From startrektech at techie.com  Wed Dec  1 08:23:52 2021
From: startrektech at techie.com (Marvin Hunkin)
Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2021 18:53:52 +1030
Subject: [NFBCS] linux talking installer
Message-ID: <00a201d7e68c$c84f0230$58ed0690$@techie.com>

Hi. Any linux on this group can help. Need to do an assignment and got vm
ware player. Need a talking linux iso, and also documentation how to use the
orca screen reader, and need the gui desktop. As need to do screen shots to
install it, and then import the screen shots into a report for my trainer.
Can you help.

Thanks.

Marvin.




From tommym2006 at gmail.com  Wed Dec  1 11:37:07 2021
From: tommym2006 at gmail.com (Tom Moore)
Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2021 06:37:07 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] linux talking installer
In-Reply-To: <00a201d7e68c$c84f0230$58ed0690$@techie.com>
References: <00a201d7e68c$c84f0230$58ed0690$@techie.com>
Message-ID: <016401d7e6a7$c59c9820$50d5c860$@gmail.com>

Hi,
Check out Slint Linux.
This is probably the most accessible distro out there that contains multiple
screen reader options for both the console and gui.

Other than this there is Debian that has a console that talks well.
There are probably other distributions out there, but a lot of them are
outdated and not actively maintained.

Tom

-----Original Message-----
From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Marvin Hunkin via NFBCS
Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 2021 3:24 AM
To: nfbcs at nfbnet.org
Cc: Marvin Hunkin <startrektech at techie.com>
Subject: [NFBCS] linux talking installer

Hi. Any linux on this group can help. Need to do an assignment and got vm
ware player. Need a talking linux iso, and also documentation how to use the
orca screen reader, and need the gui desktop. As need to do screen shots to
install it, and then import the screen shots into a report for my trainer.
Can you help.

Thanks.

Marvin.



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From paul at yorkfamily.com  Wed Dec  1 15:54:24 2021
From: paul at yorkfamily.com (Paul York)
Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2021 10:54:24 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] linux talking installer
In-Reply-To: <00a201d7e68c$c84f0230$58ed0690$@techie.com>
References: <00a201d7e68c$c84f0230$58ed0690$@techie.com>
Message-ID: <CAMwL28++5Ob=kwJQ80H1vEMYTM-wLnO6uG6tyvN0jh7BU+eVTg@mail.gmail.com>

Haven't tried it personally (for me, Linux is to be tolerated, not
embraced), but "Accessible Coconut" is based on Ubuntu 20.04 and appears
mostly up to date. Slint unfortunately appears to have gone dormant. :(

Accessible-Coconut download | SourceForge.net
<https://sourceforge.net/projects/accessible-coconut/>

Will be curious to hear your thoughts on it if it works for you.

On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 3:25 AM Marvin Hunkin via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
wrote:

> Hi. Any linux on this group can help. Need to do an assignment and got vm
> ware player. Need a talking linux iso, and also documentation how to use
> the
> orca screen reader, and need the gui desktop. As need to do screen shots to
> install it, and then import the screen shots into a report for my trainer.
> Can you help.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Marvin.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/paul%40yorkfamily.com
>

From maurice.mines at gmail.com  Wed Dec  1 17:04:53 2021
From: maurice.mines at gmail.com (Maurice A. Mines)
Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2021 09:04:53 -0800
Subject: [NFBCS] linux talking installer
In-Reply-To: <CAMwL28++5Ob=kwJQ80H1vEMYTM-wLnO6uG6tyvN0jh7BU+eVTg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <00a201d7e68c$c84f0230$58ed0690$@techie.com>
 <CAMwL28++5Ob=kwJQ80H1vEMYTM-wLnO6uG6tyvN0jh7BU+eVTg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <29f2aad7-7ff8-fbc7-02eb-5cacc911b78b@gmail.com>

Good morning, I downloaded the accessible coconut distribution and was 
unable to get it installed into a parallels virtual machine. So what I'm 
thinking I'm going to do is install Ubuntu, then add orca. And see how 
well this works. If anyone has any advice regarding watch distribution 
works in a parallels virtual machine running on a 2020 Intel MacBook Pro 
I'd be certainly happy to read your thoughts. I probably won't get a 
chance to do this until after the end of next week however yes final 
exams first. Then do something different for a while after. Any thoughts?


Just be aware I'm dictating this to the computer in Windows using 
dictation software. So if there's something written above that you 
absolutely don't understand, please reach out to me and asked me what my 
original intent may have been? I look forward to clearing up in the 
misunderstandings that might arise as a result of what I've written 
above. Thank you very much for reading this.



On 12/1/2021 7:54 AM, Paul York via NFBCS wrote:
> Haven't tried it personally (for me, Linux is to be tolerated, not
> embraced), but "Accessible Coconut" is based on Ubuntu 20.04 and appears
> mostly up to date. Slint unfortunately appears to have gone dormant. :(
>
> Accessible-Coconut download | SourceForge.net
> <https://sourceforge.net/projects/accessible-coconut/>
>
> Will be curious to hear your thoughts on it if it works for you.
>
> On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 3:25 AM Marvin Hunkin via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi. Any linux on this group can help. Need to do an assignment and got vm
>> ware player. Need a talking linux iso, and also documentation how to use
>> the
>> orca screen reader, and need the gui desktop. As need to do screen shots to
>> install it, and then import the screen shots into a report for my trainer.
>> Can you help.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Marvin.
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> NFBCS mailing list
>> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> NFBCS:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/paul%40yorkfamily.com
>>
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/maurice.mines%40gmail.com


From gtwocher at gmail.com  Wed Dec  1 18:23:56 2021
From: gtwocher at gmail.com (Greg Wocher)
Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2021 13:23:56 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] linux talking installer
In-Reply-To: <CAMwL28++5Ob=kwJQ80H1vEMYTM-wLnO6uG6tyvN0jh7BU+eVTg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <00a201d7e68c$c84f0230$58ed0690$@techie.com>
 <CAMwL28++5Ob=kwJQ80H1vEMYTM-wLnO6uG6tyvN0jh7BU+eVTg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <D0660FDE-3C4C-4A39-8D11-AAA08CFBD975@gmail.com>

Hello,
slint is very much alive and well. There is a very active email list for the slint distrobution. You can find out more information at the following link:
https://slint.fr/doc/HandBook.html

Greg Wocher
> On Dec 1, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Paul York via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Haven't tried it personally (for me, Linux is to be tolerated, not
> embraced), but "Accessible Coconut" is based on Ubuntu 20.04 and appears
> mostly up to date. Slint unfortunately appears to have gone dormant. :(
> 
> Accessible-Coconut download | SourceForge.net
> <https://sourceforge.net/projects/accessible-coconut/>
> 
> Will be curious to hear your thoughts on it if it works for you.
> 
> On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 3:25 AM Marvin Hunkin via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
> 
>> Hi. Any linux on this group can help. Need to do an assignment and got vm
>> ware player. Need a talking linux iso, and also documentation how to use
>> the
>> orca screen reader, and need the gui desktop. As need to do screen shots to
>> install it, and then import the screen shots into a report for my trainer.
>> Can you help.
>> 
>> Thanks.
>> 
>> Marvin.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> NFBCS mailing list
>> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> NFBCS:
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/paul%40yorkfamily.com
>> 
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/gtwocher%40gmail.com



