduated but with some
outstanding fee balance which I only paid in 2009 when I got a better
paying job at the SOS children’s villages Kenya.
I later partnered with a friend to form an organization whose main
mission was to empower persons with disabilities. In order to fulfill
the organization’s objectives, we set out to start income generating
projects and we made tremendous progress. We started good programmes
to assist our target group; the visually impaired and the hearing
impaired. So as to dedicate my time fully towards the realization of
the organization’s objectives, we resolved that I resign from my job
at SOS and that I would get some allowance from the proceeds of the
income generating projects to help with my upkeep. Unfortunately as
soon as we created some income and the organization had acquired some
significant resources, I was shocked to learn that my friend had
turned the organization in to a family business. I no longer received
my allowance and I have found myself without a job. It is quite
devastating and frustrating as I gave my all including my resources
towards the betterment of the organization only to be betrayed by a
friend.
My current financial status is very frustrating. I strive a lot to
even get my basic needs (food, house rent, clothing, personal effects,
transport, internet services etc)
And general upkeep. My greatest desire is to find a job. My attempts
to find employment has been met with great discrimination and stigma
by many employers who still harbor negative attitude towards persons
with disabilities.
I even have considered self employment in the sense of starting a
business but I lack funds to use as starting capital. By the grace of
God I am engaged to a loving, God fearing lady. I am to marry her this
year once my financial status improves. At the moment our wedding
plans have been put on hold due to the prevailing circumstances.
I am currently forced to depend on friends for handouts a situation
which I find totally disappointing and depressing especially given
that I am a college degree holder.
My appeal to any well wisher out there is to help me find a job or
facilitate me to be able to start a business so that I can be able to
be independent, productive and self reliant.
I have purposed to pursue my further studies in masters and PHD in one
of the renown universities in the world.
I am currently writing an autobiography where I seek to recount my
life and times with a view of encouraging and inspiring the young and
the old alike to always endeavour to keep hope alive even in the face
of suffering and difficulties.
My vision is to see a Kenya where every blind person will be able to
participate proactively in all spheres of life without any barriers,
fear or favour
Owing to the very tough experience I had to go through in order to
attain my education and coupled with the myriad of challenges facing
the blind in the country as a whole, I have purposed in my heart to
help establish computer centers for the blind around the country
starting with Mombasa.
These centers will serve as resource centers where the blind will be
trained in computer literacy thereby enhancing information access and
economic wellbeing of this group that totals to around 300,000
Kenyans.
To accomplish this noble course, I have established a community based
organization called pamoja center whose website is
http://www.pamojacenter.com.
Pamoja center also seeks to network with other like minded
organizations in order to fulfill its mission and objectives.
Pamoja center is located in Mombasa within the island and you can
reach me on tel. 254721-255746 or by email: odawosamuel at gmail.com or
even via skype on odawosamuel or follow me on twitter @odawosamuel or
find me on facebook Samuel Odawo.
I look forward to working with you.
Peace.
http://www.odawosamuel.wordpress.com
On 5/20/13, nfbcs-request at nfbnet.org <nfbcs-request at nfbnet.org> wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Preference in Braille Displays (Mike Freeman)
> 2. .WPS Files (Mike Freeman)
> 3. Re: .WPS Files (Jude DaShiell)
> 4. Re: .WPS Files (Aaron Cannon)
> 5. Re: Preference in Braille Displays
> (Stanzel, Susan - FSA, Kansas City, MO)
> 6. Re: .WPS Files (Curtis Chong)
> 7. Re: Preference in Braille Displays (Nicole Torcolini)
> 8. Re: Preference in Braille Displays (Tami Jarvis)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 19 May 2013 15:51:41 -0700
> From: "Mike Freeman" <k7uij at panix.com>
> To: "'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
> Message-ID: <00ff01ce54e3$6e2faa50$4a8efef0$@panix.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
> Nope; it sure doesn't. but I use one at work and, although quite long, it's
> very handy if Mr. Eloquence can't seem to make himself understood.
>
> Mike
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jude DaShiell
> Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2013 9:55 AM
> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>
> Baltimore Maryland inside the National Federation Of The Blind's
> technology lab is a good place to get to especially if you can arrange
> more than one appointment on more than one day. You'll have time to
> think about questions as a result of earlier appointments and get much
> better informed. No the Focus 80 3.70 hasn't got even basic notetaking
> capability.
>
> On Sun, 19 May 2013, Tami Jarvis wrote:
>
>> Ah. Thank you so much for that! It's still going to be awhile before I
>> can
>> purchase, but I like to know as much as I can so that when the time
>> comes,
> I
>> can just up and order what I need. The only good thing about the delay is
> that
>> it increases the odds I can get to somewhere to actually do some hands-on
>> exploration of models I am considering.
>>
>> I wonder if there is a difference with Linux through Orca, BRLTTY and
> liblouis
>> and all. I will definitely be asking around about that!
>>
>> Thanks again for the good info! You may have saved me from a really
> expensive
>> mistake!
>>
>> Tami
>>
>> On 05/19/2013 09:00 AM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
>> > The keyboard is a perkins-style keyboard true enough, but it cannot
>> > send
>> > the entire character set through to your computer. Only a few
>> > different
>> > keystrokes used for navigation can go through. It comes with a
>> > keyboard
>> > holder for a qwerty keyboard so you can do the rest of your typing on
>> > that qwerty keyboard. What I have is focus 80 3.70, so if you have
>> > that
>> > model, that's what you get. Whenever dealing with FreedomScientific,
>> > it's wise when you're told some unit has a braille keyboard to ask can
>> > the braille keyboard entirely replace a qwerty keyboard connected to a
>> > computer. If the answer comes back no as I expect it will, the braille
>> > keyboard isn't a full function keyboard.
>> >
>> > On Sun, 19 May 2013, Tami Jarvis wrote:
>> >
>> > > Jude,
>> > >
>> > > Yikes! I've decided that the Focus 40 Blue, when I can spring for it,
> is
>> > > the
>> > > display for me. Unless I win the lottery and can get the 80. But I
>> > > was
>> > > under
>> > > the impression that it has a braille keyboard... Well, I just
>> > > checked,
> and
>> > > the
>> > > model I'm wanting has one. That, for me, is a key feature! I'm using
> an
>> > > older
>> > > PacMate 440, which is great for reading but not for navigating or
> making
>> > > notes
>> > > without taking my hands off the display, etc., etc. I love the thing
>> > > because
>> > > it is my first refreshable display and has opened wide horizons for
> me,
>> > > but...
