[nfbcs] Accessible UNIX / LINUX Help Request

Wed May 21 14:15:07 UTC 2014

Ironically, the issue of how difficult it is to learn linux became part 
of the discussion I mentined earlier.  I pointed out that difficult is a 
relative word. Learning linux and orca is easier than learning to be a 
brain surgeon, I'll grant that. But it's harder than learning to tell a 
quarter from a dime.

It's impossible for me to say how hard it is to learn linux. I've been a 
unix/linux user my entire life. When i got my first Windows computer, it 
was Windows 95, I freaked out. I didn't see how a blind person could 
learn Windows when you had to click all these buttons to get anything 
done and eacht button could be almost anywhere in the operating system. 
Who knows how many buttons you might have to click to get to the one you 
want. In linux, you pretty much  can do anything by typing in a command. 
And to change settings, you almost always just edit a text file. It 
really is a different skill set.

Another thing, and don't tell anyone I said this, orca kinda sucks. I 
know the developers have poured their hearts andsouls into that screen 
reader but they have challenges other screen reader developers do not. 
For one thing, the window managers seem to come and go like the latest 
reality TV show star. And someone just posted a message today to the 
orca list saying the problem really is in the audio drivers in the 
kernel. And that is another point. Every few years the linux developers 
switch to a completely different set of sound drivers. First there was 
oss, then alsa, and now pulse. Yesterday, I was actually considering 
trying to re-install an obsolete version of debian linux just because 
orca was so much more stable two years ago than it is now. It could be 
argued that these problems are temporary and are due to the switch from 
alsa to pulse and gdm to gnome-shell  at the same time. So maybe things 
will settle down eventually.

I should add that I am using debian linux. Sonar is way better for blind 
people than plain debian.  That is what is so great about it, the sonar 
developers have worked out most of the bugs.

Having said all that though, I still think learning linux is worth the 
effort. If it weren't for the current instability, linux would be way 
better for blind people than Windows. Linux is designed for you to log 
in remotely and do stuff. The apache web server, for example, is managed 
entirely through text files and by entering commands at the command 
line. The same is true for dns, dhcp, database servers, backup, 
monitoring, mail. All the most popular packages for doing those things 
are managed at the command line and by text files. A blind person is 
hardly at a disadvantage at all and you don't even have to install any 
special software on the remote server. A blind person uses the exact 
same tools as a sighted person, ssh and gedit.

PS: That thing about not telling anyone what I said about orca is a joke.
On 05/21/14 08:10, Ian C. Bray via nfbcs wrote:
> John,
>
> Is there a huge learning curve?
> I'm a JAWS user, but know nothing of ORCA and your suggeted reader.
> Are ORCA & Yours similar to operate??
>
> Ian
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "John G. Heim via nfbcs" 
> <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> To: "NFB in Computer Science Mailing List" <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2014 1:49 PM
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Accessible UNIX / LINUX Help Request
>
>
>> In my opinion, the best talking distro out there is sonar linux. I 
>> don't know the URL, you can google that though. I was so impressed 
>> with sonar I installed it on my
>> machine at home. And I do linux support for a living. I have not 
>> tried the latest version though. They recently switched from basing 
>> their distro on linux to basing it on arch (I think).
>>
>> If you need something based on ubuntu, you can try vinux.
>>
>> There is currently a huge debate going on on the orca list about 
>> standardizing the key bindings to make it easier for users to switch 
>> from Windows to linux. It has gotten heated enough that I took myself 
>> off the list for a while. But I can virtually guarantee that there 
>> will be no changes. I was about the only one who even seemed to think 
>> it was worth considering. I'll admit that it would be wrong to change 
>> the orca keys to be like those of jaws. What I would hope for, 
>> though, it to get people to agree that if some standardization could 
>> be done, it would be a good thing. People won't even go for that. 
>> It's ridiculous, IMO.
>>
>>
>> On May 17, 2014, at 9:34 AM, Ian C. Bray via nfbcs wrote:
>>
>>> Is there anyone out there who can help me
>>> get an UBUNTU  box started so that it has some varriant of
>>> speech that functions simillarly to JAWS?
>>>
>>> I-- have no idea where to start with this.
>>>
>>> Tami Jarvis spoke to me about ORCA-- and I have only been diving 
>>> into my own SEMI-Professional Accessibility Needs recently.
>>>
>>> I have an ancient LAPTOP with 12.8 LTS on it, and I would like to 
>>> get back to my Unix / Linux Tinkering.
>>>
>>> Mentorship & off-line phone conversations & EMail Groups / Listservs 
>>> welcome.
>>> I do not do well in forums-- but I'm not saying I won't try.
>>>
>>> Respectfully,
>>>
>>> Ian  C. Bray
>>> Louisville, KY
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>>
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