From charleseblack126 at gmail.com  Mon Dec  6 00:54:49 2021
From: charleseblack126 at gmail.com (charleseblack126 at gmail.com)
Date: Sun, 5 Dec 2021 19:54:49 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] linux talking installer
In-Reply-To: <29f2aad7-7ff8-fbc7-02eb-5cacc911b78b@gmail.com>
References: <00a201d7e68c$c84f0230$58ed0690$@techie.com>
 <CAMwL28++5Ob=kwJQ80H1vEMYTM-wLnO6uG6tyvN0jh7BU+eVTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <29f2aad7-7ff8-fbc7-02eb-5cacc911b78b@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <069501d7ea3b$df7a1910$9e6e4b30$@gmail.com>

Install Ubuntu, has speech, press windows+alt+s to activate. You may have to
activate it after installation but then should be active throughout usage.
Black, Charles E. MS. Charleseblack126 at gmail.com -----Original Message-----
From: NFBCS On Behalf Of Maurice A. Mines via NFBCS Sent: Wednesday,
December 1, 2021 12:05 PM To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List Cc:
Maurice A. Mines ; Marvin Hunkin Subject: Re: [NFBCS] linux talking
installer Good morning, I downloaded the accessible coconut distribution and
was unable to get it installed into a parallels virtual machine. So what I'm
thinking I'm going to do is install Ubuntu, then add orca. And see how well
this works. If anyone has any advice regarding watch distribution works in a
parallels virtual machine running on a 2020 Intel MacBook Pro I'd be
certainly happy to read your thoughts. I probably won't get a chance to do
this until after the end of next week however yes final exams first. Then do
something different for a while after. Any thoughts? Just be aware I'm
dictating this to the computer in Windows using dictation software. So if
there's something written above that you absolutely don't understand, please
reach out to me and asked me what my original intent may have been? I look
forward to clearing up in the misunderstandings that might arise as a result
of what I've written above. Thank you very much for reading this. On
12/1/2021 7:54 AM, Paul York via NFBCS wrote: > Haven't tried it personally
(for me, Linux is to be tolerated, not > embraced), but "Accessible Coconut"
is based on Ubuntu 20.04 and > appears mostly up to date. Slint
unfortunately appears to have gone > dormant. :( > > Accessible-Coconut
download | SourceForge.net > > > Will be curious to hear your thoughts on it
if it works for you. > > On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 3:25 AM Marvin Hunkin via
NFBCS > > wrote: > >> Hi. Any linux on this group can help. Need to do an
assignment and >> got vm ware player. Need a talking linux iso, and also
documentation >> how to use the orca screen reader, and need the gui
desktop. As need >> to do screen shots to install it, and then import the
screen shots >> into a report for my trainer. >> Can you help. >> >> Thanks.
>> >> Marvin. >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >>
NFBCS mailing list >> NFBCS at nfbnet.org >>
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org >> To unsubscribe,
change your list options or get your account info for >> NFBCS: >>
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/paul%40yorkfamily. >> com
>> > _______________________________________________ > NFBCS mailing list >
NFBCS at nfbnet.org > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org > To
unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS: >
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/maurice.mines%40gma >
il.com _______________________________________________ NFBCS mailing list
NFBCS at nfbnet.org http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org To
unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/charleseblack126%40gmail.
com Scanned by McAfee and confirmed virus-free. Find out more here:
https://bit.ly/2zCJMrO




From carcione at access.net  Wed Dec  8 21:24:04 2021
From: carcione at access.net (Tracy Carcione)
Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2021 16:24:04 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] Teamviewer
Message-ID: <00e001d7ec79$ed840850$c88c18f0$@access.net>

Lately when I start Teamviewer, I can tab to the ID and password fields, but
I can't move either my braille display or the Jaws cursor to them to read
them.  I tried maximizing the screen, but that didn't work, either.  

When I try routing Jaws to PC, all it says is "Teamviewer".  

Is there a trick I'm missing?

This machine is running Jaws 2021 and Win7.

Tracy

 


From aruell at comcast.net  Thu Dec  9 06:36:13 2021
From: aruell at comcast.net (Amy Ruell)
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2021 01:36:13 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] Teamviewer
In-Reply-To: <00e001d7ec79$ed840850$c88c18f0$@access.net>
References: <00e001d7ec79$ed840850$c88c18f0$@access.net>
Message-ID: <B7E7DFE5-855D-4F88-9876-A9DE14A31218@comcast.net>

I have the exact same experience. If I need help now, I instruct people who are assisting to use quick assist, which is built into the windows operating system and is accessible.
Amy

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 8, 2021, at 4:25 PM, Tracy Carcione via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> ?Lately when I start Teamviewer, I can tab to the ID and password fields, but
> I can't move either my braille display or the Jaws cursor to them to read
> them.  I tried maximizing the screen, but that didn't work, either.  
> 
> When I try routing Jaws to PC, all it says is "Teamviewer".  
> 
> Is there a trick I'm missing?
> 
> This machine is running Jaws 2021 and Win7.
> 
> Tracy
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/aruell%40comcast.net



From lacy925 at gmail.com  Mon Dec 13 01:58:51 2021
From: lacy925 at gmail.com (Amanda Lacy)
Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2021 19:58:51 -0600
Subject: [NFBCS] Switching out of S mode
In-Reply-To: <009c01d7e53e$0bd63640$2382a2c0$@access.net>
References: <009c01d7e53e$0bd63640$2382a2c0$@access.net>
Message-ID: <04ADC244-3991-4B64-A67A-6B9D2DC6D86B@gmail.com>

This was so easy - I just had to know about S mode to turn it off. I laughed at the warnings it gave me about how dangerous it could be to run applications from outside of the Microsoft Store. - as iff all the programs we?ve used for decades had suddenly turned against us. Anyway, I hope my brother likes the computer.

> On Nov 29, 2021, at 10:27 AM, Tracy Carcione via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> I found instructions from Microsoft Support telling how to turn off S mode in Windows 11.  Good to know about this potential problem, and how to fix it.  Here they are:
> 
> Windows 11 in S mode is designed for security and performance, exclusively running apps from the Microsoft Store. If you want to install an app that isn't
> 
> available in the Microsoft Store, you'll need to switch out of S mode. 
> 
> Windows 11 in S mode is only available in the Windows 11 Home edition.  If you have the Pro, Enterprise, or Education editions of Windows 10 in S mode,
> 
> Windows Update will not offer Windows 11 because S mode is not available in those editions of Windows 11.  Therefore, if you have the Pro, Enterprise or
> 
> Education editions of Windows 10 in S mode, you'll need to switch out of S mode to upgrade to Windows 11.
> 
> Switching out of S mode is one-way. If you make the switch, you won't be able to go back to Windows 10 or Windows 11 in S mode. There's no charge to switch
> 
> out of S mode.
> 
> list of 3 items
> 
> 1. On your PC running Windows 11 in S mode, open Settings ? > System ? > Activation.
> 
> 2. In the Switch to Windows 11 Pro section, select Go to the Store. (If you also see an "Upgrade your edition of Windows" section, be careful not to click
> 
> the "Go to the Store" link that appears there.)
> 
> 3. On the Switch out of S mode (or similar) page that appears in the Microsoft Store, select the Get button. After you see a confirmation message on the
> 
> page, you'll be able to install apps from outside of the Microsoft Store.
> 
> list end
> 
> 
> 
> Tracy
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/lacy925%40gmail.com



From angalletta at ieee.org  Mon Dec 13 07:29:21 2021
From: angalletta at ieee.org (angalletta at ieee.org)
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2021 02:29:21 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] The 6th IEEE International Conference on Fog and Edge
 Computing (ICFEC 2022)
Message-ID: <CAN9y1QKM7u_fRWKYcswKHBkrv7wOYs99EZFh0p=SjSvh=f+Wyw@mail.gmail.com>

Dear users of Nfbcs mailing list,

===================================================================================
The 6th IEEE International Conference on Fog and Edge Computing (ICFEC 2022)

May 16, 2022, Taormina (Messina), Italy

in conjunction with IEEE/ACM CCGrid 2022

URL: https://icfec2022.eecis.udel.edu/
===================================================================================
We are delighted to invite you to the 6th IEEE International Conference on
Fog and Edge Computing to be held in Taormina (Messina), Italy.