>> > > I whine daily about its lack in the efficiency and convenience
> department.
>> > >
>> > > Could it be that the one you are using at work is an older model? Or
> are
>> > > you
>> > > saying that the perkins keyboard does not allow typing on the
> computer?
>> > > Or...
>> > >
>> > > Well, since you are using one and mentioned that issue. Would hate to
>> > > wrangle
>> > > money and order a new wonder machine only to discover that it doesn't
> do
>> > > one
>> > > of the wonderful things I most need it to! /shudder/
>> > >
>> > > Thanks for any input you can give!
>> > >
>> > > Tami
>> > >
>> > > On 05/17/2013 01:46 PM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
>> > > > If the focus 40 and focus 80 are under discussion here, they differ
> from
>> > > > the versabraille classic p2c in that the p2c has a perkins-type
> keyboard
>> > > > that can type the whole character set on the computer. That's
> something
>> > > > neither of the focus products can do. I use a focus 80 at work and
> my
>> > > > employer really ought to find other displays that can replace a
> qwerty
>> > > > keyboard and screen when necessary because the braille keyboards
> will
>> > > > sound different than qwerty keyboards and provide a security
> advantage
>> > > > against anyone picking up keystrokes with a parabolic microphone
>> > > > for
>> > > > later decoding. That having been written, two things a focus
> display
>> > > > will do are showing formatting and showing spelling easily and
> quickly.
>> > > >
>> > > > On Fri, 17 May 2013, Hyde, David W. (ESC) wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > > You can use the same display (those that are standalone devices)
> for
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > same functions as the computer displays.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>> > > > > majolls at cox.net
>> > > > > Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 12:59 PM
>> > > > > To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>> > > > > Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Why am I not surprised here.
>> > > > > What you're saying is that there's a different tool for a
> different
>> > > > > task.
>> > > > > Too bad each tool is so pricey.
>> > > > > I can definitely see for big jobs, you want the 40. For seeing a
> lot
>> > > > > of
>> > > > > formatting, you'd run out of room with the smaller device.
>> > > > > And for portability, you want the smaller device.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I was thinking about getting the 40 as a general solution. It's
>> > > > > bigger,
>> > > > > but not too big, and you can carry it around. A smaller device
> would
>> > > > > be
>> > > > > nicer .. less space and weight to take up in the backpack
>> > > > >
>> > > > > So maybe the answer is to get the 40 first, and see how it works
>> > > > > carrying
>> > > > > it around. The HIMMS isn't too big, and it does have the ability
> to
>> > > > > be a
>> > > > > standalone notetaker plus connect via Bluetooth or USB. Plus it
> has
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > SD card option for external storage. Then if I find it's too big
> for
>> > > > > carrying around, I could always try to get the 18 or 20 cell
> variety
>> > > > > HIMMS
>> > > > > that is just smaller. But I get it ... you may need more than
>> > > > > one
>> > > > > depending on what you do.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > This is kind of like guitars. When I got into playing, I asked
>> > > > > someone
>> > > > > ... "is there one guitar that does it all?". He just laughed.
> "No, I
>> > > > > have 7 and they play slightly different tones. I use them each
> for a
>> > > > > different application". I didn't understand until I started
> playing
>> > > > > in
>> > > > > earnest. Now I have 3 main guitars that I use. Each is used in
>> > > > > a
>> > > > > different application.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Too bad Braille Displays are so expensive. My wife is going to
> LOVE
>> > > > > your
>> > > > > answer. I can see her rolling her eyes and saying ... "Here we
>> > > > > go
>> > > > > again!!".
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Final note .. I take from the answers I'm hearing that a display
> with
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > built-in note taking functions (such as the HIMMS) is prefereable
> so
>> > > > > you
>> > > > > can use them standalone without being connected to anything.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Thanks for the replies.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > ---- Robert Jaquiss <rjaquiss at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> > > > > > Hello:
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > If I had to choose between an 18 and 40 cell display, I
> would
>> > > > > > choose 40 cells especially if it had some basic notetaking
>> > > > > > capabilities. Having a display that can connect with either USB
> or
>> > > > > > Bluetooth is a good idea. If you want to read NLS books, these
> are
>> > > > > > formatted for 40 cells. If you want to carry your display with
> you
>> > > > > > and
>> > > > > > use it with a phone, then a smaller display is probably better.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Regards,
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Robert
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > > From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>> > > > > > majolls at cox.net
>> > > > > > Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 9:31 AM
>> > > > > > To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>> > > > > > Subject: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Hi everyone
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Wanted to get your input on what works best as a general
>> > > > > > purpose
>> > > > > > Braille Display.
>> > > > > > Would you want one that is just a dumb terminal, or one that
>> > > > > > has
>> > > > > > some
>> > > > > > notetaking capability built into it?
>> > > > > > I also wanted to find out what gives better efficiency ... 18
> cells
>> > > > > > or
>> > > > > > 40 cells
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > So the first Braille display I tried was the Freedom Focus 40
> blue.
>> > > > > > Liked it alot, but it has to be hooked up to another device
>> > > > > > such
> as
>> > > > > > IOS or Windows PC to work. No smarts in the device at all.
>> > > > > > Next I heard about the HIMMS Edge 40. Now there's something
>> > > > > > interesting. I can connect it like the Freedom, it can be a
> slave.
>> > > > > > I
>> > > > > > can use it as a dumb terminal or I can disconnect it and do
>> > > > > > some
>> > > > > > basic
>> > > > > > notetaking tasks with it without it being connected to
>> > > > > > anything.
>> > > > > > Price is about the same as the Freedom model. Is the
> flexibility
>> > > > > > good
>> > > > > > to have? I guess that depends on where you go with it.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > As I recall, HIMMS has the 40 cell model, but it also has the
> OnHand
>> > > > > > which is an 18 cell model.
>> > > > > > So, of those that use Braille Displays, do you prefer a 40 or
>> > > > > > 18
>> > > > > > cell?
>> > > > > > Is an 18 cell adequate or are you complaining constantly
>> > > > > > because
> you
>> > > > > > don't have enough cells and you're constantlyhitting the
>> > > > > > advance
>> > > > > > button?
