[Nfbmo] subject change to church...

fred olver goodfolks at charter.net
Thu Oct 27 17:00:50 UTC 2011


I didn't go to church for a long time, either, until I figured out that I 
was the one who had to offer to put the bulletin in to an accessible format, 
until I volunteered to "participate" in anything I could to show that I was 
interested.

Fred Olver

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dewey Bradley" <dewey.bradley at kc.rr.com>
To: "NFB of Missouri Mailing List" <nfbmo at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2011 10:29 AM
Subject: Re: [Nfbmo] What would you do?


> there you go again
> I'm not blaming anyone, I'll have you know that people here in Kansas City 
> have made remarks about the Springfield chapter president, and as far as 
> me talking about churches.
> I was saying that a blind pastor said that 95% us don't go to church, I 
> said my self that I don't know if the numbers are really that high, and I 
> also said that that was my experience, and that I was not trying to tell 
> people not to go to church, and then you guys jump all over me
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Gary Wunder" <GWunder at earthlink.net>
> To: "'NFB of Missouri Mailing List'" <nfbmo at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2011 7:21 AM
> Subject: Re: [Nfbmo] What would you do?
>
>
>> Dewey, when you were in Springfield I tried to get you to join. I told 
>> you
>> how much we need people and you had an excuse about people not treating 
>> you
>> right. You indicted 95% of all churches as anti-blind and now you say 
>> Debbie
>> is causing you to leave. You have never been. You want to snipe from the
>> sidelines and never, so far as I have observed, did anything except to 
>> lift
>> a finger to your keyboard to start an argument. I do not know the city 
>> you
>> live in now, but we could have used you desperately in Springfield and 
>> there
>> was always a reason you would not commit. I guess now you have one and
>> someone to blame it on. I'm sorry about that. We need you and you need 
>> us,
>> but you can't expect people to sit passively by as you talk about their
>> churches in such a demeaning way. I hope you do something constructive 
>> for
>> the blind in your new city. We want to be your friend, and from your
>> appearance on the list I believe you want to be ours. Just don't throw a
>> stone and be surprised if some object and say it is juvenile to throw 
>> them.
>>
>> Gary
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nfbmo-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbmo-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>> Behalf
>> Of Dewey Bradley
>> Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2011 1:06 AM
>> To: NFB of Missouri Mailing List
>> Subject: Re: [Nfbmo] What would you do?
>>
>> I was talking about the blind people on this list as well, they jump all
>> over me, that is why I am going to leave all the blind groups, some 
>> things
>> have been said in the past, and so people remember my name, and are going 
>> to
>>
>> do that, so I get the pointe.
>> I just moved to a new city and whent to a chapter meeting a week ago, but
>> something Debby said has turned me off for good.
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: <DanFlasar at aol.com>
>> To: <nfbmo at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, October 27, 2011 12:47 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Nfbmo] What would you do?
>>
>>
>>>I agree - I have enough things to deal  with without having to address 
>>>the
>>> neuroses of random people at bus stops or  waiting in line.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> In a message dated 10/27/2011 12:32:36 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
>>> dewey.bradley at kc.rr.com writes:
>>>
>>> Well he  didn't think I heard him, he was an older guy, so something has
>>> up
>>> set him  I guess, who knows, but if you read the other posts from this
>>> list,
>>> I'm  the only one who has ever gotten that, I'm angry
>>> But I don't bother with  people like that, its a waste of my time
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: <DanFlasar at aol.com>
>>> To: <nfbmo at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent:  Thursday, October 27, 2011 12:13 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Nfbmo] What would you  do?
>>>
>>>
>>>> Dewey,
>>>> Sounds like that guy at the bus stop felt  inferior in the presence of
>>>> someone he felt had a lot more courage  than he does.
>>>>
>>>> Dan
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> In a message  dated 10/26/2011 11:37:02 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
>>>>  dewey.bradley at kc.rr.com writes:
>>>>
>>>> I had a guy  at the bus  stop the other day telling someone that if he
>>> were
>>>> blind he   would kill him self, but that is just me being angry I 
>>>> guess.
>>>>
>>>>  -----  Original Message ----- 
>>>> From:  <DanFlasar at aol.com>
>>>> To:  <nfbmo at nfbnet.org>
>>>>  Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2011 7:27  PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Nfbmo]  What would you do?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> There are always  a few  fringey people in every  group.  Generally,
>>>>> it's
>>>>>   not
>>>>> good to elect, appoint or anoint them, much  less  generalize  from
>>>>> their
>>>>> poor behavior to the rest of the  group.