INTRODUCTION
The number of Internet-of-Things (IoT) devices is predicted to reach 38.6
billion by 2025. These connected devices, ranging from user devices to more
complex systems, such as vehicles and power grids, are equipped with
sensing, actuating, communication, processing, and storage capabilities,
and they generate huge amounts of data of various types. However, the need
to operate the scale of heterogeneous IoT devices while being
performance-efficient in real-time is challenging. Typically, the data
generated by the IoT devices are transferred to and processed centrally by
services hosted on geographically distant clouds. This is untenable given
the communication latency incurred and the ingress bandwidth demand.
A new and disruptive paradigm spear-headed by academics and industry
experts is taking shape so that applications can leverage resources located
at the edge of the network and along the continuum between the cloud and
the edge. These edge resources may be geographically or in the network
topology closer to IoT devices, such as home routers, gateways, or more
substantial micro data centers. Edge resources may be used to offload
selected services from the cloud to accelerate an application or to host
edge-native applications. The paradigm within which the edge is harnessed
is referred to as ???Fog/Edge computing?? .

The Fog/Edge computing paradigm is expected to improve the agility of
service deployments, to allow the usage of opportunistic and cheap
computing, and to leverage the network latency and bandwidth diversities
between these resources. Numerous challenges arise when using edge
resources, which require the re-examination of operating systems,
virtualization and containers, and middleware techniques for fabric
management. New abstractions and extensions to current programming and
storage models are necessary to allow developers to design novel
applications that can benefit from massively distributed and data-driven
edge systems. Addressing security, privacy, and trust of the edge resources
is of paramount importance while managing the resources and context of
mobile, transient and hardware-constrained resources. The integration of
edge computing and 5G will also bring new opportunities and unique
challenges. Enabling machine/deep learning at the edge is critical for many
applications. Lastly, emerging domains like autonomous vehicles and smart
health need to be supported by fog and edge resources.


CALL FOR PAPERS
The conference seeks to attract high-quality contributions covering both
theory and practice over systems research and emerging domain-specific
applications related to next-generation distributed systems that use the
edge and the fog. Some representative topics of interest include, but are
not limited to:

* Data centers and infrastructures for fog/edge computing
* Mobility management in fog/edge computing
* Distributed and federated machine learning in the fog and on the edge
* 5G and fog/edge computing
* Middleware and runtime systems for fog/edge infrastructures
* Programming models for fog/edge computing
* Storage and data management platforms for fog/edge computing
* Scheduling and resource management for fog/edge infrastructures
* Security, privacy, trust and provenance issues in fog/edge computing
* Distributed consensus and blockchains at the edge and in the fog
* Modeling and simulation of fog/edge environments
* Performance monitoring and metering of fog/edge infrastructures
* Innovative, latency-sensitive and locality-critical applications of
fog/edge computing


SUBMISSION INSTRUCTIONS
We invite original manuscripts that have neither been published elsewhere
nor are under review at a different venue. Papers should follow the IEEE
template for conference proceedings. Authors should submit papers, written
in English, electronically in PDF format and may not exceed 8 letter-size
pages in length, including all figures, tables, and references. All
manuscripts will be reviewed and judged on originality, technical strength,
significance, presentation, and relevance to the conference by at least
three reviewers.
Papers may be submitted online at
https://easychair.org/conferences/?conf=icfec22

IMPORTANT DATES
* Paper submissions: January 7, 2022
* Notifications: February 13, 2022
* Camera-ready due: March 6, 2022


PUBLICATION
Papers that are accepted for publication may be accepted as REGULAR paper
(8 pages) or SHORT papers (5 pages), depending on the reviewer
recommendations. Accepted papers will be included in the conference
proceedings that will be published through the IEEE Computer Society
Conference Publishing Services.


ORGANIZATION
General Chairs
* Yogesh Simmhan, Indian Institute of Science, India
* Blesson Varghese, Queen's University Belfast, UK

Program Chairs
* Stefan Schulte, Hamburg University of Technology, Germany (
stefan.schulte at tuhh.de)
* Lena Mashayekhy, University of Delaware, USA (mlena at udel.edu)

Steering Committee:
* Rajkumar Buyya, University of Melbourne, Australia
* Adrian Lebre, INRIA, France
* Omer Rana, Cardiff University, UK
* Haiying Shen, University of Virginia, USA
* Yogesh Simmhan, Indian Institute of Science, India
* Anthony Simonet, iExec Blockchain Tech, France
* Blesson Varghese, Queen's University Belfast, UK
* Massimo Villari, University of Messina, Italy

From maurice at maurice-amines.com  Wed Dec 15 23:34:31 2021
From: maurice at maurice-amines.com (maurice mines)
Date: Wed, 15 Dec 2021 15:34:31 -0800
Subject: [NFBCS] I am in need of some help finding a binary installable real
 TTY package for Ubuntu 2110
Message-ID: <a540012b-6940-d89b-30ed-5bf9945a928e@maurice-amines.com>

good afternoon everyone the reason why I am looking for a binary 
distribution of braille TTY, is because unfortunately I cannot hear that 
robotic voice that is then orca. So the only good solution for me is to 
of course braille TTY. But if you can't hear the robotic voice well 
enough to do will make install etc. when asked to come up with an 
alternative technique to get braille TTY installed. I think it would be 
helpful if someone else and we figured out how to get this compiled and 
turn it into something that could be installed with relatively little 
typing since I can hear upon typing correctly. The braille display I'm 
using is the brilliant BI 40 X. Any thoughts on the best way to solve 
this conundrum?


Please be aware that I am dictating this to the computer so hopefully my 
email turned out okay. Thank you all for reading this in advance. Be 
well and have a great holiday season.



-- 
maurice Mines
Maurice mines.
Board member, National Federation of the blind deaf blind division.
Vice president National Federation a of the blind of California Bakersfield chapter.
Amateur radio call sign kd0iko.
Direct phone number,  661-241-3788



From angalletta at ieee.org  Thu Dec 16 10:55:45 2021
From: angalletta at ieee.org (angalletta at ieee.org)
Date: Thu, 16 Dec 2021 02:55:45 -0800
Subject: [NFBCS] [Extended deadline firm] The 22th IEEE/ACM International
 Symposium on Cluster, Cloud and Internet Computing (CCGrid 2022)
Message-ID: <CAN9y1QJ2AwdM0o39aymBhtTAyR-RrFdMpWA3pFg1E26iA0TZdA@mail.gmail.com>

Dear users of Nfbcs mailing list,

Due to many requests, both the abstract and the regular papers submission
deadlines
of CCGrid have been extended to Dec 19th, 2021. No further extensions will
be provided.

=============================================================================


The 22th IEEE/ACM International Symposium on
Cluster, Cloud and Internet Computing (CCGrid 2022)
in conjunction with
the 6th IEEE International Conference on
Fog and Edge Computing (ICFEC 2022)


May 16-19, 2022, Taormina, Sicily, Italy*

http://fcrlab.unime.it/ccgrid22/

Sponsored by:
IEEE Computer Society / Technical Committee on Scalable Computing
ACM SIGARCH



Hosted/Organised by:

* University of Messina, Italy
* Cardiff University, UK
* University of Klagenfurt, Austria
* Ohio State University, USA
* Future Computing Research LAB (FCRLAB), Italy


=============================================================================

*The safety and well-being of all conference participants is our priority.
The CCGrid organizers are closely monitoring the developments of COVID-19.