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > The 18 cell models are cheaper, that's why I'm asking. I'm
>> > > > > > thinking,
>> > > > > > however, that the 40 cell model would be better ... more
>> > > > > > braille
>> > > > > > until
>> > > > > > you hit the advance key. Also, the notetaking features built
> into
>> > > > > > the
>> > > > > > HIMMS mean you don't have to carry the display plus the iPad or
>> > > > > > iPhone. You could just carry the device alone. I'm kind of
> leaning
>> > > > > > toward the HIMMS but I'd like some info from people that
> actually
>> > > > > > have
>> > > > > > one .. or other devices. Tell me what you like and what you
> don't
>> > > > > > like. $3000 is a lot of money to spend so I wanted to get some
>> > > > > > practical advice.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > So what configuration do most of you use? Let me know.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > _______________________________________________
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>> > > > > > k.net
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > _______________________________________________
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>> > > > >
>> > > > > _______________________________________________
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>> > > > >
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>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > > jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
>> > > > About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
>> > > > Berners-lee would do.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > nfbcs mailing list
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>> > > > nfbcs:
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>> > > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
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>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
>> > About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
>> > Berners-lee would do.
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nfbcs mailing list
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>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
> About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
> Berners-lee would do.
>
>
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>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 19 May 2013 18:51:24 -0700
> From: "Mike Freeman" <k7uij at panix.com>
> To: "NFB in Computer Science Mailing List" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: [nfbcs] .WPS Files
> Message-ID: <012501ce54fc$89e9b650$9dbd22f0$@panix.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
> I asked Siri what these are and she said they were created by Microsoft
> Works - whatever that is. In any event, what's the best way to convert
> these
> to a flavor of Word?
>
>
>
> T I A.
>
>
>
> Mike Freeman
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 20 May 2013 05:07:16 -0400 (EDT)
> From: Jude DaShiell <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] .WPS Files
> Message-ID:
> <alpine.BSF.2.01.1305200505010.31945 at freire1.furyyjbeyq.arg>
> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
>
> Microsoft works is an alternate to microsoft office for those businesses
> and home users who do not have enough money for microsoft office. It
> has fewer capabilities than microsoft office and is something Microsoft
> would have to pay me to put on a computer.
>
> On Sun, 19 May 2013, Mike Freeman wrote:
>
>> I asked Siri what these are and she said they were created by Microsoft
>> Works - whatever that is. In any event, what's the best way to convert
>> these
>> to a flavor of Word?
>>
>>
>>
>> T I A.
>>
>>
>>
>> Mike Freeman
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nfbcs mailing list
>> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nfbcs:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/jdashiel%40shellworld.net
>>
>>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
> About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
> Berners-lee would do.
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 20 May 2013 07:31:13 -0500
> From: Aaron Cannon <cannona at fireantproductions.com>
> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] .WPS Files
> Message-ID:
> <CAERFoOhOd7BwK8K6Gesn_-t2m=2pBMHD5LpqwW9yiTssST5Jkg at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Looks like it was also discontinued about 5 years ago. You can find
> more information, including converters for the .wps file format at its
> Wikipedia page:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Works
>
> Aaron
>
> On 5/20/13, Jude DaShiell <jdashiel at shellworld.net> wrote:
>> Microsoft works is an alternate to microsoft office for those businesses
>> and home users who do not have enough money for microsoft office. It
>> has fewer capabilities than microsoft office and is something Microsoft
>> would have to pay me to put on a computer.
>>
>> On Sun, 19 May 2013, Mike Freeman wrote:
>>
>>> I asked Siri what these are and she said they were created by Microsoft
>>> Works - whatever that is. In any event, what's the best way to convert
>>> these
>>> to a flavor of Word?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> T I A.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Mike Freeman
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nfbcs mailing list
>>> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nfbcs:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/jdashiel%40shellworld.net
>>>
>>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
>> About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
>> Berners-lee would do.
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nfbcs mailing list
>> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nfbcs:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/cannona%40fireantproductions.com
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 20 May 2013 13:01:54 +0000
> From: "Stanzel, Susan - FSA, Kansas City, MO"
> <Susan.Stanzel at kcc.usda.gov>
> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
> Message-ID:
> <BFE31B9D23B4D547A6D3300FEB71B687F366CE at 001FSN2MPN1-022.001f.mgd2.msft.net>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I am a Java developer and I can't tell you how much I love my Focus 80
> Braille display. I love it so much that I found another display I used at
> home and then Freedom had a trade in program. I Telework and have a Braille
> display at both places. If I were not programming I think 40 would be
> enough, but 80 is more handy for programming.
>
> Susie Stanzel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman
> Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2013 5:52 PM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>
> Nope; it sure doesn't. but I use one at work and, although quite long, it's
> very handy if Mr. Eloquence can't seem to make himself understood.
>
> Mike
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jude DaShiell
> Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2013 9:55 AM
> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>
> Baltimore Maryland inside the National Federation Of The Blind's technology
> lab is a good place to get to especially if you can arrange more than one
> appointment on more than one day. You'll have time to think about questions
> as a result of earlier appointments and get much better informed. No the
> Focus 80 3.70 hasn't got even basic notetaking capability.
>
> On Sun, 19 May 2013, Tami Jarvis wrote:
>
>> Ah. Thank you so much for that! It's still going to be awhile before I
>> can purchase, but I like to know as much as I can so that when the
>> time comes,
> I
>> can just up and order what I need. The only good thing about the delay
>> is
> that
>> it increases the odds I can get to somewhere to actually do some
>> hands-on exploration of models I am considering.
>>
>> I wonder if there is a difference with Linux through Orca, BRLTTY and
> liblouis
>> and all. I will definitely be asking around about that!
>>
>> Thanks again for the good info! You may have saved me from a really
> expensive
>> mistake!
>>
>> Tami
>>
>> On 05/19/2013 09:00 AM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
>> > The keyboard is a perkins-style keyboard true enough, but it cannot
>> > send the entire character set through to your computer. Only a few
>> > different keystrokes used for navigation can go through. It comes
>> > with a keyboard holder for a qwerty keyboard so you can do the rest
>> > of your typing on that qwerty keyboard. What I have is focus 80
>> > 3.70, so if you have that model, that's what you get. Whenever
>> > dealing with FreedomScientific, it's wise when you're told some unit
>> > has a braille keyboard to ask can the braille keyboard entirely
>> > replace a qwerty keyboard connected to a computer. If the answer
>> > comes back no as I expect it will, the braille keyboard isn't a full
>> > function keyboard.
>> >
>> > On Sun, 19 May 2013, Tami Jarvis wrote:
>> >
>> > > Jude,
>> > >
>> > > Yikes! I've decided that the Focus 40 Blue, when I can spring for
>> > > it,
> is
>> > > the
>> > > display for me. Unless I win the lottery and can get the 80. But I
>> > > was under the impression that it has a braille keyboard... Well, I
>> > > just checked,
> and
>> > > the
>> > > model I'm wanting has one. That, for me, is a key feature! I'm
>> > > using
> an
>> > > older
>> > > PacMate 440, which is great for reading but not for navigating or
> making
>> > > notes
>> > > without taking my hands off the display, etc., etc. I love the
>> > > thing because it is my first refreshable display and has opened
>> > > wide horizons for
> me,
>> > > but...