>>>>>   And anyone who would pray for you to get  your  sight back  and call
>>> you
>>>>> evil if you don't needs  to pray to lift the  arrogance  from their
>>>>> soul.
>>>>>  Dan
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>  In a message dated  10/26/2011 5:51:12 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
>>>>>   mdsmith25 at ktis.net writes:
>>>>>
>>>>> I've run  across a few  people  who believe that if I just pray enough
>>>>> my
>>>>>  blindness  will be  cured, but none that thought my blindness was
>>> caused
>>>>> because I  was  evil.
>>>>>
>>>>>  Melissa Smith
>>>>>
>>>>> On 10/26/2011  5:02 PM, Gail  Bryant  wrote:
>>>>>> Personally, I go to a wonderful   church which has supported me  in
>>> every
>>>>> way
>>>>>>  possible.  When I've had surgery, the helped me with meals  and
>>> whatever
>>>> I
>>>>>> needed.  When Ed died, they prayed  with me, cried   with me, laughed
>>>>>> with
>>>>>  me
>>>>>> and more.   Never have  they called  me  evil. I don't know where Mr.
>>>>> Bradley
>>>>>>  gets  his figures, but perhaps  the reason he chooses not to go to
>>>>  church
>>>>> is
>>>>>> out of anger and    bitterness
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Gail Bryant
>>>>>>  Columbia Braille  Teaching  Services L.L.C.
>>>>>> 1212  London Drive
>>>>>>  Columbia, MO   65203-2012
>>>>>> Phone: (573)817-5993
>>>>>>  Cell:  (573)268-4962
>>>>>>    gbryant at socket.net
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  -----Original  Message-----
>>>>>>  From:  nfbmo-bounces at nfbnet.org  [mailto:nfbmo-bounces at nfbnet.org] 
>>>>>> On
>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>> Of Debbie  Wunder
>>>>>>  Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2011 2:05  PM
>>>>>>  To: NFB  of Missouri Mailing List
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Nfbmo] What    would you do?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You are being ridiculous! Where  do you  get your  facts?
>>>>>> This trivia night issue has  nothing to do  with god, or opinions  of
>>> the
>>>>>>  blind.
>>>>>> -----  Original Message -----
>>>>>>  From:  "Dewey   Bradley"<dewey.bradley at kc.rr.com>
>>>>>> To: "NFB of  Missouri   Mailing List"<nfbmo at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>  Sent: Wednesday, October  26,  2011 9:39 AM
>>>>>> Subject:  Re: [Nfbmo] What would you    do?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I wasn't going to  reply to this,  but I have to  say this
>>>>>>> its been  my experience that  churches and church groups do  this,
>>> they
>>>> do
>>>>>>> not want  anyone with a disability  around, they just  want to tell 
>>>>>>> us
>>>>>>>  that
>>>>>>> if we pray harder we will have are  sight   back, and that we are
>>>>>>> evil,
>>>>> that
>>>>>>> is why  we  are blind.
>>>>>>>  They say that 95% of us don't go  to church, I  don't know if the
>>>>>>>  numbers
>>>>>>> are that high, but  this is  why.
>>>>>>> Most people  that go to church and call  them  selves Christians are
>>>>>>> judgmental   like  that.
>>>>>>> I'm not saying don't go to church, nor am  I trying  to  get a 
>>>>>>> lintch
>>>>>>>  mob
>>>>>>> after me, I'm just saying that is  what  I've  noticed, that is why 
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>  never
>>>>>>>  go, every church I have seen do not  want  blind people  around.
>>>>>>> I'm not saying that is the case  here,  but it  could be
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  ----- Original Message   -----
>>>>>>> From:  "MATTHEW    SIEVERT"<msievert at sbcglobal.net>
>>>>>>> To: "NFB of   Missouri  Mailing List"<nfbmo at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>  Sent:  Wednesday, October 26,  2011 7:33 AM
>>>>>>>  Subject: Re: [Nfbmo]  What would you   do?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>   Group,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I hope  you are all   well.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What I have observed is that  many   times people will want to 
>>>>>>> "rebel"
>>>>>>> instead  of
>>>>>>>  remedy a  situation through other  means.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  Equality for all  will  not take place over a period of one year or
>>>>  even
>>>>> ten
>>>>>>> years, but  you can lay the  foundation  that other's can build
>>>>>>> upon.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  Representing a group in a  negative light will  not win over
>>>> supporters.