Call For Papers

The 22nd IEEE/ACM international Symposium on Cluster, Cloud and Internet
Computing (CCGrid 2022) is a leading forum to disseminate and discuss
research
activities and results on a broad range of topics in distributed systems,
ranging from computing Clusters to widely distributed Clouds and emerging
Internet computing paradigms such as Fog/Edge Computing for Internet of
Things (IoT)/Big Data applications. The conference features keynotes,
technical
presentations, posters, workshops, tutorials, as well as the SCALE challenge
featuring live demonstrations and the ICFEC 2022 conference.

We solicit original contributions on all aspects of distributed systems
and applications in the context of Cluster, Cloud, and Internet computing
environments. Specific topics of interest include but are not limited to the
following:


Track 1: Future Internet computing systems
Topics in the track:
- Internet Computing Frontiers: Edge, Fog, Serverless, Lambda, Streaming,
Highly decentralized approaches to cloud computing. Edge/Fog computing,
sensor data streaming and computation on the edges of the network. Function
as a Service (Faas), Backend as a Service (BaaS), serverless computing,
lambda computing.
- Future Internet: 5G/6G and Use cases of 5G/6G system. Software defined
networking and 5G/6G. 5G/6G cyber security challenges and concerns Machine
learning algorithms for 5G/6G systems;
- Osmotic Computing: Cloud Continuum with Osmosis behaviors, Micro Services
and MicroData, Software Defined Membranes;
- Cloud-Economics: Trustworthiness of services, ecosystem economics,
innovative metering, accounting, and billing methods and tools, automated
trading and bidding support tools, performance monitoring, optimization,
prediction, energy efficiency, sustainability, decision support systems.

Track 2: Programming models and runtime systems
Topics in the track:
- Programming Models and Runtime Systems: Programming models, languages,
systems and tools/environments. Virtualization, containers, and middleware
technologies. Actors, agents, programming decentralized computing systems.

Track 3: Distributed middleware and network architectures
Topics in the track:
- Architecture, Networking, Data Centers: Service oriented architectures.
Utility computing models. IaaS, PaaS, SaaS, *aaS paradigms. Service
composition and orchestration. Software-Defined Network-enabled Systems.
Micro-datacenter, cloudlet, edge, or fog computing infrastructure.
Virtualized hardware: GPUs, tensor processing units, FPGAs;
- Cloud-to-Things continuum: Service provisioning and monitoring in a
Cloud-to-Things environment; Resource elasticity in Cloud-to-Things
contexts; Algorithms and systems for automated elasticity; Blockchain-based
resource orchestrator; Machine learning techniques for resource
orchestration; Security policies in Cloud-to-Things.

Track 4: Storage and I/O systems
Topics in the track:
- Storage and I/O Systems: Distributed storage, cloud storage, Storage as a
Service, data locality techniques for in-memory processing, storage in the
edge.

Track 5: Security, privacy, trust and resilience
Topics in the track:
- Cyber-Security, Privacy and Resilient Distributed Systems: Distributed.
Systems security and trust Access control. Data privacy and integrity..
Regulation. Resiliency of service attacks.

Track 6: Performance modeling, scheduling, and analysis
Topics in the track:
- Resource Management and Scheduling: Resource allocation algorithms,
profiling, modeling. Cluster, cloud, and internet computing scheduling and
meta-scheduling techniques;
- Performance Modelling and Evaluation: Performance models. Monitoring and
evaluation tools. Analysis of system/application performance.

Track 7: Sustainable and green computing
Topics in the track:
- Sustainable and Green Computing: Environment friendly computing
ecosystems. Hardware/software/application energy efficiency. Power, cooling
and thermal awareness.

Track 8: Scientific and industrial applications
Topics in the track:
- Applications: Data Science, Artificial Intelligence, Machine Learning,
Cyber-Physical Systems, e-Health, Internet of Things (IoT)-enabled Smart
Systems and Applications;
- Digital Twins: Digital Twins and Industry 4.0. Digital Twins and emerging
technologies linked to IoT Platforms. Digital Twin the virtual replica of a
physical entity.

Track 9: Artificial intelligence, Machine Learning and Deep Learning
Topics in the track:
- Artificial Intelligence: Large Scalable Machine Learning, AI at the Edge
and in the Cloud. Cognitive computing;
- Machine learning: deep learning, statistical learning, natural language
processing, computer vision, data mining, multiagent systems, knowledge
representation;
- Applicative domains: healthcare, sustainability, transportation,
commerce,neuroscience and cognitive science;
- Quantum machine learning.

================================================================================

Paper Submission:
=================
Authors are invited to submit papers electronically through the following
link:
https://fcrlab.unime.it/ccgrid22/paper-submission/

Submitted manuscripts should be structured as technical papers and may not
exceed 10 letter size (8.5 x 11) pages including figures, tables and
references using the IEEE format for conference proceedings. All manuscripts
will be reviewed and will be judged on correctness, originality, technical
strength, significance, quality of presentation, and relevance to the
conference
attendees. Submitted papers must represent original unpublished research
that is
not currently under review for any other conference or journal. Papers not
following these guidelines will be rejected without review and further
action
may be taken, including (but not limited to) notifications sent to the
heads of
the institutions of the authors and sponsors of the conference. Submissions
received after the due date, exceeding length limit, or not appropriately
structured may also not be considered. Authors may contact the conference
chairs
for more information. The proceedings will be published through the IEEE
Press,
USA and will be made online through the IEEE and ACM Digital Libraries.


Important Dates:
==================
Timezone: Anywhere in the world!
Paper Due (Abstract): 19 December 2021 (Final paper submission: 19 December
2021,
Extended firm)
Full Paper Due: 19 December 2021 (Extended firm)
Acceptance Notification: 11 February 2022
Camera Ready Papers Due: 11 March 2022


Best Paper Awards:
==================
CCGrid will present Best Paper Awards to the author(s) of top three
papers selected by the Program Committee. The award will be determined
based on review comments and ratings, viewpoints of the technical and
scientific merits, impact on the science and engineering of the research
work and the clarity of presentation of the research contents in the paper.


Journal Special Issue:
======================
Highly top rated papers from the CCGrid 2022 conference will be invited for
submission of extended version for publication in one of the following
special
issues:
- "Software: Practice and Experience" Journal published by Wiley Press;
- "Green Communications via Optimization Techniques" for Sustainable
Computing:
Informatics and Systems published by Elsevier.