>> > > I whine daily about its lack in the efficiency and convenience
> department.
>> > >
>> > > Could it be that the one you are using at work is an older model?
>> > > Or
> are
>> > > you
>> > > saying that the perkins keyboard does not allow typing on the
> computer?
>> > > Or...
>> > >
>> > > Well, since you are using one and mentioned that issue. Would hate
>> > > to wrangle money and order a new wonder machine only to discover
>> > > that it doesn't
> do
>> > > one
>> > > of the wonderful things I most need it to! /shudder/
>> > >
>> > > Thanks for any input you can give!
>> > >
>> > > Tami
>> > >
>> > > On 05/17/2013 01:46 PM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
>> > > > If the focus 40 and focus 80 are under discussion here, they
>> > > > differ
> from
>> > > > the versabraille classic p2c in that the p2c has a perkins-type
> keyboard
>> > > > that can type the whole character set on the computer. That's
> something
>> > > > neither of the focus products can do. I use a focus 80 at work
>> > > > and
> my
>> > > > employer really ought to find other displays that can replace a
> qwerty
>> > > > keyboard and screen when necessary because the braille keyboards
> will
>> > > > sound different than qwerty keyboards and provide a security
> advantage
>> > > > against anyone picking up keystrokes with a parabolic microphone
>> > > > for later decoding. That having been written, two things a
>> > > > focus
> display
>> > > > will do are showing formatting and showing spelling easily and
> quickly.
>> > > >
>> > > > On Fri, 17 May 2013, Hyde, David W. (ESC) wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > > You can use the same display (those that are standalone
>> > > > > devices)
> for
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > same functions as the computer displays.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>> > > > > majolls at cox.net
>> > > > > Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 12:59 PM
>> > > > > To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>> > > > > Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Why am I not surprised here.
>> > > > > What you're saying is that there's a different tool for a
> different
>> > > > > task.
>> > > > > Too bad each tool is so pricey.
>> > > > > I can definitely see for big jobs, you want the 40. For
>> > > > > seeing a
> lot
>> > > > > of
>> > > > > formatting, you'd run out of room with the smaller device.
>> > > > > And for portability, you want the smaller device.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I was thinking about getting the 40 as a general solution.
>> > > > > It's bigger, but not too big, and you can carry it around. A
>> > > > > smaller device
> would
>> > > > > be
>> > > > > nicer .. less space and weight to take up in the backpack
>> > > > >
>> > > > > So maybe the answer is to get the 40 first, and see how it
>> > > > > works carrying it around. The HIMMS isn't too big, and it
>> > > > > does have the ability
> to
>> > > > > be a
>> > > > > standalone notetaker plus connect via Bluetooth or USB. Plus
>> > > > > it
> has
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > SD card option for external storage. Then if I find it's too
>> > > > > big
> for
>> > > > > carrying around, I could always try to get the 18 or 20 cell
> variety
>> > > > > HIMMS
>> > > > > that is just smaller. But I get it ... you may need more than
>> > > > > one depending on what you do.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > This is kind of like guitars. When I got into playing, I
>> > > > > asked someone ... "is there one guitar that does it all?". He
>> > > > > just laughed.
> "No, I
>> > > > > have 7 and they play slightly different tones. I use them
>> > > > > each
> for a
>> > > > > different application". I didn't understand until I started
> playing
>> > > > > in
>> > > > > earnest. Now I have 3 main guitars that I use. Each is used
>> > > > > in a different application.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Too bad Braille Displays are so expensive. My wife is going
>> > > > > to
> LOVE
>> > > > > your
>> > > > > answer. I can see her rolling her eyes and saying ... "Here
>> > > > > we go again!!".
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Final note .. I take from the answers I'm hearing that a
>> > > > > display
> with
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > built-in note taking functions (such as the HIMMS) is
>> > > > > prefereable
> so
>> > > > > you
>> > > > > can use them standalone without being connected to anything.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Thanks for the replies.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > ---- Robert Jaquiss <rjaquiss at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> > > > > > Hello:
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > If I had to choose between an 18 and 40 cell display,
>> > > > > > I
> would
>> > > > > > choose 40 cells especially if it had some basic notetaking
>> > > > > > capabilities. Having a display that can connect with either
>> > > > > > USB
> or
>> > > > > > Bluetooth is a good idea. If you want to read NLS books,
>> > > > > > these
> are
>> > > > > > formatted for 40 cells. If you want to carry your display
>> > > > > > with
> you
>> > > > > > and
>> > > > > > use it with a phone, then a smaller display is probably better.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Regards,
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Robert
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > > From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>> > > > > > majolls at cox.net
>> > > > > > Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 9:31 AM
>> > > > > > To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>> > > > > > Subject: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Hi everyone
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Wanted to get your input on what works best as a general
>> > > > > > purpose Braille Display.
>> > > > > > Would you want one that is just a dumb terminal, or one that
>> > > > > > has some notetaking capability built into it?
>> > > > > > I also wanted to find out what gives better efficiency ...
>> > > > > > 18
> cells
>> > > > > > or
>> > > > > > 40 cells
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > So the first Braille display I tried was the Freedom Focus
>> > > > > > 40
> blue.
>> > > > > > Liked it alot, but it has to be hooked up to another device
>> > > > > > such
> as
>> > > > > > IOS or Windows PC to work. No smarts in the device at all.
>> > > > > > Next I heard about the HIMMS Edge 40. Now there's something
>> > > > > > interesting. I can connect it like the Freedom, it can be a
> slave.
>> > > > > > I
>> > > > > > can use it as a dumb terminal or I can disconnect it and do
>> > > > > > some basic notetaking tasks with it without it being
>> > > > > > connected to anything.
>> > > > > > Price is about the same as the Freedom model. Is the
> flexibility
>> > > > > > good
>> > > > > > to have? I guess that depends on where you go with it.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > As I recall, HIMMS has the 40 cell model, but it also has
>> > > > > > the
> OnHand
>> > > > > > which is an 18 cell model.
>> > > > > > So, of those that use Braille Displays, do you prefer a 40
>> > > > > > or 18 cell?
