[nfbcs] Mac with Windows Virtual Machine was RE: The Mac Beckens
Bryan Duarte
bjduarte at asu.edu
Mon Jan 18 16:52:36 UTC 2016
I have a boot camp partition on my Mac book air running Windows 10 and Jaws 17. I have no problems at all using jaws on my mac but when I use Windows on my Mac it is for very trivial processes. I typically only use the Windows side to operate my View Plus Braille embosser since they did not build drivers for the Mac.
I would purchase a VM such as Parallels but when I attempted to install it I found that it was completely inaccessible to install without being able to see the screen so I aborted that software. I found in the past that when I used a VM such as VMware Fusion when I was running Kali linux it was very difficult because there were commands required by Orca which triggered MacosX functionality causing me to exit the VM when I did not mean to. Basically I spent more time messing with the VM than I did using the functionality of the os I was trying to run. It is one thing to use a VM with a mouse where it is all point and clicks but when everything you do is a keyboard command where some are actual system commands it becomes very difficult for the system to keep track of what os you are using and what command it should use. I use partitions on my harddrive when I need to install another computer because it makes the os run as it should with no problems.
Go Devils!
Bryan Duarte
ASU Software Engineering Graduate Student
QwikEyes CEO
> On Jan 18, 2016, at 9:25 AM, luis Mendez via nfbcs <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>
> Virtual machine or Boot Camp. Each has its advantages. Although the feedback that I am getting subjects that running windows under Boot Camp is The more efficient approach because it eliminates work sharply reduces the memory constraints that one encounters running windows as a vertical machine.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Jan 18, 2016, at 10:48 AM, Nicole Torcolini <ntorcolini at wavecable.com> wrote:
>>
>> You mean a virtual machine? Several years ago, I tried that when I
>> was required to use a Mac at an internship. It did not work well because,
>> even when the maximum amount of memory was given to the vm, JAWS was
>> extremely sluggish. Has this improved recently? I have not tried it again
>> because I do not care for the Mac. As I already said, Apple seems to be in
>> no hurry to fix some of the VoiceOver bugs. I also do not like the way that
>> VoiceOver works compared to Windows modal screen readers and the fact that
>> many of the VoiceOver require pressing three or more keys.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: luis Mendez [mailto:lmendez716 at gmail.com]
>> Sent: Monday, January 18, 2016 5:53 AM
>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>> Cc: Nicole Torcolini
>> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] The Mac Beckens
>>
>> Good article. As for Mac versus Windows, if wou can afford to do so, buy
>> a Mac and install Windows on it. It also helps to get a dedicated Windows
>> keyboard. Thus equipped, you'll have the best of both environments.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>>> On Jan 17, 2016, at 2:55 PM, Nicole Torcolini via nfbcs <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Here is my opinion. I will use a Mac when hell freezes
>> over.
>>> What the devil is so much better about VoiceOver?
>>>
>>> Stop making empty claims without supporting them. Stop
>>> cherry picking the information that you want and ignoring the rest. As
>>> this article
>>> <http://qz.com/588126/theres-a-good-reason-americans-are-horrible-at-s
>>> cience /> says, stops using facts "much like a drunk uses a
>>>
>>> lamppost: for support, not illumination."
>>>
>>> VoiceOver has just as many, if not more, problems as
>>> other screen readers. I know because many of my coworkers use Macs,
>>> and Apple is introducing more bugs than they are fixing when it comes to
>> internet use.
>>> And they have no pressure to fix the bugs because, on the Mac, there
>>> is no competition.
>>>
>>> Microsoft has a screen reader; it is called Narrator. I
>>> have heard that it is better on newer versions of Windows, which I
>>> have not tried, but, from my experience, it does not work worth a
>>> damn. I know that Microsoft has some kind of deal with Windows Eyes,
>>> but it does not work well with complex websites. Also, if Microsoft
>>> will not even consider accessibility when making their products, and
>>> do stuff like put the ribbon everywhere, why would they be interested in
>> maintaining a screen reader?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Nicole
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Peter
>>> Donahue via nfbcs
>>> Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2016 11:25 PM
>>> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'
>>> Cc: Peter Donahue
>>> Subject: [nfbcs] The Mac Beckens
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Good morning everyone,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> If Microsoft would do with its Windows screen reader
>>> what Apple has done with the MAC and its iDevices perhaps we would
>>> have fewer issues with compatibility and accessibility tools could be
>>> kept up-to-date more easily and with little to no cost. Perhaps some
>>> MAC and iOS users could weigh in on this issue with the petition and
>>> share their experiences with accessing it under iOS and oSX. Perhaps
>>> in another few years we'll be 100% Mac and iOS users in this house-hold.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Peter Donahue
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>
>>> From: nfbcs [ <mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org>
>>> mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Christopher Chaltain via
>>> nfbcs
>>>
>>> Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2016 10:35 PM
>>>
>>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
>>>
>>> Cc: Christopher Chaltain
>>>
>>> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] NVDA and JAWS [was "Re: Petition Asking President
>>> Obama To Direct the JusticeDepartment to Issue ADA Internet
>>> Regulations"]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The idea that anything that's three years old is antiquated is incorrect.