General Co-Chairs:
==================
Massimo Villari, University of Messina , Italy
Omer Rana , Cardiff University, UK

Program Committee Co-Chairs:
=============================
Maria Fazio, University of Messina, Italy
Radu Prodan University of Klagenfurt Austria
Dhabaleswar K. (DK) Panda Ohio State University. USA

Workshop Co-Chairs:
==============================
Haiying Shen, University of Virginia, USA
Antonio Celesti, University of Messina, Italy

Publicity Co-Chairs:
==============================
Jithin Jose, Microsoft, USA
Bahman Javadi, Western Sydney University, Australia
Ching-Hsien Hsu, National Chung Cheng University, Taiwan
Carlos Westphall, Federal University of Santa Catarina, Brazil
Zhicheng Cai, Nanjing University of Science and Technology, China
Helene Coullon, Inria, France
Sukhpal Singh Gill, Queen Mary University of London, UK
Antonino Galletta, University of Messina, Italy

Vice Chairs:
==============================
Track 1: Future Internet computing systems:
Hai Jin, Huangzong University of Science and Technology, China
Lydia Y. Chen, TU Delft, Netherlands
Track 2: Programming models and runtime systems:
Taisuke Boku, University of Tsukuba, Japan
Martin Schulz, Technical University of Munich, Germany
Track 3: Distributed middleware and network architectures:
Nectarios Koziris, National Technical University of Athens, Greece
Hari Subramoni, Ohio State University, USA
Track 4: Storage and I/O systems:
Suren Byna, Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory, USA
Maria S. Perez, Universidad Politecnica de Madrid, Spain
Track 5: Security, privacy, trust and resilience:
Erman Ayday, Case Western Reserve University, USA
Richard Sinnott, University of Melbourne, Australia
Track 6: Performance modeling, scheduling, and analysis:
Sameer Shende, University of Oregon, USA
Ana Lucia Varbanescu, University of Amsterdam, Netherlands
Track 7: Sustainable and green computing:
Young Choon Lee, Macquarie University, Australia
Wu Feng, Virginia Tech, USA
Track 8: Scientific and industrial applications:
Vipin Chaudhary, Case Western Reserve University, USA
Dana Petcu, West University of Timisoara, Romania
Track 9: Artificial intelligence, Machine Learning and Deep Learning:
Manish Parashar, University of Utah, USA
Ashiq Anjum, University of Leicester, UK

CCGrid Steering Committee:
=========================
Henri Bal, Vrije University, The Netherlands
Pavan Balaji, Argonne National Laboratory, USA
Rajkumar Buyya, University of Melbourne, Australia
Franck Capello, University of Paris-Sud, France
Jesus Carretero, Universidad Carlos III de Madrid, Spain
Ewa Deelman, University of Southern California/ISI, USA
Marios Dikaiakos, University of Cyprus, Cyprus
Jack Dongarra, University of Tennessee & ORNL, USA
Tarek El-Ghazawi, George Washington University, USA
Dick Epema, Technical University of Delft, The Netherlands
Thomas Fahringer, University of Innsbruck, Austria
Ian Foster, University of Chicago, USA
Wolfgang Gentzsch, UberCloud, Germany
Hai Jin, Huazhong University of Science & Technology, China
Craig Lee, The Aerospace Corporation, USA
Laurent Lefevre, INRIA, France
Manish Parashar, Rutgers: The State University of New Jersey, USA
Shikharesh Majumdar, Carleton University, Canada
Satoshi Matsuoaka, Tokyo Institute of Technology, Japan
George Pallis, University of Cyprus, Cyprus
Dhabaleswar K Panda, The Ohio State University, USA
Omer Rana, Cardiff University, UK
Paul Roe, Queensland University of Technology, Australia
Bruno Schulze, LNCC, Brazil
Yogesh Simmhan, Indian Institute of Science, India
Xian-He Sun, Illinois Institute of Technology, USA
Nalini Venkatasubramanian, University of California, USA
Carlos Varela, Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, USA.
Massimo Villari, University of Messina, Italy
Cho-Li Wang, University of Hong Kong, China
Cheng-Zhong Xu, University of Macau, China

================================================================================

From carcione at access.net  Thu Dec 30 16:32:56 2021
From: carcione at access.net (Tracy Carcione)
Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2021 11:32:56 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
Message-ID: <006001d7fd9a$e6cc5260$b464f720$@access.net>

Just grumbling.  

This time of year, everyone and his cousin is asking for charitable
donations.  There are some I'd actually like to donate to, so I've been to 2
of those organizations' websites and been unable to make a donation.  On
one, there's no way to specify the frequency of my donation.  On another, I
was unable to get to the form field to put in some of my credit card info.

While I could pay AIRA to help me do this, why should I?  If someone wants
my hard-earned cash, they ought to make it easy for me to hand it over.
Really, I am sick of these half-accessible websites.

Tracy

 


From charles.vanek at gmail.com  Thu Dec 30 16:49:25 2021
From: charles.vanek at gmail.com (charles.vanek at gmail.com)
Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2021 10:49:25 -0600
Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
In-Reply-To: <006001d7fd9a$e6cc5260$b464f720$@access.net>
References: <006001d7fd9a$e6cc5260$b464f720$@access.net>
Message-ID: <000001d7fd9d$345ef490$9d1cddb0$@gmail.com>

I hear you Tracy.  Kiva I thought sounded like a really cool organization
giving micro loans to people around the world.  So I suggested it as a gift
certificate opportunity to someone about 4-5 years ago... I come to find out
that their site was inaccessible.  In contacting Kiva their customer support
had no way of helping to resolve the problem.  So to this day there's $50 I
have loaded into a Kiva account that has never been loaned out to a worthy
person.

Sad.  I don't know if anyone has used Kiva in the past few years and found
that they have fixed their site.  

Anyway inaccessible site grumblings aside.  Have a Happy New Year Tracy and
all.



-----Original Message-----
From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via NFBCS
Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2021 10:33 AM
To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites

Just grumbling.  

This time of year, everyone and his cousin is asking for charitable
donations.  There are some I'd actually like to donate to, so I've been to 2
of those organizations' websites and been unable to make a donation.  On
one, there's no way to specify the frequency of my donation.  On another, I
was unable to get to the form field to put in some of my credit card info.

While I could pay AIRA to help me do this, why should I?  If someone wants
my hard-earned cash, they ought to make it easy for me to hand it over.
Really, I am sick of these half-accessible websites.

Tracy

 

_______________________________________________
NFBCS mailing list
NFBCS at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/charles.vanek%40gmail.com



From torcolini at comcast.net  Thu Dec 30 23:07:32 2021
From: torcolini at comcast.net (Nicole Torcolini)
Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2021 15:07:32 -0800
Subject: [NFBCS] O.T. Command Line on Windows
Message-ID: <001501d7fdd2$09ec4e80$1dc4eb80$@comcast.net>

            If you have worked with command line on Windows, particularly
Cygwin, would you please email me off list?

 

Thanks,

Nicole


From reeceobryan at icloud.com  Fri Dec 31 11:55:29 2021
From: reeceobryan at icloud.com (Reece O'Bryan)
Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2021 06:55:29 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
In-Reply-To: <000001d7fd9d$345ef490$9d1cddb0$@gmail.com>
References: <000001d7fd9d$345ef490$9d1cddb0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <36023418-99BF-4EC2-81C5-2BE2A3E4F664@icloud.com>

Instead of writing your frustration to this list,whom I am quite sure are also aware of inaccessible websites and frustrations, then why not contact the websites themselves with these exact issues?

Frame it as a way they are losing money and I am sure that they?ll address it.

I just want to add that I also would definitely not be giving a donation to a company that cannot spend minuscule amounts of time to verify basic accessibility for screen readers.