>> > > > > > Is an 18 cell adequate or are you complaining constantly
>> > > > > > because
> you
>> > > > > > don't have enough cells and you're constantlyhitting the
>> > > > > > advance button?
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > The 18 cell models are cheaper, that's why I'm asking. I'm
>> > > > > > thinking, however, that the 40 cell model would be better
>> > > > > > ... more braille until you hit the advance key. Also, the
>> > > > > > notetaking features built
> into
>> > > > > > the
>> > > > > > HIMMS mean you don't have to carry the display plus the iPad
>> > > > > > or iPhone. You could just carry the device alone. I'm kind
>> > > > > > of
> leaning
>> > > > > > toward the HIMMS but I'd like some info from people that
> actually
>> > > > > > have
>> > > > > > one .. or other devices. Tell me what you like and what you
> don't
>> > > > > > like. $3000 is a lot of money to spend so I wanted to get
>> > > > > > some practical advice.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > So what configuration do most of you use? Let me know.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > > > nfbcs mailing list
>> > > > > > nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> > > > > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> > > > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> info
>> > > > > > for
>> > > > > > nfbcs:
>> > > > > >
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlin
>> > > > > > k.net
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > > > nfbcs mailing list
>> > > > > > nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> > > > > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> > > > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> info
>> > > > > > for
>> > > > > > nfbcs:
>> > > > > >
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/majolls%40cox.net
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > > nfbcs mailing list
>> > > > > nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> > > > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> > > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> > > > > info
> for
>> > > > > nfbcs:
>> > > > >
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/david.hyde%40wcbvi.k12.wi
> .us
>> > > > >
>> > > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > > nfbcs mailing list
>> > > > > nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> > > > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> > > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> > > > > info
> for
>> > > > > nfbcs:
>> > > > >
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/jdashiel%40shellworld.net
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > > jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
>> > > > About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what
>> > > > Tim Berners-lee would do.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > nfbcs mailing list
>> > > > nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> > > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> > > > info
> for
>> > > > nfbcs:
>> > > >
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/tami%40poodlemutt.com
>> > > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
>> > > nfbcs mailing list
>> > > nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> > > for
>> > > nfbcs:
>> > >
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/jdashiel%40shellworld.net
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
>> > About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
>> > Berners-lee would do.
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nfbcs mailing list
>> > nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> > for
> nfbcs:
>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/tami%40poodlemutt
>> > .com
>> >
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nfbcs mailing list
>> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nfbcs:
>>
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/jdashiel%40shellworld.net
>>
>>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
> About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
> Berners-lee would do.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nfbcs mailing list
> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nfbcs:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nfbcs mailing list
> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nfbcs:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/susan.stanzel%40kcc.usda.gov
>
>
>
>
>
> This electronic message contains information generated by the USDA solely
> for the intended recipients. Any unauthorized interception of this message
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>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 20 May 2013 08:43:51 -0500
> From: "Curtis Chong" <curtischong at earthlink.net>
> To: "'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] .WPS Files
> Message-ID: <000c01ce5560$10ace230$3206a690$@earthlink.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Mike:
>
> Microsoft offers a free utility that you can install as a plug-in to
> Microsoft Word. I can supply this to you if you have trouble finding it.
> Just let me know.
>
> Cordially,
>
> Curtis Chong
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman
> Sent: May 19, 2013 8:51 PM
> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
> Subject: [nfbcs] .WPS Files
>
> I asked Siri what these are and she said they were created by Microsoft
> Works - whatever that is. In any event, what's the best way to convert
> these
> to a flavor of Word?
>
>
>
> T I A.
>
>
>
> Mike Freeman
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nfbcs mailing list
> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nfbcs:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/curtischong%40earthlink.n
> et
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Mon, 20 May 2013 06:58:10 -0700
> From: "Nicole Torcolini" <ntorcolini at wavecable.com>
> To: "'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
> Message-ID: <A4FCFC5BC5EA4C42B8A66BCD752BA85E at NicoleDell>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Ditto on the 80 cells for programming. At home, I use my 32 cell
> BrailleNote
> as a display, but, at work, I love having the 80 cells. Also, at work, the
> maximum line length allowed for code is 80 characters, so, in Computer
> Braille, the display is perfect for measuring that.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Stanzel, Susan -
> FSA, Kansas City, MO
> Sent: Monday, May 20, 2013 6:02 AM
> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>
> I am a Java developer and I can't tell you how much I love my Focus 80
> Braille display. I love it so much that I found another display I used at
> home and then Freedom had a trade in program. I Telework and have a Braille
> display at both places. If I were not programming I think 40 would be
> enough, but 80 is more handy for programming.
>
> Susie Stanzel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Mike Freeman
> Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2013 5:52 PM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>
> Nope; it sure doesn't. but I use one at work and, although quite long, it's
> very handy if Mr. Eloquence can't seem to make himself understood.
>
> Mike
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jude DaShiell
> Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2013 9:55 AM
> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>
> Baltimore Maryland inside the National Federation Of The Blind's technology
> lab is a good place to get to especially if you can arrange more than one
> appointment on more than one day. You'll have time to think about
> questions
> as a result of earlier appointments and get much better informed. No the
> Focus 80 3.70 hasn't got even basic notetaking capability.
>
> On Sun, 19 May 2013, Tami Jarvis wrote:
>
>> Ah. Thank you so much for that! It's still going to be awhile before I
>> can purchase, but I like to know as much as I can so that when the
>> time comes,
> I
>> can just up and order what I need. The only good thing about the delay
>> is
> that
>> it increases the odds I can get to somewhere to actually do some
>> hands-on exploration of models I am considering.
>>
>> I wonder if there is a difference with Linux through Orca, BRLTTY and
> liblouis
>> and all. I will definitely be asking around about that!
>>
>> Thanks again for the good info! You may have saved me from a really
> expensive
>> mistake!
>>
>> Tami
>>
>> On 05/19/2013 09:00 AM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
>> > The keyboard is a perkins-style keyboard true enough, but it cannot
>> > send the entire character set through to your computer. Only a few
>> > different keystrokes used for navigation can go through. It comes
>> > with a keyboard holder for a qwerty keyboard so you can do the rest
>> > of your typing on that qwerty keyboard. What I have is focus 80
>> > 3.70, so if you have that model, that's what you get. Whenever
>> > dealing with FreedomScientific, it's wise when you're told some unit
>> > has a braille keyboard to ask can the braille keyboard entirely
>> > replace a qwerty keyboard connected to a computer. If the answer
>> > comes back no as I expect it will, the braille keyboard isn't a full
> function keyboard.