>>>>>  It
>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>> bring attention  to   the issue, but you want people understand, not
>>>>>>>   simply
>>>>>>>  notice
>>>>>>> through a  negative  act.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Some day we   will have a  blind/visually impaired astronaut. Until
>>> that
>>>>>  time
>>>>>>>  we  as
>>>>>>> the NFB should  do what we can to build upon  our   organization's
>>>>>>> achievements and
>>>>>>>   represent our disabled  community in a positive   light.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Equality  at   trivia night's should be obtained, but like all
>>>>  challenges,
>>>>>  it
>>>>>>>   will
>>>>>>> take time and a calm   intellect.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Matt    Sievert
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    ________________________________
>>>>>>> From: fred    olver<goodfolks at charter.net>
>>>>>>> To: NFB of  Missouri  Mailing  List<nfbmo at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>  Sent: Wed, October  26, 2011 7:41:12  AM
>>>>>>>  Subject: Re: [Nfbmo] What would you   do?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    Gary,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have read your comments  several times  and  perhapse even lost 
>>>>>>> some
>>>>>  sleep
>>>>>>> over what I  consider to be an  afrontery  to me and others who 
>>>>>>> might
>>>> wish
>>>>>   to
>>>>>>> participate in an  activity alongside individuals  who  are not
>>>>>>> limited
>>>> in
>>>>>>> their    vision.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Let me say first of all that a  year  ago I  confronted this 
>>>>>>> situation
>>>>  and
>>>>>>> explained to the  individuals in  charge  that I felt wronged 
>>>>>>> because
>>>> half
>>>>>   of
>>>>>>> the questions were  undeciferable by myself.  Okay,  they didn't 
>>>>>>> know
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>  going to be   there. This year, however nearly a third of the
>>> questions
>>>>>  were
>>>>>>>  again undeciferable  by a blind person. It is my  feeling that if 
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>  folks
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>> charge  know that  individuals will be  participating who are unable
>>> to
>>>>>>> participate in a significant  number of  questions  related to the
>>>>>>>  activity
>>>>>>> that they not  allow  those questions.  To me, the reasons ought to 
>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>   very
>>>>>>> obvious. If  you alienate a significant number  of  individuals you
>>>>>>> won't
>>>>>  get
>>>>>>>  them to come back next  year. If you  knowingly allow questions to 
>>>>>>> be
>>> a
>>>>> part
>>>>>>>  of  an activity which you know will exclude individuals  from
>>>>>  participating
>>>>>>> then you are wrong to  include them. If for  example I  only provide
>>>>>  agenda's
>>>>>>> in Braille to  individuals who don't  read  Braille then I am wrong 
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>  do
>>>>>  so,
>>>>>>> because I have ignored  their   needs.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bottom line,  I'm feeling ignored. Next  year, I  think I'll find
>>> seven
>>>>> other
>>>>>>> individuals  who can not make  use of  visual questions and attend 
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>   same
>>>>>>> fundraiser and practice a bit  of civil   disobedience.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  Fred   Olver
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message  -----
>>>>>>> From:  "Gary   Wunder"<GWunder at earthlink.net>
>>>>>>> To: "'NFB of   Missouri Mailing  List'"<nfbmo at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>  Sent:  Tuesday, October 25, 2011  5:53 PM
>>>>>>>  Subject: Re: [Nfbmo]  What would you   do?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>  Hi  Fred and the folks who have  commented here. Please allow me
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> interject
>>>>>>>>   another  perspective. I find this troublesome philosophically. 
>>>>>>>> When
>>> I
>>>>>  can
>>>>>>>> have access and am denied it  because someone doesn't  want  to go 
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>  the
>>>>>>>> trouble of making their software  accessible,  I'm  up in arms. 
