[NFBCS] Accessibility for programmers

Tue Feb 25 23:05:35 UTC 2020

To be clear, I did not mean to imply that the NFBCS was nothing more 
than an email list. I genuinely did not know that it was a group within 
the NFB with a President and everything. I have to say though, I've been 
on this list for about 25 years and I do not recall ever seeing a 
message on this list from the NFBCS itself. I mean I do not recall ever 
seeing a message from one of it's officers saying, "Hi, I'm one of the 
officers of the NFBCS and this is what we are working on this year."

I would hope the officers of the NFBCS would be thrilled to see this 
spontaneous outpouring of enthusiasm. But it would be fair for them to 
say "When you say we should do this or that, you mean you're willing to 
lead that team, right?" Most of the time when people say we should do 
this or we should do that, they mean somebody else should do it.

But I have all kinds of ideas. Googling the NFBCS gives you nothing. It 
needs a web site. Does the NFB have a Zoom account? If so, we should set 
up some webinars. I'd be willing to do one on training yourself to be a 
Linux systems administrator. We could do one on VMware. Using an IDE.

I do not feel it is my place to tell the officers of the NFBCS how to 
deal with reports of accessibility problems. I would just point out that 
someone representing the National Federation of the Blind could probably 
call a company and set up a teleconference meeting between developers 
and  blind end users. I mean, if someone from the NFB called up a 
company and said, "We would like to have your developers talk to some 
blind users of your products," the company would probably listen.

On 2/25/20 4:28 PM, Kevin via NFBCS wrote:
> How shall we mobilize?
> 
> 
> On 2/25/2020 5:06 PM, Bryan Schulz via NFBCS wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I offered the suggestion that it would be nice if the cs division could
>> address/fix the problem of Microsoft exams through certiport and a cisco
>> networking program called packet tracer not being accessible and there 
>> was
>> NO interest!
>> So yes, I agree the group isn't much more than an email list!
>> Bryan
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Rasmussen, Lloyd via
>> NFBCS
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2020 2:54 PM
>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>> Cc: Rasmussen, Lloyd <lras at loc.gov>
>> Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Accessibility for programmers
>>
>> Speaking as a former board member:
>> The NFB in Computer Science is a division of the national 
>> organization. When
>> it was formed, probably in 1976, its primary emphasis and membership 
>> was for
>> programmers of all types. As the years went by, more and more
>> non-programmers needed to use computers, and the focus drifted 
>> somewhat away
>> from programming and toward user interface problems.
>> The NFBCS has one meeting per year, as part of the NFB national 
>> convention.
>> About a hundred people show up.
>> Curtis Willoughby was president of NFBCS for many years. In more recent
>> years, Curtis Chong was the president. The president now is Jim 
>> Barbour, who
>> sometimes posts to this listserv.
>> The NFBCS listserv is a primary communication vehicle between 
>> conventions.
>> Programming and access to programming tools continues to be a major 
>> emphasis
>> at NFBCS meetings, and the officers are always looking for suggestions.
>> I hope this clarifies things even a little.
>>
>> Lloyd Rasmussen, Senior Staff Engineer
>> National Library Service for the Blind and Print Disabled Library of
>> Congress, Washington, DC 20542
>> 202-707-0535     https://nls.loc.gov
>> The preceding opinions are my own and not necessarily those of the 
>> Library
>> of Congress, NLS.
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Jack Heim via NFBCS
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2020 3:35 PM
>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>> Cc: Jack Heim <john at johnheim.com>
>> Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Accessibility for programmers
>>
>> I don't know what the NFBCS is other than an email list.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2/25/20 12:16 PM, Peter Donahue via NFBCS wrote:
>>> Hello everyone,
>>>
>>>     Isn't this supposed to be something the NFB in Computer Science is
>>> addressing?
>>>
>>> Peter Donahue
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via
>>> NFBCS
>>> Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2020 10:08 AM
>>> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
>>> Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
>>> Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Accessibility for programmers
>>>
>>> Jack, I agree with everything you said.  I'm willing to help as best I
>> can.
>>> I should have more time soon, as I get backwatered.
>>> Tracy
>>>
>>>> Yeah, I think if the NFB got behind a group for blind IT
>>>> professionals, we might be able to do some good. As I said, I tried
>>>> to get something like that started independently but it fizzled out.
>>>> Here is a list of the goals of that organization.
>>>>
>>>> 1. Communicate with hardware & software manufacturers about
>>>> accessibility problems. If their new router software has
>>>> accessibility issues, does Cisco even know it? Lets make sure they do.
>>>>
>>>> 2. Help current IT professionals avoid being "backwatered". (I
>>>> personally coined that phrase). Getting backwatered is my term for
>>>> being stuck in a job dealing with obsolete technology because its
>>>> what has always been accessible -- until its not. Your skills get
>>>> narrower and narrower. You don't get to play with the new stuff
>>>> because its not accessible.  These are huge problems in a very
>> competitive job market.
>>>> 3. Provide a place for IT professionals to exchange knowledge of how
>>>> to deal with accessibility issues. All of us know tricks to get
>>>> around accessibility problems. I am sure that by now, many blind IT
>>>> professionals have missed out on an opportunity when there was a
>>>> workaround they didn't even know about.
>>>>
>>>> 4. Encourage young people to consider information technology and comp
>>>> sci as a career. With the right education and tools, a person can
>>>> earn a place in one of the most sought after and highly paid
>>>> professions available to a blind person. Not to diss musician or
>>>> massage therapist but IT pays better and there are more jobs.
>>>>
>>>> On 2/25/20 9:10 AM, Tracy Carcione via NFBCS wrote:
>>>>> When I was complaining about 32    70 accessibility a couple weeks 
>>>>> ago,
>>>>> some
>>>>> people seemed to say that it was because 3270 emulation is old and
>>>>> not used so much anymore.  I see that.  I know I'm a bit of a 
>>>>> dinosaur.
>>>>> But this morning, I thought I saw an opportunity to start moving out
>>>>> of the old legacy system and into another system supported by my
>>>>> group.  I asked my boss about the possibilities, and he said that
>>>>> that would be fine, except that system has a lot of Citrix-hosted
>>>>> applications, and we know making Jaws and Citrix play together is a
>>>>> real
>>> pain.
>>>>> Citrix is common as dirt.  I think my whole IT department uses it a
>>>>> lot, but not me.  I know how to get Jaws to work with it, but it
>>>>> takes quite a bit of coordination, and, if that coordination is with
>>>>> outside vendors, it's even more complicated.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think Jack is right.  We of NFBCS should be working on
>>>>> accessibility for programmers.  I don't know what that would entail,
>>>>> but I think we need to do it, or we'll have more and more problems.
>>>>> The things we need access to are a lot more complicated than Granny
>>>>> getting her email.
>>>>> Now, please, tell me I'm all wet, and there are simple solutions to
>>>>> my problems.
>>>>> Tracy
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>> m
>>>>>
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>>>> et
>>>>
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>>>
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