>> >
>> > On Sun, 19 May 2013, Tami Jarvis wrote:
>> >
>> > > Jude,
>> > >
>> > > Yikes! I've decided that the Focus 40 Blue, when I can spring for
>> > > it,
> is
>> > > the
>> > > display for me. Unless I win the lottery and can get the 80. But I
>> > > was under the impression that it has a braille keyboard... Well, I
>> > > just checked,
> and
>> > > the
>> > > model I'm wanting has one. That, for me, is a key feature! I'm
>> > > using
> an
>> > > older
>> > > PacMate 440, which is great for reading but not for navigating or
> making
>> > > notes
>> > > without taking my hands off the display, etc., etc. I love the
>> > > thing because it is my first refreshable display and has opened
>> > > wide horizons for
> me,
>> > > but...
>> > > I whine daily about its lack in the efficiency and convenience
> department.
>> > >
>> > > Could it be that the one you are using at work is an older model?
>> > > Or
> are
>> > > you
>> > > saying that the perkins keyboard does not allow typing on the
> computer?
>> > > Or...
>> > >
>> > > Well, since you are using one and mentioned that issue. Would hate
>> > > to wrangle money and order a new wonder machine only to discover
>> > > that it doesn't
> do
>> > > one
>> > > of the wonderful things I most need it to! /shudder/
>> > >
>> > > Thanks for any input you can give!
>> > >
>> > > Tami
>> > >
>> > > On 05/17/2013 01:46 PM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
>> > > > If the focus 40 and focus 80 are under discussion here, they
>> > > > differ
> from
>> > > > the versabraille classic p2c in that the p2c has a perkins-type
> keyboard
>> > > > that can type the whole character set on the computer. That's
> something
>> > > > neither of the focus products can do. I use a focus 80 at work
>> > > > and
> my
>> > > > employer really ought to find other displays that can replace a
> qwerty
>> > > > keyboard and screen when necessary because the braille keyboards
> will
>> > > > sound different than qwerty keyboards and provide a security
> advantage
>> > > > against anyone picking up keystrokes with a parabolic microphone
>> > > > for later decoding. That having been written, two things a
>> > > > focus
> display
>> > > > will do are showing formatting and showing spelling easily and
> quickly.
>> > > >
>> > > > On Fri, 17 May 2013, Hyde, David W. (ESC) wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > > You can use the same display (those that are standalone
>> > > > > devices)
> for
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > same functions as the computer displays.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>> > > > > majolls at cox.net
>> > > > > Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 12:59 PM
>> > > > > To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>> > > > > Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Why am I not surprised here.
>> > > > > What you're saying is that there's a different tool for a
> different
>> > > > > task.
>> > > > > Too bad each tool is so pricey.
>> > > > > I can definitely see for big jobs, you want the 40. For
>> > > > > seeing a
> lot
>> > > > > of
>> > > > > formatting, you'd run out of room with the smaller device.
>> > > > > And for portability, you want the smaller device.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I was thinking about getting the 40 as a general solution.
>> > > > > It's bigger, but not too big, and you can carry it around. A
>> > > > > smaller device
> would
>> > > > > be
>> > > > > nicer .. less space and weight to take up in the backpack
>> > > > >
>> > > > > So maybe the answer is to get the 40 first, and see how it
>> > > > > works carrying it around. The HIMMS isn't too big, and it
>> > > > > does have the ability
> to
>> > > > > be a
>> > > > > standalone notetaker plus connect via Bluetooth or USB. Plus
>> > > > > it
> has
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > SD card option for external storage. Then if I find it's too
>> > > > > big
> for
>> > > > > carrying around, I could always try to get the 18 or 20 cell
> variety
>> > > > > HIMMS
>> > > > > that is just smaller. But I get it ... you may need more than
>> > > > > one depending on what you do.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > This is kind of like guitars. When I got into playing, I
>> > > > > asked someone ... "is there one guitar that does it all?". He
>> > > > > just laughed.
> "No, I
>> > > > > have 7 and they play slightly different tones. I use them
>> > > > > each
> for a
>> > > > > different application". I didn't understand until I started
> playing
>> > > > > in
>> > > > > earnest. Now I have 3 main guitars that I use. Each is used
>> > > > > in a different application.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Too bad Braille Displays are so expensive. My wife is going
>> > > > > to
> LOVE
>> > > > > your
>> > > > > answer. I can see her rolling her eyes and saying ... "Here
>> > > > > we go again!!".
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Final note .. I take from the answers I'm hearing that a
>> > > > > display
> with
>> > > > > the
>> > > > > built-in note taking functions (such as the HIMMS) is
>> > > > > prefereable
> so
>> > > > > you
>> > > > > can use them standalone without being connected to anything.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Thanks for the replies.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > ---- Robert Jaquiss <rjaquiss at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> > > > > > Hello:
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > If I had to choose between an 18 and 40 cell display,
>> > > > > > I
> would
>> > > > > > choose 40 cells especially if it had some basic notetaking
>> > > > > > capabilities. Having a display that can connect with either
>> > > > > > USB
> or
>> > > > > > Bluetooth is a good idea. If you want to read NLS books,
>> > > > > > these
> are
>> > > > > > formatted for 40 cells. If you want to carry your display
>> > > > > > with
> you
>> > > > > > and
>> > > > > > use it with a phone, then a smaller display is probably better.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Regards,
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Robert
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > > From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>> > > > > > majolls at cox.net
>> > > > > > Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 9:31 AM
>> > > > > > To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>> > > > > > Subject: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Hi everyone
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Wanted to get your input on what works best as a general
>> > > > > > purpose Braille Display.
>> > > > > > Would you want one that is just a dumb terminal, or one that
>> > > > > > has some notetaking capability built into it?
>> > > > > > I also wanted to find out what gives better efficiency ...
>> > > > > > 18
> cells
>> > > > > > or
>> > > > > > 40 cells
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > So the first Braille display I tried was the Freedom Focus
>> > > > > > 40
> blue.
>> > > > > > Liked it alot, but it has to be hooked up to another device
>> > > > > > such
> as
>> > > > > > IOS or Windows PC to work. No smarts in the device at all.
>> > > > > > Next I heard about the HIMMS Edge 40. Now there's something
>> > > > > > interesting. I can connect it like the Freedom, it can be a
> slave.
>> > > > > > I
>> > > > > > can use it as a dumb terminal or I can disconnect it and do
>> > > > > > some basic notetaking tasks with it without it being
>> > > > > > connected to anything.