>>>>>>>> When
>>>> they
>>>>>>>>   use
>>>>>>>> artificial barriers  such as possessing  a  driver's license when
>>>>>>>> what
>>>>> they
>>>>>>>>  mean is  that  an employee has to get around, I'm bothered. When
>>> they
>>>>> say   I
>>>>>>>> have to be able to  visually read print to take a job and  I  have 
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>  machine
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> do  it,  I'm  outraged.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> How is  the  issue changed when we  know of no way to make a 
>>>>>>>> process
>>>>  100
>>>>>>>> percent accessible? I  don't want to  deprive  anyone of the beauty
>>>> found
>>>>>  in
>>>>>>>> paintings  or  photography simply because  I can't observe them. I
>>>>>>>>    understand
>>>>>>>> there are some cartoons that are so  torturous  to  explain that by
>>> the
>>>>>  time
>>>>>>>> one finishes  putting them into words,   they are no longer 
>>>>>>>> funny.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Mental challenges   may be  audible, visual, or they might even
>>> involve
>>>>>>>>   other
>>>>>>>>  senses such as taste or smell. If we look hard  enough,  we'll 
>>>>>>>> find
>>>>> people
>>>>>>>>   who
>>>>>>>> have problems with one  or more of these. So,  in  the areas where 
>>>>>>>> we
>>>>> don't
>>>>>>>> have  true   alternatives, should our request be that the thing we
>>>>  cannot
>>>>>  do
>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>>  stricken from the activity?  Would we  have been wrong to run a 
>>>>>>>> clip
>>>
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>   Henry
>>>>>>>>  Kissinger saying "Piece is at hand,"  and  asking the group to
>>>>>>>> identify
>>>>>  the
>>>>>>>> man or what he  was talking about or the year  when he made  the
>>>>>  utterance?
>>>>>>>>  The
>>>>>>>> blind are at something  of a   disadvantage because we cannot see
>>>>>>>> him.
>>>>>>>>   The
>>>>>>>>  deaf
>>>>>>>> are at a  disadvantage  because they cannot hear him. The  young 
>>>>>>>> may
>>>>  well
>>>>>  be
>>>>>>>> at
>>>>>>>> a  disadvantage because   they weren't around when he made 
>>>>>>>> headlines
>>>> with
>>>>>>>>    that
>>>>>>>> statement, much to the displeasure of his  boss,  the  president of
>>> the
>>>>>>>>  United
>>>>>>>>  States. Take the same  question, put  it in print, and then decide
>>>>>>>> if
>>>> it
>>>>>  is
>>>>>>>> fair to  the dyslexic who might have an   easy time with the audio 
>>>>>>>> or
>>>> the
>>>>>>>>    video
>>>>>>>>  clip.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I  Don't like  being  excluded, and if I am excluded enough, I'll
>>> find
>>>>>>>>  another
>>>>>>>> activity.  It hurts  and seems unfair, but to me it  doesn't rise 
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>   level
>>>>>>>> of discrimination  which, if I understand  it,  means something 
>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>>  is
>>>>>>>>  both
>>>>>>>>   unreasonable and detrimental. I don't think we can be  critical
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>> people
>>>>>>>> using sight and acknowledging  that it  plays  a major role in the
>>>>>>>> way
>>>>>  they
>>>>>>>> find and  even remember things.  What  we can and should make an
>>>>>   unequivocal
>>>>>>>> stand for are  things which  have  nonvisual alternatives but which
>>> are
>>>>>>>>   ignored
>>>>>>>> to the  detriment of our education and    employment.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I do not mean this  as a  real  answer to the question of what 
>>>>>>>> should
>>> I
>>>>>  do,
>>>>>>>>   but
>>>>>>>> as a thought process we  go through when  trying to decide  when to
>>>> fight
>>>>>>>>   and
>>>>>>>> what we can reasonably fight  for as  blind  people. I am not
>>> targeting
>>>>>  Fred
>>>>>>>> here but  trying  to engage in some  discussion of a philosophical
>>>>>   principle
>>>>>>>> that  I wrestle with at least two or  three  times per month. I
>>>>>  appreciate
>>>>>>>>  the
>>>>>>>> question,  even if I don't have  anything like a  good  answer.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From:   nfbmo-bounces at nfbnet.org  [mailto:nfbmo-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>> On
>>>>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>>>> Of  fred   olver
>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 8:45    AM
>>>>>>>> To: NFB of Missouri Mailing  List
>>>>>>>>  Subject:  [Nfbmo] What would you   do?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A year ago, I   attended a  Trivia Night put on by a food pantry in
>>> the
>>>>>   St.