>>>
>>> I'm sure quite a few people on this list are using Office2013 or
>>> Office 2010 if not something older. Microsoft and many companies
>>> support products for more than three years. People used Windows XP for ten
>> years and beyond.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I never saw anything on this list that the problem accessing this
>>> petition has to do with the version of JAWS being used. I get the
>>> impression that people using more recent versions of JAWS are experiencing
>> the same problem.
>>>
>>> In other words, I didn't see anything in this thread that JAWS 13
>>> can't do the job and can't be used affectively for all sorts of tasks.
>>> It seems to me that people are just jumping to conclusions and using
>>> this message to make a point rather than help a JAWS user solve their
>>> problem and submit this petition.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Obviously, I can't tell people what words they can and cannot use, but
>>> I think information can be provided in a more sympathetic tone. I'm
>>> sure most people running JAWS 13 would like to upgrade, and they don't
>>> need to have their faces rubbed in the fact that they can't afford an
>> update.
>>>
>>> No one may have intended to make anyone feel bad but communication is
>>> a two way street, and people need to take into account not just how
>>> their words are intended but how they may be received.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 16/01/16 22:08, Buddy Brannan via nfbcs wrote:
>>>>
>>>> The unfortunate reality is that you simply *can't* do everything with
>>>
>>>> one
>>>
>>> screen reader. There's certainly no reason not to have more than one
>>> if you can afford one, because NVDA is free software. Both definitions of
>> free.
>>>
>>> Window-Eyes is even no cost if you have Office 2010 or newer.
>>>
>>>
>>>> The other unfortunate reality is that Jaws 13.0 *is* antiquated, and
>>>
>>>> that
>>>
>>> isn't meant to make anyone feel bad, it's just a fact. You really
>>> can't use a three year old version of anything and expect it to behave
>>> correctly with something that's newer. It just isn't realistic.
>>>
>>>
>>>> --
>>>
>>>> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
>>>
>>>> Phone: 814-860-3194
>>>
>>>> Mobile: 814-431-0962
>>>
>>>> Email: <mailto:buddy at brannan.name> buddy at brannan.name
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>> On Jan 16, 2016, at 10:55 PM, Christopher Chaltain via nfbcs
>>>
>>> < <mailto:nfbcs at nfbnet.org> nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>> I agree that it's good to have NVDA in your tool box regardless of
>>>
>>>>> what
>>>
>>> version of JAWS you're running, but it isn't always possible for
>>> people to keep up with a product like JAWS, and using two different
>>> screen readers can be frustrating. I think it's OK to suggest JAWS,
>>> but there's no need to make anyone feel bad by calling the tools they can
>> afford to use "antiquated".
>>>
>>>
>>>>> On 16/01/16 15:18, Jude DaShiell via nfbcs wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> This is why when jaws users know they're not going to be able to
>>>
>>>>>> update jaws it's a good idea to have installed nvda to do the jobs
>>>
>>>>>> their antiquated version of jaws can no longer do.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, 16 Jan 2016, Mike Freeman via nfbcs wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>> Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2016 16:03:52
>>>
>>>>>>> From: Mike Freeman via nfbcs < <mailto:nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>>> nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>>>
>>>>>>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List <
>>>>>>> <mailto:nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>>> nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>>>
>>>>>>> Cc: Mike Freeman < <mailto:k7uij at panix.com> k7uij at panix.com>
>>>
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Petition Asking President Obama To Direct the
>>>
>>>>>>> JusticeDepartment to Issue ADA Internet Regulations
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>> excess ability does not imply backward compatibility. Your version
>>>
>>>>>>> of jaws is several versions out of date. I suspect it may be part
>>>
>>>>>>> of the problem.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>> Mike Freeman
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> On Jan 16, 2016, at 12:52, Jennifer Aberdeen via nfbcs
>>>
>>>>>>>> < <mailto:nfbcs at nfbnet.org> nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> Why is this patition not accessible? When I click on the submit
>>>
>>>>>>>> button, in different ways; enter, space, left mouse button on the
>>>
>>>>>>>> num pad, nothing happens.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm using jaws 13 with win 7 and IE 11.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> Jen
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Curtis Chong via nfbcs
>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2016 1:38 PM
>>>
>>>>>>>> To: <mailto:nfbcs at nfbnet.org> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>>>
>>>>>>>> Cc: Curtis Chong
>>>
>>>>>>>> Subject: [nfbcs] Petition Asking President Obama To Direct the
>>>
>>>>>>>> JusticeDepartment to Issue ADA Internet Regulations
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> Greetings:
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, January 12, 2016, the National Federation of the
>>>>>>>> Blind
>>>
>>>>>>>> launched a petition (the link to which is provided below) calling
>>>
>>>>>>>> on the Obama administration promptly to release the long-awaited
>>>
>>>>>>>> ADA internet regulations. On the 20th anniversary of the
>>>>>>>> Americans
>>>
>>>>>>>> with Disabilities Act (way back in 2010), President Obama said
>>>
>>>>>>>> that he would issue regulations implementing the requirement for
>>>
>>>>>>>> accessible websites, noting that they would be "the most
>>>>>>>> important
>>>
>>>>>>>> updates to the ADA since its original enactment."