>> > > > > > Price is about the same as the Freedom model. Is the
> flexibility
>> > > > > > good
>> > > > > > to have? I guess that depends on where you go with it.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > As I recall, HIMMS has the 40 cell model, but it also has
>> > > > > > the
> OnHand
>> > > > > > which is an 18 cell model.
>> > > > > > So, of those that use Braille Displays, do you prefer a 40
>> > > > > > or 18 cell?
>> > > > > > Is an 18 cell adequate or are you complaining constantly
>> > > > > > because
> you
>> > > > > > don't have enough cells and you're constantlyhitting the
>> > > > > > advance button?
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > The 18 cell models are cheaper, that's why I'm asking. I'm
>> > > > > > thinking, however, that the 40 cell model would be better
>> > > > > > ... more braille until you hit the advance key. Also, the
>> > > > > > notetaking features built
> into
>> > > > > > the
>> > > > > > HIMMS mean you don't have to carry the display plus the iPad
>> > > > > > or iPhone. You could just carry the device alone. I'm kind
>> > > > > > of
> leaning
>> > > > > > toward the HIMMS but I'd like some info from people that
> actually
>> > > > > > have
>> > > > > > one .. or other devices. Tell me what you like and what you
> don't
>> > > > > > like. $3000 is a lot of money to spend so I wanted to get
>> > > > > > some practical advice.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > So what configuration do most of you use? Let me know.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > > > nfbcs mailing list
>> > > > > > nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> > > > > > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> > > > > > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> info
>> > > > > > for
>> > > > > > nfbcs:
>> > > > > >
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/rjaquiss%40earthlin
>> > > > > > k.net
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > > > nfbcs mailing list
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>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > > nfbcs mailing list
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>> > > > >
>> > > > > _______________________________________________
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>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > > jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
>> > > > About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what
>> > > > Tim Berners-lee would do.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > nfbcs mailing list
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> for
>> > > > nfbcs:
>> > > >
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>> > > >
>> > >
>> > > _______________________________________________
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>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
>> > About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
>> > Berners-lee would do.
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nfbcs mailing list
>> > nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> > for
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>> > .com
>> >
>>
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>>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
> About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
> Berners-lee would do.
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Mon, 20 May 2013 08:30:23 -0700
> From: Tami Jarvis <tami at poodlemutt.com>
> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
> Message-ID: <519A418F.4070608 at poodlemutt.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Jude,
>
> I would so love to do that! It's just not doable at this point, although
> Baltimore is on the list of must-see's for when we ever get to our east
> coast trip. A tech purchase for me is ahead of that on the budget,
> though, so there you have it. Of course, our family emergency Florida
> trip took out my tech budget for the year, so I feel sorry for myself
> and am trying to come up with a new plan I can live with. With 2 fathers
> in their nineties on opposite sides of the country, planning is iffy.
>
> I have been thinking iPad (and later iPhone) to compensate for the lack
> of native note taking capability in the Focus. I have other plans for
> using the iPad anyway. So if that combo works as advertised, that would
> give me a lot more portability and flexibility than I have now. Of
> course, if the perkins keyboard cannot be used to type notes in braille
> there, either... Yikes!
>
> Anyway, for now I'm on hold, but I do like to keep up with what's
> available and how things work so I can make good decisions when the time
> comes to get back to my own life. Of all the questions I asked around
> about the Focus, though, a few months ago when I was doing more serious
> research, it just never occurred to me to ask if the braille keyboard
> can be used to type braille! Silly me, I guess. /smile/
>
> Tami
>
> On 05/19/2013 09:55 AM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
>> Baltimore Maryland inside the National Federation Of The Blind's
>> technology lab is a good place to get to especially if you can arrange
>> more than one appointment on more than one day. You'll have time to
>> think about questions as a result of earlier appointments and get much
>> better informed. No the Focus 80 3.70 hasn't got even basic notetaking
>> capability.
>>
>> On Sun, 19 May 2013, Tami Jarvis wrote:
>>
>>> Ah. Thank you so much for that! It's still going to be awhile before I
>>> can
>>> purchase, but I like to know as much as I can so that when the time
>>> comes, I
>>> can just up and order what I need. The only good thing about the delay is
>>> that
>>> it increases the odds I can get to somewhere to actually do some
>>> hands-on
>>> exploration of models I am considering.
>>>
>>> I wonder if there is a difference with Linux through Orca, BRLTTY and
>>> liblouis
>>> and all. I will definitely be asking around about that!
>>>
>>> Thanks again for the good info! You may have saved me from a really
>>> expensive
>>> mistake!
>>>
>>> Tami
>>>
>>> On 05/19/2013 09:00 AM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
>>>> The keyboard is a perkins-style keyboard true enough, but it cannot
>>>> send
>>>> the entire character set through to your computer. Only a few
>>>> different
>>>> keystrokes used for navigation can go through. It comes with a
>>>> keyboard
>>>> holder for a qwerty keyboard so you can do the rest of your typing on
>>>> that qwerty keyboard. What I have is focus 80 3.70, so if you have
>>>> that
>>>> model, that's what you get. Whenever dealing with FreedomScientific,
>>>> it's wise when you're told some unit has a braille keyboard to ask can
>>>> the braille keyboard entirely replace a qwerty keyboard connected to a
>>>> computer. If the answer comes back no as I expect it will, the braille
>>>> keyboard isn't a full function keyboard.
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, 19 May 2013, Tami Jarvis wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Jude,
>>>>>
>>>>> Yikes! I've decided that the Focus 40 Blue, when I can spring for it,
>>>>> is
>>>>> the
>>>>> display for me. Unless I win the lottery and can get the 80. But I was
>>>>> under
>>>>> the impression that it has a braille keyboard... Well, I just checked,
>>>>> and
>>>>> the
>>>>> model I'm wanting has one. That, for me, is a key feature! I'm using
>>>>> an
>>>>> older
>>>>> PacMate 440, which is great for reading but not for navigating or
>>>>> making
>>>>> notes
>>>>> without taking my hands off the display, etc., etc. I love the thing
>>>>> because
>>>>> it is my first refreshable display and has opened wide horizons for
>>>>> me,
>>>>> but...
>>>>> I whine daily about its lack in the efficiency and convenience
>>>>> department.
>>>>>
>>>>> Could it be that the one you are using at work is an older model? Or
>>>>> are
>>>>> you
>>>>> saying that the perkins keyboard does not allow typing on the
>>>>> computer?
>>>>> Or...
