[Nfbk] Fwd: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets

lrsj89 at aol.com lrsj89 at aol.com
Fri Apr 12 16:40:04 UTC 2013 


Sent from my iPod

Begin forwarded message:

> From: Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com>
> Date: April 12, 2013, 12:30:08 PM EDT
> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
> Reply-To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
> 
> It's obvious I need to see what's going on with my keyboard.  I'm
> pressing keys, but sometimes they aren't typing the letters, as you
> all just saw.  My laptop didn't do this before, does anybody know what
> might be causing this really random and kind of irritating problem?
> 
> On 4/12/13, Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Brandon,
>>  Give it ten or fifteen more years of widespread testing in all sorts
>> of environments and I'll agree with you.  I think it will probably
>> happen...but, like, if this wa a computer program, we aren't even in
>> public beta yet, and that's probably at least a few years down the
>> line.  Furthermore, I think it will take several years, at least, with
>> the cars being widely driven in the public before society at large
>> accepts us blind folks driving them.  It probably will happen
>> _eventually_, but I'm still not willing to bank on it.  It'll be
>> interesting to follow this as it develops over the next couple
>> decades, though, and see what happens.
>>  Best,
>> Kirt
>> 
>> On 4/12/13, Brandon Keith Biggs <brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Hello,
>>> Google is supportive of having blind drivers, they have come to events
>>> and
>>> shown blind folks the car. I've sat in quite a few, although I've never
>>> been
>>> 
>>> in one while it has been driven. I'd think it will be exactly like being
>>> a
>>> passenger of a sighted driver, but without the crazy breakings every few
>>> minutes and the heart attacks the sighted drivers constantly face.
>>> Frankly, I would trust the Google Car way more than I would trust my mom
>>> as
>>> 
>>> the driver. Computers are much more reliable than humans in my opinion.
>>> Thanks,
>>> 
>>> Brandon Keith Biggs
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: christopher nusbaum
>>> Sent: Friday, April 12, 2013 6:03 AM
>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
>>> 
>>> As it stands, he's going to need a sighted driver in the car who can
>>> take the wheel when the need arises. But Google will have to fix this
>>> if they're hoping for a blind person to drive it independently.
>>> 
>>> Chris Nusbaum
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> On Apr 12, 2013, at 8:18 AM, Carly Mihalakis <carlymih at comcast.net>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Hi, Chris, Kirt and everyone else on this thread,
>>>> 
>>>> You guys are right in saying that, one need not pass judgement without
>>>> fully experiencing this machine in Wonderland. it's true we don't have
>>>> all
>>>> 
>>>> the information. And, I think it's right when you say the thing doesn't
>>>> murge onto the freeway. What happens to the driving blink if he dares to
>>>> usese se the interstate? usese the freeway? 4/12/2013, christopher
>>>> nusbaum
>>>> 
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Kirt,
>>>>> 
>>>>> I agree with you. Before we make any judgments on the Google car, we
>>>>> must remember that it is still in the planning stages and that  all
>>>>> Google cars that have been tested so far are no more than prototypes.
>>>>> This is evidenced by the need for the Google car to be taken over by
>>>>> human driver when it pulls off the highway, as the story which someone
>>>>> reposted here mentioned.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Carly, we must also take into account that some blind people don't
>>>>> live in areas where public transportation is easily available, such as
>>>>> Boston or New York City. I, for instance, live in a semi rural town in
>>>>> Maryland, where our only options For public transportation are
>>>>> paratransit and a cab service. As you can imagine, neither of these
>>>>> options are preferable Because of the cost if not the reliability. For
>>>>> this reason, I would love the independence that the Google car might
>>>>> give me in this area.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Just my thoughts,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Apr 12, 2013, at 2:41 AM, Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> Patrick,
>>>>>> If it's time they want, I'm willing to give it.  I hope you're
>>>>>> right; we'll have to wait and see.  I guess my only point was that
>>>>>> this thing isn't right around the corner; while it's realisticly
>>>>>> viable now, it's still probably a long ways off before we'll be able
>>>>>> to drive.  Where the google car is now is probably comparable to
>>>>>> where
>>>>>> the internet was thirty or so years ago; people could see the
>>>>>> possibilities, it was realistic and people "in the know" were
>>>>>> probably
>>>>>> aware it was coming...but it still had a long way to go before it was
>>>>>> viable to the general public.
>>>>>> And, Patrick, you're probably right that airplane pilots don't have
>>>>>> to manually control the plane very much between takeoff and landing.
>>>>>> Still, I can almost guarantee you they are paying very close
>>>>>> attention
>>>>>> in the event something goes wrong.
>>>>>> Carley,
>>>>>> I don't really see anything inherently wrong or undesirable about
>>>>>> driving.  In most places it is probably more efficient than public
>>>>>> transport.  Of course there are exceptions; New York city comes to
>>>>>> mind, for instance.  Still, living where I do now, I would totally
>>>>>> jump on the chance to drive if I could and it were realistic and
>>>>>> safe,
>>>>>> at least most of the time.  That being said, it's far enough away
>>>>>> that
>>>>>> I'm definitely not going to stop riding my busses and trains any time
>>>>>> soon.
>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>> Kirt
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On 4/10/13, justin williams <justin.williams2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Count me in.  I'm driving.   No wait; not driving, drivin.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Carly
>>>>>>> Mihalakis
>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 11:33 PM
>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list; National
>>>>>>> Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Hi, List,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On the other hand, for my whole life I have watched sighted folk
>>>>>>> seem
>>>>>>> to agonize over so much turmoil, and hostility towrd their fellow
>>>>>>> man, as they drive. I have always been grateful not having that crap
>>>>>>> to contend with. Besides, I am not confident about chances of ever
>>>>>>> affording such a car. And, I don't care about the principles
>>>>>>> personal
>>>>>>> cars supposedly afford. Where can they take you that a bus, train,
>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>> friend/driver cannot?
>>>>>>> Ultimately, i believe traveling from point A to point B, oughta be
>>>>>>> a communal affair. Leave the driving to ol' Sighty!
>>>>>>> So no, on the car!