>>>>>>>>  Louis area. This pantry is supported by  my  church along with
>>>>>>>>  several
>>>>>>>>  others.
>>>>>>>> After  the night's program was  over, half of  the categories 
>>>>>>>> being
>>>>>>>> visual
>>>>>>>>   in
>>>>>>>>  nature so that a blind person could not   participate in that
>>>>>>>> portion
>>>>>>>>  of
>>>>>>>>  the
>>>>>>>> program I wrote  an item for my churches   news-letter and sent it 
>>>>>>>> on
>>>
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> director  of  the  organization. In this item I pointed out that it
>>> was
>>>>>   not
>>>>>>>> fair  or  necessary to include only video-type  questions and asked
>>>>  that
>>>>>>>> they
>>>>>>>>  do, in the  future consider having  categories which were 
>>>>>>>> non-video
>>>>>>>> in
>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> future. I  received  assurances from  the director of the
>>> organization
>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> indeed   they  would do this.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Last Friday,  I  attended  their Trivia Nighht again. True, only
>>>>>>>> two
>>>>>>>>  categories
>>>>>>>> of  questions were  video in nature, however these  two  categories
>>>>>  included
>>>>>>>> roughly 1/3 of  the questions.  Yesterday at  a meeting of a 
>>>>>>>> church
>>>>>>>> committee
>>>>>>>>    I
>>>>>>>> suggested that they with-hold two weeks worth  of  donations  and
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>> these
>>>>>>>>  donations go to  another organization as a  protest, the rest of
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>  committee
>>>>>>>> said no  to  this idea, sighting the  possibility that a family
>>>>>>>> might
>>>>>>>>  have
>>>>>>>>   to
>>>>>>>> do without this food, I  personally doubt it,  and figure  they're
>>> just
>>>>>>>>   to
>>>>>>>> comfortable in their place and don't wish  to   because it doesn't
>>>> affect
>>>>>>>>  them,
>>>>>>>> so  what would  you do if you were in  my place? This really upsets
>>>>>>>>  me,
>>>>>>>>  especially since I had spoken to this   organization a year ago 
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>  they
>>>>>>>>  had
>>>>>>>> more or less  agreed that this was not  a good  thing to have
>>>>>>>> happen.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Fred    Olver
>>>>>>>> http://www.dealingwithvisionloss.com For some of  us  it's  a way 
>>>>>>>> of
>>>> life
>>>>>>>>  and
>>>>>>>> for some  of us it just makes  life  easier. Fred Olver
>>>>>>>>    _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>  Nfbmo  mailing  list
>>>>>>>>   Nfbmo at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbmo_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>   To  unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account 
>>>>>>>> info
>>>> for
>>>>>>>>  Nfbmo:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbmo_nfbnet.org/gwunder%40earthlink.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>    _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>  Nfbmo  mailing  list
>>>>>>>>   Nfbmo at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>    http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbmo_nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>> info
>>>> for
>>>>>>>>  Nfbmo:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbmo_nfbnet.org/goodfolks%40charter.net
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>  Nfbmo  mailing  list
>>>>>>>  Nfbmo at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>    http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbmo_nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>   Nfbmo:
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
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>>>>>>>    _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbmo_nfbnet.org/dewey.bradley%40kc.rr.com
>>>>>>>    _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>  Nfbmo  mailing  list
>>>>>>>  Nfbmo at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>   Nfbmo:
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
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>>>>>>    .net
>>>>>>
>>>>>>   _______________________________________________
>>>>>>   Nfbmo  mailing list
>>>>>>  Nfbmo at nfbnet.org
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>>> for
>>>>> Nfbmo:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbmo_nfbnet.org/gbryant%40socket.net
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>    -----
>>>>>> No virus found in this message.
>>>>>> Checked  by AVG  -  www.avg.com
>>>>>> Version: 2012.0.1834 / Virus  Database:  2092/4575 - Release  Date:
>>>>>>   10/26/11
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>    _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Nfbmo   mailing  list
>>>>>>  Nfbmo at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>    http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbmo_nfbnet.org
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>>> for
>>>>> Nfbmo:
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nfbmo_nfbnet.org/mdsmith25%40ktis.net
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>   _______________________________________________
>>>>> Nfbmo    mailing  list
>>>>> Nfbmo at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>  Nfbmo:
>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>   _______________________________________________
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>>>>> Nfbmo at nfbnet.org
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  _______________________________________________
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