Thank you,

-Reece O?Bryan
C: (502)-827-3724
1645 Parkway, Sevierville, TN 37862



> On Dec 30, 2021, at 11:50 AM, charles.vanek--- via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> ?I hear you Tracy.  Kiva I thought sounded like a really cool organization
> giving micro loans to people around the world.  So I suggested it as a gift
> certificate opportunity to someone about 4-5 years ago... I come to find out
> that their site was inaccessible.  In contacting Kiva their customer support
> had no way of helping to resolve the problem.  So to this day there's $50 I
> have loaded into a Kiva account that has never been loaned out to a worthy
> person.
> 
> Sad.  I don't know if anyone has used Kiva in the past few years and found
> that they have fixed their site.  
> 
> Anyway inaccessible site grumblings aside.  Have a Happy New Year Tracy and
> all.
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via NFBCS
> Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2021 10:33 AM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
> Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
> 
> Just grumbling.  
> 
> This time of year, everyone and his cousin is asking for charitable
> donations.  There are some I'd actually like to donate to, so I've been to 2
> of those organizations' websites and been unable to make a donation.  On
> one, there's no way to specify the frequency of my donation.  On another, I
> was unable to get to the form field to put in some of my credit card info.
> 
> While I could pay AIRA to help me do this, why should I?  If someone wants
> my hard-earned cash, they ought to make it easy for me to hand it over.
> Really, I am sick of these half-accessible websites.
> 
> Tracy
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/charles.vanek%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/reeceobryan%40icloud.com

From carcione at access.net  Fri Dec 31 12:36:54 2021
From: carcione at access.net (Tracy Carcione)
Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2021 07:36:54 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
In-Reply-To: <36023418-99BF-4EC2-81C5-2BE2A3E4F664@icloud.com>
References: <000001d7fd9d$345ef490$9d1cddb0$@gmail.com>
 <36023418-99BF-4EC2-81C5-2BE2A3E4F664@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <003c01d7fe43$17d30bd0$47792370$@access.net>

Of course you are right, but I haven't had any success at contacting them in the past.  But I'll try again.
Tracy


-----Original Message-----
From: NFBCS [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Reece O'Bryan via NFBCS
Sent: Friday, December 31, 2021 6:55 AM
To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
Cc: Reece O'Bryan; Tracy Carcione
Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites

Instead of writing your frustration to this list,whom I am quite sure are also aware of inaccessible websites and frustrations, then why not contact the websites themselves with these exact issues?

Frame it as a way they are losing money and I am sure that they?ll address it.

I just want to add that I also would definitely not be giving a donation to a company that cannot spend minuscule amounts of time to verify basic accessibility for screen readers.


Thank you,

-Reece O?Bryan
C: (502)-827-3724
1645 Parkway, Sevierville, TN 37862



> On Dec 30, 2021, at 11:50 AM, charles.vanek--- via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> ?I hear you Tracy.  Kiva I thought sounded like a really cool organization
> giving micro loans to people around the world.  So I suggested it as a gift
> certificate opportunity to someone about 4-5 years ago... I come to find out
> that their site was inaccessible.  In contacting Kiva their customer support
> had no way of helping to resolve the problem.  So to this day there's $50 I
> have loaded into a Kiva account that has never been loaned out to a worthy
> person.
> 
> Sad.  I don't know if anyone has used Kiva in the past few years and found
> that they have fixed their site.  
> 
> Anyway inaccessible site grumblings aside.  Have a Happy New Year Tracy and
> all.
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via NFBCS
> Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2021 10:33 AM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
> Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
> 
> Just grumbling.  
> 
> This time of year, everyone and his cousin is asking for charitable
> donations.  There are some I'd actually like to donate to, so I've been to 2
> of those organizations' websites and been unable to make a donation.  On
> one, there's no way to specify the frequency of my donation.  On another, I
> was unable to get to the form field to put in some of my credit card info.
> 
> While I could pay AIRA to help me do this, why should I?  If someone wants
> my hard-earned cash, they ought to make it easy for me to hand it over.
> Really, I am sick of these half-accessible websites.
> 
> Tracy
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/charles.vanek%40gmail.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/reeceobryan%40icloud.com
_______________________________________________
NFBCS mailing list
NFBCS at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/carcione%40access.net



From chaltain at outlook.com  Fri Dec 31 13:30:42 2021
From: chaltain at outlook.com (Christopher Chaltain)
Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2021 13:30:42 +0000
Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
In-Reply-To: <003c01d7fe43$17d30bd0$47792370$@access.net>
References: <000001d7fd9d$345ef490$9d1cddb0$@gmail.com>
 <36023418-99BF-4EC2-81C5-2BE2A3E4F664@icloud.com>
 <003c01d7fe43$17d30bd0$47792370$@access.net>
Message-ID: <PH0PR14MB42969E2EE577DD785B7B186DC8469@PH0PR14MB4296.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>

There's also no reason you can't discuss inaccessible web sites on this list either, and even express some frustration over the situation. In other words you can certainly do both. Discuss such web sites on this list and report these issues to the web site owners as well.

--
Christopher (AKA CJ)
Chaltain at Outlook

-----Original Message-----
From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via NFBCS
Sent: Friday, December 31, 2021 6:37 AM
To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites

Of course you are right, but I haven't had any success at contacting them in the past.  But I'll try again.
Tracy


-----Original Message-----
From: NFBCS [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Reece O'Bryan via NFBCS
Sent: Friday, December 31, 2021 6:55 AM
To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
Cc: Reece O'Bryan; Tracy Carcione
Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites

Instead of writing your frustration to this list,whom I am quite sure are also aware of inaccessible websites and frustrations, then why not contact the websites themselves with these exact issues?

Frame it as a way they are losing money and I am sure that they?ll address it.

I just want to add that I also would definitely not be giving a donation to a company that cannot spend minuscule amounts of time to verify basic accessibility for screen readers.


Thank you,

-Reece O?Bryan
C: (502)-827-3724
1645 Parkway, Sevierville, TN 37862



> On Dec 30, 2021, at 11:50 AM, charles.vanek--- via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> ?I hear you Tracy.  Kiva I thought sounded like a really cool 
> organization giving micro loans to people around the world.  So I 
> suggested it as a gift certificate opportunity to someone about 4-5 
> years ago... I come to find out that their site was inaccessible.  In 
> contacting Kiva their customer support had no way of helping to 
> resolve the problem.  So to this day there's $50 I have loaded into a 
> Kiva account that has never been loaned out to a worthy person.
> 
> Sad.  I don't know if anyone has used Kiva in the past few years and 
> found that they have fixed their site.
> 
> Anyway inaccessible site grumblings aside.  Have a Happy New Year 
> Tracy and all.
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via 
> NFBCS
> Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2021 10:33 AM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
> Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
> 
> Just grumbling.  
> 
> This time of year, everyone and his cousin is asking for charitable 
> donations.  There are some I'd actually like to donate to, so I've 
> been to 2 of those organizations' websites and been unable to make a 
> donation.  On one, there's no way to specify the frequency of my 
> donation.  On another, I was unable to get to the form field to put in some of my credit card info.
> 
> While I could pay AIRA to help me do this, why should I?  If someone 
> wants my hard-earned cash, they ought to make it easy for me to hand it over.
> Really, I am sick of these half-accessible websites.
> 
> Tracy
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbnet
> .org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fnfbcs_nfbnet.org&amp;data=04%7C01%7C%7C821
> c8561caa442ae4f1c08d9cc5a8172%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7
> C0%7C637765511357497441%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLC
> JQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&amp;sdata=TmZn0ItN
> BxCebFpkVnSS%2FmvQr7KX72V2T1Y8JOOHK%2BE%3D&amp;reserved=0
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fnfbnet
> .org%2Fmailman%2Foptions%2Fnfbcs_nfbnet.org%2Fcharles.vanek%2540gmail.
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From aqilsajjad at gmail.com  Fri Dec 31 14:46:05 2021
From: aqilsajjad at gmail.com (Aqil Sajjad)
Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2021 07:46:05 -0700
Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
In-Reply-To: <003c01d7fe43$17d30bd0$47792370$@access.net>
References: <000001d7fd9d$345ef490$9d1cddb0$@gmail.com>
 <36023418-99BF-4EC2-81C5-2BE2A3E4F664@icloud.com>
 <003c01d7fe43$17d30bd0$47792370$@access.net>
Message-ID: <001801d7fe55$23eb08c0$6bc11a40$@gmail.com>

May be we need to approach this from different directions. One other angle would be to try engaging with computer science or software engineering departments at universities and ask them to include accessibility as part of the standard coursework for any academic degree in programming. The other possible angle would be to pursue complaints at least against large websites or social media companies like twitter. But I don't know how that works in actual practice and when it makes sense to file a case with the department of justice. Does anyone have any thoughts on that?