>>>
>>>>>>>> President Obama now says that the regulations will not be
>>>>>>>> released
>>>
>>>>>>>> until 2018, after he leaves office.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> For those of who are blind, inaccessible websites can make it
>>>
>>>>>>>> impossible to apply for jobs, participate in online courses, or
>>>
>>>>>>>> conduct vital personal financial business. Website developers
>>>>>>>> need
>>>
>>>>>>>> guidance on how to comply with the law. Failing to provide that
>>>
>>>>>>>> guidance is irresponsible and inconsistent with President Obama's
>>>
>>>>>>>> expressed commitment to civil rights.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> If you are interested in signing the petition (and I hope you
>>>
>>>>>>>> are), point your browser to this link.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> <https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/direct-us-department-j
>>>>>>>> us>
>>> https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/direct-us-department-jus
>>>
>>>>>>>> tice-promp
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> tly-release-ada-internet-regulations
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> As an example of the need for these regulations, some JAWS users
>>>
>>>>>>>> running Internet Explorer have reported a problem with the "sign"
>>>
>>>>>>>> button when attempting to add their name. Here are some solutions
>>>
>>>>>>>> to help mitigate that problem.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> 1. Try routing the JAWS cursor to PC (Insert+Numpad
>>>
>>>>>>>> Minus), and
>>>
>>>>>>>> pressing the left mouse button (Numpad Slash), and the "sign"
>>>
>>>>>>>> button will be selected.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> 2. Alternatively, you can sign the petition using the
>>>
>>> Mozilla
>>>
>>>>>>>> Firefox browser.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> The petition is reported to be accessible using iOS devices such
>>>
>>>>>>>> as the iPad or iPhone.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> Cordially,
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> Curtis Chong, President
>>>
>>>>>>>> National Federation of the Blind in Computer Science
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>>>>>> nfbcs mailing list
>>>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:nfbcs at nfbnet.org> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>>>
>>>>>>>> <http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org>
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>>>
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>
>>>>>>>> for
>>>
>>>>>>>> nfbcs:
>>>
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>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/freespirit328%4
>>>
>>>>>>>> 0gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> ---
>>>
>>>>>>>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>>>
>>>>>>>> <https://www.avast.com/antivirus> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>>>>>> nfbcs mailing list
>>>
>>>>>>>> <mailto:nfbcs at nfbnet.org> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>>>
>>>>>>>> <http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org>
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>>>
>>>>>>>> nfbcs:
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>>>>>>>> .c>
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/k7uij%40panix.c
>>>
>>>>>>>> om
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>>>>> nfbcs mailing list
>>>
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>>>
>>>>>>> <http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org>
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>>>>>>> nfbcs:
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>>>>>>> ix>
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/jdashiel%40panix
>>>
>>>>>>> .com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>> --
>>>
>>>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>
>>>>> chaltain at Gmail
>>>
>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>>> nfbcs mailing list
>>>
>>>>> <mailto:nfbcs at nfbnet.org> nfbcs at nfbnet.org
>>>
>>>>> <http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org>
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
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>>>>> for
>>>
>>> nfbcs:
>>>
>>>>> <http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.
>>>>> na>
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.na
>>>
>>>>> me
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>>> nfbcs mailing list
>>>
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>>>
>>>> <http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org>
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>>>
>>> nfbcs:
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>>>> co>
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/chaltain%40gmail.co
>>>
>>>> m
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Christopher (CJ)
>>>
>>> chaltain at Gmail
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
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>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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