>>>>>>> Car At 06:23 PM 4/11/2013, Sophie Trist wrote:
>>>>>>>> I can't wait to see these google cars come out. It will be a major
>>>>>>>> milestone in the independence and assimulation of blind people in
>>>>>>>> sighted society. My only worry is that the sighties won't trust us
>>>>>>>> to drive, even (maybe especially) if the car was
>>>>>>>> computer-controlled. Even my boyfriend, who is blind, says he will
>>>>>>>> never trust a self-propelled car. Our trouble will be convincing
>>>>>>>> them that it's safe for us and for others on the road.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>> From: "Brandon Keith Biggs" <brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com
>>>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> Date sent: Thu, 11 Apr 2013 14:02:08 -0700
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>> The reason why the Google Car is Superior is because it is already
>>>>>>>> going
>>>>>>>> mainstream, it has a major company behind it and there is nothing
>>>>>>>> wrong
>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>> backing both cars.
>>>>>>>> The big debate will be if people want to drive under their own
>>>>>>>> control or
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>> computers. It is not unlike reading Braille or using a screen
>>>>>>>> reader
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> read
>>>>>>>> a book. Braille is all fine and dandy, but a screen reader is very
>>>>>>>> important. The difference is the Google car is going mainstream and
>>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>>> have mainstreem support. It would be the same if Jaws went
>>>>>>>> mainstreem
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> companies like Google started making units that used Jaws and no
>>>>>>>> screen.
>>>>>>>> Braille would be useful, but not particularly necessary for most
>>>>>>>> common
>>>>>>>> tasks.
>>>>>>>> If one used a car on city roads and highways, there would be very
>>>>>>>> little
>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>> no need to manually drive. If one wanted to map a long driveway or
>>>>>>>> country
>>>>>>>> road, one would need to manually drive it till the road could be
>>>>>>>> completely
>>>>>>>> entered into the database.
>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: Sophie Trist
>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 1:37 PM
>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Brandon, I totally 100% agree!!! However, didn't the NFB invent a
>>>>>>>> self-propelled car of sorts? If so, it might be hard to convince
>>>>>>>> them to back the google car unless we can prove theirs is
>>>>>>>> superior.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>> From: "Brandon Keith Biggs" <brandonkeithbiggs at gmail.com
>>>>>>>> To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>>>>>>>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> Date sent: Thu, 11 Apr 2013 10:05:01 -0700
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>> Yes in a way, the logistics of liability still need to be taken
>>>>>>>> into account
>>>>>>>> I'm sure and licensing probably still needs to be worked out, but
>>>>>>>> if the
>>>>>>>> government officials are pushed, it will happen very soon.
>>>>>>>> I think the NFB should push for these quite hard. Perhaps they
>>>>>>>> could even
>>>>>>>> ask that a car come to the convention, I think Google would take
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> challenge.
>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: Justin Young
>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 9:13 AM
>>>>>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Google car takes to the streets
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> So does this mean these vehicles will soon be on the market for
>>>>>>>> individuals to purchase in Nevada?  Sounds like a very
>>>>>>>> interesting
>>>>>>>> project.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On 4/11/13, Robert William Kingett <kingettr at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Google's self-driven cars will soon be appearing on Nevada roads
>>>>>>>> after
>>>>>>>> the state's Department of Motor Vehicles approved on Monday the
>>>>>>>> nation's
>>>>>>>> first autonomous vehicle license.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> The move came after officials rode along on drives on highways,
>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>> Carson City neighborhoods and along the famous Las Vegas Strip,
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> Nevada DMV said in a statement.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> The Nevada legislature last year authorized self-driven cars for
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> state's roads, the first such law in the United States. That law
>>>>>>>> went
>>>>>>>> into effect on March 1, 2012.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Google's self-driven cars rely on video cameras, radar sensors,
>>>>>>>> lasers,
>>>>>>>> and a database of information collected from manually driven
>>>>>>>> cars to
>>>>>>>> help navigate, according to the company.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> The DMV licensed a Toyota Prius that Google modified with its
>>>>>>>> experimental driver-less technology, developed by Stanford
>>>>>>>> professor and
>>>>>>>> Google Vice President Sebastian Thrun.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Google's self-driving cars have crossed the Golden Gate Bridge
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> driven along the picturesque Pacific Coast Highway, according to
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> company.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Autonomous vehicles are the "car of the future," Nevada DMV
>>>>>>>> director
>>>>>>>> Bruce Breslow said in a statement. The state also has plans to
>>>>>>>> eventually license autonomous vehicles owned by the members of
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> public, the DMV said.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Legislation to regulate autonomous cars is being considered in
>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>> states, including Google's home state of California.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> "The vast majority of vehicle accidents are due to human error.
>>>>>>>> Through
>>>>>>>> the use of computers, sensors and other systems, an autonomous
>>>>>>>> vehicle
>>>>>>>> is capable of analyzing the driving environment more quickly and
>>>>>>>> operating the vehicle more safely," California state Senator
>>>>>>>> Alex
>>>>>>>> Padilla said in March when he introduced that state's autonomous
>>>>>>>> car
>>>>>>>> legislation.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Other car companies are also seeking self-driven car licenses in
>>>>>>>> Nevada,
>>>>>>>> the DMV said.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
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>>>>>>>> 
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>>>>>>> 
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>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>> 
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