-----Original Message-----
From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via NFBCS
Sent: Friday, December 31, 2021 5:37 AM
To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites

Of course you are right, but I haven't had any success at contacting them in the past.  But I'll try again.
Tracy


-----Original Message-----
From: NFBCS [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Reece O'Bryan via NFBCS
Sent: Friday, December 31, 2021 6:55 AM
To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
Cc: Reece O'Bryan; Tracy Carcione
Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites

Instead of writing your frustration to this list,whom I am quite sure are also aware of inaccessible websites and frustrations, then why not contact the websites themselves with these exact issues?

Frame it as a way they are losing money and I am sure that they?ll address it.

I just want to add that I also would definitely not be giving a donation to a company that cannot spend minuscule amounts of time to verify basic accessibility for screen readers.


Thank you,

-Reece O?Bryan
C: (502)-827-3724
1645 Parkway, Sevierville, TN 37862



> On Dec 30, 2021, at 11:50 AM, charles.vanek--- via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> ?I hear you Tracy.  Kiva I thought sounded like a really cool 
> organization giving micro loans to people around the world.  So I 
> suggested it as a gift certificate opportunity to someone about 4-5 
> years ago... I come to find out that their site was inaccessible.  In 
> contacting Kiva their customer support had no way of helping to 
> resolve the problem.  So to this day there's $50 I have loaded into a 
> Kiva account that has never been loaned out to a worthy person.
> 
> Sad.  I don't know if anyone has used Kiva in the past few years and 
> found that they have fixed their site.
> 
> Anyway inaccessible site grumblings aside.  Have a Happy New Year 
> Tracy and all.
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via 
> NFBCS
> Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2021 10:33 AM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
> Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
> 
> Just grumbling.  
> 
> This time of year, everyone and his cousin is asking for charitable 
> donations.  There are some I'd actually like to donate to, so I've 
> been to 2 of those organizations' websites and been unable to make a 
> donation.  On one, there's no way to specify the frequency of my 
> donation.  On another, I was unable to get to the form field to put in some of my credit card info.
> 
> While I could pay AIRA to help me do this, why should I?  If someone 
> wants my hard-earned cash, they ought to make it easy for me to hand it over.
> Really, I am sick of these half-accessible websites.
> 
> Tracy
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/charles.vanek%40gma
> il.com
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
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> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/reeceobryan%40iclou
> d.com
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From paul at yorkfamily.com  Fri Dec 31 16:24:29 2021
From: paul at yorkfamily.com (Paul York)
Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2021 11:24:29 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
In-Reply-To: <001801d7fe55$23eb08c0$6bc11a40$@gmail.com>
References: <000001d7fd9d$345ef490$9d1cddb0$@gmail.com>
 <36023418-99BF-4EC2-81C5-2BE2A3E4F664@icloud.com>
 <003c01d7fe43$17d30bd0$47792370$@access.net>
 <001801d7fe55$23eb08c0$6bc11a40$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMwL28KLCuLmkVecsD=X47xVcKHpUOFSNBPV57MbhUKBOvDfKA@mail.gmail.com>

I teach CS (and specifically Web Programming) at a university. Most
books/courses do spend some time discussing accessibility. I'd venture that
very few instructors force students to practice it. I'm blind I don't even
assess student performance/knowledge on it. It's a bit difficult given the
number of other things being taught. At best it'd be one or two questions
or a rubric item on a project.

Another good place might be in a Human Computer Interaction (HCI) course.
I've taught that, as well. Mostly focuses on usability issues for sighted,
but a fair amount of coverage is given to accessibility for the disabled.
That course though is so broad and focused on so many topics that again,
it'd be hard to assess student comprehension of the necessity for
accessibility in a meaningful way. Ditto for senior projects (only a few of
which would even involve web sites or mobile apps).

Hmm #AssessAccessibility. Fun near-homonym hashtag. :)

The actual process of adding accessibility to a website is really quite
simple. In the end it's just prioritizing it. And in that sense, it's
marketing executives that really need the education. Not CS students.

I've had some luck with polite Tweet-shaming:

   "I want to donate to @whoever but their web site isn't #accessible to
the #blind. Anyone know anyone at #whoever to contact?"

Something like that. Note the use of both @ and # with their name so that
it's broadcast both public and private. It goes directly to their marketing
folks and hurts them where marketing folks care: public perception. Often
they'll reply quickly and have someone contact you directly. It's kind of a
passive-aggressive stick in the "carrot and stick" metaphor. Just make sure
you put other stuff on Twitter or Instagram so you don't look like you just
use it for social shaming. ;)

Paul

PS: Regarding DOJ, of course you can try:

How to File an ADA Complaint with the Department of Justice
<https://www.ada.gov/fact_on_complaint.htm>

The challenge is that this is usually for significant violations. Since
Section 508 only applies to federal agencies, you'd have to show that this
is violating your civil rights. DOJ only have a limited bandwidth. I'm just
not sure there's a lot of "meat" in that approach.

On Fri, Dec 31, 2021 at 9:47 AM Aqil Sajjad via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
wrote:

> May be we need to approach this from different directions. One other angle
> would be to try engaging with computer science or software engineering
> departments at universities and ask them to include accessibility as part
> of the standard coursework for any academic degree in programming. The
> other possible angle would be to pursue complaints at least against large
> websites or social media companies like twitter. But I don't know how that
> works in actual practice and when it makes sense to file a case with the
> department of justice. Does anyone have any thoughts on that?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via
> NFBCS
> Sent: Friday, December 31, 2021 5:37 AM
> To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
> Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
>
> Of course you are right, but I haven't had any success at contacting them
> in the past.  But I'll try again.
> Tracy
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: NFBCS [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Reece O'Bryan
> via NFBCS
> Sent: Friday, December 31, 2021 6:55 AM
> To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
> Cc: Reece O'Bryan; Tracy Carcione
> Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
>
> Instead of writing your frustration to this list,whom I am quite sure are
> also aware of inaccessible websites and frustrations, then why not contact
> the websites themselves with these exact issues?
>
> Frame it as a way they are losing money and I am sure that they?ll address
> it.
>
> I just want to add that I also would definitely not be giving a donation
> to a company that cannot spend minuscule amounts of time to verify basic
> accessibility for screen readers.
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> -Reece O?Bryan
> C: (502)-827-3724
> 1645 Parkway, Sevierville, TN 37862
>
>
>
> > On Dec 30, 2021, at 11:50 AM, charles.vanek--- via NFBCS <
> nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >
> > ?I hear you Tracy.  Kiva I thought sounded like a really cool
> > organization giving micro loans to people around the world.  So I
> > suggested it as a gift certificate opportunity to someone about 4-5
> > years ago... I come to find out that their site was inaccessible.  In
> > contacting Kiva their customer support had no way of helping to
> > resolve the problem.  So to this day there's $50 I have loaded into a
> > Kiva account that has never been loaned out to a worthy person.
> >
> > Sad.  I don't know if anyone has used Kiva in the past few years and
> > found that they have fixed their site.
> >
> > Anyway inaccessible site grumblings aside.  Have a Happy New Year
> > Tracy and all.
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via
> > NFBCS
> > Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2021 10:33 AM
> > To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> > Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
> > Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
> >
> > Just grumbling.
> >
> > This time of year, everyone and his cousin is asking for charitable
> > donations.  There are some I'd actually like to donate to, so I've
> > been to 2 of those organizations' websites and been unable to make a
> > donation.  On one, there's no way to specify the frequency of my
> > donation.  On another, I was unable to get to the form field to put in
> some of my credit card info.
> >
> > While I could pay AIRA to help me do this, why should I?  If someone
> > wants my hard-earned cash, they ought to make it easy for me to hand it
> over.
> > Really, I am sick of these half-accessible websites.
> >
> > Tracy
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NFBCS mailing list
> > NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> NFBCS:
> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/charles.vanek%40gma
> > il.com
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > NFBCS mailing list
> > NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> NFBCS:
> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/reeceobryan%40iclou
> > d.com
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/carcione%40access.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/aqilsajjad%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NFBCS mailing list
> NFBCS at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbcs_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> NFBCS:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbcs_nfbnet.org/paul%40yorkfamily.com
>

