[nfbcs] Help for older students

Wed Jul 20 20:21:42 UTC 2016

School doesn't guarantee you will get a job or internship at the end.

-----Original Message-----
From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Bryan Schulz via
nfbcs
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2016 4:11 PM
To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Bryan Schulz <b.schulz at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Help for older students

Hi,

The thing is college was about 20 years ago and nothing came of the promises
with placement or a second so called guarantee after completing a
specialized programming program graded by it managers.
Bryan

-----Original Message-----
From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cricket Bidleman
via nfbcs
Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2016 2:51 PM
To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
Cc: Cricket Bidleman; Bryan Schulz
Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Help for older students

Hi,

Allow me to remind you that an intern can be an older student as well.
Anyone in education. If you're in grad school, apply to the internship if
you want to. That announcement did not talk about age limits. In addition,
there will be jobs available. No age restrictions there.

On 7/20/16, Bryan Schulz via nfbcs <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Just another example along with the nfb focus on stem workshops was 
> the post about nasa interns.
> Bryan
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tracy 
> Carcione via nfbcs
> Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2016 1:20 PM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'
> Cc: Tracy Carcione
> Subject: [nfbcs] Help for older students
>
> Hi Brian S.
> I understand your frustration.  I think it's very difficult for an 
> older person to find any kind of tech job.  Companies figure an older 
> person won't be up on the latest whatever, and they'd rather pay some 
> young person peanuts and work them 20-hour days.  Me, I have other 
> things to do than work, and I have expenses, and need health 
> insurance.
> I think what people are discussing would help anyone trying to learn a 
> new language, or make a career change, but I think there are other 
> systemic social problems hitting older people looking for something 
> better than unskilled work.
> Tracy
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Bryan 
> Schulz
via
> nfbcs
> Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2016 1:55 PM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'
> Cc: Bryan Schulz
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Future goals for the division
>
> Hi,
>
> I would like info and thoughts of how older people can get into 
> cs/help desk jobs and am so sick of the nfb only being interested in 
> young students.
> The situation of someone going down the technical college road and 
> only ending up with an associates degree isn't fun and gaining certs 
> hasn't helped at all.
> Bryan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kathryn 
> Webster via nfbcs
> Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2016 12:20 PM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List'
> Cc: Kathryn Webster; 'Jim Barbour'
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Future goals for the division
>
> Debee and all,
>
> 	I would be exceedingly interested in contributing to this. I'd like 
> to echo Jim's suggestion of a wiki as that would be easy to maintain,
edit,
> and expand.
> In terms of publicity, I'm eager to take the lead on marketing any new 
> intiatives to help blind students through our master database and website.
> Collaboration amongst divisions is a significant goal of mine, and I 
> see the CS Division as an ideal place to continue that effort. Our 
> student
division
> leaders, particularly Bryan Duarte and myself, are both very in touch 
> with CS and student issues, so there is some place for us to start.
> If our CS Division leadership chooses to move forward with this idea,
count
> me in on all accounts. I am more than happy to help with whatever is 
> necessary in kickstarting this effort.
>
> What a fabulous idea!
>
> Best,
> Kathryn
>
> Kathryn Webster
> President | National Association of Blind Students
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbcs [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jim Barbour 
> via nfbcs
> Sent: Wednesday, July 20, 2016 1:07 PM
> To: Deborah Armstrong via nfbcs
> Cc: Jim Barbour
> Subject: Re: [nfbcs] Future goals for the division
>
> I think Debee has a great idea.  I actually think it's a very good 
> application for a wiki.
>
> One person won't know everything about what is accessible and what 
> isn't, even in the developer and IT focused worlds.
>
> If we agree, I'd be happy to work with Curtis W on setting up a wiki 
> and start populating it.  I'd like to hear from folks that we think 
> this is worth collaborating on.
>
> Jim
>
> On Wed, Jul 20, 2016 at 04:54:45PM +0000, Deborah Armstrong via nfbcs
> wrote:
>> >I'm interested in hearing from folks on this list about things 
>> >they'd
> like to see the NFB in Computer Science do in the future
>> I'm changing the subject line so people won't skip over it.
>>
>> I think one of the most crucial things is to put together an online 
>> paper,
> that is updated regularly, that spells out what one needs to know to 
> get started in any computer science related field. This would be 
> different
from
> what sighted people need to know; it would focus on which current 
> tools
are
> accessible, which aren't, and include the resources such as books or
online
> training that were discussed over in the other thread.
>>
>> I work at a college, and I know new blind students get stymied by the
> simplest things because they lack experience and so do their sighted 
> helpers. For example, I heard of a student who dropped a Linux class 
> which was all command-line based, because the rest of the class was 
> using telnet built in to Windows to log in to the class server. Not 
> sure why they used anything this insecure, but I wasn't administering 
> that system and heard about it third-hand. And JAWS was not accurately 
> reading what appeared onscreen, nor was it tracking the cursor when 
> the student tried to use Emacs. As a Linux-head I had to laugh a bit 
> about the ignorance that lead the student and his professor to 
> conclude the coursework was inaccessible, but it's not a laughing 
> matter, when a beginner doesn't know where to
turn.
>
>>
>> The document could have sections: What you need to know to Learn C++"
>> or
> "What you need to know in your first Visual Basic Class" etc.
>>
>> I also think we need to nail down and possibly explain the reasons 
>> behind
> the inaccessibility of many current tools. For example, if the QT4 
> library is used in creating interfaces, screen readers only partially 
> identify or even recognize the existence of controls. If in learning 
> SQL the
difference
> between inner joins and outer joins is explained through the use of 
> diagrams only, then it's not going to make sense to any blind student. 
> That caused me, an experience programmer to drop a course just last 
> year. I would have loved to be able to find a paper that outlined 
> where I could go to locate
a
> book that explained these concepts in plain English.
>>
>> Another thought about UML: wild idea here, but how about digital 
>> tactile
> diagrams of the symbols that could be embossed? I know different 
> embossers have different codes for doing graphics, but someone who 
> knows more about this than I could perhaps take the lead here. A 
> student could simply
emboss
> the shapes, or get their school to do it, and then using post-it note 
> glue which comes in sticks, post their charts on a classroom wall, 
> doing homework along with a sighted class.
>>
>> One way in which I can contribute is writing, and I'd be happy to 
>> take the
> lead on that part.
>>
>> --Debee
>>
>>
>>
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>
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