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, since you are using one and mentioned that issue. Would hate to
>>>>> wrangle
>>>>> money and order a new wonder machine only to discover that it doesn't
>>>>> do
>>>>> one
>>>>> of the wonderful things I most need it to! /shudder/
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for any input you can give!
>>>>>
>>>>> Tami
>>>>>
>>>>> On 05/17/2013 01:46 PM, Jude DaShiell wrote:
>>>>>> If the focus 40 and focus 80 are under discussion here, they differ
>>>>>> from
>>>>>> the versabraille classic p2c in that the p2c has a perkins-type
>>>>>> keyboard
>>>>>> that can type the whole character set on the computer. That's
>>>>>> something
>>>>>> neither of the focus products can do. I use a focus 80 at work and
>>>>>> my
>>>>>> employer really ought to find other displays that can replace a
>>>>>> qwerty
>>>>>> keyboard and screen when necessary because the braille keyboards will
>>>>>> sound different than qwerty keyboards and provide a security
>>>>>> advantage
>>>>>> against anyone picking up keystrokes with a parabolic microphone for
>>>>>> later decoding. That having been written, two things a focus display
>>>>>> will do are showing formatting and showing spelling easily and
>>>>>> quickly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, 17 May 2013, Hyde, David W. (ESC) wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You can use the same display (those that are standalone devices) for
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> same functions as the computer displays.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>> majolls at cox.net
>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 12:59 PM
>>>>>>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why am I not surprised here.
>>>>>>> What you're saying is that there's a different tool for a different
>>>>>>> task.
>>>>>>> Too bad each tool is so pricey.
>>>>>>> I can definitely see for big jobs, you want the 40. For seeing a
>>>>>>> lot
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>> formatting, you'd run out of room with the smaller device.
>>>>>>> And for portability, you want the smaller device.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I was thinking about getting the 40 as a general solution. It's
>>>>>>> bigger,
>>>>>>> but not too big, and you can carry it around. A smaller device
>>>>>>> would
>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>> nicer .. less space and weight to take up in the backpack
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So maybe the answer is to get the 40 first, and see how it works
>>>>>>> carrying
>>>>>>> it around. The HIMMS isn't too big, and it does have the ability to
>>>>>>> be a
>>>>>>> standalone notetaker plus connect via Bluetooth or USB. Plus it has
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> SD card option for external storage. Then if I find it's too big
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> carrying around, I could always try to get the 18 or 20 cell variety
>>>>>>> HIMMS
>>>>>>> that is just smaller. But I get it ... you may need more than one
>>>>>>> depending on what you do.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This is kind of like guitars. When I got into playing, I asked
>>>>>>> someone
>>>>>>> ... "is there one guitar that does it all?". He just laughed. "No,
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>> have 7 and they play slightly different tones. I use them each for
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>> different application". I didn't understand until I started playing
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>> earnest. Now I have 3 main guitars that I use. Each is used in a
>>>>>>> different application.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Too bad Braille Displays are so expensive. My wife is going to LOVE
>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>> answer. I can see her rolling her eyes and saying ... "Here we go
>>>>>>> again!!".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Final note .. I take from the answers I'm hearing that a display
>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> built-in note taking functions (such as the HIMMS) is prefereable so
>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>> can use them standalone without being connected to anything.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks for the replies.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ---- Robert Jaquiss <rjaquiss at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hello:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If I had to choose between an 18 and 40 cell display, I
>>>>>>>> would
>>>>>>>> choose 40 cells especially if it had some basic notetaking
>>>>>>>> capabilities. Having a display that can connect with either USB or
>>>>>>>> Bluetooth is a good idea. If you want to read NLS books, these are
>>>>>>>> formatted for 40 cells. If you want to carry your display with you
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> use it with a phone, then a smaller display is probably better.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Robert
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>>>>>> majolls at cox.net
>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 9:31 AM
>>>>>>>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>>>>>>>> Subject: [nfbcs] Preference in Braille Displays
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi everyone
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Wanted to get your input on what works best as a general purpose
>>>>>>>> Braille Display.
>>>>>>>> Would you want one that is just a dumb terminal, or one that has
>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>> notetaking capability built into it?
>>>>>>>> I also wanted to find out what gives better efficiency ... 18 cells
>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>> 40 cells
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So the first Braille display I tried was the Freedom Focus 40 blue.
>>>>>>>> Liked it alot, but it has to be hooked up to another device such as
>>>>>>>> IOS or Windows PC to work. No smarts in the device at all.
>>>>>>>> Next I heard about the HIMMS Edge 40. Now there's something
>>>>>>>> interesting. I can connect it like the Freedom, it can be a slave.
>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>> can use it as a dumb terminal or I can disconnect it and do some
>>>>>>>> basic
>>>>>>>> notetaking tasks with it without it being connected to anything.
>>>>>>>> Price is about the same as the Freedom model. Is the flexibility
>>>>>>>> good
>>>>>>>> to have? I guess that depends on where you go with it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> As I recall, HIMMS has the 40 cell model, but it also has the
>>>>>>>> OnHand
>>>>>>>> which is an 18 cell model.
>>>>>>>> So, of those that use Braille Displays, do you prefer a 40 or 18
>>>>>>>> cell?
>>>>>>>> Is an 18 cell adequate or are you complaining constantly because
>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>> don't have enough cells and you're constantlyhitting the advance
>>>>>>>> button?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The 18 cell models are cheaper, that's why I'm asking. I'm
>>>>>>>> thinking,
>>>>>>>> however, that the 40 cell model would be better ... more braille
>>>>>>>> until
>>>>>>>> you hit the advance key. Also, the notetaking features built into
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> HIMMS mean you don't have to carry the display plus the iPad or
>>>>>>>> iPhone. You could just carry the device alone. I'm kind of
>>>>>>>> leaning
>>>>>>>> toward the HIMMS but I'd like some info from people that actually
>>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>> one .. or other devices. Tell me what you like and what you don't
>>>>>>>> like. $3000 is a lot of money to spend so I wanted to get some
>>>>>>>> practical advice.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So what configuration do most of you use? Let me know.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>> k.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>> jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
>>>>>> About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
>>>>>> Berners-lee would do.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nfbcs mailing list
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>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> nfbcs:
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
>>>> About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
>>>> Berners-lee would do.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nfbcs mailing list
>>>> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
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>>>> nfbcs:
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>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> jude <jdashiel at shellworld.net>
>> About to block another web browser version? Ask yourself what Tim
>> Berners-lee would do.
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nfbcs mailing list
>> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
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>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nfbcs:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/tami%40poodlemutt.com
>>
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> End of nfbcs Digest, Vol 108, Issue 16
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