From mickmcquaid at gmail.com  Fri Dec 31 17:48:10 2021
From: mickmcquaid at gmail.com (Michael McQuaid)
Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2021 12:48:10 -0500
Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
In-Reply-To: <CAMwL28KLCuLmkVecsD=X47xVcKHpUOFSNBPV57MbhUKBOvDfKA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <000001d7fd9d$345ef490$9d1cddb0$@gmail.com>
 <36023418-99BF-4EC2-81C5-2BE2A3E4F664@icloud.com>
 <003c01d7fe43$17d30bd0$47792370$@access.net>
 <001801d7fe55$23eb08c0$6bc11a40$@gmail.com>
 <CAMwL28KLCuLmkVecsD=X47xVcKHpUOFSNBPV57MbhUKBOvDfKA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHhPcORHB6E-VmVRhe6XULF=zgqpRuWsHNz9HsP1SSAnp3Z4ng@mail.gmail.com>

Teach Access (see https://teachaccess.org) is all about the educational
approach. For example, I have received a TeachAccess grant to spend more of
my time developing accessibility curriculum for my HCI courses. All the
teaching materials from past TeachAccess grantees is available at the
TeachAccess website. This approach is helpful, but other types of advocacy
such as Paul mentions are also needed. I'm just afraid that, with the
quickening pace of new technology, it's getting harder for
accessibility-minded developers to keep up.

- Mick

On Fri, Dec 31, 2021 at 11:26 AM Paul York via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
wrote:

> I teach CS (and specifically Web Programming) at a university. Most
> books/courses do spend some time discussing accessibility. I'd venture that
> very few instructors force students to practice it. I'm blind I don't even
> assess student performance/knowledge on it. It's a bit difficult given the
> number of other things being taught. At best it'd be one or two questions
> or a rubric item on a project.
>
> Another good place might be in a Human Computer Interaction (HCI) course.
> I've taught that, as well. Mostly focuses on usability issues for sighted,
> but a fair amount of coverage is given to accessibility for the disabled.
> That course though is so broad and focused on so many topics that again,
> it'd be hard to assess student comprehension of the necessity for
> accessibility in a meaningful way. Ditto for senior projects (only a few of
> which would even involve web sites or mobile apps).
>
> Hmm #AssessAccessibility. Fun near-homonym hashtag. :)
>
> The actual process of adding accessibility to a website is really quite
> simple. In the end it's just prioritizing it. And in that sense, it's
> marketing executives that really need the education. Not CS students.
>
> I've had some luck with polite Tweet-shaming:
>
>    "I want to donate to @whoever but their web site isn't #accessible to
> the #blind. Anyone know anyone at #whoever to contact?"
>
> Something like that. Note the use of both @ and # with their name so that
> it's broadcast both public and private. It goes directly to their marketing
> folks and hurts them where marketing folks care: public perception. Often
> they'll reply quickly and have someone contact you directly. It's kind of a
> passive-aggressive stick in the "carrot and stick" metaphor. Just make sure
> you put other stuff on Twitter or Instagram so you don't look like you just
> use it for social shaming. ;)
>
> Paul
>
> PS: Regarding DOJ, of course you can try:
>
> How to File an ADA Complaint with the Department of Justice
> <https://www.ada.gov/fact_on_complaint.htm>
>
> The challenge is that this is usually for significant violations. Since
> Section 508 only applies to federal agencies, you'd have to show that this
> is violating your civil rights. DOJ only have a limited bandwidth. I'm just
> not sure there's a lot of "meat" in that approach.
>
> On Fri, Dec 31, 2021 at 9:47 AM Aqil Sajjad via NFBCS <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> wrote:
>
> > May be we need to approach this from different directions. One other
> angle
> > would be to try engaging with computer science or software engineering
> > departments at universities and ask them to include accessibility as part
> > of the standard coursework for any academic degree in programming. The
> > other possible angle would be to pursue complaints at least against large
> > websites or social media companies like twitter. But I don't know how
> that
> > works in actual practice and when it makes sense to file a case with the
> > department of justice. Does anyone have any thoughts on that?
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via
> > NFBCS
> > Sent: Friday, December 31, 2021 5:37 AM
> > To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> > Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
> > Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
> >
> > Of course you are right, but I haven't had any success at contacting them
> > in the past.  But I'll try again.
> > Tracy
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: NFBCS [mailto:nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Reece O'Bryan
> > via NFBCS
> > Sent: Friday, December 31, 2021 6:55 AM
> > To: NFB in Computer Science Mailing List
> > Cc: Reece O'Bryan; Tracy Carcione
> > Subject: Re: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
> >
> > Instead of writing your frustration to this list,whom I am quite sure are
> > also aware of inaccessible websites and frustrations, then why not
> contact
> > the websites themselves with these exact issues?
> >
> > Frame it as a way they are losing money and I am sure that they?ll
> address
> > it.
> >
> > I just want to add that I also would definitely not be giving a donation
> > to a company that cannot spend minuscule amounts of time to verify basic
> > accessibility for screen readers.
> >
> >
> > Thank you,
> >
> > -Reece O?Bryan
> > C: (502)-827-3724
> > 1645 Parkway, Sevierville, TN 37862
> >
> >
> >
> > > On Dec 30, 2021, at 11:50 AM, charles.vanek--- via NFBCS <
> > nfbcs at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > ?I hear you Tracy.  Kiva I thought sounded like a really cool
> > > organization giving micro loans to people around the world.  So I
> > > suggested it as a gift certificate opportunity to someone about 4-5
> > > years ago... I come to find out that their site was inaccessible.  In
> > > contacting Kiva their customer support had no way of helping to
> > > resolve the problem.  So to this day there's $50 I have loaded into a
> > > Kiva account that has never been loaned out to a worthy person.
> > >
> > > Sad.  I don't know if anyone has used Kiva in the past few years and
> > > found that they have fixed their site.
> > >
> > > Anyway inaccessible site grumblings aside.  Have a Happy New Year
> > > Tracy and all.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: NFBCS <nfbcs-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Tracy Carcione via
> > > NFBCS
> > > Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2021 10:33 AM
> > > To: 'NFB in Computer Science Mailing List' <nfbcs at nfbnet.org>
> > > Cc: Tracy Carcione <carcione at access.net>
> > > Subject: [NFBCS] Inaccessible websites
> > >
> > > Just grumbling.
> > >
> > > This time of year, everyone and his cousin is asking for charitable
> > > donations.  There are some I'd actually like to donate to, so I've
> > > been to 2 of those organizations' websites and been unable to make a
> > > donation.  On one, there's no way to specify the frequency of my
> > > donation.  On another, I was unable to get to the form field to put in
> > some of my credit card info.
> > >
> > > While I could pay AIRA to help me do this, why should I?  If someone
> > > wants my hard-earned cash, they ought to make it easy for me to hand it
> > over.
> > > Really, I am sick of these half-accessible websites.
> > >
> > > Tracy
> > >
> > >
> > >
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> > >
> > >
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